LifeHiscost Posted February 24, 2005 Share Posted February 24, 2005 Oftentimes I've listened to Christians who appear to consider anyone who follows God's instruction for the sake of reward, as second class Christians. If this is truly the way we should respond to Christian living observed in others or practiced ourselves, what would be the ideal reaction when Jesus tells us there are rewards for particular behavior? [:"red"] "Thus shall he who conquers (is victorious) be clad in white garments, and I will not erase or blot out his name from the Book of Life; I will acknowledge him [as Mine] and I will confess his name openly before My Father and before His angels. " [/] Rev 3:5 [:"red"] "Because you have guarded and kept My word of patient endurance [have held fast the lesson of My patience with the expectant endurance that I give you], I also will keep you [safe] from the hour of trial (testing) which is coming on the whole world to try those who dwell upon the earth" [/] V 10 [:"red"] "He who overcomes (is victorious), I will grant him to sit beside Me on My throne, as I Myself overcame (was victorious" [/] V 21 Lift Jesus up!! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 24, 2005 Share Posted February 24, 2005 I guess it depends on how you see things. Up until this moment I have not contemplated the idea of being rewarded for behaving in a manner that Christ or anyone else has set out. Thinking about it now, I see the things that we are rewarded with as a consequence of a particular action, like cause and effect. Having said that, if I am to get real, I have to admit that I sometimes behave the way I do to obtain certain rewards. It sounds sooo tacky doesn't it? The more I think about it the more sense it makes. I eat right and I am rewarded with good health. I do good things and I am rewarded in various ways. I follow Christ and I am rewarded with the eternal life etc. In the Christian context, I think it is good to consider one's motives regarding being rewarded. For example: If I do something good in order to appear good, it is a head, rather than a heart experience and my motives are impure. If I do something good because I care and it needs doing, it is a heart experience and my motives are pure. For me, when it is a heart decision the reward does not enter the equation. I don’t think we should judge others for appearing to follow God's instructions for the sake of a reward as we do not know where their hearts are, or what their motives really are. And whether they are right or wrong it is a personal thing between them and God. I also think that Christians have been socialised by the church into thinking that it is not okay to seek a reward for anything. Consequently, overt reward seekers are seen as being self centred or bad. If we get real we will all have to admit that we behave in various ways to obtain a reward of some kind or other. Rewards are often subtle and not easy to identify, but they are definitely there. They are part of life whether we want to admit it or not. Sorry to ramble on so much. I hope it all makes sense, if not, feel free to delete it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted February 25, 2005 Author Share Posted February 25, 2005 Quote: I eat right and I am rewarded with good health. I do good things and I am rewarded in various ways. >>I follow Christ and I am rewarded with the eternal life<< etc. I really thought your "rambling" was well worth reading. Just thought it interesting that you see eternal life as a reward. My observation about my own life, as well as results in others, is that when we see eternal life as a gift as opposed to something we work for, it becomes easier to rest contented with working with a reward in mind. I won't write out the dictionary difference between gift and reward, but I suggest the difference is quite distinct. It also seems to help contentment in allowing God to determine the reward for what we do or give. [:"red"] "But love your enemies, do good, and lend, hoping for nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High. For He is kind to the unthankful and evil." [/] Luke 6:35 NKJV I'm supposing this Scripture above reveals the ideal. However no mention is made decrying reward. After all, what would all the givers do if every one refused to accept gratefully and gracefully. In fact, where would that possibly place the most generous Giver of all, not to mention those who find great joy in giving? [:"red"] "And remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He said, "It is more blessed to give than to receive." [/] Acts 20:35 NKJV Where would the blessedness come from if no one was willing to receive with grace. [:"red"] "What do you have that you did not receive?" [/] 1 Cor 4:7 NASB Lift Jesus up!! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 25, 2005 Share Posted February 25, 2005 Quote: Just thought it interesting that you see eternal life as a reward. My observation about my own life, as well as results in others, is that when we see eternal life as a gift as opposed to something we work for, it becomes easier to rest contented with working with a reward in mind. I see your point. I guess reward is not the right word as I do not think I have to work for salvation. I do, however, see it as conditional. If I do not continue to follow Christ the gift will be taken away. John 15:5-6 “Yes, I am the vine; you are the branches. Those who remain in me, and I in them, will produce much fruit. For apart from me you can do nothing. 6 Anyone who parts from me is thrown away like a useless branch and withers. Such branches are gathered into a pile to be burned." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted February 25, 2005 Moderators Share Posted February 25, 2005 The Bible is very explicit in talking about rewards, and also in saying 'do this because' of them, so I think the 'you're just doing it for the reward' mentality you described is unBiblical. Some of the rewards are natural and some miraculous, though. Eating well and exercising naturally lead to good health, but believing in Christ miraculously leads to immortality! The Bible doesn't always make that distinction, it just says 'do this and this will happen'. The question in the thread title is interesting. I don't think God's commands are capricious - "Just 'cos I said so". There are real and practical reasons behind them, and when we keep them we'll see the benefits, and when we break them we'll see the consequences. But for the Creator, it might not even be a useful distinction to make whether they're demands or instructions. As a dumb metaphor, when the manufacturer of your car says 'don't run it with no oil in the crankcase', you'd better listen! Is it a demand or an option with consequences? Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 25, 2005 Share Posted February 25, 2005 People do what they do depending on their maturity at the time.. Fear Reward For others Love It is appropriate, when settled into the truth.. Keeping God's commands..minimizes suffering in the total equation...so whatever the reason...fine..yet maturity/Christ likeness is the goal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 25, 2005 Share Posted February 25, 2005 I believe what Jesus had to say about this was not that it was wrong to do things for the sake of the reward, but rather, to concentrate on the *right* reward: the lasting, eternal one instead of the immediate temporal one. He encouraged us to look to our heavenly reward, which is, as I see it, that cause and effect measure built into reality to encourage us to choose what is good and life-affirming, and reject that which is evil and life-destroying. God built some sensible cause/effect loops into reality so that our own experience would testify of His truth. Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 25, 2005 Share Posted February 25, 2005 Quote: I see your point. I guess reward is not the right word as I do not think I have to work for salvation. I do, however, see it as conditional. If I do not continue to follow Christ the gift will be taken away. Just a slight aside here, a little -- I see it as that the gift (of eternal life) is IN Christ (the Bible states as much) and if we do not continue to follow (or "remain in") Christ, it is we who are discarding the gift, not He who is taking it away from us. Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
there buster Posted February 25, 2005 Share Posted February 25, 2005 to all: All of this discussion overlooks the problems posed by the book of Job. His "comforters" championed cause-and-effect, action-and-reaction, performance-and-reward. Job rejected their reasoning. And God reprimanded both. Quote “the slovenliness of our language makes it easier to have foolish thoughts.” George Orwell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 25, 2005 Moderators Share Posted February 25, 2005 I see God making/offering/promising all kinds of rewards in the Bible. I believe He does that to get the attention of reward-oriented sinners which we all are, but He also knows that once we REALLY get to know Him, the material rewards pale to nothingness compared to the reward of knowing Him & and being with the kind of person He is. Gerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted February 26, 2005 Author Share Posted February 26, 2005 Quote: -- ...the gift (..eternal life) is IN Christ... if we do not ........("remain in") Christ, it is....not He who is taking it away... Did I edit that right,Nico? If so, I'm with you. [:"red"] "If we are faithless [do not believe and are untrue to Him], He remains true (faithful to His Word and His righteous character), for He cannot deny Himself." [/] 2 Timothy 2:13 AMP Ain't God good! Lift Jesus up!! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 Yes. Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 Quote: Just a slight aside here, a little -- I see it as that the gift (of eternal life) is IN Christ (the Bible states as much) and if we do not continue to follow (or "remain in") Christ, it is we who are discarding the gift, not He who is taking it away from us. Very well put Nico. I had not thought of it that way before. I have been struggling with the conditional thing for quite a while and had even mentioned it to my pastor a couple of times. I was just told that it was not conditional and that was that. So thanks for making it simple enough for my simple mind to grasp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 One aspect of the "reward" idea is this. If we have given our life in serivce to others, have loved others, and done everything with God's power to reach thoes around us then we will have "rewards" in heaven. It isn't as if they were created to be "rewards" as per say but that when we see people in heaven whom we have had a small part in leading to Jesus we will be overjoyed. That joy will be so intense and deep that it will be one of the greatest rewards ever. Another "reward" you can say about heaven will be to never be sick, to live in harmony with others etc. That is what heaven is naturally like but we will enjoy it immensly, especially after coming from our lives here on earth where life was anything but healthy and peaceful all the time with all people. Even if life was extra good for us and we made all the right choices, all you have to do is turn on the news to have sadness overwhelm you at times as to the sufferings of others. Heaven and eternal life are not "punishments" or "accidents" they are the result of an incredible God and our choice in following his direction and leadership in our lives through his power. It will be the result of a surrendered will to God. Whatever you call it, the reward, the gift, it all is on the opposite side of punishment or "just desserts". Taylor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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