Ernie Knoll's Dreams -- Comfort from Christ Himself?

[John317]

What do you think of the objections brought up on this website, especially concerning the statements made by the Harold on tithing, etc.?

http://www.notaprophet.org/

The question of using 1 John 4: 2 to test whether an angel is of God or not is discussed in the link above. It is just one of the tests, of course, and as pointed out in the link, we have no evidence that evil angels can't say they believe Jesus came in the flesh.

[David-Kingsley]

ATTENTION!!!

I just knelt down and prayed (again) that Jesus must show me what is truth and what is not. I considered going to sleep, but I felt I had to open my Bible. I did, and this is what I opened to:

1 Tim 4:

"The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods (in greek: meats), which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth."

Dream: "WATCH, AS I AM COMING!"

Quote:

…

This book, inspired by Jesus, is a foundation of what to do." The angel expounds on

elements of the book. He speaks about morality in the way we dress. He talks about the

over-abundance of makeup. He explains about jewelry and that there is no need to

wear it. He says that even wearing the small symbol of your marriage is a small

compromise, and that one leads to another. There will no longer be marriage in heaven.

and no rings. You were not born with it. The mind will be cleansed of want and craving

and the diet will be given up to that of which God had given Adam and Eve to eat. This

will be done not because of the desire to be one of the 144,000, but because of the love

for the One who is of the Great Love.

…

Dream: A GREAT WORK

Quote:

…

“There is a great work to be done. Remember the

whole universe is watching these important final moments.”

The Herald stands up and we walk through a wall and enter a room. I now see families

sitting down to eat. He explains that they do not know we are there. I realize it is a

special meal for a special occasion. The foods that are spread out on the table are what

one would expect from a worldly person. The individuals hold hands and a prayer is

given that is a mockery to the Creator of the universe." (The Herald speaking)

…

The Herald is still holding my hand as we return to the corridor. We sit down and he

explains that it is now time that we “who are they” correct our diets. We have a great

work ahead of us and the things that we have been fueling ourselves with will prohibit

the Holy Spirit’s work. We are to stop eating any living thing which God created that

flies, walks, or swims.

…

SPREAD THE WORD, THIS IS CRITICAL!!

Will be back for some discussion later, just spread the word.

Thanks to God our Father who delivers me and others from deception. I will write to the site-keepers and Knoll! I am sorry, all I can say is that I was earnest and genuine. Everything is to be tested by the Scripture!

Thank you! May Jesus, our Savior protect and defend you all!

[John317]

... I read the Bible, and I don't see the Sabbath being pushed as the most important issue among Jesus followers.

But why would they have? The Sabbath was not disputed. The way to keep it was certainly disputed, but no one at that time was teaching that the Sabbath had come to an end or that the law of God had been changed.

Some of the reasons the Sabbath is of importance in our day, close to when Christ returns, are

(1) the little-horn power of Daniel 7 and 8 has attempted to change the law of God, specifically the 4th commandment; an attempt made after the close of the NT; leading virtually the entire Christian world to accept the false sabbath;

(2) Revelation shows that just before Christ returns, the Sabbath/Sunday issue will be the main test determining who receives the seal of God and who receives the Mark of the Beast. (It is a given that all of God's moral law is of importance and will be kept by those who receive the seal of God.)

3) There is such a thing as "present truth," meaning that there are some truths that are especially applicable to that particular period of time. For instance, present truth for Noah's time was that they needed to get inside the ark because probation was going to end for that generation. Another example of present truth was the preaching of John the Baptist. In Luther's day, it was justification by faith vs. church tradition, etc. In our own day, present truth is the Third Angels Messages, which includes the Sabbath truth.

[Gail]

Wow!

[John317]

It is also interesting that David Gates (together with seven other pastors) who surely is a dedicated pastor working in the mission fields, winning souls for Christ, also comes to the same conclusion! This is not proof, but strong evidence. He himself mentions the dreams in "The Converging Crisis, part 2".

I understand that David Gates has reversed his view of Ernie Knoll's dreams and now does not believe they are of God. Were you aware of this? I just found it out.

