Who is "We"?

[Guest]

President Barack Obama said in Turkey : "We do not consider ourselves a Christian nation or a Jewish nation or a Muslim nation. We consider ourselves a nation of citizens who are bound by ideals and a set of values."

I found this very interesting.

Do you know the Preamble for your state?

Alabama 1901, Preamble

We the people of the State of Alabama , invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God, do ordain and establish the following Constitution..

Alaska 1956, Preamble We, the people of Alaska , grateful to God and to those who founded our nation and pioneered this great land.

Arizona 1911, Preamble We, the people of the State of Arizona , grateful to Almighty God for our liberties, do ordain this Constitution...

Arkansas 1874, Preamble We, the people of the State of Arkansas , grateful to Almighty God for the privilege of choosing our own form of government...

California 1879, Preamble We, the People of the State of California , grateful to Almighty God for our freedom...

Colorado 1876, Preamble We, the people of Colorado , with profound reverence for the Supreme Ruler of Universe....

Connecticut 1818, Preamble. The People of Connecticut , acknowledging with gratitude the good Providence of God in permitting them to enjoy.

Delaware 1897, Preamble Through Divine Goodness all men have, by nature, the rights of worshipping and serving their Creator according to the dictates of their consciences...

Florida 1885, Preamble We, the people of the State of Florida , grateful to Almighty God for our constitutional liberty, establish this Constitution...

Georgia 1777, Preamble We, the people of Georgia , relying upon protection and guidance of Almighty God, do ordain and establish this Constitution...

Hawaii 1959, Preamble We , the people of Hawaii , Grateful for Divine Guidance ... Establish this Constitution.

Idaho 1889, Preamble We, the people of the State of Idaho , grateful to Almighty God for our freedom, to secure its blessings..

Illinois 1870, Preamble We, the people of the State of Illinois, grateful to Almighty God for the civil , political and religious liberty which He hath so long permitted us to enjoy and looking to Him for a blessing on our endeavors.

Indiana 1851, Preamble We, the People of the State of Indiana , grateful to Almighty God for the free exercise of the right to choose our form of government.

Iowa 1857, Preamble We, the People of the St ate of Iowa , grateful to the Supreme Being for the blessings hitherto enjoyed, and feeling our dependence on Him for a continuation of these blessings, establish this Constitution.

Kansas 1859, Preamble We, the people of Kansas , grateful to Almighty God for our civil and religious privileges establish this Constitution.

Kentucky 1891, Preamble.. We, the people of the Commonwealth are grateful to Almighty God for the civil, political and religious liberties..

Louisiana 1921, Preamble We, the people of the State of Louisiana , grateful to Almighty God for the civil, political and religious liberties we enjoy.

Maine 1820, Preamble We the People of Maine acknowledging with grateful hearts the goodness of the Sovereign Ruler of the Universe in affording us an opportunity .. And imploring His aid and direction.

Maryland 1776, Preamble We, the people of the state of Maryland , grateful to Almighty God for our civil and religious liberty...

Massachusetts 1780, Preamble We...the people of Massachusetts, acknowledging with grateful hearts, the goodness of the Great Legislator of the Universe In the course of His Providence, an opportunity and devoutly imploring His direction

Michigan 1908, Preamble.. We, the people of the State of Michigan , grateful to Almighty God for the blessings of freedom, establish this Constitution.

Minnesota, 1857, Preamble We, the people of the State of Minnesota, grateful to God for our civil and religious liberty, and desiring to perpetuate its blessings:

Mississippi 1890, Preamble We, the people of Mississippi in convention assembled, grateful to Almighty God, and invoking His blessing on our work.

Missouri 1845, Preamble We, the people of Missouri , with profound reverence for the Supreme Ruler of the Universe, and grateful for His goodness . Establish this Constitution...

Montana 1889, Preamble. We, the people of Montana , grateful to Almighty God for the blessings of liberty establish this Constitution ..

Nebraska 1875, Preamble We, the people, grateful to Almighty God for our freedom . Establish this Constitution.

Nevada 1864, Preamble We the people of the State of Nevada , grateful to Almighty God for our freedom, establish this Constitution...

New Hampshire 1792, Part I. Art. I. Sec. V Every individual has a natural and unalienable right to worship God according to the dictates of his own conscience.

