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#570969 - 09/08/12 11:08 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Q.E.D. Online   content
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"The ark in the tabernacle on earth contained the two tables of stone, upon which were inscribed the precepts of the law of God. The ark was merely a receptacle for the tables of the law, and the presence of these divine precepts gave to it its value and sacredness. When the temple of God was opened in heaven, the ark of His testament was seen. Within the holy of holies, in the sanctuary in heaven, the divine law is sacredly enshrined–the law that was spoken by God Himself amid the thunders of Sinai and written with His own finger on the tables of stone."(Great Controversy 1911, page 433)

Q.E.D.
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#570972 - 09/08/12 11:16 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Q.E.D. Online   content
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"The law of God in the sanctuary in heaven is the great original, of which the precepts inscribed upon the tables of stone and recorded by Moses in the Pentateuch were an unerring transcript. Those who arrived at an understanding of this important point were thus led to see the sacred, unchanging character of the divine law. They saw, as never before, the force of the Saviour's words: "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law." Matthew 5:18. The law of God, being a revelation of His will, a transcript of His character, must forever endure, "as a faithful witness in heaven." Not one command has been annulled; not a jot or tittle has been changed. Says the psalmist: "Forever, O Lord, Thy word is settled in heaven." "All His commandments are sure. They stand fast for ever and ever." Psalms 119:89; 111:7, 8."(Great Controversy 1911, page 434)

Q.E.D.
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#570974 - 09/08/12 11:32 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Q.E.D. Online   content
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" The seal of God's law is found in the fourth commandment. This only, of all the ten, brings to view both the name and the title of the Lawgiver. It declares Him to be the Creator of the heavens and the earth, and thus shows His claim to reverence and worship above all others. Aside from this precept, there is nothing in the Decalogue to show by whose authority the law is given"(Great Controversy 1911, page 451)

Q.E.D.
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#570975 - 09/08/12 11:35 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Q.E.D. Online   content
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"To the law and to the testimony." While conflicting doctrines and theories abound, the law of God is the one unerring rule by which all opinions, doctrines, and theories are to be tested. Says the prophet: "If they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them." Verse 20." (Great Controversy 1911, page 452)

Q.E.D.
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#570976 - 09/08/12 11:40 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Q.E.D. Online   content
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"Hallowed by the Creator's rest and blessing, the Sabbath was kept by Adam in his innocence in holy Eden; by Adam, fallen yet repentant, when he was driven from his happy estate. It was kept by all the patriarchs, from Abel to righteous Noah, to Abraham, to Jacob. When the chosen people were in bondage in Egypt, many, in the midst of prevailing idolatry, lost their knowledge of God's law; but when the Lord delivered Israel, He proclaimed His law in awful grandeur to the assembled multitude, that they might know His will and fear and obey Him forever."(Great Controversy 1911, page 453)

Q.E.D.
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#570981 - 09/09/12 12:32 AM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Gerry Cabalo Online   content


Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 14823
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
Originally Posted By: Robert
Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo
The law is a reflection of God's character. Therefore, the law is as old as God himself!!!


Most of the law doesn't apply to heavenly beings, Gerry. You didn't have to tell an angel not to kill. The angel wouldn't understand that concept - it would be foreign to it's mind. Death was unknown in heaven. You wouldn't have to tell an angel not to steal because in heaven there was no ownership. Like the early church, they had all things in common. And we know you didn't need to tell an angel not to commit adultery. It would be like telling me not to fly.

I mean, folks, we have to think outside the box of tradition. Let go of your preconceived ideas and let God guide!


When you say the law, you did not specify the 10c! The 10c are adaptations of the two great commandments to this particular planet. If there is marriage in other planets, then the 5th & 7th commandment would also apply.

QED,however, made a point. It could still apply to spiritual adultery & I might add, spiritual parents.

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#571003 - 09/09/12 05:46 AM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Gerry Cabalo]
Robert Offline


Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 23638
Loc: Columbia, SC
Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo
QED,however, made a point. It could still apply to spiritual adultery & I might add, spiritual parents.



You could justify anything, I suppose, but that doesn't make it truth. Here's Jesus on adultery:

Matt 5:27 "You have heard that it was said, 'Do not commit adultery.' 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

In other words you sin when you look lustfully without doing the act.

Here's the thing...if your mind was filled with agape and if you weren't born with a nature that's bent to self, you wouldn't need all those rules, would you? That's my point.