[John317]

1 Tim 4:

"The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods (in greek: meats), which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth."

The Greek [broma] at 1 Tim. 4: 3 is actually not meat as such but solid food. It refers to edible food such as vegetables. Flesh food is kreas and occurs in Romans 14: 21 and 1 Cor. 8: 13.

But you are right that the demons will be very active and deceiving people into believing all kinds of lies, including the ones you refer to in this passage. There will be many others.

All of the messages from God will be in agreement with each other.

Quote:

Thanks to God our Father who delivers me and others from deception. I will write to the site-keepers and Knoll! I am sorry, all I can say is that I was earnest and genuine. Everything is to be tested by the Scripture!

David, come back soon and tell us what happened and what you have found.

[John317]

ATTENTION!!!

I just knelt down and prayed (again) that Jesus must show me what is truth and what is not.....

SPREAD THE WORD, THIS IS CRITICAL!!

Will be back for some discussion later, just spread the word.

Thanks to God our Father who delivers me and others from deception. I will write to the site-keepers and Knoll! I am sorry, all I can say is that I was earnest and genuine. Everything is to be tested by the Scripture!

Thank you! May Jesus, our Savior protect and defend you all!

Let us know what that was all about and what happened. What was critical? And what is your conclusion?

[David-Kingsley]

Well, to be honest, I really do not know what happened. I prayed that my Father would show me what was truth and what was not, and moments later I opened my Bible to the given verse.

The "critical" part was Tim .. 4:1? Or was it 1:4? Hehehe, either of them (concerning the latter day deception about foods/marriage).

I haven't come to any conclusion yet, as a lot of (probably everything) what the dreams teach is true, but I still do not think these dreams have their orgin in the courts of Heaven. The fact that they state a lot of EGW/Bible truths does not prove that they are from our Father. If only 1 % of them differ from what EGW/the Bible teaches, you can be sure they're not from God.

At the moment, I am waiting, watching and praying about this, as well as I keep myself updated on prospective new dreams on Ernie's website.

For instance, I have noticed how the Herald several times makes it clear that all people who do not believe that the messages are from God are forever doomed and without hope of salvation. For those who are familiar with the dreams: I think he clearly mentions this in his testimony of Jesus Christ (can't recall the dream in which this scene is found).

[John317]

For instance, I have noticed how the Herald several times makes it clear that all people who do not believe that the messages are from God are forever doomed and without hope of salvation. ...

That would be enough to cause me real concern. It's one thing to say people will be lost if they reject God's revelation in Jesus. It is entirely different to say that people will be lost if they don't accept the words of a messenger that comes in 2008 and claims to be from God. No messenger came to Ellen White with those words. And that is one reason that the SDA church does not make acceptance of Ellen White a test of faith or membership.

The basis of our acceptance of Ellen White or any other prophetic utterance must be based on study, prayer, and conviction, not on the basis of fear or threat. I don't know of a single instance in the Bible where an angel came and said "if you don't accept what I am telling you, you are forever doomed." Jesus Himself is the only messenger who said anything like that (John 8).

[Morning Glory]

Just tagging on here as I have not read this entire thread........

What struck me was someone's comment re: what is said in these dreams IS from the Bible or Spirit of Prophecy writings, (sorry, old fashioned wording) which led them to think that they were from Above......

In reading the Book of Job I've have difficulty figuring out exactly what Job's "friends" said that was so wrong. They all said things that were "correct"; now I think that is was the context that was wrong. Or was it the harshness with which it was said? I see something along those lines as being the case with these dreams.

Back to the topic at hand.....

Morning Glory

[Beryl]

Quote:

I haven't come to any conclusion yet, as a lot of (probably everything) what the dreams teach is true, but I still do not think these dreams have their orgin in the courts of Heaven. The fact that they state a lot of EGW/Bible truths does not prove that they are from our Father. If only 1 % of them differ from what EGW/the Bible teaches, you can be sure they're not from God.

At the moment, I am waiting, watching and praying about this, as well as I keep myself updated on prospective new dreams on Ernie's website.