New Jersey 1844, Preamble We, the people of the State of New Jersey, grateful to Almighty God for civil and religious liberty which He hath so long permitted us to enjoy, and looking to Him for a blessing on our endeavors.

New Mexico 1911, Preamble We, the People of New Mexico, grateful to Almighty God for the blessings of liberty..

New York 1846, Preamble We, the people of the State of New York , grateful to Almighty God for our freedom, in order to secure its blessings.

North Carolina 1868, Preamble We the people of the State of North Carolina, grateful to Almighty God, the Sovereign Ruler of Nations, for our civil, political, and religious liberties, and acknowledging our dependence upon Him for the continuance of those...

North Dakota 1889, Preamble We , the people of North Dakota , grateful to Almighty God for the blessings of civil and religious liberty, do ordain...

Ohio 1852, Preamble We the people of the state of Ohio , grateful to Almighty God for our freedom, to secure its blessings and to promote our common.

Oklahoma 1907, Preamble Invoking the guidance of Almighty God, in order to secure and perpetuate the blessings of liberty, establish this

Oregon 1857, Bill of Rights, Article I Section 2. All men shall be secure in the Natural right, to worship Almighty God according to the dictates of their consciences

Pennsylvania 1776, Preamble We, the people of Pennsylvania, grateful to Almighty God for the blessings of civil and religious liberty, and humbly invoking His guidance....

Rhode Island 1842, Preamble. We the People of the State of Rhode Island grateful to Almighty God for the civil and religious liberty which He hath so long permitted us to enjoy, and looking to Him for a blessing...

South Carolina , 1778, Preamble We, the people of the State of South Carolina grateful to God for our liberties, do ordain and establish this Constitution.

South Dakota 1889, Preamble We, the people of South Dakota , grateful to Almighty God for our civil and religious liberties ...

Tennessee 1796, Art. XI..III. That all men have a natural and indefeasible right to worship Almighty God according to the dictates of their conscience...

Texas 1845, Preamble We the People of the Republic of Texas , acknowledging, with gratitude, the grace and beneficence of God.

Utah 1896, Preamble Grateful to Almighty God for life and liberty, we establish this Constitution.

Vermont 1777, Preamble Whereas all government ought to enable the individuals who compose it to enjoy their natural rights, and other blessings which the Author of Existence has bestowed on man ..

Virginia 1776, Bill of Rights, XVI Religion, or the Duty which we owe our Creator can be directed only by Reason and that it is the mutual duty of all to practice Christian Forbearance, Love and Charity towards each other

Washington 1889, Preamble We the People of the State of Washington, grateful to the Supreme Ruler of the Universe for our liberties, do ordain this Constitution

West Virginia 1872, Preamble Since through Divine Providence we enjoy the blessings of civil, political and religious liberty, we, the people of West Virginia reaffirm our faith in and constant reliance upon God .

Wisconsin 1848, Preamble We, the people of Wisconsin, grateful to Almighty God for our freedom, domestic tranquility...

Wyoming 1890, Preamble We, the people of the State of Wyoming, grateful to God for our civil, political, and religious liberties, establish this Constitution...

After reviewing acknowledgments of God from all 50 state constitutions, one is faced with the prospect that maybe, Obama, the ACLU and the out-of-control federal courts are wrong!

[karl]

President Barack Obama said in Turkey : "We do not consider ourselves a Christian nation or a Jewish nation or a Muslim nation. We consider ourselves a nation of citizens who are bound by ideals and a set of values."

Uh, which values would those be? One Nation, under Obama, redistributed, with pretzels and gusto for all. (As long as supplies last.)

[phkrause]

"After reviewing acknowledgments of God from all 50 state constitutions, one is faced with the prospect that maybe, Obama, the ACLU and the out-of-control federal courts are wrong!"

I agree with the first part of this statement, but notice the dates? The second part I do not agree with! This country has gone down hill as far as it being a christian nation every year for as long as I can remember. Very sad indeed! Everything that has to do with God is slowly being weeded out of every part of our country. we will find ourselves getting so bad that we will have to force worship, ring any bells?

pk

[CyberGuy]

Were it not for the look into the future given Ellen White by God that would not seem like such a bad idea. But thank God for the warning of heading down that path.

