You're welcome Redwood old pal.

Here's another volume for you. See if you can guess the author.


‘BYE, ‘BYE, RABBONI

“What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?” (Romans 6:1, 2).

“And Jesus said, ‘Neither do I condemn you; go, and do not sin again’” (John 8:11, RSV).

The woman rose from her frightened crouch and started to scurry away. But then, as though suddenly aware of Jesus’ closing injunction, she stopped and looked quizzically at her rescuer.

“What do You mean ‘do not sin again’?” she asked. “I think you know what I mean,” Jesus replied. “But I don’t know, Rabbi, unless You are suggesting that my relationship with Rubin is sinful.”

“What would you call it?”
“A significant relationship,” the woman answered. “An interpersonal commitment in which each of us seeks to realize our full potential.”
“Oh, really!” Jesus said.

“Rubin and I love one another. Surely you know what that means! How can a relationship be sinful when it expresses true love?”
“What about your covenant with your husband?” “Isaac? Well, Rabbi, Isaac and I never have really turned one another on. We cannot realize our full potential together.”
“What does that have to do with...” “Come now, Rabboni. People have a duty to themselves. You know, a right to their happiness.” “They do?”

“Certainly, and why should we let an outmoded legalism tie us to relationships that are sterile and unfulfllling?” “Oh, you mean that Isaac is unable to father children and you hope that Rubin. .”

“Rabbi! You’re putting me on. You know very well what I mean. God knows Isaac can father children. I have three of them to prove that.” “You have three children? And you propose to ignore your marriage vows and carry on with this man, Rubin?” “Oh, Rabbi, You’re really cute! ‘Carry on with this man, Rubin.’

That kind of talk went out with the age of the judges. I’m not saying that Rubin and I will stay together forever; we may very well outgrow one another after a
time and need room to explore our authentic selfhoods. People do change, you know.”

“But the children?” “Kids aren’t as fragile as you think, Rabboni. You’d be
surprised at how well they get along with Rubin; the way they hang on him when he stays for breakfast, when Isaac is away on a camel drive, that is. They call him Uncle Rube, and he does magic tricks for them. They like that.
They much prefer him to Nathan.”
“Nathan...”
My previous significant relationship. He got to be a terrible drag. Said his conscience bothered him and legalistic stuff like that. I told him he should pay more attention to people like You.” “Like Me? How might I have helped him?”
“Oh, You know that business you say about not being paralyzed by guilt and fearing human opinion. “I see... , but tell me, if this Rubin loves you so deeply, why wasn’t he here today?” “He wanted to be, Rabbi, he really did, very much. But, he just can’t stand the sight of blood. He is a very sensitive person, not at all like Joshua.” “Joshua? Another significant one...?
“Oh, that was over a long time ago, and it wasn’t really significant, not really. You might say I was just trying my wings. “What will you say to your husband about today?” “I’ll tell him to view it as a learning experience. A chance to broaden his horizons. Well, I must run now. ‘Bye ‘bye, Rabboni. Have a good day.”

Jesus gazed reflectively after the departing figure... "


humbly selected by oG

We have the whole gamut here in the U.S. I don't know if you've studied much into the life cycle of churches, but many of our churches here - and probably where you are as well - have reached the near-death stage. This sounds like the churches you are describing. Fortunately, in our conference, which others are now beginning to pay attention and copy, we are big into church planting. Starting new churches is a very effective way to get rid of that unhealthy DNA and dilute the power brokers' influence.

I've also seen where pastors make intentional efforts to develop, mentor, and empower new leaders within a church, which can also be very successful. Just a few new people on the church board can make a big difference. And sometimes you can get creative and bypass the church board entirely. For instance, teach a couple people how to give Bible studies, and they start bringing fresh blood into the church. If the old blood won't tolerate the new blood, plant a church with the new blood.

All of these methods do take some time and a lot of work, but they are well worth it. And often you don't have to start a big controversy to do them.

Yeah, studied that at college as apart of our theology training. Institutionalisation is also one of those stages before death. I would rather a church die than see it in the institutional stage. Remember the lightohouse rescue club story? All institutional churches look with unfriendly eyes at those who would bring in change - it's part of the institutional disease. Don't rock the boat because we are all nice and comfy.


Yep. We have that happening here but some of the DNA of "fear" can cross over still. Some new church plants here are still stuck in the past and that old self righteous holy stuff keeps popping up.


Yeah but they don't go far enough I reckon. There are some good pastors out there but by and large they are all frightened of the conference and holding onto their jobs.

A true church plant takes only a few leaders and then builds off that so pretty soon most of the church is brand new Christians w/o any of that baggage. You're right, it can happen that the leaders take their DNA with them, but that's why it's important to plant intentionally and for the right reasons, and to be trained beforehand so they know the pitfalls to watch out for. Russell Burrill's books are really good. Now there's a "male man" for you. You might not agree with everything he says, but he has dared to do something bold and rock the boat.

 Quote:

I would rather be hit over the head these days

Please, please, don't tempt me!!!

I like Russel Burrel - he's a yank and came to our camp here in Oz once. That's the only way our people get fired up over here when a guy from the US comes. They can say anything they like because they get to go home afterwards. Funny thing though, our own speakers all say amen to this guy but they are all afraid to say it themselves. "All praise Russel Burrel" they said when he came here but why were they not saying this stuff before? Scared is why!


Please Beryl hit me please! For all your "niceness" you sure are the violent type aren't you.

Yes, I don't even like mosquitoes!

Speaking of "male men" ... How many of you are cheering for Yau Man to win Survivor this season?

And, why hasn't Jesus come already if all we need is grace and faith? I mean, what is stopping Him? Could it be that the 'gospel' that is to be preached to all the world is NOT the gospel of Jesus--but "The Gospel Of (about) The Kingdom Of Heaven" and no one knows anything about this yet?

Who is the Kingdom of Heaven today? Perhaps they don't even know it themselves yet? But there is small group from the Calimesa California SDA church who have had a Sabbath School class for over 14 years and broadcast it live at 10am Sabbath morning on internet radio at: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/spiritoftruth They seem to know who this group is and all about the 144,000. They have written a new book out called "THE SPIRIT OF THE CHURCH" by Neufeld and Sterling. Both are SDA members and it now seems like some of the church members want this book banned. What do you think?

Dr. Rich

If it speaks contrary to the SDA church teachings and the fundamental doctrines of the church ... then they may have good cause. Otherwise ... why be concerned?