You made me very angry!!!

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Why do we get angry with people when we are the ones who choose to be upset? Look at this chart. Any comments?

My son returns from work or school and goes to his room without saying anything.

This is ‘A,’ the ACTIVATING event. Listed below are five thoughts I may have, depending on my BELIEFS. Next to the thoughts are emotions that are linked to them.

1. "After all I’ve done for him, he doesn’t have the common courtesy to say hello." Feeling angry.

2. "Something must have upset him." Feeling concerned about his welfare.

3. "He must be angry with me." Feeling worried.

4. "He must be upset because this morning I told him he was late for work again." Feeling hurt.

5. "He must be lost in thought." Feeling compassionate and understanding — no loss of happiness.

In thought #1, I believe my son is rude and I feel angry, the CONSEQUENCE of which may be an argument with him. But what if he was innocent? The happiness of two people are jeopardized by my irrational thought (distorted thinking). On the other hand, what if I DISPUTED the thought before flying off the handle? As soon as I felt the anger, I could have paused and asked myself some questions such as, "Am I jumping to conclusions? Can there be an alternative explanation for his silence? Am I unfairly judging him? Since I am his father and not a child, why don’t I take the initiative by greeting him and starting a conversation to learn why he was so quiet?"

Can you see the powerful EFFECT of changing my thought? Doesn’t it also change my behavior and its CONSEQUENCE? The point to remember is that it is not the ACTIVATING EVENT that determines our actions or behavior, but our interpretation of that event. You can practice the ABCDE steps with the other four example thoughts. Once you’re comfortable doing so, practice with your own thoughts and watch you change your life!

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

The above is taken from: http://www.personal-development.com/chuck/rationalliving.htm

[Gail]

Cool! Thanks for sharing, Norman!

[Nan]

"The ultimate human freedom is the choice of how we react to others and to our circumstances".

(not my words, I read them years ago from Corrie ten Boom)

[olger]

This is good stuff,

oG

[jasd]

QR frame:

principle:: ...bruise your heel? step on its head. (Genesis 3)

aww, c'mon, [/kidding!] ;-)

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

This is taken from "A new guide to rational living" written by Albert Ellis and Robert A. Harper. In this chapter they discuss 10 major irrational ideas that most people struggle with. I will post one at a time. Some of these we all know but some will help us look at ourselves a little closer and hopefully make the changes we are looking for.

Quote:

Some of the major irrational ideas which you can strongly and persistently challenge, as well as forcefully propel yourself to act against include these:

1. Dispute the belief that you must feel loved or accepted by every significant person for almost everything you do. Instead, try to stand on your own two feet; keep the approval of others as a desirable but not necessary goal; seriously and self-correctively consider other people’s criticisms of your traits without concurring with their negative evaluations of you. Mainly strive to do what you really enjoy rather than what other people think you ought to do.

This fits in great with the chart above. More to come. Share times when you've been able to overcome other's critisism of you and how you did it. I must say that it is not necessary to overcome critisism in this way, but when you have no way to deal with it, this is certainly a great starting point.

Norman

[Dr. Shane]

It is a hard concept for many to grasp. I was taught this in AA as I sobered up as a teenager. I think because of my young, impressionable age at the time, I was better able to grasp the concept.

That said there was a time that I was wronged severely and became very angry. Interestingly as I was angry I told myself that something was wrong with ME. I did not blame my anger on the person that had wronged and harmed me. What he had done was over and done. I was the one choosing to remain angry about it. I had the problem - not him. Eventually I worked through it, which included a lot of prayer and forgiveness.

It is natural to get angry when someone harms us. However often times it is not necessary. When we do become angry, we ought not let the sun go down on our anger. That is, we should forgive the offending party and go on with life before we go to bed. Often times I don't even get angry when someone harms me because I know they are spiritually sick. So I have pity on them instead of being angry.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

It was great that you were able to learn this at a young age. I was 35 when I learned this principle. It is difficult to live by, especially for people who are more emotional than others. It takes time to get the mind trained to think like this.

Quote:

That said there was a time that I was wronged severely and became very angry. Interestingly as I was angry I told myself that something was wrong with ME. I did not blame my anger on the person that had wronged and harmed me. What he had done was over and done. I was the one choosing to remain angry about it. I had the problem - not him. Eventually I worked through it, which included a lot of prayer and forgiveness.

