Michigan Conference suspends funding for LSU Tuition

[BobRyan]

The Michigan Exec Committee has released a statement saying that they will no longer be providing subsidy funding for conference employees who send family members to LSU for education.

http://www.educatetruth.com/news/michigan-conference-takes-substantial-action-in-lsu-conflict/

They are the first conference to take a public stand that includes "action" regarding the promotion of -- evolution as the right answer for the doctrine on origins - by La Sierra.

Quote:

Whereas, the Adventist Review (in the article by Mark Kellner in April 15, 2010) has now publicly addressed the issue of evolution being taught at and supported by La Sierra University; and, whereas their board of trustees and constituency have collectively been unwilling to rectify this vital spiritual issue, the Michigan Conference Executive Committee has voted the following actions:

1. Effective June 1, 2010 the Michigan Conference has removed La Sierra University from its list of Adventist Colleges and Universities which qualify for employee subsidy. This means that no employee may expect tuition support if they have a dependent attending La Sierra.

2. With sorrow we feel it is our spiritual responsibility to notify Michigan Conference members that we do not believe that La Sierra can currently be trusted to be supportive of Seventh-day Adventist spiritual values especially in reference to faith in the biblical understanding of creation, and thus the authority of Scripture in the life and practice of the believer.

What other Conferences are brave enough to follow Michigan in taking that leadership position in the coming months?

Or better yet - what would it take for LSU to stop evangelizing for evolutionism in their religion and biology departments?

What are your thoughts?

in Christ,

Bob

[olger]

Very commendable.

[Gregory Matthews]

I am not going to comment on whether or not LSU is actually doing what lit is claimed it is doing because I do not know. But, I have a real problem with the action of the Michigan Conference, if the report as to what it has done is accurate. I have read both the report here in CA and on the Educate Truth website.

1) It appears that the Michigan Conference has acted without giving LSU a change to respond. At least there is no indication that it has done such. That is patently unfair. Decisions should be made in a context of all sides being given a fair chance to present their viewpoint.

2) The alleged problem appears to be with the Biology department. Students who are studying in disciplines that have nothing to do with biology are being punished. I wonder, will the Michigan Conference decide that it will not hire any pastors who have graduated from LSU (or LSC)? Will it decide not to hire math teachers who have graduated from LSU? Why punish a student who is taking Math for the Biology department.

3) The Conference is going beyond the actual stated belief of the denomination as voted by the church: The voted denominational belief says nothing about creation being recent. Yes, it does requires a belief that God created in six literal days. Educate Truth tells us that the Michigan Conference also requires that the creation be recent. The reality is that a person who believes that God created the Earth in six literal days, 100,000 years ago does believe all that is required by our voted denominational belief.

4) The issue at LSU is a denominational problem. It needs to be addressed by the NAD. It is not fair for the Michigan Conference to act on its own and go out ahead of the denomination.

5) The salary paid to denominational employees, to include benefits, is supposed to be uniform and in accord with Division policy. IOW one conference is not allowed to double the basic salary (over what other Conferences pay) that they pay their workers. It is outside of policy and unfair to their employees to take this position independent of the rest of the Conferences in the NAD. If LSU should be removed from the schools supported by such, this should be a NAD Action and not that of a single Conference. In our present policy, the authority to do such rests with the NAD, not a Conference and policy does not require this to be done at the General Conference level.

6) The Mid-America Union and/or the NAD needs to step in and deal with this breach of conduct on the part of the Michigan Conference just as surely as it needs to respond to the allegations raised against the LUS Biology department.

[Tom Wetmore]

It is interesting that we applaud this action in defiance of Church policy but chastise another conference for acting similarly on another issue...

It would appear that both were taking a stand on an issue they feel in good conscience they must do.

[olger]

You do err by equating two non coalescing issues.

g

[Woody]

It is interesting that we applaud this action in defiance of Church policy but chastise another conference for acting similarly on another issue...

It would appear that both were taking a stand on an issue they feel in good conscience they must do.

[BobRyan]

2) The alleged problem appears to be with the Biology department. Students who are studying in disciplines that have nothing to do with biology are being punished. I wonder, will the Michigan Conference decide that it will not hire any pastors who have graduated from LSU (or LSC)? Will it decide not to hire math teachers who have graduated from LSU? Why punish a student who is taking Math for the Biology department.

3) The Conference is going beyond the actual stated belief of the denomination as voted by the church: The voted denominational belief says nothing about creation being recent. Yes, it does requires a belief that God created in six literal days. Educate Truth tells us that the Michigan Conference also requires that the creation be recent. The reality is that a person who believes that God created the Earth in six literal days, 100,000 years ago does believe all that is required by our voted denominational belief.

4) The issue at LSU is a denominational problem. It needs to be addressed by the NAD. It is not fair for the Michigan Conference to act on its own and go out ahead of the denomination.

5) The salary paid to denominational employees, to include benefits, is supposed to be uniform and in accord with Division policy. IOW one conference is not allowed to double the basic salary (over what other Conferences pay) that they pay their workers. It is outside of policy and unfair to their employees to take this position independent of the rest of the Conferences in the NAD. If LSU should be removed from the schools supported by such, this should be a NAD Action and not that of a single Conference. In our present policy, the authority to do such rests with the NAD, not a Conference and policy does not require this to be done at the General Conference level.

6) The Mid-America Union and/or the NAD needs to step in and deal with this breach of conduct on the part of the Michigan Conference just as surely as it needs to respond to the allegations raised against the LUS Biology department.

Answering - number for number

2. The problem at LSU is in both the Religion and Biology department. There are 100 level biology classes and religion classes taken as electives and in some of the religion cases "required".

