Dr. Shane Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 As I think about it, a blanket law against book burning may be unconstitutional. However a law that simply bans burning religious books may be OK. The Supreme Court did rule that the KKK does not have the right to burn crosses. It will be interesting to see where this goes. Hopefully no one has to die in the process. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 BTW: when I was in high school, I attended a book burning at an Assembly of God church. They had a bomb fire and tossed in a bunch of worldly books and music. So this isn't that unheardof. Banning that kind of activity, is what I would think would be unconstitutional. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 8, 2010 Author Share Posted September 8, 2010 The odd thing is that most of the radical right-wing that is against the ground-zero mosque supports this church's right to burn books. They are anti-First Amendment in the mosque debate but pro-first Amendment in the book burning issue. I think that kind of takes off their mask. They are simply anti-Muslim. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 gp I see a lot of liberal leaders speaking out against this sort of book burning... What is troubling me is the lack of conservative leaders also speaking out against this...Where is the speaker of the house or Senate on this issue? They are not getting press on speaking out agianst this...Even Pailin is not saying much against sthis sort of thing...where are the conservatives showing leadership in abusing the freedom of expression? Where is the responsible leaders who are talking about this? I am not trying to politi-cise this post, but it bothers me to hear one thing from conservatives against the mosque and then this koran book burning that might hurt our soldiers in Afgahanistan...Why can't they say something? At least, why cant they stand up for our boys and girls in uniform??? Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 gp I see a lot of liberal leaders speaking out against this sort of book burning... Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 I see a lot of liberal leaders speaking out against this sort of book burning... How are they speaking out against book burning? Are they saying that the government should ban it? Or are they saying the individuals simply shouldn't do it? We know the Supreme Court has said no to burning a cross and yes to burning the flag. Book burning probably isn't the same as either of those. I don't see a problem with book burning in and of itself. Burning another religion's holy book is certainly inflammatory (in more than one way ) There may be reason to ban that. However, if we are going to allow flag burning... we need to ask ourselves how much more inflammatory burning a holy book is. I do not think the government should have the right to burn books. That is what we need to fear most. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SivartM Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Have the "lot of liberals" spoken out against the call to kill americans because of the actions of one man? Who is asking for that? Most of the Muslims I'm seeing are asking for Allah to have mercy on the DWOC. Quote "Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde�Do to others whatever you would like them to do to you. This is the essence of all that is taught in the law and the prophets." - Jesus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Define the radical right wing that is against the ground zero mosque and backs the book burning. Basically they are a bunch or media types that need to drive up ratings so they make a mountain out of what isn't even a mole hill. A bunch of mindless zombies jump on their political band wagon and ride it where ever it goes. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Originally Posted By: bonnie Have the "lot of liberals" spoken out against the call to kill americans because of the actions of one man? Who is asking for that? Most of the Muslims I'm seeing are asking for Allah to have mercy on the DWOC. How about in addition to personal prayer they state beyond question the call to kill americans for the action of one man is as wrong and immoral as the actions of this pastor.And do so just as vocally and publically as they do condemnation of americans.Maybe if they did not demand and get this special treatment honoring their beliefs there might not be the tension there is Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Originally Posted By: bonnie Define the radical right wing that is against the ground zero mosque and backs the book burning. Basically they are a bunch or media types that need to drive up ratings so they make a mountain out of what isn't even a mole hill. A bunch of mindless zombies jump on their political band wagon and ride it where ever it goes. This ...bunch or media types that need to drive.... sounds pretty general. Who are the media types? Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 I wouldn't want to name any by name and cause anyone to listen, watch or read their stuff. They are the modern day racist hate mongers. Not exactly they type I would want my children watching, listening to or reading. They have quite a following which is what is most scary. One of these days they will say Sunday law and all their mindless zombies will all shout out "yes, yes". Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Quote: wouldn't want to name any by name and cause anyone to listen, watch or read their stuff. They are the modern day racist hate mongers. Not exactly they type I would want my children watching, listening to or reading. They have quite a following which is what is most scary. One of these days they will say Sunday law and all their mindless zombies will all shout out "yes, yes". Have to really appreciate the slick response. Condemning someone and yet not giving their identity. I don't think your children are all old enough to be reading here. I am sure you will never ask for "proof" of what anyone says after this. Makes it easier on everyone Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Originally Posted By: Neil D I see a lot of liberal leaders speaking out against this sort of book burning... How are they speaking out against book burning? Are they saying that the government should ban it? Or are they saying the individuals simply shouldn't do it? Ok, I've found both liberal and conservatives who have condemned the Koran book burning....here is a list... The terrorist attacks of 9/11, says the Vatican, "cannot be counteracted by an outrageous and grave gesture against a book considered sacred by a religious community." Attorney General Eric Holder called the plan "idiotic and dangerous." Presumed presidential candidate Mitt Romney told Politico "Burning the Quran is wrong on every level. It puts troops in danger, and it violates a founding principle of our republic." [ "I do not think well of the idea of burning anybody's Koran, Bible, Book of Mormon or anything else," Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour told reporters. "I don't think there is any excuse for it. I don't think it's a good idea." "Any type of activity like that that puts our troops in harm's way would be a concern," White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said Tuesday. "I appeal to people who are planning to burn the Quran to reconsider and drop their plans because they are inconsistent with American values and, as General Petraeus has warned, threatening to America's military," Connecticut Sen. Joe Lieberman said in a statement. House Minority Leader John Boehner spoke out against the event, comparing it to the planned Islamic center near Ground Zero. "Well, listen, I just think it's not wise to do this in the face of what our country represents. ... Just because you have the right to do something in America, doesn't mean it's the right thing to do." New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg called it "boneheaded and wrong" but said the protesters are protected by the First Amendment. "He has a right to do it," he said. Actress Angelina Jolie spoke out against the plan while visiting Pakis Never let it be said that I don't find some conservative doing the right thing once in a while... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 That really didn't answer my questions. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Have to really appreciate the slick response. Well, thank you. The question was one of those "gocha" questions so I responded appropriately. Anyone discussing politics that doesn't know who the right-wing media is in the US, really shouldn't be discussing politics in the US. Should they? We all know who is out there drumming up hate in order to drive up ratings. My goodness. They are treating our President like a dog. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Never let it be said that I don't find some conservative doing the right thing once in a while... Actually, conservatives being against the mosque at ground zero is contra to their typical position. Conservatives are normally all for private property rights and less government regulation. In the ground zero controversy, many wanted the zoning commission to deny the permit. That is very contrary to conservative ideology. I can only think conservatives are abandoning their ideals because of the hatred or fear of Muslims. Those I have seen condemning the book burning have not been clear. Do they think such book burnings should be illegal? Or are they just saying that it is immoral and lacking good judgment? Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Hear some conservative 'enthusiastically' condemn the book burning.... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Originally Posted By: bonnie Have to really appreciate the slick response. Well, thank you. The question was one of those "gocha" questions so I responded appropriately. Anyone discussing politics that doesn't know who the right-wing media is in the US, really shouldn't be discussing politics in the US. Should they? We all know who is out there drumming up hate in order to drive up ratings. My goodness. They are treating our President like a dog. Because the president claims to be treated like a dog does not make it true. The question was not I gotcha,it was a request for you to back up what you said. You refused. I have not heard anyone in the right wing media in favor of this book burning.They believe he has a right to do so but believe it to be pretty stupid to say the least Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Quote: Actually, conservatives being against the mosque at ground zero is contra to their typical position. Conservatives are normally all for private property rights and less government regulation. In the ground zero controversy, many