When we don't do as you have done, we are sometimes not aware of the bondage that we are in until we see that person that has wronged us (whether real or perceived) and then all those feelings arise and we get back into battle mode. Sometimes the rest of the day is wasted rehashing the event that led us to choose to think and feel this way in the past. We even can go so far as to fantasize how we would now just let them have it!

Thinking rationally is what we all should strive for but as the children of God we have an even higher goal. Our love for God and people should make us just about immune to attacks from people, knowing that they truly come from Satan and as you have said, we can have pity on them, love them and pray for them. In that state of being, we can live without anger and having to deal with it for a long period of time. In other words, we can get over this quickly and truly have no ill thoughts and feelings and sometimes we the event can does not phase us because of the joy that we have in our hearts.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Irrational Idea #2

2. Give up the notion that you must act quite competently, adequately and achievingly. Try to do or to do well rather than to do perfectly. Try to better your own performances rather than that of others. Strive, if you will, to perform better at art, ball playing or business than you do now. But do not delude yourself that you will prove a better person if you achieve your goal. Strongly desire and work for success in your chosen fields. But accept failures as undesirable but not awful – as having nothing whatever to do with your intrinsic value as a human.

[there buster]

It's more than slightly ironic. Many seem to love this thread, while at the same time one of the most common complaints is being 'offended,' saying, 's/he is responsible for my emotions.'

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Ed,

you are right; in the book, "A new guide to rational living" they state something like your post. They say that while many people love their material and what they teach, many people are not living by the principles outlined in the book. People would tell them how much they appreciate their work but at the same time they did not live it.

I am guilty of the same and sometimes am able to catch myself. It is a constant effort but a rewarding one.

Norman

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

This one might raise some eyebrows, please share your thoughts.

irrational idea #3

3. Get rid of the idea that you can label people certain people bad, wicked or villainous and that they deserve severe blame or punishment for their sins. Accept your own and others’ wrongdoings objectively: as misdeeds to learn from and to try and correct in the future. Fully acknowledge your and others’ fallibilities and make due allowance for the possibility – indeed, the practical certainty- of your and their continuing to make numerous errors and mistakes. Learn to distinguish between your having responsibility for your actions (which you frequently do) and deserving damnation for theses actions (which you do not). See that when you condemn yourself or others, you act perfectionistically and grandiosely, and that you thereby perpetuate rather than correct your or their misdeeds. Don’t confuse people with their deeds, a person who acts badly with a bad person. As L. S. Barksdale has noted, although you can sensibly rate an individual’s acts, can you ever legitimately rate that which acts?

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

major irrational idea #4

4. Combat the idea that you must view it as terrible, horrible and awful when things do not go the way you would like them to go. When conditions seem undesirable or obnoxious, determinedly try to change them for the better. When, for the moment, you cannot change them, accept them (and wait and plan for the time when you can). The greater your loss or frustration, the more philosophical you can make yourself in regard to it: the more you can see it as undesirable- but not as unbearable nor intolerable.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

I am curious, after reading these first 4 of the 10, do you think that if you practice these things it will help you?

Norman

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

This one is good! major irrational idea #5

5. Reject the hypothesis that human misery gets externally caused and that you have little or no ability to control your depression or self-pity. Instead, realize that you create most of your own misery with you own irrational thinking, your self propagandization; and that you can minimize your despair or your anger by changing your thinking or self-talk. If you ferret out your own shoulds, aughts and musts and replace your childish demands and whinings with realistic preferences, you need rarely make yourself anxious or upset.

See the chart on the 1st post of this thread and try this out.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

major irrational idea #6

6. Rid yourself of the idea that if something may prove dangerous or fearsome, you must get terribly occupied with and upset about it. Seriously question the real dangers accompanying the things you fear and determine the actual probabilities of their occurring or leading to dreadful consequences if they do occur. If you would live fully and creatively, accept certain inevitable dangers and risks that go with life. Most of your overconcerns stem from your definitions – follows from your own awfulizing internalized sentences- and can get dealt with by observing and disputing your definitional assumptions, especially your assumption that you must always please others and achieve outstandingly.

