Health care Bill passes house

[CyberGuy]

Final count 220 Yea 215 Nay

One republican voted for the bill so Nancy Polosi can claim bi partisenship. Also she did not allow the bill to be posted for 72 hours ahead of the vote.

Now this goes to the senate. No vote is expected until December there.

[Dr. Shane]

A lot of political capital was spent there. Those numbers tell us quite a few Democrats voted against it.

[CyberGuy]

176 republicans voted against the bill and 1 republican voted for the bill. The rest of the count were democrats.

The lone republican vote was from Louisianna whose district is part of New Orleans. He narrowly won and on election day a hurricane was threatening New Orleans keeping many democrat voters at home. New Orleans was heavily pro health care bill and the democrats were pressuring him to vote for the bill. It worked. Political capital was indeed spent here.

Now the democrats can claim bipartisonship support for the bill because of the one republican vote.

[Dr. Shane]

I was watching them live, congratulate themselves last night. When one of them mentioned that it was a bipartisan bill, the rest of them broke out in laughter. Apparently the press corps was laughing too.

It doesn't sound like too bad of a bill to me. I think most of the objectionable features will be removed in the Senate where it faces much more opposition.

[CyberGuy]

Democrats’ health care bill has mandates and penalties

By DAVE HELLING

The Kansas City Star

The House Democrats’ bill is called the Affordable Health Care for America Act, HR 3962. The information below was gathered from the bill’s text, an analysis by the Congressional Budget Office, an analysis by the non-partisan Kaiser Family Foundation, and reporting by The Associated Press. Links to those sources can be found at kansascity.com.

What’s the goal of the bill?

“To provide affordable, quality health care for all Americans and reduce the growth in health care spending, and for other purposes,” according to the text.

Would I have to have health insurance?

Yes, or pay a penalty of 2.5 percent of your income. Hardship and religious waivers would be available, and some very low-wage earners would be exempt. The requirement would begin in 2013.

People who don’t get insurance and don’t pay the penalty face fines and possibly jail time.

Would my employer have to provide it?

Yes, or pay a penalty of 8 percent of payroll. Companies with payrolls under $500,000 would be exempt. Companies would have to pay 72.5 percent of the cost of the premium for a single worker and 65 percent of premium costs for a family policy, and small companies could get tax credits to help pay their costs.

Could I keep my current insurance?

Probably, at least for a while. Your employer could always change your carrier, and it’s possible employers might decide it’s cheaper to pay the 8 percent penalty and drop coverage for workers, forcing you to buy coverage elsewhere.

It’s also possible your coverage won’t meet standards for a basic policy, and would have to be changed when the bill is fully implemented.

What if I don’t have a job and can’t afford insurance premiums?

Beginning in 2013 you could get subsidies, based on your income, to buy your own insurance. Subsidies would end at 400 percent of the federal poverty level, or $88,000 for a family of four.

What if I use Medicaid, the insurance program for the poor?

Medicaid eligibility would be expanded to include everyone earning less than 150 percent of the federal poverty level, or $33,075 for a family of four. States would have to pick up some of the additional costs beginning in 2015.

How would I find health insurance?

For those not insured at work, a national health exchange would be established beginning in 2013 where you could compare and buy coverage, using subsidies if you qualify. States could set up their own exchanges, which could be expanded beyond individuals and small businesses to include large businesses, too.

Could I get a government-run public policy in the exchange?

Yes, if you’re not covered at work. You would pay a premium, just like a private policy, and the government would negotiate with doctors and hospitals to establish payments for services.

Could my children get coverage under my policy?

Yes, until age 27.

Will insurers have to accept me, even with pre-existing medical conditions?

Yes, and premiums could not be increased based on illness or gender. The bill also establishes a temporary “high risk” pool, beginning next year, so individuals with uncovered pre-existing conditions now could get insurance and not have to wait for the exchange to start.

How much is this going to cost?

The CBO said it would cost $1.052 trillion over the first 10 years to expand insurance coverage. Because people who don’t buy insurance and businesses that don’t provide it would pay penalties, the budget office said the net cost would be $891 billion over 10 years.

[Dr. Shane]

What about the death panels?

[bonnie]

http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics/story/1556149-p2.html

Tell me again what this is all for........

Who pays for it?

Individuals earning more than $500,000 and couples earning more than $1 million will pay a 5.4 percent income tax surcharge, raising $460 billion over 10 years.