So agape is eternal. God's law, given at Sinai isn't.
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#571004 - 09/09/12 05:49 AM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Q.E.D.]
Robert Offline


Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 23638
Loc: Columbia, SC
Originally Posted By: Q.E.D.
"To the law and to the testimony." While conflicting doctrines and theories abound, the law of God is the one unerring rule by which all opinions, doctrines, and theories are to be tested. Says the prophet: "If they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them." Verse 20." (Great Controversy 1911, page 452)

Q.E.D.


Ellen White apparently didn't know that "the law" is referring to the book of the law or the Torah. The Torah isn't the law of God. The law of God is in the Torah.
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#571005 - 09/09/12 05:54 AM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Q.E.D.]
Robert Offline


Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 23638
Loc: Columbia, SC
Originally Posted By: Q.E.D.
" The seal of God's law is found in the fourth commandment. This only, of all the ten, brings to view both the name and the title of the Lawgiver. It declares Him to be the Creator of the heavens and the earth, and thus shows His claim to reverence and worship above all others. Aside from this precept, there is nothing in the Decalogue to show by whose authority the law is given"(Great Controversy 1911, page 451)

Q.E.D.


The Sabbath commandment not longer is valid. As soon as Adam fell God went back to work. He stopped resting in His perfect creation because it was ruined by the entrance of sin.

Ellen White had limited light. You need to get your light from the Bible. Cults quote their leader as the final word. Ellen White never wanted a cult following. She always pointed to the Bible as the final word. So it would be nice to get your info from your Bible.

That's it, dust it off and open it up. I'm waiting. giggle

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#571006 - 09/09/12 05:57 AM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Q.E.D.]
Robert Offline


Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 23638
Loc: Columbia, SC
Originally Posted By: Q.E.D.
(Great Controversy 1911, page 433)Q.E.D.


"In regard to infallibility, I NEVER claimed it; God ALONE is Infallible." Selected Messages, Book One, pp 415 and 37

Do not think that, because we have a glimmer of the light of God, that we have it all.--Ms. 3, 1889, pp. 1-3. (Morning Talk at Ottawa, Kansas, May 14, 1889.)

The question has been asked me, "Do you think that the Lord has any more light for us as a people?" I answer that He has light that is new to us, and yet it is precious old light that is to shine forth from the Word of truth [the Bible]. We have only the glimmerings of the rays of the light that is yet to come to us. [1SM 401]

We have many lessons to learn, and many, many to unlearn. God and heaven alone are infallible. Those who think that they will never have to give up a cherished view, never have occasion to change an opinion, will be disappointed. [CW 37]


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#571035 - 09/09/12 12:15 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Q.E.D.]
Robert Offline


Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 23638
Loc: Columbia, SC
Originally Posted By: Q.E.D.
Originally Posted By: Q.E.D.
I will put my law in their inward parts,....


Originally Posted By: Robert
What law? The principle of agape? Yes..rules? no!


The 10 Commandments.

Q.E.D.


Those are rules.

Turn to Gal 5:14! What does Paul say?

"The entire law is summed up in a single command: 'Love your neighbor as you love yourself.'"

The law is basically one command - love your neighbor in the same way that you naturally, sinfully love yourself.

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#571036 - 09/09/12 12:25 PM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
Robert Offline


Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 23638
Loc: Columbia, SC
Originally Posted By: Robert
Turn to Gal 5:14! What does Paul say?

"The entire law is summed up in a single command: 'Love your neighbor as you love yourself.'"

The law is basically one command - love your neighbor in the same way that you naturally, sinfully love yourself.



Now, I'll use Ellen White to back up the Bible. That's how you use her:

"The lover of self is a transgressor of the law." [COL 392]

If you love yourself you are a transgressor!

If you are controlled only by agape "you will have that love which seeks not her own, but another's wealth." [DA 439]

As the Beatles said, "all you need is love" - except the love they sang about was human love, which is self-seeking.

So you don't need a bunch of rules - do this, don't do that. All you need is agape. That's the law written in your mind as a believer. The problem, however, is we have another law - the law of sin (our bent to self).
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#571717 - 09/14/12 05:34 AM Re: Is the law eternal? [Re: Robert]
12tribes Offline
Past the 700 posts

Registered: 08/12/11
Posts: 711
Loc: Australia
The Law is a transcript of the character of God
Psalms 19:7 KJV
(7) The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
Matthew 5:48 KJV
(48) Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Proverbs 6:23 KJV
(23) For the commandment is a lamp; and the law is light; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:
1 John 1:5 KJV
(5) This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

There are more texts like this that show the Law is a transcript of the character of God. Then what we need to look at is how does it show the character of God? Looking at the letter of the Law we will not see it we need to look at the spirit of the Law to understand.

Romans 7:14 KJV
(14) For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
1 Corinthians 2:14 KJV
(14) But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
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Galatians 3:29
(29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

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