For instance, I have noticed how the Herald several times makes it clear that all people who do not believe that the messages are from God are forever doomed and without hope of salvation. For those who are familiar with the dreams: I think he clearly mentions this in his testimony of Jesus Christ (can't recall the dream in which this scene is found).

Hi, David, I only came to this forum today, and read it all so as to catch up on what was happening. I also went to the link that was given. David, this is not from God.

You mention "I keep myself updated on prospective new dreams on Ernie's website." In my opinion, that is playing into the devil's hands! The more that you read his works, the more he will impress on your mind the "truth" of what he is saying, causing you to not see the "little bits" of error.

Just a few quotes from EGW.

"..path of error often appears to lie close to the path of truth." 8T 290.

"Many will stand in our pulpits with the torch of false prophecy..kindled from..the torch of Satan." TM 409,410.

From "The Great Controversy" p624, "As the crowning act in the great drama of deception, Satan himself will personate Christ. The church has long professed to look to the Savour's advent as the consummation of her hopes. Now the great deceiver will make it appear the Christ has come. In different parts of the earth, Satan will manifest himself among men as a majestic being of dazzling brightness, resembling the description of the Son of God given by John the the Revelation. The glory that surrounds him is unsurpassed by anything that mortal eyes have yet beheld. The shout of triumph rings out upon the air, "Christ has come! Christ has come!" The people prostrate themselves in adoration before him, while he lifts up his hands, and pronouces a blessing upon them as Christ blessed His disciples when He was upon the earth. His voice is soft and subdued, yet full of melody. In gentle, compassionate tones he presents some of the same gracious, heavenly truths which the Saviour uttered; he heals the diseases of the people, and then, in his assumed character of Christ, he claims to have changed the Sabbath to Sunday, and commands all to hallow the day which he has blessed. He declares that those who persist in keeping holy the seventh day are blasheming his name by refusing to listen to his angels sent to them with light and truth. This is the strong, almost overmastering delusion."

Satan is a master of deception -- he deceived one third of the innumerable number of angels of heaven sufficiently enough for them to be tossed out of heaven, and it is only by keeping our minds on Jesus that we have any protection from his deceptions now.

From "The Great Controversy" p.625, "Satan will, if possible, prevent them from obtaining a preparation to stand in that day. He will so arrange affairs as to hedge up their way, entangle them with earthly treasures, cause them to carry a heavy, wearisome burden, that their hearts may be overcharged with the cares of this life, and the day of trial may come upon them as a thief."

David, keep your eyes on Jesus, and forget finding out what Satan wants you to keep reading.

God bless,

Beryl

[David-Kingsley]

Quote:

I haven't come to any conclusion yet, as a lot of (probably everything) what the dreams teach is true, but I still do not think these dreams have their orgin in the courts of Heaven. The fact that they state a lot of EGW/Bible truths does not prove that they are from our Father. If only 1 % of them differ from what EGW/the Bible teaches, you can be sure they're not from God.

At the moment, I am waiting, watching and praying about this, as well as I keep myself updated on prospective new dreams on Ernie's website.

For instance, I have noticed how the Herald several times makes it clear that all people who do not believe that the messages are from God are forever doomed and without hope of salvation. For those who are familiar with the dreams: I think he clearly mentions this in his testimony of Jesus Christ (can't recall the dream in which this scene is found).

Hi, David, I only came to this forum today, and read it all so as to catch up on what was happening. I also went to the link that was given. David, this is not from God.

You mention "I keep myself updated on prospective new dreams on Ernie's website." In my opinion, that is playing into the devil's hands! The more that you read his works, the more he will impress on your mind the "truth" of what he is saying, causing you to not see the "little bits" of error.

Just a few quotes from EGW.

"..path of error often appears to lie close to the path of truth." 8T 290.

"Many will stand in our pulpits with the torch of false prophecy..kindled from..the torch of Satan." TM 409,410.

