#191880 - 10/10/08 01:54 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Gerry Cabalo]
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Swiss n Swedish American
Registered: 12/09/06
Posts: 9833
Loc: A citizen of Heaven
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The key here is 'after knowing' . And I think that with most as in the case of homosexuality ... they simply do not believe it to be sin. Thus it is not held against them according to what you and John have said. Once the Holy Spirit has convicted them then that is a different thing.
For certain ... if I thought what I as doing was sin and would keep me from heaven ... I would think twice about doing that sin. I might even think three or four times.
Edited by Redwood (10/10/08 02:05 AM)
_________________________
Another one of Woodies Goodies
Love WON Another.
Lord, make me the person my dog thinks I am.
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#191886 - 10/10/08 02:02 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Gerry Cabalo]
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Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 15764
Loc: Columbia, SC
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The sin in Hebrews 10 is the sin of unbelief. As to the other quote, take it as it reads: The soul that sins shall die. You've sinned and you are sinning. Therefore you must die.
Rob
_________________________
"We preach Christ crucified, to Jews a stumbling block, and to Gentiles foolishness"
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#191887 - 10/10/08 02:06 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Robert]
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Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 7527
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
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Sanctification is a past and present experience.
Past: "And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the bdy of Jesus Christ once for all." Heb 10:10 ESV
Present: "For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified." Heb 10:14 ESV
Gerry
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#191891 - 10/10/08 02:17 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Gerry Cabalo]
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Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 15764
Loc: Columbia, SC
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Present: "For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified." Heb 10:14 ESV[/color]
Gerry NASB (not paraphrased) For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified.
_________________________
"We preach Christ crucified, to Jews a stumbling block, and to Gentiles foolishness"
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#191935 - 10/10/08 04:47 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Robert]
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Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 7527
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
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Present: "For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified." Heb 10:14 ESV[/color]
Gerry NASB (not paraphrased) For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified.
From the ESV-Greek Reverse Interlinear NT, "are being sanctified": verb, participle, accusative, plural, masculine, PRESENT, passive, [Greek morphology - Swanson].Gerry
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#191944 - 10/10/08 05:19 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Robert]
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Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 7527
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
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The sin in Hebrews 10 is the sin of unbelief. As to the other quote, take it as it reads: The soul that sins shall die. You've sinned and you are sinning. Therefore you must die.
Rob
"But if a wicked person TURNS AWAY FROM ALL HIS SINS that he has committed and keeps all my statutes and does what is just and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die." Ez 18:21 ESV
"There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit." Rom 8:1&4 NKJ.
"But if you are led by the Spirit, YOU ARE NOT UNDER LAW. Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and thing like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that THOSE WHO DO SUCH THINGS WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is NO LAW. And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit." Gal 5:18-25 ESV.
"Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal bodies, to make you obey their passions. Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. FOR SIN WILL HAVE NO DOMINION OVER YOU, SINCE YOU ARE NOT UNDER LAW BUT UNDER GRACE." Rom 6:12-14 ESV. Who goes to jail? The one who is obeying the law? Or the one who lives a life of LAWLESSNESS?
"SO I WILL LIVE IN FREEDOM, BECAUSE I WANT TO FOLLOW YOUR ORDERS." Ps 119:45 NCV
"But the one who looks into the perfect law, THE LAW OF LIBERTY, and perseveres, BEING NO HEARER WHO FORGETS BUT A DOER WHO ACTS, HE WILL BE BLESSED IN HIS DOING." Jam 1:25 ESV.Gerry
Edited by Gerry Cabalo (10/10/08 05:20 AM)
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#191947 - 10/10/08 05:46 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Robert]
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Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 7527
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
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The sin in Hebrews 10 is the sin of unbelief. As to the other quote, take it as it reads: The soul that sins shall die. You've sinned and you are sinning. Therefore you must die.
Rob
Since you are a stickler to context, let's see what sins Heb 10:26 is talking about. In Heb 10:3, it says: "But in these sacrifices [animal] there is a reminder of sinS every year. For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sinS." .....10:12 "But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sinS, He sat down at the right hand of God...."
Is the writer just talking only about the sin of unbelief that atonement was being made for? Clearly not. Atonement was made for ALL kinds of sins. So, when the writer says, "For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sinS, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries." 10:26 ESV, he is talking ANY AND EVERY KIND OF SIN.
Notice the PLURAL "sinS". Furthermore, what does unbelief lead to?
"And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were DISOBEDIENT? So we see that they were unable to enter because of UNBELIEF." Heb 3:18 ESV.
So according to the writer of Hebrews, UNBELIEF = DISOBEDIENCE, and vice versa.Gerry
Edited by Gerry Cabalo (10/10/08 05:49 AM)
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#191950 - 10/10/08 06:04 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Robert]
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Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 10830
Loc: CA
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Present: "For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified." Heb 10:14 ESV[/color]
Gerry NASB (not paraphrased) For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified. The NT uses sanctification in both ways: there is sanctification that is virtually synonymous with justification, but it is also used as a process. It's common knowledge as I'm sure you realize. As justification, or instantaneously and completed: 1 Cor. 6:11; Acts 2o: 32. As process: Romans 6:19; Hebrews 12: 14; 1 Peter 1: 15, etc.
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#191953 - 10/10/08 06:07 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: Robert]
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Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 7527
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
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DO you already stand sanctified "in Christ"? Yes...then that is complete and the Sabbath makes sense.
Whether you are sanctified or not, it is still the sign of His creative power. IT IS WRITTEN: [color:red]"REMEMBER, the Sabbath day,....For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
However, if you are referring to the process of sanctification this is always incomplete and ongoing. Hence it can't point to a finished and perfect work. That means once again you are being the legalist!
If that makes me a legalist for upholding God's law, then I'm in good company.
GOD: "You shall have no other gods before me."
"You shall not make for yourself a carved image..."
"You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD WILL NOT HOLD HIM
GUILTLESS WHO TAKES HIS NAME IN VAIN."
"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy."
"Honor your father & your mother..."
"You shall not murder."
"You shall not commit adultery."
"You shall not steal."
"You shall not bear false witness..."
"You shall not covet..."
JESUS: "If you love me, you WILL keep my COMMANDMENTS."
Redwood, look how Gerry uses the Bible. He says, "it is also a COMMAND, not a suggestion". That's a sure sign that a legalist is behind such....He's confused, but he wants to glory in your flesh if you do as he says....
See comment above.Gerry
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#191957 - 10/10/08 07:04 AM
Re: Was the Sabbath just for the Jews...?
[Re: BobRyan]
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Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 10830
Loc: CA
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Ellen White argued that the great majority of the saints were "outside the Adventist denomination". The argument of scripture is "To him that knows to do right and does it not - to him it is sin" James 4.
We can trust God in this case for HE IS "The Spirit of truth that convicts the WORLD of sin and righteousness and jugment".
Our role is not to work ourselves up into a state of thinking that only an Adventist can be saved - (something that hopefully no one is arguing here) - but rather to follow the Holy Spirit -- saying whatever HE LEADS us to say via doors HE opens.
... All very true, Bob. Rest assured that no one on this thread is arguing that only Adventists can be saved.
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