There are other taxes and fee increases, including a $20 billion fee for makers of medical devices and a limit on how much you can put into existing flexible spending accounts.

What about Medicare?

The bill cuts roughly $425 billion from projected spending on Medicare and Medicaid over 10 years. The Medicare cuts would largely come from Medicare Advantage, an HMO-like program involving private insurers.

Will the plan reduce the cost of health care?

Unclear. There are mechanisms designed to lower costs, like requiring the government to negotiate drug prices under Medicare, better use of technology, and efforts against “waste, fraud, and abuse.” It isn’t known how well they’ll work.

Does it cover everyone?

No. The CBO estimates 18 million people under age 65 will be uninsured in 2019, including about 6 million illegal immigrants.

The CBO said about 96 percent of Americans under the age of 65 would have insurance, though, compared with about 83 percent coverage today.

If you take the current figure and eliminate those already qualifying for medicaid and don't sign up,eliminate the illegal immigrants as Old Honest Abe said he was,the ones that simply don't want insurance the numbers before and after are not very far apart.

18 million without insurance is within the numbers already quoted for the chronically uninsured. So we are doing this why??

[Dr. Shane]

The more I hear about the details of the bill the more I like it. There are some parts that I expect the Senate to get rid of, like the public option, and that is a good thing. If the Senate replaces the public option with heath-care co-ops I would be very happy.

[bonnie]

The more I hear about the details of the bill the more I like it. There are some parts that I expect the Senate to get rid of, like the public option, and that is a good thing. If the Senate replaces the public option with heath-care co-ops I would be very happy.

I have never had any doubt you would like someone else paying more for everyone's insurance.

The one part I do like if this goes thru is the more than good chance your employer is going to dump you and others to a government run health care.If they have the brains to run a successful business most will.

Saves the employer and let's the government take care of those that refuse to take the responsibility for their own.

While we all pay for the down turn in the economy it also makes me feel a bit better of the many business that will voluntarily close their doors. Those that can retire and cut the rug out from their employee's and the government is not a bad thing,except for those looking for a free ride.

You are having a delusion if you think health care co-ops are any different. Or that government won't have their grimy little mitts in them.

[Dr. Shane]

I really like the idea that the playing field will be leveled. My company will no longer have to compete against those that take advantage of their employees. I am glad that health-care insurance costs will finally be included in the cost of consumer products and services. Products and services will no longer be artificially low - subsided by the poorest of society. I am glad the companies that cannot provide health insurance to their employees will fail and make room for other companies that can and will.

The far right did have me a bit concerned about Obama-care but as I am seeing the details I feel much better about it. This may go over so well that we ammend the Constitution to allow Obama to serve until he dies like FDR did. "Long live Obama" I can almost hear it now.

[Woody]

Have you flipped your lid?

[Dr. Shane]

The Democrats don't have the 60 votes they need in the Senate. Joe Lieberman has already said he will joins the Republicans in a filibuster if the public option is included. Harry Reid doesn't have as much power over the other senators either as Pelosi does over the congressmen and women. I feel confident that the bill coming out of the Senate will have the objectionable features removed.

[Woody]

Well ... Lieberman answers to nobody.

[bonnie]

Quote:

I really like the idea that the playing field will be leveled. My company will no longer have to compete against those that take advantage of their employees.

The government only levels the playing field downward. Then we can all be victims as you suggest over and over.

Kind of amusing to watch and listen to those with CC have the playing field leveled. 3 Different friends of mine that use credit cards and pay in full every month,have found their interest rate will be going up as of Jan,1st and they will pay interest from the date of purchase.

All three canceled immediately. Be fun to see "the victims" trying to maintain their victim status as their interest rate will also go up

Quote:

I am glad that health-care insurance costs will finally be included in the cost of consumer products and services. Products and services will no longer be artificially low - subsided by the poorest of society. I am glad the companies that cannot provide health insurance to their employees will fail and make room for other companies that can and will.

And here I could have sworn you have insisted that is part of their salary already and not costing the employer. If the going wage is 20.00 you pay 12.00 and provide benefits.

The poorest of society can now pay what the rest of us pay.Or do you think the poor will have special stores where they can buy a gallon of milk for 1.00 and the rest have to pay 5.00?

They will be paying the higher prices thanks to those always so concerned about the poor.

