God the eternal Son became incarnate in Jesus Christ. Through Him all things
were created, the character of God is revealed, the salvation of humanity is accomplished, and
the world is judged. Forever truly God, He became also truly man, Jesus the Christ. He was
conceived of the Holy Spirit and born of the virgin Mary. He lived and experienced temptation
as a human being, but perfectly exemplified the righteousness and love of God. By His miracles
He manifested God’s power and was attested as God’s promised Messiah. He suffered and
died voluntarily on the cross for our sins and in our place, was raised from the dead, and
ascended to minister in the heavenly sanctuary in our behalf. He will come again in glory for the
final deliverance of His people and the restoration of all things. (John 1:1-3, 14; Col. 1:15-19;
John 10:30; 14:9; Rom. 6:23; 2 Cor. 5:17-19; John 5:22; Luke 1:35; Phil. 2:5-11; Heb. 2:9-18; 1
Cor. 15:3, 4; Heb. 8:1, 2; John 14:1-3.)

I don't see here anything that makes it clear whether Jesus had a fallen, sinful nature or whether he had the nature of Adam before the Fall. It seems to me that is very important. Perhaps it is stated in another section but it seems that it should be here.

Ahh yes, Jim, the nature of Christ. Quite an interesting and, indeed, important question. Well, you are quite a scholar. What do you find to be taught in Scripture? For example, in Romans 8:3. Any insights from the Greek?

