Higher CAFE Standards Translate to More Deaths

[Key Guy]

From: http://hotair.com/archives/2009/05/19/ob...t-for-starters/

Quote:

Michelle Malkin correctly notes that Pres. Obama’s planned standards for tailpipe emissions from new automobiles will raise the cost of a new car by $600 to $1,300 and continue a regulatory regime that kills motorists. That is more than can be said for the Associated Press, which is trying to bury the increased upfront cost down the memory hole.

As for the increased motorist deaths, which the National Academy of Sciences once estimated at 1,300 to 2,600 in 1993 alone, even a less lethal estimate of 800 excess deaths annually is roughly the number of US troops killed annually during the peak years of the Iraq war. Indeed, the estimated cumulative death toll of 46,000 in 2001 suggests that CAFE standards inflict casualties on the magnitude of Vietnam. The lapdog media, however, does not devote time to reporting the grim milestones when people die in fuel-efficient cars.

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[lazarus]

The estimated deaths did not materialize. Therefore this another bogus claim from conservative bloggers who are clutching at straws.

[Woody]

From: http://hotair.com/archives/2009/05/19/ob...t-for-starters/

Quote:

Michelle Malkin correctly notes that Pres. Obama’s planned standards for tailpipe emissions from new automobiles will raise the cost of a new car by $600 to $1,300 and continue a regulatory regime that kills motorists. That is more than can be said for the Associated Press, which is trying to bury the increased upfront cost down the memory hole.

As for the increased motorist deaths, which the National Academy of Sciences once estimated at 1,300 to 2,600 in 1993 alone, even a less lethal estimate of 800 excess deaths annually is roughly the number of US troops killed annually during the peak years of the Iraq war. Indeed, the estimated cumulative death toll of 46,000 in 2001 suggests that CAFE standards inflict casualties on the magnitude of Vietnam. The lapdog media, however, does not devote time to reporting the grim milestones when people die in fuel-efficient cars.

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Thank you for posting this. It is very informative.

[lazarus]

by the way highway deaths consistently falling since 1980

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/pubs/pl08021/fig7_5.cfm.

[Planey]

Using your logic, timewarp, and in line with the conservative premise that less government is automatically better (for who?) then why not remove all regulations related to cars and other private transport devices? This should greatly lower the prices that the beleaguered car companies would have to charge. Think how this could really lower the road toll? Might even practically wipe it out!

Graeme

[Dr. Shane]

A lot of highway deaths can be reduced by focusing on trucks. Big trucks cause a disproportionate number of accidents. Getting SUVs off the road will help too. An SUV hitting a small car isn't a good thing.

Personally, I think that anyone driving a car with an engine bigger than 4.0 should have to pay an extra $500 tax per year. If they drive one with an engine about 5.0 it should be an extra $1,000 tax.

[bonnie]

A lot of highway deaths can be reduced by focusing on trucks. Big trucks cause a disproportionate number of accidents. Getting SUVs off the road will help too. An SUV hitting a small car isn't a good thing.

Personally, I think that anyone driving a car with an engine bigger than 4.0 should have to pay an extra $500 tax per year. If they drive one with an engine about 5.0 it should be an extra $1,000 tax.

How would you propose getting trucks off the road? Without the trucking industry we would all be in a world of hurt

[Dr. Shane]

We don't have to get trucks of the road. We need to focus on them primarily through our Highway Patrols. Speed limits should be lower for trucks on highways than for cars. Fines should be much higher for traffic violations for trucks. Trucks tailgating cars need to be seriously punished. The bumpers on trucks need to be made so they line up with the bumpers on cars.

[bonnie]

We don't have to get trucks of the road. We need to focus on them primarily through our Highway Patrols. Speed limits should be lower for trucks on highways than for cars. Fines should be much higher for traffic violations for trucks. Trucks tailgating cars need to be seriously punished. The bumpers on trucks need to be made so they line up with the bumpers on cars.

Lower speeds,longer behind the wheel,the higher your prices.

They are taxed to the hilt now. Let's hit them again because the idiot in the little lawn mower thinks he owns the road

Trucks do pay some hefty fines. Most truckers are professionals

Tailgating might not be such a problem if the guy in the little go cart ahead of them has enough brains not to pull out in front of them and then slow down

Maybe you will help them pay for modifying their trucks to line up with car bumpers.

What car bumpers by the way? The one on my little cavalier or on a mazda pickup?

[Dr. Shane]

If the speed limit is lower for trucks, tail gating shouldn't be a problem because the cars will be driving faster. 70 mph for cars and 65 mph for trucks.

Big trucks cause a disproportionate number of accidents so if we want to call the professionals should we add assassins after that adjective?

We shouldn't have to drive tanks that only get 20 mpg in order to protect ourselves from the big trucks on the road.

[bonnie]

If the speed limit is lower for trucks, tail gating shouldn't be a problem because the cars will be driving faster. 70 mph for cars and 65 mph for trucks.