wanted the zoning commission to deny the permit. That is very contrary to conservative ideology. I can only think conservatives are abandoning their ideals because of the hatred or fear of Muslims. How so? There may have been some wanting the zoning commission to block the permitbut most acknowledge the right to build a mosque there but don't want it? I have not heard anyone that is happy about the proposed book burning.Your "claims" are just opinion till you produce those many of the right wing media that favor the book burning. Quote: Those I have seen condemning the book burning have not been clear. Do they think such book burnings should be illegal? Or are they just saying that it is immoral and lacking good judgment? What is it they are supposed to condemn.The burning of the Quran is as legal and as stupid if I stood in my yard burning my catholic bibles. I have a right to do so.But my catholic neighbors might have a little problem with me doing that. It is immoral and and lacking good judgment and perfectly legal and I have the right to do just that Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted September 9, 2010 Moderators Share Posted September 9, 2010 Fahrenheit 451 Hmmm. You made me wonder if the Spirit of Prophesy is broader than I think it is. Ooops, did I just make a heretical statement? Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 The actions of the "times square wannabe bomber" had few comments or condemnation by the liberal's.It was quickly stated that it was not the actions of all of Islam.Mayor Bloomberg first claimed it could be by those that disliked Obama's health care plan.The call for killing americans for the actions of one man doesn't appear to cause concern either. Maybe if the day comes when the left stop treating Islam with such awe and reverence and special preference some of the tension might cease. The religion of muslims should be on equal footing of other religions,not above. When immigrants come here because of a better life,don't assume your religious beliefs must be treated as in a musim country. Don't demand a service dog for the handicapped be removed or you will kill it.Rearrange your schedule or go to another school. Don't apply for and be given a job that you know ahead of time will offend your religious principals. Don't demand paid for muslim prayer time,unless you are demanding the same special concessions for all religions. If you are a cabbie,either pick up all travelers or get out of the front of the line.Wait your turn for a acceptable fare. If the job requires you to check out products that violate your religious principals,don't apply and expect to be given special permission to shut down your line,waiting for someone that can check out,pork,dog food etc. As a SDA I cannot demand and expect to get a change in the scheduling of town meetings. No one is going to listen when I demand a change because of Fri evening sundown. We have many such examples in MN.I don't believe it is only here. Treat Islam and the followers of Islam as all religions should be treated. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Because the president claims to be treated like a dog does not make it true. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Neil, in all honesty, Keith Olbermann is about as objective as Rush Limbaugh is. These guys are ideologues chasing ratings. We have already seen that John Boehner has taken a position against this book burning. John Boehner is the most powerful Republican voice in the House of Representatives. If the Republicans win control of the House, he may well be the next Speaker of the House. His voice against it is a Republican equivalent to President Obama's voice for the Democrat Party. Olbermann claims only a handful of Republicans have condemned this book burning and then goes on to list quite a few that have - only to go on to mention a handful that have not. Was Olbermann against the ACLU law suit to get more pictures released of abuses against Arab prisoners at Abu Grab? Did he go on record as saying it was poor judgment for Newsweek to publish a story about a soldier at Gitmo flushing a Koran down the toilet? These had the same impact of anti-American violence as burning the Koran will have. I am wondering if Olbermann was as concerned about anti-American violence then as he is now. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 The burning of the Quran is as legal and as stupid if I stood in my yard burning my catholic bibles. I have a right to do so. From what I understand, the local municipality has passed a law that bans book burning. So burning the Koran is not legal. This church will be breaking the law if they burn the Koran. That is what this whole discussion should be about. Is that local law constitutional? I think everyone agrees that it is stupid and inconsiderate to burn a holy book of another faith. The bigger concern is whether or not the local municipality's ban on book burning is unconstitutional. I say "maybe". Burning flags is not unconstitutional. Burning crosses is. What about burning the holy book of another person's faith? Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 It is really shameful the tactics the radical right wing is stooping to. Isn't it? Downright shameful. They are acting as bad as the fanatical left did during the Bush years. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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