Dr. Shane Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Chinese missile destroys satellite in space Quote: Britain has joined the US, Japan and Australia's condemnation of China after the communist country destroyed a satellite in space using a ballistic missile. Quote: "What we are concerned about however is lack of consultation and we believe that this development of this technology and the manner in which this test was conducted is inconsistent with the spirit of China's statements to the UN and other bodies on the military use of space." The Chinese authorities have not confirmed a US report that it blew up one of its own aged weather satellites last Thursday with a ballistic missile fired from the Xichang space centre in Sichuan province. Look's like China is going to replace the USSR as the world's second super power. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bevin Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Arguably they have already Also remember that the USA has had anti-satellite missiles for decades - and the Bush admin argument that we are allowed to militarise space and no-one else is is patently absurd. /Bevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 If we are going to allow satellites to be destroyed then will space be a safe place to travel with all the space junk. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bevin Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Nope - it will get steadily less safe as the junk builds up But remember - we did it first... and what is good for the goose is good for the gander. /Bevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 19, 2007 Moderators Share Posted January 19, 2007 Buut... the worry with this is not so much about space junk. If you do some fairly simple math on the volume of space around the earth compared to the volume of junk, the probability of hitting anything is pretty slender. The worry is much more about a country having the ability to wipe out a lot of communications, including GPS access, by destroying satellites. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bevin Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Estimates of 40,000 pieces of junk added from this destruction. On earlier flights the space shuttle has recorded hits on various pieces of debris - but nothing serious yet. Quick math... (time to run, ye who fear math) The shuttle has a cross section of about 400 sq m It orbits the earth at about 400 km up, but the earth's radius is about 4000 km, so another 400 is irrelevant, so each orbit sweeps out about 400 sq m x 2 x pi x 4,000,000 m = 1,600,000,000 cubic meters and it does this about 15 x per day on a flight and flights last about 6 days 15 x 6 is about 100 so 160,000,000,000 = 1.6E11 cubic meters are swept per mission http://www.space.com/spacewatch/space_junk.html estimates 100,000 pieces of junk in low earth orbit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_Earth_orbit defines this as in the 200 - 2000 km altitude. The volume of a sphere is 4/3 x pi x r^3, so (just trust me) this means low earth orbit is about 6.4E20 So the shuttle is sweeping about 6.4E20/1.6E11 = 4E9 of the space per mission, and there is 1E5 pieces of junk, so it has a 1E5/4E9 = 2.5E-5 probably of hitting a significant piece of junk in a mission. About 3 chances in 100,000. On the other hand, it has about a 1% chance of blowing up or failing on reentry (2 failures in less than 200 launches) so the space junk is not high on their list of concerns... /Bevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyberGuy Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Look's like China is going to replace the USSR as the world's second super power. A superpower WITHOUT a blue water navy. No Aircraft carriers and no long range navy. Hardly a threat yet. Quote Riverside CA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted January 20, 2007 Author Share Posted January 20, 2007 Unless things change, I don't see China as a threat to the US anyway. They are a threat to Tawain but they have no reason to theaten the US. We help their economy and they help ours. Having them as the world's second superpower appears to be much better than having the USSR in that position. Political change is bound to take place in China as it economy and technology developes. Space and nuclear technology will eventually be available to any nation willing to spend the money for it. This simply means that international agreements have to be enforced to prevent nations with such technology from abusing it. China could become a major player in enforcing such agreements. I see no reason in treating them with hostility. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted January 20, 2007 Author Share Posted January 20, 2007 Quote: Arguably they have already Yes that would be arguable. They are on their way and as their economy grows they will have more money to invest in the infrastructure to make them a mature superpower. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bevin Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,FL_china_123104,00.html One day in November, a nuclear-powered Chinese Navy submarine quietly slipped past this western Pacific island, home port for five supply and ammunition ships positioned here by the U.S. military for rapid deployment around the world. ... According to military analysts, China is rapidly expanding its submarine force to about 85 by 2010, about one-third more than today. ... The Chinese are converting their surface navy into a truly modern antiship cruise-missile surface navy," McVadon, now an East Asia security consultant, said after attending a naval review conference in Hawaii. "The modernization of their navy has taken a great leap forward. Their nuclear sub program has taken off like wildfire." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bevin Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Quote: I see no reason in treating them with hostility I agree /Bevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted January 20, 2007 Author Share Posted January 20, 2007 I think the fear is that since they are building up a strong military, they must be preparing for war. However the US built up a strong, peace-time military during the 1980s and no major war resulted in the 1990s. In the 1990s the US drastically downsized their military and CIA as a result of the USSR falling and it was with this much smaller military that it went to war in Afghanistan and Iraq. Historically China has been invaded by many of its neighbors and the US has been able to prevent it from taking control of Tawain. It is logical that they would want to be on an equal footing with the US, if not a step ahead. A war between them would be so devestating, it is hard to believe either would want it. Both have the submarine technology to launch cruise missles into the other from near its shores. Such missles could take out bridges and power plants. Both also have the technology to knock each other satellites out of the sky which could impact television and cell phones. Thus each could easily leave the other without power, mass transportation and modern communication. That threat alone is a big deterant to such a war from happening. So China may be seeking to avoid war rather than start war with the US. It would be nice, however, if they would state exactly what their motives are. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 If they stated their reason to be peaceful ... would you believe them ?? I for one ... WOULD NOT. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 I agree with you on that 100%. I can still remember in the early 60's or mid 60's our jewish adventist church were having evangelist meetings for the Jewish people in NYC, down in manhattan, and Pastor JM Hoffman was saying that just before christ returns that China (the sleeping Bear or something if I recall correctly) would awaken again. It seems interesting that that is what is happening. pkrause Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliensanctuary Posted January 22, 2007 Share Posted January 22, 2007 When "sleeping bears" awaken after hibernation, they're really hungry. What would the world do if China starts grabbing territory belonging to others? We could easily bomb Iraq off the map if necessary, but taking on China without using nuclear weapons might be a serious challenge. Quote The Parable of the Lamb and the Pigpen https://www.createspace.com/3401451 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted January 22, 2007 Author Share Posted January 22, 2007 If it came down to that I suspect we would do the same thing we did with the USSR. We would arm our allies in the region with nuclear missles. However that is a big "IF". Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted January 22, 2007 Moderators Share Posted January 22, 2007 Quote: One day in November, a nuclear-powered Chinese Navy submarine quietly slipped past this western Pacific island, home port for five supply and ammunition ships positioned here by the U.S. military for rapid deployment around the world. ... I have heard that it is the Diesel electric subs that are of even greater concern than the nuclear subs. When they are running on electric they are virtually silent and therefore undetectible. I think China took delivery of two in '05. There was an incident last yeartwhere what was thought to be a D/Electric got close to carrier group and was undetected for days. Thats serious business and sounds like a plot from a Patrick Robinson novel! Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bevin Posted January 22, 2007 Share Posted January 22, 2007 Quote: We would arm our allies in the region with nuclear missles. Which allies did the US arm with nuclear missiles? /Bevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 22, 2007 Share Posted January 22, 2007 Quote: We would arm our allies in the region with nuclear missles. Which allies did the US arm with nuclear missiles? /Bevin "Would" Bevin WOULD Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 22, 2007 Moderators Share Posted January 22, 2007 I know, but you said 'do the same as we did with the USSR' before that. Anyway... what perhaps Americans don't fully understand yet is that many in the rest of the world no longer trust that America's intentions are peaceful. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted January 22, 2007 Author Share Posted January 22, 2007 The Trident missles that the UK still has were built in the US. When the USSR threatened western Europe with SS-20 missiles, the US offered western Europe its Pershing IIs but the USSR withdrew its SS-20s before that happened. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Quote: perhaps Americans don't fully understand yet is that many in the rest of the world no longer trust that America's intentions are peaceful. This may be so but which would the rest of the world rather trust, China or America? Australia is closer to China's neighborhood than the US. If China became agrressive, I suspect Australia would reconsider having nuclear weapons. Certainly the US would want to see that the Philipians, Japan and South Korea could deter a Chinesse attack. However I don't see China becoming aggressive with anyone other than Tiwain and perhaps some of its western provinces. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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