You live in a different reality that is for sure.......

I am glad the companies that cannot provide health insurance to their employees will fail and make room for other companies that can and will.

Maybe they will be able to dump their employee's in the tender mercies of the federal government.

You don't seem to get it. The desire to punish those immoral unchristian employers is going to punish the very ones you claim to care so much about.

Those that have made it and can quit if they so desire are going to be doing just that.

Among my brother's business peers there are now 14 that have decided they are no longer going to fight it.

They are financially secure,now let the government take care of their employee's

My brother has closed his doors,Over 50 employee's are now without jobs.These are jobs and incomes not easily replaced. You don't go and work at Tom Thumb.

The others that are closing number over 400 employee's. They will find themselves at the tender mercies of the government.

Entry level businesses that could succeed and pay good benefits in time will be gone

Our computer shop is one. He made a reasonable income out of his home,deciding he could do better he recently opened a shop,hired 1 then 2,then 3,has 2 part time.

As of the first of the year he will be moving his business back home.He has told his employee's they best be looking for work.

Quote:

The far right did have me a bit concerned about Obama-care but as I am seeing the details I feel much better about it. This may go over so well that we ammend the Constitution to allow Obama to serve until he dies like FDR did. "Long live Obama" I can almost hear it now.

I agree we are likely to have our constitution amended,or possibly as Obama is prone to do,ignore it altogether.

We have been told such things will happen. I guess some still believe in biblical prophecy and that the time will come when the government of the US will control/punish for a short time.

And as you admit,you are very enthusiastic over government control. Maybe with your enthusiasm for government control you will be exempt from government control and punishment for awhile.

[Woody]

Quote:

I agree we are likely to have our constitution amended,or possibly as Obama is prone to do,ignore it altogether.

This is what concerns me. We are quickly losing our constitutional rights under Obama. And he is just ignoring the constitution. This is change. NO doubt.

[bonnie]

Quote:

I agree we are likely to have our constitution amended,or possibly as Obama is prone to do,ignore it altogether.

This is what concerns me. We are quickly losing our constitutional rights under Obama. And he is just ignoring the constitution. This is change. NO doubt.

We should know it is coming. If you have an IQ that exceeds double digits you can easily figure out that government punishing the so-called rich and immoral is never done without hurting those that make a lifetime career of victimization.

The poor do not hire, manufacture,create a service, they remain in the comfortable niche of victims

And there is a cure for the career victims. Off the duff ,set your goals,and if necessary work two jobs. Quit whining when the CC Company does exactly as the fine print says. Need insurance,buy your own. Employer doesn't provide it,improve your skills and go where they do.Or you become the employer as most of the "victims" think this is a cake walk.

[CyberGuy]

http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics/story/1556149-p2.html

Tell me again what this is all for........

Who pays for it?

Individuals earning more than $500,000 and couples earning more than $1 million will pay a 5.4 percent income tax surcharge, raising $460 billion over 10 years.

There are other taxes and fee increases, including a $20 billion fee for makers of medical devices and a limit on how much you can put into existing flexible spending accounts.

What about Medicare?

The bill cuts roughly $425 billion from projected spending on Medicare and Medicaid over 10 years. The Medicare cuts would largely come from Medicare Advantage, an HMO-like program involving private insurers.

Will the plan reduce the cost of health care?

Unclear. There are mechanisms designed to lower costs, like requiring the government to negotiate drug prices under Medicare, better use of technology, and efforts against “waste, fraud, and abuse.” It isn’t known how well they’ll work.

Does it cover everyone?

No. The CBO estimates 18 million people under age 65 will be uninsured in 2019, including about 6 million illegal immigrants.

The CBO said about 96 percent of Americans under the age of 65 would have insurance, though, compared with about 83 percent coverage today.

If you take the current figure and eliminate those already qualifying for medicaid and don't sign up,eliminate the illegal immigrants as Old Honest Abe said he was,the ones that simply don't want insurance the numbers before and after are not very far apart.

18 million without insurance is within the numbers already quoted for the chronically uninsured. So we are doing this why??

From what I understand much of the cuts from medicare are going to be passed onto the states by 2015. So No federal tax increases but count on state tax increases to cover the increase cost the feds pass onto the states. It is a sly way of increasing the tax but not from the federal tax.

[bonnie]

I would like to hear why our fearless president does not go after the medicare fraud he claims is at least 500 billion.