[karl]

This country has gone down hill as far as it being a christian nation every year for as long as I can remember.... we will find ourselves getting so bad that we will have to force worship, ring any bells?

And it may very well be that the religious laws will be passed against the will of the people, the way it was done with healthcare. The precedent has been set. "You'll thank us later."

[doug yowell]

This reminds me of the story of when Obama and Tonto were riding together thru Indian country when they suddenly found themselves surrounded by over 100 Sioux on the warpath. Obama turned to Tonto and said, "Come on Tonto, we can take em!"

[doug yowell]

"After reviewing acknowledgments of God from all 50 state constitutions, one is faced with the prospect that maybe, Obama, the ACLU and the out-of-control federal courts are wrong!"

I agree with the first part of this statement, but notice the dates? The second part I do not agree with! This country has gone down hill as far as it being a christian nation every year for as long as I can remember. Very sad indeed! Everything that has to do with God is slowly being weeded out of every part of our country. we will find ourselves getting so bad that we will have to force worship, ring any bells?

pk

And the current Administration and it's leader are not contributing to forced worship,pk? And they are not contributing to a national apostasy?Under the God (I think the President left that part out)of which of those religions does our pledge of allegience refer to?You're dead on about the decline of America, but decline from what?

[phkrause]

Originally Posted By: pkrause

"After reviewing acknowledgments of God from all 50 state constitutions, one is faced with the prospect that maybe, Obama, the ACLU and the out-of-control federal courts are wrong!"

I agree with the first part of this statement, but notice the dates? The second part I do not agree with! This country has gone down hill as far as it being a christian nation every year for as long as I can remember. Very sad indeed! Everything that has to do with God is slowly being weeded out of every part of our country. we will find ourselves getting so bad that we will have to force worship, ring any bells?

pk

And the current Administration and it's leader are not contributing to forced worship,pk? And they are not contributing to a national apostasy?Under the God (I think the President left that part out)of which of those religions does our pledge of allegience refer to?You're dead on about the decline of America, but decline from what?

And who said there not????? Did I not say that this is been going on for years????? But no you seem to be saying that it just started happening yesterday. Unreal and incredible, for what, to just blame all on this administration????? Obviously they have done nothing to stop the trend but they did not start this trend that's for sure.

pk

[karl]

Unreal and incredible, for what, to just blame all on this administration????? Obviously they have done nothing to stop the trend but they did not start this trend that's for sure.

This is the administration we have to stop. We cannot stop those in the past. We can only stop this one and future ones.

Let's get to work.

[phkrause]

Originally Posted By: pkrause

Unreal and incredible, for what, to just blame all on this administration????? Obviously they have done nothing to stop the trend but they did not start this trend that's for sure.

This is the administration we have to stop. We cannot stop those in the past. We can only stop this one and future ones.

Let's get to work.

So were than was the out rage to the previous adminstration's??? Been on this forum for awhile and have not seen these comments about them? Maybe a little when Clinton was in office.

And yes I've been at work each and every year. Doing what I can with the way I live and the type of neighbor that Christ would have me be. Seems to me that we are trying to be just like the Jews of Jesus' day. Didn't they think and/or want Jesus to over throw the Roman's, and didn't he tell them that they should give to Rome what was there's and give to God what belongs to him. I interpret that as Jesus not only talking about taxes but about loyalty. So when the government comes and tells me I have to worship on the day that they will choose, I than have a choice to make give to Satan or God my loyalty.

pk

[doug yowell]

pk

[phkrause]

I see your point, at this moment I'm not sure if I agree or disagree that they've gone further and the rest. But like I mentioned, they haven't done anything to reverse the trend either.

pk

[bonnie]

I see your point, at this moment I'm not sure if I agree or disagree that they've gone further and the rest. But like I mentioned, they haven't done anything to reverse the trend either.

pk

What I find so puzzling is that the secular world and non SDA christians see more danger than the typical SDA.

The sky is not falling today and the end times won't be on our doorstep tomorrow.It is a process before this once great country willingly turns over their freedoms "for our own good"

We are the ones that are supposed to know what will come. Yet it is secular friends that have asked "do you believe this is what many have claimed we have been warned about"

It sounds at times like the SDA's in general have become the soothsayers my dad used to warn about.