Thanks for the complement, but I don't consider myself a "scholar" unless you only have in mind the archaic meaning of student.
I believe the answer to your question may be determined by a careful study of what both the Bible and Ellen White have to say about the human nature of Christ.
While a theology student at LLU, I believed that Jesus's human nature was the same as Adam's before the fall. Since that time, however, as I've studied, I've become persuaded that Jesus had a fallen human nature. That is, I believe that although Jesus had a fallen human nature, yet He never once sinned in either thought or action. He overcame sin with the same power of the Holy Spirit that you and I have access to in order to overcome. (See Rev. 3:21)
But did Jesus have any advantage over us in His experience of overcoming sin? Yes, I believe He did. First, Jesus never had to undergo conversion or the new birth, because he was born with the Holy Spirit already in His life. Second, Jesus never had sinful habits to overcome like we do.
The primary Biblical sources for my beliefs on this subject are John 1:14; Romans 1:3; 8:3; Hebrews 2:14-18; cf. Hebrews 4:15; 5:2; James 1:14,15.
Romans 1:3 says that the Son was "descended from David according to the flesh." What flesh? Fallen flesh, of course, because it is the only flesh that David and his descendents had. It's the same flesh you and I have. It seems to me that the geneologies of Jesus as given in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 show us that Jesus was a real human being with all the inherited tendencies with which human beings are born. Hebrews 2:16 says, "He had to be made like his brethren in every respect" (RSV).
Also John 1:14: "And the word became flesh..." Again what kind of flesh? No doubt the same flesh that Mary, his mother, had-- fallen.
(Remember it was in order to avoid this truth that the Roman Catholic Church invented its doctrine of the Immaculate Conception, which Adventists do not believe in because it is a lie based on tradition and not on Holy Scripture.)
Next, I believe that a comparison of Hebrews 4:15 and James 1:14, 15 shows that since Jesus was truly tempted in all points as we are, He must have have been tempted "from within" the same way that James says all of us experience temptation.
I believe that a close study of the following writings of Ellen White confirm the view that Jesus came to live among us with a fallen human nature: DA 49, 117, 131; SG vol. 4, pages 115, 116; MM 181; 1 SM 95, 267-268; MH 7; 7 BC 926; Review and Herald 2-24-1874; FILB 114; ST 177. (For a complete listing of Ellen White's comments on this subject, see The Word Was Made Flesh by Ralph Larson.)
The Bible Readings For the Home Circle (1915), page 174, reads: "In His humanity Christ partook of our sinful, fallen nature..." It was changed following the death of Ellen White.
Here's how 52 translations have rendered the Greek words of Romans 8:3 ...en homoiomati sarkos hamartias... "in likeness of flesh of sin..." (There are no varients in the Greek text.)
1) "... in the likeness of sinful flesh..." KJV, NASB, NAB, RSV, NRSV, ASV, KJ II, Lamsa's, Rotherham's, Lattimore's, RY Literal, Jay Green's Literal, New Berkeley, NT in Modern English, Jay Adam's, A.S. Worrell's, Confraternity.
2) CEV--"...to be like us sinners..."
3) Christian Standard Bible--"...in flesh like ours under sin's dominion..."
4) NIV-- "...in the likeness of sinful man..."
5) New International Readers' Version-- "...to be like those who have a sinful nature..."
6) Laubach's Inspired Letters-- "..in flesh like our sinning flesh..."
7) Complete Jewish Bible-- "...as a human being with a nature like our own sinful one..."
8) New Jerusalem Bible-- "...in the same human nature as any sinner..."
9) New Century-- "...with the same human life that others use for sin..."
10) God's Word--"...to have a human nature as sinners have..."
11) Revised English Bible-- "...in the likeness of our sinful nature..."
12) 21st Century-- "...with a nature resembling our sinful nature..."
13) TEV (1976)--"...with a nature like man's sinful nature..."
14) Alfred Dewes' Translation of Romans (1866)-- "...in the likeness of the flesh in which sin dwells..."
15) Free Paraphrase by Jack Sequeira-- "...uniting the divine nature of His Son, at the incarnation, to our corporate sinful human nature that needed redeeming and in that humanity Christ assumed, which was identical to ours, the principle or power of sin was both defeated and executed."
16) Clear Word--"...Jesus took on human nature and demonstrated by the power of the Holy Spirit that sin can be overcome."
17) Charles William's-- "...in a body similar to that of our lower nature..."
18) God's New Covenant (Cassiner)-- "...in a form like that borne by our own sinful nature..."
19) The New Translation (1990)--"...having a body like our sinful bodies..."
20) Bible In Basic English-- "...in the image of the evil flesh..."
21) Goodspeed-- "...in our sinful physical form..."
22) Emphatic Diaglott (Translated by B. Wilson)--"...in a form of a flesh of sin..."
23) Amplified and Moffatt-- "...in the guise of sinful flesh..."
24) Darby's Holy Bible-- "...in the likeness of flesh of sin..."
25) Fenton's Holy Bible in Modern English-- "...in the likeness of a sinful body..."
26) Byington's Bible in Living English-- "...in the likeness of sinning flesh..."
27) The Unvarnished NT (Andy Gaus)-- "...in the fleshly likeness of sin..."
29) Letters From Paul (Blackwelder)-- "...in the likeness of sinful nature..."
30) Wuest's Expanded Trans.-- "...in likeness of flesh of sin..."
31) R.A.Knox (Catholic)-- "...in the fashion of our guilty nature..."
32) J.B.Phillips'-- "...in that human nature which causes the trouble..."
33) Weymouth (3rd edition, 1909)-- "...in a body like that of sinful human nature..."
34) Weymouth (4th edition, 1929, James Robertson ed.)-- "...in the form of sinful humanity..."
35) The Message-- "...took on the human condition, entered the disordered mess of struggling humanity..."
For those interested in how the NT elsewhere uses the Greek word here usually translated "likeness," please see Romans 6:5 and Phil. 2:7. Similar Greek words also occur in James 3:9 and Acts 14:11.
The following quote from the pen of Ellen White shows the importance and relevance of this topic for Seventh-day Adventists with our unique understanding of the Great Controversy theme and the High Priestly ministry of Jesus:
"Satan claimed that it was impossible for human beings to keep God's law. In order to prove the falsity of this claim, Christ left His high command, took upon Himself the nature of man, and came to the earth to stand at the head of the fallen race, in order to show that humanity could withhstand the temptations of Satan. He became the Head of humanity, to be assaulted with temptations on every point as fallen human nature would be tempted, that He might know how to succor all who are tempted. On this earth He worked out the problem of how to live in accordance with God's standard of right. Bearing our nature, He was true to God's standard of righteousness, gaining the victory over Satan. he was tempted in all points like as we are, yet He was without sin." The Upward Look, page 172.
There are of course SDA and others who will not agree with my analysis of what the Bible and Ellen White teach on this subject, and I invite their comments and criticism. Jim

Thank-you, Jim, thank-you. You have posted a real tour-de-force, which I shall enjoy perusing over the next several days. This is truly exciting and enjoyable. You have made my day, by posting this. I am MOST anxious to look into 'homoiwmati.' I really appreciate your listing the comparative translations. It seems to me that the crux of the issue has to do with the meaning of homoiwmati (homoiwma). Kittel has an excellent 13 page article, written by Herr Schneider, in v. 5, begining on p. 186. As I recall, Schneider does good work.