From "The Great Controversy" p624, "As the crowning act in the great drama of deception, Satan himself will personate Christ. The church has long professed to look to the Savour's advent as the consummation of her hopes. Now the great deceiver will make it appear the Christ has come. In different parts of the earth, Satan will manifest himself among men as a majestic being of dazzling brightness, resembling the description of the Son of God given by John the the Revelation. The glory that surrounds him is unsurpassed by anything that mortal eyes have yet beheld. The shout of triumph rings out upon the air, "Christ has come! Christ has come!" The people prostrate themselves in adoration before him, while he lifts up his hands, and pronouces a blessing upon them as Christ blessed His disciples when He was upon the earth. His voice is soft and subdued, yet full of melody. In gentle, compassionate tones he presents some of the same gracious, heavenly truths which the Saviour uttered; he heals the diseases of the people, and then, in his assumed character of Christ, he claims to have changed the Sabbath to Sunday, and commands all to hallow the day which he has blessed. He declares that those who persist in keeping holy the seventh day are blasheming his name by refusing to listen to his angels sent to them with light and truth. This is the strong, almost overmastering delusion."

Satan is a master of deception -- he deceived one third of the innumerable number of angels of heaven sufficiently enough for them to be tossed out of heaven, and it is only by keeping our minds on Jesus that we have any protection from his deceptions now.

From "The Great Controversy" p.625, "Satan will, if possible, prevent them from obtaining a preparation to stand in that day. He will so arrange affairs as to hedge up their way, entangle them with earthly treasures, cause them to carry a heavy, wearisome burden, that their hearts may be overcharged with the cares of this life, and the day of trial may come upon them as a thief."

David, keep your eyes on Jesus, and forget finding out what Satan wants you to keep reading.

God bless,

Beryl

Thank you for replying, Beryl. The Bible itself encourages us to "test the spirits" and find out what is truth and what is not. All prophets must be tested by the Scripture, and that is what I am doing. I read the dreams and compare everything to the Scriptures until I might find something that differs from what the Scripture teaches. If so, I do not have to pay further attention to them, because I then know for sure that they're not heaven-sent. Where I am now, is that I do not know whether they are from God or not. I still do not pay so much attention to them, because I really do not need them, if you see what I mean. A lot of what they talk about, Ellen White already has written in her writings. And any "new info" would be irrelevant, unless it is found in the Bible.

Why do I do this? Because the Bible teaches us that in the latter days, there will be old as well as young people (in plural) who'll be having visions and dreams (Joel 3:1-5). So if we are to find the true prophets, we ought to look for them, don't we? :)

[BobRyan]

I agree that testing all things - and holding fast to what is Good is key!

So far Ernie Knolls appears to pass the test of scripture. And what is pretty facinating is all the objections raised against him so far - also "just so happen" to cut across both Bible writers and Ellen White.

You would think that "people would notice" after a while.

in Christ,

Bob

[CarpeDiem]

Whoa, seriously?! I knew Ernie when I was a kid. I used to play with his daughter. He was a great guy, so I'm not trying to judge him...but read what he's writing!

Haven't you ever read any of the prophecies of Mary to the Catholics? It's the same stuff, almost word-for-word. It's also very similar to the writings of Joseph Smith. This is not the manner nor the spirit in which Ellen White wrote.

Even if everything else he says is great, (I don't know; I haven't read any of his stuff, other than what's been posted on this forum)compare his humility as the servant of God, vs. the humility of Ellen White. I don't think she ever made a blanket statement about the salvation of people who didn't believe in her.

And I think she avoided doing that for a reason: God never told her that! Because God's not like that. The only person one absolutely must believe in is Jesus.

[LifeHiscost]

In a little while every one who is a child of God will have His seal

placed upon him. O that it may be placed upon our foreheads! Who can

endure the thought of being passed by when the angel goes forth to seal

the servants of God in their foreheads?

>From Maranatha - Page 211

[LifeHiscost]

What do you think of the objections brought up on this website, especially concerning the statements made by the Harold on tithing, etc.?

http://www.notaprophet.org/

The question of using 1 John 4: 2 to test whether an angel is of God or not is discussed in the link above. It is just one of the tests, of course, and as pointed out in the link, we have no evidence that evil angels can't say they believe Jesus came in the flesh.

