Woody Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 State Secrets Privilege Why is Obama supporting the State Secrets Privilege when he opposed it during the campaign? What is he up to trying to keep secrets from us? Is this the change that we voted for? From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia The State Secrets Privilege is an evidentiary rule created by United States legal precedent. The court is asked to exclude evidence from a legal case based solely on an affidavit submitted by the government stating court proceedings might disclose sensitive information which might endanger national security,and military secrets in particular as in the case of United States v. Reynolds,[7] the first case that saw formal recognition of the privilege. Following a claim of "State Secrets Privilege", the court rarely conducts an in camera examination of the evidence to evaluate whether there is sufficient cause to support the use of this doctrine. This results in court rulings in which even the judge has not verified the veracity of the assertion.[1] The privileged material is completely removed from the litigation, and the court must determine how the unavailability of the privileged information affects the case Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldona Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Redwood, You just don't quit, do you? It's becoming predictable - open up the World Affairs forum and find another 1-2 anti-Obama threads started by you. (And I'm speaking as a foreigner who doesn't have a vested interest either way. I don't know whether I would have voted for Obama or not. (Hey, most of the time I don't vote at all). I don't think he is the Messiah, but I don't think he is the Antichrist either.) Could the moderators please give Redwood some kind of prize if he manages to go for one week without digging up something negative about Obama? aldona Quote www.asrc.org.au (Asylum Seeker Resource Centre, Melbourne)Helping over 2000 refugees & asylum seekers each monthIMSLP/Petrucci Music LibraryThe Public Domain Music Score Library - Free Sheet Music DownloadsLooking for classical sheet music? Try IMSLP first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe_in_RP Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 That's what freedom is. We don't have to read if we don't want to. When views like his disappear, then we know democracy is fading. I don't agree with his President Obama positions but I strongly support his postings here. Sometimes it sparks other people to post. There are many people who I don't agree with here. But I like seeing their posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Actually, Redwood, I agree with you on wondering about this. It seems to be no different than GWB. Not sure I like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 15, 2009 Author Share Posted April 15, 2009 Hey now ... this will have to be considered a negative post against Obama. We are only allowed two per day. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Well, the day is almost over and then we get to start over. But the real cause for concern is that you and I agree on something in the politics forum. Not sure what to make of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 15, 2009 Author Share Posted April 15, 2009 WOW !!! Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted April 15, 2009 Moderators Share Posted April 15, 2009 To make it freakier still, I agree with Woodie on this one too. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 State Secrets Privilege Why is Obama supporting the State Secrets Privilege when he opposed it during the campaign? What is he up to trying to keep secrets from us? Is this the change that we voted for? I am wondering if I am remembering incorrectly.....but basically, when I saw the news articles, I also agreed with Red.....although, I am thinking that there is probably a more practical reason than the "Obama is out to subvert our individual specific freedoms" syndrome and the "Obama is the anti-Christ" that I continually see from you, Red... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Maybe Redwood is coming over to our side, becoming a little more liberal. I didn't think conservatives were concerned about state secrets. Or maybe he's just trying to get us stirred up, like he sometimes likes to do. You know, like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted April 15, 2009 Members Share Posted April 15, 2009 Not Redwood, oh no. hahahahaha hehehehehe hohohohoho pk Quote phkrause Obstinacy is a barrier to all improvement. - ChL 60 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldona Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 That's what freedom is. We don't have to read if we don't want to. When views like his disappear, then we know democracy is fading. I don't agree with his President Obama positions but I strongly support his postings here. Sometimes it sparks other people to post. There are many people who I don't agree with here. But I like seeing their posts. Redwood is a valued member of ClubAdventist and has a lot of intelligent and well-thought-out input to add to many topics. But he does himself no credit when he is perceived as constantly having an anti-Obama axe to grind. It is like 3ABN being regarded by some sections of the viewing public as "the anti-Catholic TV station." Credibility in other areas will suffer. aldona Quote www.asrc.org.au (Asylum Seeker Resource Centre, Melbourne)Helping over 2000 refugees & asylum seekers each monthIMSLP/Petrucci Music LibraryThe Public Domain Music Score Library - Free Sheet Music DownloadsLooking for classical sheet music? Try IMSLP first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 15, 2009 Author Share Posted April 15, 2009 So ... which side of the fence are you on with the issue of this thread Aldona. You indicated that it was attacking Obama ... but yet ... most here seem to agree with the concern. This is actually the first time I have seen both sides agreeing with an issue. Oh. And thanks for your concern for me. But I am doing just fine. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldona Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I'm not taking a position in this debate. I've learned not to take a position in any debates on the political forum. The tone in here has been so nasty at times in the past few weeks that I'm not in the mood to stick my neck out only to have my head blown off. I'm not good at arguing and verbal abuse. I just thought it was getting predictable, that was all...any thread started by you was automatically anti-Obama. Please carry on. I'll go and lurk somewhere else. aldona Quote www.asrc.org.au (Asylum Seeker Resource Centre, Melbourne)Helping over 2000 refugees & asylum seekers each monthIMSLP/Petrucci Music LibraryThe Public Domain Music Score Library - Free Sheet Music DownloadsLooking for classical sheet music? Try IMSLP first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Jeannieb43 Posted April 16, 2009 Moderators Share Posted April 16, 2009 Obama ... but yet ... most here seem to agree with the concern. Quite the contrary. "Most" here just don't wish to becoming entangled in your mudslinging, so are holding their peace. Quote Jeannie<br /><br /><br />...Change is inevitable; growth is optional.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 Either one agrees or one doesn't. You can take the post on it's merits. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Or you say nothing at all, and keep your opinions to yourself....due to all the "Anti-[insert political opinion]" here.... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
there buster Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Quote: I didn't think conservatives were concerned about state secrets. Liberals like Sandy Berger love them so much they steal them and destroy them. Quote “the slovenliness of our language makes it easier to have foolish thoughts.” George Orwell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I believe that those were COPIES state papers....not the origional documents...But you knew that, didn't you, buster..... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
there buster Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Quote: I believe that those were COPIES state papers....not the origional documents... Well, that makes all the difference. But wait, no, wrong again. Quote “the slovenliness of our language makes it easier to have foolish thoughts.” George Orwell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted April 16, 2009 Moderators Share Posted April 16, 2009 The issue people are trying to raise, Redwood, is that many of us on the left have very serious concerns about some of the things President Obama is doing, and his use of the Official Secrets power is one of those things we're concerned about. It just makes it harder to have an open discussion of those issues, on which our concerns line up with yours, when there are 2-3 new threads every single day in this forum of the 'Obama passed wind in an elevator AND DIDN'T OWN UP THAT HE DEALT IT!!!' variety. My own approach is to be open about these areas of concern and issues, and to post things like Glenn Greenwald's challenges to Obama, and to try to ignore the vexatious anti-Obama posts, but you have to recognise that everything has its costs, and that the anti-Obama barrage makes it harder for anyone but the few strongly anti-Obama people here to participate in this forum. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 I don't mind being the poster child for the Liberal Left to attack. Go ahead ... I happen to be on here far more than most. I have the time. So, you would have me muzzeled. That is your leftist desire. Fine. But that will not change my posting habits. But you are free to bring an equal amount of threads in support of Obama ... that way your leftist friends will have a place to post. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 Just one more thing ... With the example of this thread which was accused of being "mud slinging" .... Below is what I wrote. Please tell me how this question is mud slinging? Quote: State Secrets Privilege Why is Obama supporting the State Secrets Privilege when he opposed it during the campaign? What is he up to trying to keep secrets from us? Is this the change that we voted for? Are these not legitimate questions? Obama opposed this during the election. Now he is supporting and using it. What has caused the change? IF this is mud ... then he deserves it. On the news today ... it was reported that Obama indicated that he would tear up and destroy the papers if they were not classified as 'secrets' and protected under Executive Powers. Destroy documents if he doesn't get his way? Am I just not allowed to question this man when he does things like this. I am asking questions. If we can't have these kinds of discussions ... things like bills passing without reading them ... WILL happen. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I don't mind being the poster child for the Liberal Left to attack. Go ahead ... I happen to be on here far more than most. I have the time. So, you would have me muzzeled. That is your leftist desire. Fine. But that will not change my posting habits. But you are free to bring an equal amount of threads in support of Obama ... that way your leftist friends will have a place to post. All you have to do is listen to the reporter from CNN. Complete bias,derogatory and just plain nasty. With the turn out across the nation yesterday it might be a little unnerving to the left. Liberal MN turned out by the thousands across the state. College towns attracted young people wit signs telling Obama to leave their future alone. Even our local news commented on the orderliness of a large crowd,the rally area clean of trash and no need for riot police. What a contrast to the "law abing left" as exhibited during the primaries. Urine bombs and worse,rito police and police on horseback to control the crowd Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 Good points Bonnie. I saw how that CNN reporter treated a young man with his daughter. Terrible. But typical. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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