Moderators Gerr Posted June 14, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2009 Originally Posted By: Twilight My carnal nature had to be nailed to the cross, not my "humanity". Where does your bent-to-self (your nature) reside? Let me direct you to Paul: Romans 7:17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my flesh (body - humanity). ....20 it is sin living in me that does it. ....23 I see another law at work in the members of my body [humanity], waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. In your body...in your flesh...in your members (your body parts). Now, tell me, where this bent-to-self is so you can operate and cut it out. Yes? That's why Jesus said, "you must be born again!" And once you who profess to be the expert on what "in Christ" really means, then you will understand that: "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away, behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself...." 2 Cor 5:17,18 ESV. Quote: EGW: By His obedience to all the commandments of God, Christ wrought out a redemption for man. This was not done by going out of Himself to another, but by taking humanity into Himself. Thus Christ gave to humanity an existence out of Himself. To bring humanity into Christ, to bring the fallen race into oneness with divinity,is the work of redemption." (RH April 5, 1906). What kind of logic is a mind that professess to be superior using to quote someone he considers an unreliable source to shore up his arguments? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted June 14, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2009 Originally Posted By: Twilight That is saying that the human part of Christ's nature died. Please be honest. Dishonesty is the same as a lie. The text is clear: " YOU died to the law in the body of Christ" So you die to the law in the body of Christ, and now you can live outside/beyond the law? And Christ's death now becomes my license to continue in a life of sin? Paul says: God forbid! May it never be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted June 14, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2009 Paul: "We know that our old self was crucified WITH him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing. so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin." Rom 6:6 ESV. Until you see this truth, you will continue to preach that the "in Christ" is not also "with Christ" and so remains divorced from real experience. "For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his.......For one who has died has been set free from sin. Now if we have died WITH Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. ....For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. SO YOU ALSO MUST CONSIDER YOURSELVES DEAD TO SIN AND ALIVE TO GOD IN CHRIST JESUS. LET NOT SIN THEREFORE REIGN IN YOUR MORTAL BODIES, TO MAKE YOU OBEY THEIR PASSIONS." Rom 6:5-12 ESV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away, behold, the new has come. Sorry, all things have not become new for you....You still retain your mortal life indwelt with sin. Yes, you have received an enlightened mind, or have you? The only change in the believer at the new birth is a new heart (mind). So, your quote reference is totally out of context, but I've touched on this before....You just forgot, again.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 So you die to the law in the body of Christ, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 Paul: "We know that our old self was crucified WITH him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing. so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin." Rom 6:6 ESV. Right, "in Christ"....Read Romans 8:2....Same thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 Paul: "We know that our old self was crucified WITH him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing. so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin." Rom 6:6 ESV. I just noticed your translation isn't the best. Here's a better one: "We know that our old self [our fallen life from Adam] was crucified with him [refers to the cross] so that the body of sin ["sin living in my memembers" - my body] might be destroyed [done away with], and we might no longer be enslaved to sin." [The New Revised Standard Version] If a man came up and shot you, I can guarantee that you would no longer be enslaved to sin. That's what Christ did to our humanity...He submitted it to the eternal grave. Sunday morning God raised Him with a glorified humanity. The old one stayed in the grave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted June 14, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2009 Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away, behold, the new has come. Sorry, all things have not become new for you....You still retain your mortal life indwelt with sin. Yes, you have received an enlightened mind, or have you? The only change in the believer at the new birth is a new heart (mind). So, your quote reference is totally out of context, but I've touched on this before....You just forgot, again.... Enlightened mind without an enlightened life? Isn't it time to take your fantasy theology and hit the road, Robert! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted June 14, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2009 Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo So you die to the law in the body of Christ, No Gerry, it says "you died (past tense)..." not you die....Try to get your grammar straight.... You might want to tell and correct Paul who said, "I DIE DAILY!" Quote: Quote: and now you can live outside/beyond the law? As far as the law is concerned I'm a dead, killed by the law itself. Since I accepted my death in Christ the law can't touch me. Hence, "the law brings wrath, but where there is no law neither is there any transgression." DEAD PEOPLE DON'T GO AROUND BREAKING THE LAW! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted June 14, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2009 I just noticed your translation isn't the best. Here's a better one: "We know that our old self [our fallen life from Adam] was crucified with him [refers to the cross] so that the body of sin ["sin living in my memembers" - my body] might be destroyed [done away with]' date=' and we might no longer be enslaved to sin." [The New Revised Standard Version'] I have an NRSV and it doesn't match what you quoted. You shouldn't pass off YOUR translation/paraphrase as that done by a scholarly group! And you were rebuking Twilight for dishonesty? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 Enlightened mind without an enlightened life? Isn't it time to take your fantasy theology and hit the road, Robert! Are you walking as Christ? Why not? No use to point those fingers at me when three of them (assuming you have all your fingers) are pointing at you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 You might want to tell and correct Paul who said, "I DIE DAILY!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 14, 2009 Author Share Posted June 14, 2009 I have an NRSV and it doesn't match what you quoted Here's my quote: "We know that our old self [our fallen life from Adam] was crucified with him [refers to the cross] so that the body of sin ["sin living in my memembers" - my body] might be destroyed [done away with], and we might no longer be enslaved to sin." [The New Revised Standard Version] Now compare: Rom 6:6 NRS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lutz13 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 You know, after much thought and asking God questions. It comes down to this. If we are to have agape love. Then we also have to have a mindset like Christ. Lets say you have a guarantee to make it to heaven. Now lets say some guy came in and killed your whole family. Would you be willing to trade places with that guy? Give him your guarantee into heaven and you take his spot of eternal death? Would you trade that guy? If you had agape love, you would. You see, our God was beat, spit on, mocked, kicked, and crucified, and He still said "forgive them". He still wanted to trade spots. He wanted to give it all up so that all of those people would have life forever. God asks us to be the same way. Am I that way now? No way, not even close. That is what this walk is all about though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted June 16, 2009 Author Share Posted June 16, 2009 So, ask Gerry where the self-love is in that kind of love? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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