What about this text?

"Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost."1 Corinthians 12:3 KJV

Would saying that Jesus came in the flesh be akin to saying Jesus is Lord?

Just asking.

Regards!

[Daryl]

A lot has happened since the last post here in that Ernie Knolls has stated that his dreams were not from God.

Check out his web sites regarding this.

[Taylor]

Interesting. I was afraid it would all "blow up" for his followers.

[John317]

07/22/2009 - NOTICE FROM 4HisPeople Board: The 4 His People Ministry Board learned of some very disturbing information the week of July 15. This information has led us to believe that though the dreams appear to be of a supernatural source, we now believe that this source was of Satan. Along with the meetings being cancelled and no future meetings authorized by the board, please know that Ernie and Becky Knoll are suspended from any activity related to the 4 His People Ministry.

Please cease contributing funds to this ministry.

For those of you who read the testimony and/or received emails from someone going by the name of “Candace”, we were able to determine through tracking email IP information, that Ernie Knoll is “Candace”. When pressed, he admitted to this on July 21 at 2:43pm in a phone call to two ministry board members. We have also determined that the “Great Commission Counsel” is also Ernie Knoll.

We urge everyone who has a “dream book” to throw it away, as we now understand that there are mind control elements in it.

We sincerely apologize to all who have read and believed these messages. We pray that those whose lives have been affected, including those of us on this ministry team and our families, will find closure. Thankfully, we have a loving Savior in Jesus Christ who is willing to forgive all who come to Him with sincere repentance.

Source: http://www.ernieknoll.org/ernieknoll.htm

[Tammy]

What a scam artist! He ought to go to jail!

[nuff sed]

"Time wounds all heels"

[mikeyswen79]

Thank goodness he admitted it.

[John317]

We need to pray for him and for those who were deceived by him. Ernie is claiming that his own wife was one of those whom he tricked into believing he was having dreams from God.

[LifeHiscost]

The problem with the idea of THE MOST IMPORTANT COMMANDMENT, is that Sabbath is not sited in the Bible as such. I can see it being very important in the context of today, but yet I don't see it being above the other. Could you provide me with Biblical proof.

The indication that the Seventh Day Sabbath commandment is at least as important as any of the other of the nine is found in James.

OTOH____

"Then one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, perceiving that He had answered them well, asked Him, “Which is the first commandment of all?”

Jesus answered him, “The first of all the commandments is: ‘Hear, O Israel, the LORD our God, the LORD is one. And you shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment.

And the second, like it, is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” Mark 12:28-33 NKJV

The person who is a believer that the Holy Scriptures is the voice of God speaking to their soul, has no difficulty in accepting those words. However to those who need to know the identity of the One Who said the commandments are authoritative, the 4th commandment is indispensable as it identifies the Person's legal reason for that authority.

" Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it. "

Exodus 20:9-11 NKJV

Regards!

[LifeHiscost]

John,

The reason is that Sabbath is not more important than salvation

True! However accepting a day to worship contrary to the day the Creator said to remember, is to accept worship of the enemy as just as important as worship of the Creator, which is idolatry and bowing down to another than Jehovah Himself, as god.

"“You shall have no other gods before Me." Exodus 20:3 NKJV

After all, no Christian who believes in living a moral life, believes it's alright to do the opposite of a commandment.

Such as, it's alright to commit adultery, it's alright to covet your neighbors wife, or surely his goods. It's alright to have another god, it's alright to steal if you need it bad enough. It's alright to dishonor your parents, or to murder if you feel like it, or at least if you can't help yourself.

Would you say that if a person accepts those behaviors, he/she

at least puts his/her salvation in jeopardy? For instance if one followed that lifestyle, wouldn't it be difficult to keep oneself confident in the Lord's promises as we experienced the abuse brought on by a life of choices out of control?

And thus___

"For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it."James 2:10 NIV

"Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, this he will also reap."

Galatians 6:7 NASB

Regards!