When we were kids we had a hard time understanding that the very people we considered good friends outside the SDA church would turn on us and persecute.

My dad always told us not to be concerned with those outside the church but those with the soothing words inside,sitting in the pews with us.

I have been surprised to find more SDA's than not enthralled with Obama and "how he will take care of us".

No matter what has gone on in the past and granted much did,there will be one that will bring about the destruction of what this country was founded on.

I believe even if many no longer do founding this country was part of prophecy. As long as we adhere to the founding principals we won't lose our freedoms. Those principals are fast going by the wayside.When that is complete we are no different than any other country

[Guest]

Amen, and AMEN!!

[karl]

So were than was the out rage to the previous adminstration's??.... I interpret that as Jesus not only talking about taxes but about loyalty. So when the government comes and tells me I have to worship on the day that they will choose, I than have a choice to make give to Satan or God my loyalty.

1. The outrage with previous administrations was coming hot and heavy from me.

2. If you wait to protect liberty until religious liberty is the last liberty remaining, you will have already lost the battle for liberty.

[lazarus]

Bonnie,

I think confusion comes when we conflate being Adventist with American culture and American right wing political views. They are not one and the same. Adventist does not = conservative = American = conservative = Adventist.

[lazarus]

Quote:

This is the administration we have to stop. We cannot stop those in the past. We can only stop this one and future ones.

Let's get to work.

LOL. "we" have to stop it because it's a democratic one. When Cheney said deficits don't matter the right was mute. All of a sudden deficits do matter, simply because it's a Democratic deficit. This is a game.

We're losing our liberties!!! LOL. When Bush suspended Habius Corpus that was a fundamental shift but again the right cheered. When there was warrantless wiretapping the right cheered because it was one of their own who was doing the wiretapping. Democrats are quiet because its now one of their own. Don't fall for this foolishness.

[lazarus]

historical American religious values as an attempt to take our country on the fast track to this "higher" level.

American has only just, in the last 40 years become a truly democratic state. American religious values?

[Dr. Shane]

I appreciate you here, Lazarus.

[lazarus]

lol, do you mean here in America or here on CA

[karl]

Quote:

This is the administration we have to stop. We cannot stop those in the past. We can only stop this one and future ones.

Let's get to work.

LOL. "we" have to stop it because it's a democratic one.

Wrong, Laz. We have to stop this administration because it is the one we have now.... and it is killing us. We can't do anything about something that does not currently exist (i.e. in the past.)

The pseudo-conservatives of the past deserved our ire just as much as this one does. But that had to happen then, not now.

Vote conservative. To do otherwise is to slit your own throat.

[lazarus]

The pseudo-conservatives of the past deserved our ire just as much as this one does. But that had to happen then, not now.

Vote conservative. To do otherwise is to slit your own throat.

These fake conservatives didn't get your ire though, why? Conservatives consistently voted for them precisely because they were spending the money on the things that conservatives like to spend money on. Like Dick C said deficits don't matter. Don't believe the hype.

The tea party movement is the best thing that happened to the democratic party because it will hopefully split the right wing vote.

[doug yowell]

Originally Posted By: karl

The pseudo-conservatives of the past deserved our ire just as much as this one does. But that had to happen then, not now.

Vote conservative. To do otherwise is to slit your own throat.

These fake conservatives didn't get your ire though, why? Conservatives consistently voted for them precisely because they were spending the money on the things that conservatives like to spend money on. Like Dick C said deficits don't matter. Don't believe the hype.

The tea party movement is the best thing that happened to the democratic party because it will hopefully split the right wing vote.

Respectfully, Lazarus. You really don't know much about Republican politics.Why don't you ask a few of them (start with Ron Paul) why they didn't vote for Mr. McCain?

[lazarus]

Few is the key word. The vast majority of republicans voted for McCain, and BUsh twice. It's interesting that Palin not Paul that is the most closely connected with the Tea baggers.

[doug yowell]

Few is the key word. The vast majority of republicans voted for McCain, and BUsh twice. It's interesting that Palin not Paul that is the most closely connected with the Tea baggers.

I used the word few because I didn't want to burden you down with actually having to seriously put your allegations to the test. As it's obvious that you're not a Republican I stand by my previous statement.But you are good at repeating liberal talking points. That's gotta count for something.