Big trucks cause a disproportionate number of accidents so if we want to call the professionals should we add assassins after that adjective?

We shouldn't have to drive tanks that only get 20 mpg in order to protect ourselves from the big trucks on the road.

[Dr. Shane]

Quote:

I would trust my life to the professionalism of a trucker before that of an idiot behind the wheel of a little car

Minnesota has good drivers. Insurance rates prove that. If everyone drove like Minnesotans the roads would be much safer.

Quote:

75% of truck related accidents are caused by the other vehicle.

I know that is not true in the state of Texas. I have heard the statistics directly from the Texas Department of Public Safety. In Texas, trucks are a problem.

[bonnie]

Quote:

I would trust my life to the professionalism of a trucker before that of an idiot behind the wheel of a little car

Minnesota has good drivers. Insurance rates prove that. If everyone drove like Minnesotans the roads would be much safer.

Quote:

75% of truck related accidents are caused by the other vehicle.

I know that is not true in the state of Texas. I have heard the statistics directly from the Texas Department of Public Safety. In Texas, trucks are a problem.

Maybe some common sense is in order. Truck following to close many times is telling you move over or speed up.

I move. Self preservation is stronger than my desire to get in the way of a trucker. I can figure out he can not maneuver or stop as quickly as I can. As I have little desire to be road kill I don't try to prove a point to somebody that much bigger than me

[Dr. Shane]

Nope, I don't buy that. Truck following too close is truck breaking the law and truck driver should be fined. If it is a repeat offense for truck driver then jail time should be in his future.

[bonnie]

Nope, I don't buy that. Truck following too close is truck breaking the law and truck driver should be fined. If it is a repeat offense for truck driver then jail time should be in his future.

You don't buy what?? I didn't say a trucker following to close was not breaking the law.

Most truckers are pretty heavily invested in taxes ,insurance.

My brothers last truck cost more than my house. What he pays in road taxes,insurance and misc a year he could have fed our family for a year.

Most take pretty good care of their investment. Ticketed for accidents or unsafe driving can make already high expenses go even higher by a great amount

[phkrause]

I agree with you Bonnie about road curtesy. I have been driving for many years and have seen many car drivers driving in the 2nd and 3rd lane of highways, way below the speed limit. I think that vehicles driving below the speed limit cause many of those accidents and should be driving in the first lane. I know for me, if I'm paying attention and see a truck barreling down the road behind me, I move over so he can pass. I remember years ago there used to be more common curtesy on the roads between trucks and cars, have not seen that the last 15-20 years or so. Whenever I see a trackertrailer jack knifed on the road the first thing I think of is, I wonder who cut him off.

pk

[Dr. Shane]

You don't buy what??

I don't buy the idea that a car needs to move over and let a truck pass. Yes, slow traffic should use the far right lane. However I have been in that far right lane and had 18 wheeler so close to me they couldn't possible see me license plate. Many truck drivers (even local ones) get paid by the number of miles they drive. So they have little concern for those around them. They are like taxi drivers zooming around trying to run up the clock. They are dangerous and they kill a lot of people.

[Dr. Shane]

I remember years ago there used to be more common curtesy on the roads between trucks and cars, have not seen that the last 15-20 years or so.

There should be a greater incentive given for Defensive Driving classes. Common courtesy is taught in these classes. When a person gets a minor traffic ticket, they should be able to get one such ticket forgiven each year, without any court costs, upon completion of defensive driving. That is the best way I know to educate drivers.

[phkrause]

I remember that we used to have those to back awhile, not sure if they still do that anymore, at least not here in Mass.

pk

[bonnie]

Quote:

I don't buy the idea that a car needs to move over and let a truck pass. Yes, slow traffic should use the far right lane. However I have been in that far right lane and had 18 wheeler so close to me they couldn't possible see me license plate.

You may want to insist upon your right to stay at a slower speed with a truck behind you or refuse to change lanes. Your right,I haven't the slightest desire to find myself road kill. No doubt about it,he hits me and I am going to lose.

As in anything you will find the rude,aggressive and and obnoxious. Most truckers are not. It is also prudent to figure out that a trucker in the best of cases cannot always guard against any and all going on.

I am going to do my best to keep that and the irresponsible trucker in mind and get myself out of their way

You will find the same driving any vehicle

Quote:

Many truck drivers (even local ones) get paid by the number of miles they drive. So they have little concern for those around them. They are like taxi drivers zooming around trying to run up the clock. They are dangerous and they kill a lot of people.

Owner-operators are more prone to take very good care of their investment and their financial responsibilities in driving that truck.

Each at fault accidents cost them a bundle in higher insurance rates. Rates they can ill afford at times with a good record. Accidents cause them to lose their rating which causes them lower pay in not getting the premium loads. My brother has held number one driver status for over 20 years. Truckers like him are not going to throw that out the window for a few minutes of carelessness.

Add to that at least 2500.00 in truck payments and you have some hefty amounts to pay before you start making a profit.

The last truck my brother purchased was once again the cost of my house.