3. Evolution that is taught at LSU is not even remotely of the form "all life on earth created in 6 literal days" whether it be 6000 years ago or 100,000 years ago.

4. The issue at LSU has resulted in students dumping Christianity entirely. The Michigan Conference has a moral obligation to inform constituents and to send tithe and offering dollars to the right place.

5. The "group-think" process you suggest is the way to defeat action because it argues that "until everyone is willing to step up to the plate - to stand and be counted -- then no one should be ALLOWED to do it". Furthermore - suppose that in 2 years or so the entire NAD finally "Gets around" to everyone admitting that the LSU problem is every bit the runnaway horse that many people have found it to be -- in that case Michigan leadership will be considered "visionaries" - people of "action".

If God abhors one sin above another, of which His people are guilty, it is doing nothing in case of an emergency. Indifference and neutrality in a religious crisis is regarded of God as a grievous crime and equal to the very worst type of hostility against God. {3T 280.3}

6. the NAD has been dragging its feet on the LSU problem for over ten years. So let us say that the NAD finally jumps to its feet next month and instantly fixes the LSU problem. (Not that the NAD has that much control over the Pacific Union -- which is what it would take in this case.) We should graciously give them that same ten or 15 year window to finally getting around to asking Michigan if they are doing the right thing.

in Christ,

Bob

[abelisle]

Maybe this and other issues like this that ask Adventists to take a side is a precursor to the "shaking" that we read about in the SOP.

All of this is sad to watch. The church is self destructing. We are not a cult but are behaving like one in a sociocultural aspect. Liberals vs. conservatives, creationism vs. theistic evolution, WO vs. no WO, et al.

What happens when other conferences decide to do their own thing based on what they (probably only the leadership) thinks is right? Many innocent students will be affected; intellectual freedom will be stymied due to the fear of not holding the orthodox line. Christlike behavior is trumped by the necessity for upholding church tradition and doctrinal integrity.

A church divided will not stand.

Alex

[BobRyan]

It is interesting that we applaud this action in defiance of Church policy but chastise another conference for acting similarly on another issue...

It would appear that both were taking a stand on an issue they feel in good conscience they must do.

Is there some other conference - restricting its own educational subsidy funding within its own jurisdiction because an Adventist school someplace is teaching creationism or teaching evolution?

[BobRyan]

A church divided will not stand.

Alex

Battle Creek burned and the church was not divided.

When men choose to fail at their jobs as administrators - God has a funny kind of way of stepping in to get the job done. But God's overruling providence is not a reason to promote or excuse failure - it is just a fact about God's Sovereign ability.

in Christ,

Bob

[lazarus]

All of this is sad to watch. The church is self destructing.

Alex

It is sad. Battle lines are being drawn. I think a split may be coming.

Then again..... perhaps we won't really deal with the issue but avoid the split by having different conferences recognizing different colleges. We have black and white conferences. Split avoided there. We have conferences that commission women pastors and those that don't. That seems to work well. Now we can have conferences that accept evolution and those that don't. If in doubt sidestep the issue.

[Woody]

I place little value on what a conference like Michigan does. Everyone knows how extreme they are. I doubt anyone from that conference would want to go to La Sierra anyways.

[olger]

I find your denunciation of Michigan to be short-sighted, ill-informed, and unnecessary.

gcw

[John317]

The shaking has been going on in the SDA church for a long time. It will get more intense, far worse than it is now. It will get to the point where the church will appear about to fall but it won't. The purpose of the shaking is to purify the church.

There's an excellent book, The Shaking Among God's People, Keavin Hayden (Review & Herald Pub., 1994)

[lazarus]

I place little value on what a conference like Michigan does. Everyone knows how extreme they are.

Don't know much about them, honest. What is that conference like?

[Woody]

Hmmm.

You are blessed in your ignorance. I won't disturb you.

[Woody]

I find your denunciation of Michigan to be short-sighted, ill-informed, and unnecessary.

gcw

The thoughts about the Southern California Conferences are short-sighted, ill-informed and unnecessary. But the truth about the Michigan is well documented.

Tell us what you think of the Southern California Conferences OG.

[BobRyan]

I place little value on what a conference like Michigan does. Everyone knows how extreme they are. .

How so?

Just another empty accusation or are there facts to back up the idea of "extreme Michigan conference"? (Surely they don't promote "fall down laughing in a spirit" eh?)

in Christ,

Bob

[BobRyan]

Randal Wisbey responded to the Michigan Conference by arguing in effect "we are nice people" and "if you could see our faces" you would not think we are anything but nice people.

But never actually came around to speaking to the actual issue at LSU that forced the Michigan Conference to take that action. Or the fact that the Michigan statement was clear that they did not want to say anything until after the Review had come out and publically admitted to the evolution problem at LSU.

in Christ,

Bob

[olger]

Jerry Page is a friend.

og out

[Jeannieb43]

What Michigan conference is doing hurts their own members more than it hurts La Sierra University.

This is an ill-informed decision, IMHO.

[Woody]

I agree. Can you imagine the precident this might set. WE could have a trade war. We could ban going to any conference that ruffles our feathers. I can think of a lot of extremist conservative conferences that I would like to ban but Michigan is at the top of the list.

[BobRyan]

Well you are right about one thing - other conferences may soon join with the Michigan Conference if the LSU-all-for-evolutionism problem is allowed to fester for 10 more years as it was allowed in the last ten years.

At this point the historic Battle Creek problem comes to mind.

in Christ,

Bob

[Guest]

Yes, and you remember how God solved that problem.

[BobRyan]

True. But before He took that drastic action - there were a lot of people whining that Ellen White was being too judgmental and "against science" in her statements about the errors of pantheism in the "Living Temple" fad at Battle Creek.