Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted January 31, 2005 Moderators Share Posted January 31, 2005 There may be some forums that can be publicly mentioned, where people can be alerted to the general subject matter, and and be allowed in. But, there is another catagory where such should not be done. If Mrs. Smith wants to discuss a personal issue affecting her life, she should be allowed to do so in a private forum where she selects the people who will be invited in, and the general public does not know that such a discussion is going on. Quote Gregory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Absolutely. I agree. We need to keep those forums strictly private. However, there are some forums that could be more open and I think they should be. A place for people who are seeking a place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted January 31, 2005 Administrators Share Posted January 31, 2005 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> There may be some forums that can be publicly mentioned, where people can be alerted to the general subject matter, and and be allowed in. But, there is another catagory where such should not be done. If Mrs. Smith wants to discuss a personal issue affecting her life, she should be allowed to do so in a private forum where she selects the people who will be invited in, and the general public does not know that such a discussion is going on. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> There used to be a place where announcements were made to inform members of the foundation of a private forum. As Gregory has stated, there are some private places that are more personal than others- I remember one which had only one member plus admin access. As the need is seen, communication is made. I have done it often- seen a particular interest/experience in a member and have approached him/her regarding the private interest fora. The basis for establishing these private fora in the first place was actually experimental. We wanted to see how folks would react given more breathing space with issues that were perhaps more volatile and disturbing to others, in order to keep them off the public board. The results so far, as far as I can tell, have been positive all the way round. I know of one (at least) that has been discontinued for lack of use, and there may be more, but the reason for the privacy was as Gregory has stated, that as in real life there are times when confidentiality is beneficial. As was mentioned, entrance is upon request to any admin and is at his/her discretion. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted January 31, 2005 Moderators Share Posted January 31, 2005 Neil: You could have been more civis in your response to Fran. But, for whatever reason, you chose not to be. Quote Gregory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Jeannieb43 Posted January 31, 2005 Moderators Share Posted January 31, 2005 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> Again, I failed in leadership for doing what I did, and ask forgiveness. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Stan, where you might have "failed in leadership" escapes me. I can't see any place where you failed. But you do have my forgiveness, certainly. [Why do we always seem to want what we can't have? There's already plenty for everybody here, IMHO. I've never had time even to read everything that's available.] Quote Jeannie<br /><br /><br />...Change is inevitable; growth is optional.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Yes, Gail, I realize that you have invited others as the needs seems prevalent. What I am saying is that there might be a need for someone who is in NO WAY going to make that need known to you or others in the general viewing area. Me? I'm not afraid to talk about having been an adulteress. Others, however, might be. They might not want ANYONE in their personal circle to know. There are soemthing like 1500 anonymous visitors here, aren't there? Surely, someone who knows me has been here reading some of what I post--and I'm completely unaware. So, if I wish to join a private group concerning something sinful in nature, I'm not going to make it aware to anyone reading these forums. But, if I knew there was a forum for people like me that was private, I might ask to join. Doesn't this make sense to anyone but me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 31, 2005 Moderators Share Posted January 31, 2005 I wonder wther there's a way to simply have a list of all the forums like that. (There may still be a very few that want to be completely secret, and to me that is completely appropriate. To say otherwise is to suggest I should allow anyone who wants to plant a bug in my house to do so... Openness *does* have legitimate limits.) Particularly forums relating to particular issues, I think Fran and Christine have a point that it's hard for mods to know who might need such forums, so having a list that allows people to approach the mods for admission makes a lot of sense. Is that doable, just as a list of titles, Stan? It wouldn't be the same as opening the actual forums up to view with their thread titles and so on available to everyone - I'm talking about a simple plain text list within a post (maybe a 'sticky' that's always accessible). I think your perspective does make a lot of sense, Christine, but I also think a complete 'all access' approach is not necessary. (And finally, it's not about what is paid for. For a start, the model is 'user-supported service', like PBS, not 'fee for service', like cable. And for another thing, having a private forum with low bandwidth costs almost nothing now the service is here, and I for one am happy to support that for someone who needs it.) Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Posted January 31, 2005 Author Share Posted January 31, 2005 Boy Neal, You sure do have me wrong! That is neither here nor there. Nico; You are right, every experience is different. The group I speak of is out of New Orleans, and that is where I intend to leave them! Enough said. I was not trying to be rude to you. I just meant you have a right to your stories and I have a right to mine and I do not wish to intrude on yours in any forum whatsoever. I do not question that you belong to a private forum. I just don't feel a need for a private forum. Neil; I did not lament my troubles to get on a forum. My point was, if these places exist what does a person have to do to get there? Don't offer me a private forum, because I won't go! My point was shock and awe to let you see you can not know about a private person unless they say something in public. Sorry you were offended by such a small part of me. So was I! You don't have to worry, I did not mean to *lament* to anyone. I am fine. I can deal with what God has dealt to me. I've figured out a long long time ago that Christ is my only help in time of need. I did not ask to be on a private forum Neil. I questioned why I was not aware of what was there. I wanted to know what we were hiding. I got my answer. Don’t worry; I won’t be joining any of them, what or where ever they are. There is no need to fear! I still don’t know what or where they are! You are all safe from *lamenting me*! Now, remember that laughter is still the best medicine! This is not meant to offend. Bravus; You missed the bus man; all the way around. Everything in this world is not (a) or (. I never meant to offend anyone. Sorry if I have. Now, everyone go back and reread the first post. Is there anything there that is true about CA in general and specific? Do we fit? Are we so blinded by our own thoughts that we cannot see others? Just how do we reflect the Adventist church? I believe that everyone on this forum could do a good shock and awe of their own. I am not alone! My point was this, which person was it that died and made these other certain people, who ever they are, the judges of who belongs and does not belong! Maybe Stan should list the person/s that needs to be contacted for an invite to a private forum. CA has missed the mark by a long shot. Maybe the first post was right and we do need to look in the mirror. Over and out! Quote The greatest want of the world is the want of men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true & honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty..., men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.{Ed 57.3} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 31, 2005 Moderators Share Posted January 31, 2005 OK, glad to know I missed the mark. I think that Christine has suggested a workable solution to your concerns. Do you agree? Two more points: (a) (hehe) Is it our job to reflect the Adventist church? Or just ourselves? (And as it happens, i think we do a pretty decent job of reflecting the totality of the SDA church - which is a hospital for sinners) ( I suspect we probably are sometimes so blinded by our own thoughts that we have trouble understanding those of others. But we're all trying - that's (mostly) why were on a forum where we'll be challenged, not alone somewhere. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Quote: There may still be a very few that want to be completely secret, and to me that is completely appropriate. To say otherwise is to suggest I should allow anyone who wants to plant a bug in my house to do so... Openness *does* have legitimate limits. Absolutely. I should have been more clear. A list of the forums that are open to others who wish to have a semi-private place to go; the ones that have been initiated by a member and are by invitation by that member only should stay that way. Bravus, you say it so much better than I. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted January 31, 2005 Moderators Share Posted January 31, 2005 This is just a reply, and is not directed to Fran: I will suggest that the resolution lies with the person who requests the private forum: a) Some will request a semi-private forum that published as such, and will be open to those who request membership, and are approved by the person who requested the forum. Several of these types exist, and they are commonly known by many people here. Others will request a private forum where the existence of that forum is private, and members are asked by the one who requested it to join. This type also exists. This type should not be published as to its existance. There is no need for any to know about them other than those who are invited to participate. Quote Gregory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 It would be my preference that the moderators of the forums would be he ones to make an announcement from time to time. AND that the moderator recommend to an admin, on who to give access to. One problem with doing a general post, is that so many people will say .... sign me up... ALSO members can invite like members and let the moderators know. Not sure it is best for the admins to tell each of the moderators who should join and who should not join. FRAN, I would really love it if you were willing to take on those two forums. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> This is just a reply, and is not directed to Fran: I will suggest that the resolution lies with the person who requests the private forum: a) Some will request a semi-private forum that published as such, and will be open to those who request membership, and are approved by the person who requested the forum. Several of these types exist, and they are commonly known by many people here. Others will request a private forum where the existence of that forum is private, and members are asked by the one who requested it to join. This type also exists. This type should not be published as to its existance. There is no need for any to know about them other than those who are invited to participate. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Good stuff here Gregory!! Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 There is one in particular that I'm part of which I don't want public, personally. I don't know how it started so I don't know if it would be one of those thrown open or not. I was under the understanding that people were invited individually and quietly in PM like I was. If this is going to change please notify me first so I can save my posts from my personal thread there and have the thread deleted before the door is flung open. Think of it as a courtesy knock on a bathroom door -- I'd like to at least don a towel and/or finish my "business". Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 This is the first forum that has allowed me to fully express my opinions LOULDLY! This forum let's me question traditional Adventism, and for that reason the person putting down this forum has probably encountered me [now I'm getting the big head ].... You see if you come here to promote a false gospel, I am not going to let you get by with it! I guess some don't like that, so they [he/she] badmouth CA....Well, we are still standing, bubba!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Quote: Nico; .... I was not trying to be rude to you. I forgive you. Quote: I just meant you have a right to your stories and I have a right to mine and I do not wish to intrude on yours in any forum whatsoever. Who says you'd be "intruding"? Needing help isn't a competition; support is meant to be shared. I can't speak for others, but in general the only thing I'd feel to be "intrusive" would be if someone were to come there -- to a place where I'm emotionally and spiritually vulnerable -- and treat me in an unsafe manner. Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Quote: I should have been thoughtful enough to not mention those private forums. ... Again, I failed in leadership for doing what I did, and ask forgiveness. You're forgiven for MAKING A MISTAKE ... but you did NOT fail anyone, OK? YOU HEAR ME MR. STAN??? Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatLakesGramma Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Quote: Now, everyone go back and reread the first post. Is there anything there that is true about CA in general and specific? Do we fit Fran, I've re-read the first post, and as far as I'm concerned, the poster is all wet. I have seen little here that resembles his description, except for the part about vulgarity. That is one thing I do agree could stand some improvement. And I'm not talking about some off-color joke forum. I'm thinking of some of the crude remarks that have been made in the course of the normal discussions here in town hall. I'm not talking about subject matter either, but rather the use of crude and vulgar expressions to attempt to add some kind of misguided emphasis to the point being made by the poster. I could probably go find some examples and post them here, but I'd rather not. It might take more time than I can afford to spare looking for them, as I do not remember what threads to look in, or what exact words I could use to search for them. I could name one guilty party who I seriously considered putting on ignore after reading one of his posts, but I'm not trying to point fingers or shame anyone, and there may be others who've done the same that I haven't read. But I would like to say to all - Friends, if you can't state your case without getting crude, maybe it doesn't have as much merit as you think it does. Vulgarity does not inspire respect for your position, it does just the opposite. Quote Catherine God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. Psalm 73:26. "To be a Christian means to forgive the inexcusable, because God has forgiven the inexcusable in you." -- C. S. Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Quote: Friends, if you can't state your case without getting crude, maybe it doesn't have as much merit as you think it does. Vulgarity does not inspire respect for your position, it does just the opposite. You may have a valid point here Christine. However, it runs two ways. First of all: vulgarity or crude speech does not, in itself, constitute "verbal abuse", and there are those who have proven themselves QUITE adept at verbally abusing and pushing the buttons of others WITHOUT the use of obvious "vulgarities" of speech. Does this make them more righteous than those whom they provoke and provide a stumblingblock unto? HARDLY. Are those who react to this provocation with a vulgar expression more to be faulted than those presumably sufficiently "mature" to have eradicated (or never developed) "vulgarities" of speech? HARDLY. So you see, there is MUCH MORE to be examined here than the surface flotsam. MUCH more. And personally, there are also those who throw up excuses like this ("I don't like your tone" -- "I don't like the words you use") to avoid listening to others and hearing from them. All too often, it becomes just another way to "shoot the messenger." And no more impressive as such than the vulgarities of expression you decry. Personally, I'm tired of seeing the lame demanded to walk to satisfy the lazinesses of those with two working legs -- so to speak. But that's just me. And just to reiterate: my stating all this does NOT make your point any less valid. Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Quote: Boy Neal, You sure do have me wrong! That is neither here nor there. Which and where? Mea culpa. Posts on this side of the screen are colored only by the emotional baggages one carrys... It looked to me to be a manipulative gesture, to which I will say, I was wrong. [Hey, Didn't I start out the post with- I must of woke up on the wrong side of the bed!] My point was that nobody can get into a forum just parading thier woes. They have to ask. Others within the forum may recognise a problem and extend an invitation, but to parade one's life history in order to get that coveted invite, reeks of manipulation. That is what I apparently saw. Since then, I have realized I mis-read the post. My public appologies to Fran [in addition to the private ones]. My emotional baggage is one where I hate to be manipulated. Having seen this manipulation in other forums, I need to remember that there are others here who are just as capable of seeing things as I am and are quite able to take appropriate action. I am sorry for that lack of trust in the moderator's abilities and of their judgements. Quote: I wanted to know what we were hiding. I got my answer. Don’t worry; I won’t be joining any of them, what or where ever they are. I wouldn't want you to turn any of them down if you were invited. Quote: There is no need to fear! I still don’t know what or where they are! You are all safe from *lamenting me*! Now, remember that laughter is still the best medicine! This is not meant to offend. Oh, we know. See tagline- Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve.  