Stan Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Hehe - read your own text a little more closely, Bob. Incidentally, this particular 'liberal' is extremely strongly opposed to abortion. I always thought it should be a Liberal issue, they usually stand up for those who can not stand up for themself. Just my opinion. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planey Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Incidentally, this particular 'liberal' is extremely strongly opposed to abortion. Actually Bravus only another Aussie would understand why you wrote 'liberal' and not Liberal. Graeme Quote Graeme____________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True-believer Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 Originally Posted By: Bravus Incidentally, this particular 'liberal' is extremely strongly opposed to abortion. Actually Bravus only another Aussie would understand why you wrote 'liberal' and not Liberal. Graeme Why you picking on the Aussies Planey??? Just because the liberals got kicked out of office at last election, and now labor has taken over, and since then everything in the government isn't going to plan... The labor party has already bankrupted Australia by giving everyone here free money---up to $900+ That is crazy and just plain stupid... Who in their right mind would give away free money just to help the economy???????? Quote Luke 4:19To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True-believer Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 Originally Posted By: Bravus The Catholics are in an awkward position on this, since they oppose abortion but also oppose all forms of contraception. Ironically, without their opposition to contraception, there would be fewer abortions. I think from the Catholic perspective, contraception does the same thing as abortion. So they wouldn't see contraception as a means to decrease abortions. Just my 2cents.... I reckon the SDA's and Catholics should work together on this issue of abortion??? What do you all think??? Can the SDA's work together with The Apostates, with the Mark of the Beast Church//Catholic Church??? There is Christians in both Churches... Can the SDA's and Catholics be universal---work together as one??? Quote Luke 4:19To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Originally Posted By: Bravus Hehe - read your own text a little more closely, Bob. Incidentally, this particular 'liberal' is extremely strongly opposed to abortion. I always thought it should be a Liberal issue, they usually stand up for those who can not stand up for themself. Just my opinion. Indeed think of all the women being killed via aborting them as infants!! Think of all the infant victims seeking a liberal with a heart for the innocent victims! Why in the world would liberals want to be pro-death?? You would think that this would be the ONE thing they got right! in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Just my 2cents.... I reckon the SDA's and Catholics should work together on this issue of abortion??? What do you all think??? I think they should just like Ellen White urged the Adventist church to work closely with the Temperance movement that was being run by - pro-sunday-legislation leaders. But we should DO as the Catholics DO -- as we see that the "Catholic vote" consistently has gone for pro-abortion political candidates except for a very few cases over the past 20 years. in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Jeannieb43 Posted April 27, 2009 Moderators Share Posted April 27, 2009 Originally Posted By: True-believer Just my 2cents.... I reckon the SDA's and Catholics should work together on this issue of abortion??? What do you all think??? I think they should just like Ellen White urged the Adventist church to work closely with the Temperance movement that was being run by - pro-sunday-legislation leaders. But we should DO as the Catholics DO -- as we see that the "Catholic vote" consistently has gone for pro-abortion political candidates except for a very few cases over the past 20 years. in Christ, Bob I prefer the term pro-choice. God created us with freedom of choice. I believe we should foster that same type of choice for all people. Quote Jeannie<br /><br /><br />...Change is inevitable; growth is optional.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 The "choice to murder" has been exercised by various cultures all through history - including the choice to cause infants to "pass through the fire" as we see in the O.T. I suppose there is a way to gloss over all of that as simply "the choices people ought to be allowed to make if they are so inclined" - or maybe it can be filtered as "We should be allowed to kill our infants as a choice but they should not be allowed the choice to kill theirs the way they did with fire in the O.T" - To each his own. Maybe that too is personal choice. in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Adventists and Catholics do not agree on birth control. Our positions on abortion are not identical either - although they are closer than our positions on birth control. Abortion is a horrid sin. No doubt. The mother whom God has created life within should protect and provide for that life and instead she decides to terminate and abandon it. Isaiah 49:15 tells us that a woman can forget her sucking child but that God will not forget us. Such is the case with those that choose abortion. Most women that choose abortion are afraid, feel trapped and pressured by others. They are in crisis thinking mode. They are not making a rationale decision to snuff out the life of their child. They are in a bad situation and just want the circumstances to be different. Studies estimate that the number of abortions performed in countries where it is illegal - like Mexico - are about the same as in the US. However in places where abortion is legal but publicly discouraged, like the Netherlands, the abortion rate is actually lower than in places like Mexico and Kenya. So the real way to reduce abortions seems to be helping women in crisis so they do not see abortion as the best choice for their circumstance. There are Christians that are "pro-choice" because they do not see laws banning abortion as being an effective deterrent. They think it is more effective to reach women through pregnancy crisis centers in an environment where abortion is legal and women have nothing to fear. Catholics are quick to get after the civil government to ban abortion because Catholics do not cherish the separation of church and state. Abortion is illegal in most countries where the Catholic church has a heavy influence on public policy. I do not think an alliance with the Catholic church is politically wise for the Adventist church or individual Adventists themselves. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Adventists and Catholics do not agree on birth control. Our positions on abortion are not identical either - although they are closer than our positions on birth control. Abortion is a horrid sin. No doubt. The mother whom God has created life within should protect and provide for that life and instead she decides to terminate and abandon it. Isaiah 49:15 tells us that a woman can forget her sucking child but that God will not forget us. Such is the case with those that choose abortion. Most women that choose abortion are afraid, feel trapped and pressured by others. They are in crisis thinking mode. They are not making a rationale decision to snuff out the life of their child. They are in a bad situation and just want the circumstances to be different. Studies estimate that the number of abortions performed in countries where it is illegal - like Mexico - are about the same as in the US. However in places where abortion is legal but publicly discouraged, like the Netherlands, the abortion rate is actually lower than in places like Mexico and Kenya. So the real way to reduce abortions seems to be helping women in crisis so they do not see abortion as the best choice for their circumstance. There are Christians that are "pro-choice" because they do not see laws banning abortion as being an effective deterrent. They think it is more effective to reach women through pregnancy crisis centers in an environment where abortion is legal and women have nothing to fear. Catholics are quick to get after the civil government to ban abortion because Catholics do not cherish the separation of church and state. Abortion is illegal in most countries where the Catholic church has a heavy influence on public policy. I do not think an alliance with the Catholic church is politically wise for the Adventist church or individual Adventists themselves. 1. Adventists were quick to get after government to ban the sale of alcohol - EVEN to the point of amending the constitution to get that morals-based legislation passed. Ellen White was in the lead in promoting this united effort with the temperance leaders of her day. Clearly the pro-sunday-legislating temperance leadership did not have as clear an understanding of the separation of church and state - as the SDAs had. 2. The "Catholic Vote" in America went overwhelmingly for pro-abortion candidates in this last election as well as in the 1998 and 1994 elections. And in numerous elections before that aside from the case of Reagan. 3. SDAs and Catholics "could join" on the issue of NOT promoting pro-abortion candidates and of urging for the end of "abortion on demand" and the end of "partial birth abortions" and a number of other atrocities associated with the practice. 4. In Lev 18 God is clear that this killing of infants is one of the gross sins that he will not tolerate and for which he did destroy the nations prior to Israel entering Caanan. in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Well I am glad this thread has not turned political. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.