That would cover a bit of taxes. That however does not give him control

[Woody]

I would like to hear why our fearless president does not go after the medicare fraud he claims is at least 500 billion.

That would cover a bit of taxes. That however does not give him control

He prefers to go after those of us who have the nerve to USE Medicare rather than those who commit fraud.

[Dr. Shane]

Quote:

The government only levels the playing field downward. Then we can all be victims as you suggest over and over.

Not true. Anti-trust legislation is a fine example of good government at work. Without anti-trust legislation we would all be victims of corporate monopolies.

Quote:

Kind of amusing to watch and listen to those with CC have the playing field leveled. 3 Different friends of mine that use credit cards and pay in full every month,have found their interest rate will be going up as of Jan,1st and they will pay interest from the date of purchase.

That is fantastic news. Credit card customers are finally going to have to pay for the services they use instead of getting the service paid for by the poor, elderly, gullible and ignorant. Obama deserves a cape for what he did with credit card companies. If he didn't accomplish anything else, that alone was worth voting for him.

Quote:

And here I could have sworn you have insisted that is part of their salary already and not costing the employer.

That is correct. It will cost the consumer, not the employer.

[Dr. Shane]

This is what concerns me. We are quickly losing our constitutional rights under Obama. And he is just ignoring the constitution. This is change. NO doubt.

The liberals said the same thing about Bush.

[Dr. Shane]

I would like to hear why our fearless president does not go after the medicare fraud he claims is at least 500 billion.

He is saving that for his second term. We can't expect him to do everything at once.

[bonnie]

Quote:

Not true. Anti-trust legislation is a fine example of good government at work. Without anti-trust legislation we would all be victims of corporate monopolies.

Don't you just love the word victim tho? The government has no desire to level the playing field of health insurance.Otherwise they would let buyers buy across state lines.But again,it is the power and control he is after and "victims" want to be protected. Maybe Obama could tackle the fraud in medicare without waiting for 3-4 years.Again that gives him no power and control

Quote:

That is fantastic news. Credit card customers are finally going to have to pay for the services they use instead of getting the service paid for by the poor, elderly, gullible and ignorant. Obama deserves a cape for what he did with credit card companies. If he didn't accomplish anything else, that alone was worth voting for him.

Yup and so are the "poor victims" or they will lose the ability to charge.Any that are not adult enough to responsibly handle their credit card will have to find a new place to whine.

The rich and well to do,middle income can still have a charge card if they choose.Whatever will the poor ignorant victims do then. Maybe learn some personal responsibility and some reading comprehension? Nah,whatever am I thinking.

Socialism cannot work in a free market so we need one crisis after another and a promise to be taken care of by the government. The crybabies will be lining up one after another making sure as a "victim" they get theirs and ours

Quote:

That is correct. It will cost the consumer, not the employer.

La la land for you. You need to become an employer instead of a employee,run the risk,work the hours,and pay the expenses.

It cannot always cost the consumer but that is something you would not know.

The way the economy is and will be for some time,there is not much consuming going on.

But for those that are envious and resentful that some make more than others that matters little Make sure you work things that all are in the same boat.That is only fair no matter if some don't work and stand with their hand out

It is rather interesting tho that you cannot figure out ,the poor,gullible and ignorant are consumers as well.

Personally I would rather see a good economy and the poor working and the ignorant educated.Instead of the desire to keep the poor and ignorant just that way.

[Dr. Shane]

The rich and well to do,middle income can still have a charge card if they choose.Whatever will the poor ignorant victims do then?

The rich and well-to-do middle class will pay annual fees for their credit cards and interest from date-of-purchase. The survivors of credit cards will get debit cards backed-up with an emergency fund. No more fees. No more interest. No more being victimized.

Thank you President Obama. God Bless you President Obama and may God bless your wife, children and extended family.

[bonnie]

Quote:

The liberals said the same thing about Bush.

They did. There was risk in some of what Bush did concerning that.It may have laid the groundwork for some abuses like Obama,but that was not the intent of Bush

We were not dealing with a narcissistic power/control freak.Now that even tho Obama condemned some of those laws as a presidential candidate,in true liberal fashion it sounded like a good idea as president

Some of the leg work was done for Obama,he could condemn,blame Bush,and put far worse into law or action and use that which he promised to put a stop to