George Bernard Shaw  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted February 1, 2005 Moderators Share Posted February 1, 2005 Christine, as moderator of Town Hall I'm aware of the vulgarity issue and have made the odd edit. Have you noticed improvement in the past couple of weeks? I'm trying to stay on top of it - not censoring as such but just encouraging people to scratch their heads a little and come up with a different form of emphasis... Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatLakesGramma Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Nico, I wasn't thinking of any vulgarities used in responding to abuse, just someone using some crude, disgustingly descriptive language in speaking of something he has an issue with. If you yourself have used vulgar language in responding to someone who you felt had abused you, I don't remember it, so I'd say it probably was nothing compared to the series of crude posts that almost inspired me to put a certain individual on ignore a few months ago. I agree with you concerning the problem of verbal abuse. It is more common and more serious, but I was addressing only the issues brought up by the poster. And he's completely ignored that issue, which I consider to be quite a different thing than what he describes as controversy with the "in" crowd, and what happens when it occurs. The only abuse I've observed is from individuals who speak only for themselves and not in agreement with any so-called administrative bias. Quote Catherine God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. Psalm 73:26. "To be a Christian means to forgive the inexcusable, because God has forgiven the inexcusable in you." -- C. S. Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatLakesGramma Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Bravus, I haven't actually seen anything vulgar in a while. In fact the crudeness I referred to was rebuked at the time, though I don't remember by who, but if the posts were edited, they should have been edited a lot more than they were. The one I remember being rebuked should have been deleted entirely, as there was nothing in the entire post BUT vulgarity. I didn't realize that the editing I've seen lately might have been for vulgarity. The thought that has come to me as I've see it was that it probably had to do with abusiveness. So I thought the absence of vulgarity was just because someone was in a better frame of mind lately. Quote Catherine God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. Psalm 73:26. "To be a Christian means to forgive the inexcusable, because God has forgiven the inexcusable in you." -- C. S. Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 2, 2005 Share Posted February 2, 2005 Quote: If you yourself have used vulgar language in responding to someone who you felt had abused you, I don't remember it, so I'd say it probably was nothing compared to the series of crude posts that almost inspired me to put a certain individual on ignore a few months ago. OK, thanks for the reality check. I have to really, REALLY bite my cyber-tongue sometimes when I am provoked. I developed the unfortunate habit of cussing around the age of 8 or 9 (like many kids do who don't have the benefit of a Christian home and/or school) and often when provoked I have really just wanted to post two words back: one starting with "F" the other ending in "U"! But I have refrained. However, some have taken exception to lighter words I've used to emphasize and/or express feeling, such as "freaking" and "[censored]". They think even this is vile and ought to be grounds for persecuting me all the way off the board. Some people have no lives, I suppose ... nevertheless I'm trying to make an effort to avoid even using those overmuch -- in the spirit of Philippians 2:4 -- for them and for my Lord, not because I necessarily feel like I "want" to or even that I "should". Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka Posted February 3, 2005 Share Posted February 3, 2005 "I'm trying to make an effort to avoid even using those overmuch -- in the spirit of Philippians 2:4 -- for them and for my Lord, not because I necessarily feel like I "want" to or even that I "should". I acknowledge having seen a vast improvement in your explosives. Be they ad hominem, idioms, negatives of slang in your general tone of complaining or undercurrant of sarcasm. I have left you alone and purposely did not interact with you in public talking after I became aware in knowing you were not on medication for your bi-polar mental sickness as you mentioned yourself in some thread. I never disagreed that you are a child of God as you confessed to be. I accepted that. I see you are contributing well now in a beautiful way of thinking about how your posts affect others. This is where I want to say thank you. It must be everso hard for you to get into moderation with your ability of verbiage. This adapting your expressional creativity here on the boards is an act of kindness and love to others to avoid shock effects that don't jar the readers who have another set of values when it comes to online postings. I pray that the seeing of me through a negative self-defensive filter will in time get healed as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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