[Taylor]

Very interesting stuff. Thanks for sharing

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Hi Taylor,

this stuff was life changing for me after coming out of rehab years ago. I lived by it and it truly made me a different person. Even today, even though I'm not as tuned in to it as then, it helps me get through a lot of life's messes.

----------------------------------------------------------------

I want to ask some questions of all of you who are reading this. Please do not reply to them now, but just think about them.

1. Do you believe that if you lived by these teachings that it would help you overcome some of your sometimes irrational behavior?

2. Also, if you lived by these teachings, do you believe that it could help you to overcome some of your besetting sins?

There are still three more major irrational ideas to come, so be thinking about this as I post them. If after the 10th one and some instruction from the book, you think you want to relpy to these questions, please do so. I truly am not interested in debating, but am interested in seeing how this can be of help to people.

Sincerely,

Norman

[LifeHiscost]

Why do we get angry with people when we are the ones who choose to be upset?

"...for the anger of man does not achieve the righteousness of God." James 1:20 NASB

When I recognized that principle as all encompassing in the nature of fallen man, I accepted the reality that I was not being led of God whenever my anger was the reason for the decisions I was making.

"Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful." Colossians 3:15 NASB

Regards!!

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Quote:

"...for the anger of man does not achieve the righteousness of God." James 1:20 NASB

Hi Life,

this verse is truly significant because we sometimes think that because things don't go the way we think they should or because we or someone has been wrong, we have the right to blast the perpretrator and we truly don't. Yet, that does not mean we have to just sit there and be abused all the time. But it does mean that we need to let reason be led by the Spirit.

A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace. Ecc 3:7-8

Norman

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Major irrational idea #8

7. Stop trying to run away from many life difficulties and responsibilities. Short range hedonism, or the insistence on immediate gratifications, proves a senseless philosophy in most instances. You can change it for a harder-headed long-range approach to pleasure and enjoyment. Determine what you’d really better (not must) do – and then, no matter how unpleasant these things, unrebelliously and promptly perform them. Although acquiring a considerable degree of self-discipline may seem unduly difficult, in the long run you will find the “easy” and undisciplined way harder, less rewarding, and often self-sabotaging.

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

"...for the anger of man does not achieve the righteousness of God." James 1:20 NASB

Yet, that does not mean we have to just sit there and be abused all the time. But it does mean that we need to let reason be led by the Spirit.

A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace. Ecc 3:7-8

Norman

Some have seen the seeming anger expressed under certain circumstances by Jesus, as reason to justify their personal failure at ignoring the admonition to be at peace with all men, insofar as possible. On close scrutiny, as far as I have been able to determine, each circumstance of Jesus expressions of anger occurred when Jesus was protecting the rights of others as divinely ordained. Would that we all could experience that godly anger that is concerned for others who are exploited for selfish reasons, without succumbing to personal oneupmanship.

Granted this can only be accomplished through submission to the enabling power of the Holy Spirit.

"But brother goes to law against brother, and that before [Gentile judges who are] unbelievers [without faith or trust in the Gospel of Christ]?

Why, the very fact of your having lawsuits with one another at all is a defect (a defeat, an evidence of positive moral loss for you). Why not rather let yourselves suffer wrong and be deprived of what is your due? Why not rather be cheated (defrauded and robbed)?

But [instead it is you] yourselves who wrong and defraud, and that even your own brethren [by so treating them]!"

1 Corinthians 6:6-8 AMP

Regards!!

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Quote:

"But brother goes to law against brother, and that before [Gentile judges who are] unbelievers [without faith or trust in the Gospel of Christ]?

Why, the very fact of your having lawsuits with one another at all is a defect (a defeat, an evidence of positive moral loss for you). Why not rather let yourselves suffer wrong and be deprived of what is your due? Why not rather be cheated (defrauded and robbed)? But [instead it is you] yourselves who wrong and defraud, and that even your own brethren [by so treating them]!"

1 Corinthians 6:6-8 AMP

I like the way that is written.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Major irrational idea #8

8. Surrender the idea that the past remains all-important and that because something once strongly affected your life it must do so indefinitely. While considering your past history seriously and doing your best to learn valuable lessons from it, realize that your present constitutes your tomorrow’s past and that working to change the present may enable you to create a radically better future. Continual rethinking of your old assumptions and reworking of your past habits can help minimize most of the pernicious influences from your childhood and adolescence.