He and others like him are hardly careless when it comes to their bread and butter.

Over the road truckers do not zoom around trying to run up the clock.

And now,most owner operators do not try to run up the clock.

They have scheduled runs. They can have a mighty tight schedule,especially in bad weather.When they load they of course know their destination and time of delivery. There is no running around trying to drum up more. At times they can pull out after loading and know their next pickup,otherwise they may have dead time on the other end. At times they will have to dead head home,but there is no running around like a taxi driver.

[bonnie]

Quote:

Many truck drivers (even local ones) get paid by the number of miles they drive. So they have little concern for those around them. They are like taxi drivers zooming around trying to run up the clock. They are dangerous and they kill a lot of people.

This is just a irresponsible statement. Owner operators generally get a percentage of the load they are delivering. They are on schedules. Drop load A off at a set time and load B is loaded at a set time. Owner Operators know this in advance.Their loads are scheduled. At times something can happen that a load is cancelled or the driver is rerouted. He still is not zooming around looking for loads.

Many in town drivers are on a hourly wage. Those that are on per mile still can't go zooming around for loads. They have scheduled pickups and deliveries

They do not zoom around looking for loads like a taxi driver looking for fares.

[Amelia]

*gp

Most of the highways in Oregon have dual speed limits. One for cars the other for trucks. Trucks are to drive in the right hand lane except to pass. Slow cars to the right and faster cars to the left.

If a truck is running with it's flashers going, it is driving below the posted speed limit for trucks due to a heavy load or some type of problem. So if you see a truck with flashers on, don't get behind it. Normally a trucker will flash it's lights at a slow moving vehicle indicating it should speed up or move over. And they will also flash lights to a signaling vehicle indicating it's safe to pull into the lane in front of them. Trucks running at speed have an extremely long stopping distance. Way too often I have seen cars cut trucker short in passing causing them to downshift and brake. If the driver has a short cab it can easily tip a cab onto it's face.

Then there are the car drivers who drive in the wake. This is so dangerious. If the trucker has to stop short that car is compacted into the back end. Truckers have a blind spot and wake driving puts you in that blind spot. Cars need stay back far enough to see the side mirror of the truck. That way the trucker can see you.

Granted there are always going to be jerky truckers as there are jerky car drivers. But as a whole truckers drive as safe as they can.

IMHO, if a car driver can't drive the speed limit on the highway, they shouldn't be on it. Slow drivers are as much a danger as a speeder. Just last week I had a driver ahead of me on the on-ramp to I84, slow down instead of speeding up to wait for an opening. Almost honked the noise right out of my horn.

[carolaa]

I don't get it. How does more regulation cause motorist deaths?

[Dr. Shane]

We have a lot of construction going on where I live and the roads are filled with trucks carrying fill dirt and asphalt. These drivers get paid by the mile and they know the more trips they can make from the pit to the job site in a day the more money they make. They are incredibly dangerous. Taxi cab drivers do a better job on the road. Often times when traffic is backed up there is an accident ahead with a truck.

carolaa, the concern is that new regulations will result in smaller cars which are less safe. Some believe we should all have to drive tanks and hummers in order to stay safe on the road. I say that smaller cars don't have to be unsafe if we keep our roads safe.

[bonnie]

Quote:

We have a lot of construction going on where I live and the roads are filled with trucks carrying fill dirt and asphalt. These drivers get paid by the mile and they know the more trips they can make from the pit to the job site in a day the more money they make. They are incredibly dangerous. Taxi cab drivers do a better job on the road. Often times when traffic is backed up there is an accident ahead with a truck.

Local construction work really does not reflect the drining of owvr the road company owned or owner operators.

It may be that the incredibly dangerous trucker has been placed in that position by a incredibly stupid car driver . Drivers are warned by signs for construction work. That is why there is a big fine for violation. Taxi drivers,good or bad do not spend their days in construction zones to operate their business.

The often times you see truck accidents in your area were caused by what and by whom?

Company drivers do not stay company drivers very long accumulating moving violations or accidents. Their insurance claims would go thru the roof. Owner Operators don't either. My brothers were number 1 and 2 drivers for the same company. One still is number one. He is in part because of his driving record and delivery on time. This has accounted for their pick of the crop of higher paying loads.

Quote:

the concern is that new regulations will result in smaller cars which are less safe. Some believe we should all have to drive tanks and hummers in order to stay safe on the road. I say that smaller cars don't have to be unsafe if we keep our roads safe.

I don't think anyone has said we need hummers or tanks.That may be what you wish has been said.

By the time they are done with cap and trade and the automobiles being manufacturerd that most don't want you might see what it could harm.

Those that want a bigger automoble should be able to buy.

Quote:

I say that smaller cars don't have to be unsafe if we keep our roads safe.

Here again we have the "nanny government"

I had a 78 olds . That was a big car. The hood was at least 3/4 as long as my current car.

There is no way to make my little car as safe as that one.

Nor can my little car accommodate a family with more than 2 children.