I will respond as soon as I have had a chance to look into this.

Best regards, Dave

Here is some info from Kittel. The word itself is "what is made similar," "copy." The word . . . ALWAYS HAS THE CONCRETE SENSE OF 'COPY' RATHER THAN THE ABSTRACT SENSE OF LIKENESS OR CORRESPONDENCE." (Kittel, v. 5, p. 191)

Bingo!!!! THAT is what I was looking for! Here, then, is a key in understanding Paul's intent in this verse. A copy, in the concrete rather than the abstract. Here is some further commentary from Kittel (pp. 195, 196):

"In R. 8:3 Paul says that God sent His Son into the world in the form of sinful flesh . . . He is emphasizing that Christ was really man. He bore a physical body fashioned according to the human body which is infected with sin. In outward form He was in no way different from other men. But Paul does not say that he came en sarki hamartias. With his en homoiwmati Paul is showing that for all the similarity between Christ's physical body and that of men there is an essential difference between Christ and men. Even in Hihs earthly life Christ was still the Son of God. This means that He became man without entering the nexus of human sin. The words en homoiwmati keep us from a deduction which Paul did not wish to make, namely, that Christ became subject to the power of sin and did in fact sin. For Paul Christ is sinless. Sin, which clung to the physical body He assumed, had no power over Him. The homoiwma thus indicates two things, first the likeness in appearance, and secondly the distinction in essence. Why did God send His Son into the world in the form of sinful flesh? Paul answers: with this body the intrinsically sinless Christ became the representative of sinful mankind. Hence God, by giving up Christ to death, could condemn sin by destroying His body, and thus cancel it. Christ took the likeness of sarx hamartias in order that God in Christ might achieve the liberation of mankind from sin."

Well, Jim, what think you of the foregoing?

Dave

The essential question for me is, was Jesus "really man" as all men are or as only one man was before the Fall? Kittel writes that "Christ was really man" but then he apparently says Christ was not like us in the most fundamental feature, that of our sinful nature. It seems to me that if Christ did not have our sinful nature, He could not have known temptation as we know it. And therefore, if that were the case, Jesus did not overcome sin as we must overcome it. And if Jesus did not overecome sin as we must overcome it, how then can we say he was made like his brothers in every respect and that he is truly able to sympathize with the struggles of sinners fighting against sinful desires?
To say that Jesus had a sinful nature is not the same as saying that "Christ became subject to the power of sin" or that he sinned. Christ was sinless, certainly, and saying He had a sinful nature does not in any way detract from His sinlessness. It is not sin to be powerfully tempted-- even if that temptation comes from within our own sinful nature. To have a sinful nature does not require God's forgiveness because our sinful nature itself is not sin. What is sin is the giving in to sin, that is, surrendering our will to it. Christ never did that, and the reason He did not do it is that He resisted it by the power of the Holy Spirit.
For instance, did Jesus know experientially what it was like to resist the desire to do what He knew was against His Father's will? That is, did the thought ever come into His mind to do something wrong? Christ had a natural desire to follow his human inclinations, but He resisted those desires. Christ immediately rejected the thought and never coveted it or dwelt on it. Instead, Christ prayed that the Father's will would be done in all things. He completely submitted Himself to God.
Christ not only merely appeared to be a real man-- He actually was 100% a real man.
Well, what is the essential nature of a real man? Isn't it that it is sinful?
What makes him vulnerable? Isn't it that he has a sinful nature?
What makes him in need of a mediator and a Savior? Again, isn't it his sinful nature?
Yes, Christ was indeed sinless, of course! But He was not sinless because His human nature was essentially different from our own human nature. "He was made like his brothers in every respect," just as the Scripture says, and it is because He was in all points tempted like as we are that Christ as our High Priest is well able to sympathize with us now in our weaknesses. He was sinless because He overcame sin by the same power that is available to you and me. Jesus really could have sinned. Christ's temptations were real and not make-believe. That is how Christ became the representative of sinful mankind and how He achieved our liberation. It was by taking on Himself our sinful nature, yet without sinning, that Jesus became the author and leader of our salvation.
God did not condemn sin by destroying Christ's body but rather by Christ's demonstration that through the dynamite/power of God's indwelling Spirit, people with sinful natures really can resist and overcome sin. Jim