Dr. Shane Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 A candidate's marriage is very much a reasonable issue for voters to consider. When Ross Perot ran for President he took some heat because he had hired a private detective to find out if one of his employees was committing adultery. He explained it by saying if a man would cheat on a contract he makes with his wife, he would certainly cheat on a contract he makes with his boss. Jesus didn't live in a Democracy where He actively took part in choosing the nation's leaders. He did make Judas the treasurer. I don't know if He would have made Judas Secretary of the Treasury for all of Rome but that is a thought. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 A candidate's marriage is very much a reasonable issue for voters to consider. When Ross Perot ran for President he took some heat because he had hired a private detective to find out if one of his employees was committing adultery. He explained it by saying if a man would cheat on a contract he makes with his wife, he would certainly cheat on a contract he makes with his boss. Jesus didn't live in a Democracy where He actively took part in choosing the nation's leaders. He did make Judas the treasurer. I don't know if He would have made Judas Secretary of the Treasury for all of Rome but that is a thought. Are you dizzy yet from so much spinning? You were not talking of the state of the marriage of Newt Gingrich.You are making snide remarks about the age of his wife. You are talking of the state of his previous marriage.What is the state of his current marriage which so far seems to be working? YOU HAVE NO IDEA,ANYMORE THAN YOU KNOW THE STATE OF THE OBAMA MARRIAGE.Until and unless there is an indication something is amiss the state of either is FLAT OUT NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS,nor is the age of their spouse Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 16, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 16, 2011 A candidate's marriage is very much a reasonable issue for voters to consider. When Ross Perot ran for President he took some heat because he had hired a private detective to find out if one of his employees was committing adultery. He explained it by saying if a man would cheat on a contract he makes with his wife, he would certainly cheat on a contract he makes with his boss. Obviously, Clinton's infidelity gave an indication of the kind of man that he was. Equally so Gingrich's behavior is an indicator too. It's troubling when we as Christians give our guy a pass simply because he's a member of a political party. If you are serious about character Gingrich's past would give anyone considerable pause for concern. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Obviously, Clinton's infidelity gave an indication of the kind of man that he was. Equally so Gingrich's behavior is an indicator too. It's troubling when we as Christians give our guy a pass simply because he's a member of a political party. If you are serious about character Gingrich's past would give anyone considerable pause for concern. I have a BIL that is married to a woman 15 years younger. My BIL could have given Clinton a run for his money in the infidelity dept.His wife and I had been good friends and ended up marrying brothers. It is still hard to understand how he could put his first wife and children thru what he did.He married the woman he was having an affair with,not a solid ground on which to build.They have been married many years and neither are the person they were at that time.He to repented and asked for forgiveness.Shall we as a family hold his past over his head so as to not look as if we are giving him a pass? HIs children have seen the change in his life and forgiven him as has his former wife and more importantly I have to believe God has..I am a little funny on that score as I believe God can change people.Doesn't mean they escape the consequences of their actions but it does mean I am not in charge of those consequences. The age of Newt Gingrichs wife is not a moral issue.The moral issue was when he was unfaithful to his wife. As for giving Gingrich a pass I guess I have to accept till he proves otherwise that God has forgiven if his repentence was/is sincere. What Clinton did afterwards showed as much if not more of his character than the actual act.Never once heard any true repentence as to his actions while leader of this country. If there were credible current evidence of repeat behaviour while married to this wife,I would be one of the first to bail.I would not vote period.I could not vote for a man like Obama,but neither would I vote for a man that would use a "conversion" to achieve his own ends. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 16, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 16, 2011 Never once heard any true repentence as to his actions while leader of this country. How did you miss that? Google it. I guess you don't believe it because he's a democrat. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted December 17, 2011 Share Posted December 17, 2011 Originally Posted By: bonnie Never once heard any true repentence as to his actions while leader of this country. How did you miss that? Google it. I guess you don't believe it because he's a democrat. No,you guess wrong. A lot is missing including actions in his "repentence speech".As a sitting president he was responsible for what was done to his accusers.James Carville did not act/speak independent of Clinton.Clinton is as responsible for referring to them as trailer park trash as Carville was. Clinton approved of his wife on national television blaming everyone but her "dear faithful" husband.Hilary has her own share of "sin" in his infidelities by publically defending her husband,who she knew to be a serial adulterer,and blaming others. The act of adultry can never be excused,regardless of political party. Nor can blaming others for those actions. Clinton has never taken responsibility for trying to place blame on others,other than a few generic remarks. The behavior of Gingrich was inexcusable to put it mildly.If the past few years are any indication he has put it behind him.If that is true it is up to others to do same. For a party that so enthusiatically supported Ted Kennedy and Chris Dodd I find the concern over the past of Gingrich a little hypocritical Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 You are talking of the state of his previous marriage.What is the state of his current marriage which so far seems to be working? He left his former wife for the current one. He treats women like cars. When one gets too old, he trades it in for a younger one. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 If you are serious about character, Gingrich's past would give anyone considerable pause for concern. It is a serious concern but so is competence. Clinton had character issues but he was competent. Obama isn't competent. He is in over his head and has dug a hole so deep he will never get out of it. What I mean by that is that he cannot work with people that disagree with him. A leader needs to be able to lead and Obama just makes people mad and dig in their heels. He is incompetent. So while Gingrich is not my first choice among the Republican candidates, I have little doubt of his competence. Our nation needs a competent President at this point. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 18, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 18, 2011 I think the opposite is true. I think Obama has been TOO willing to work with the GOP. He should have been tougher, more passionate and more demanding. Clinton had the economy on his side. Obama has the economy against him. The GOp is simply running out the clock. They don't need to comprmise and work with the President. Their tactic may just work. One of the major criticisms of Gingrich is his leadership ability. Serious conservatives have heavy criticism of his competence. Clearly they fear the same lack of discipline will infect the White House if he is President. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 I think the opposite is true. I think Obama has been TOO willing to work with the GOP. He should have been tougher, more passionate and more demanding. Clinton had the economy on his side. Obama has the economy against him. The GOp is simply running out the clock. They don't need to comprmise and work with the President. Their tactic may just work. I agree, this is what I've seen these past 2 1/2 years. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Quote: Their tactic may just work. I'm not sure what their tactic is - but I pray it works. The Democrats have had their time. I'm ready for the REpublicans to rule. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 I think Obama has been TOO willing to work with the GOP. I think you are wearing some very funny glasses. During the health-care reform negotiations when Obama finally agreed to include Republicans in one meeting and allow CSPAN cameras there, McCain made a comment that caused Obama to remind him that he (Obama) had won and elections have consequences. Basically Obama was telling McCain to shut up and it didn't matter what Republicans thought or wanted because he was the new sheriff in town and things were going to be run his way. Then in the Fall of 2010 the American people voted in the Republicans to control the House and Obama doesn't think that elections should have any consequences anymore. He thinks everyone should still do as he says. He needs to listen to his own words. Elections have consequences. Obama could get everything he wants. He could get a tax hike on the rich. He could get an increase in the capital gains tax. He could get another stimulus bill. BUT he has to be willing to give the Republicans some of the things they want. That is how politics works. He has to give them off-shore drilling. He needs to open up ANWAR. He needs to give the Canadian pipeline a green light. But that is not how he thinks. He draws a line in the sand and says its his way or he is not going to play. Thousands can lose their jobs and have their homes foreclosed but he doesn't care. He will not compromise with Republicans. Never! He is Obama. The Republicans need to give him what he wants and forget about any promises they made to their constituents. That is not how things work and that is why he is an utter failure. He can't get anything done. He is not up to the job. He is in over his head and swimming down. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 One of the major criticisms of Gingrich is his leadership ability. Gingrich was the most powerful Speaker of the House since the American Civil War. The Speaker of the House, Senate Majority Leader and the President are basically the three people that run this nation. However when the Speaker or Senate Leader are of a different party than the President, they really need to have excellent leadership skills. That is because they make deals that they have to go back and get their fellow Congressmen to vote for. Gingrich, for example, would make a deal with Clinton and then Gingrich had to go back to the House and sell that deal to all the other Republicans. He did a remarkable job. One of the reasons Clinton was successful was because Gingrich was also successful. Compare that to Nancy Pelosi. Obama wanted a single-payer health-care system. Look at what we got. What we got is a mess. The individual mandate is actually an idea that came out of the conservative Heritage Foundation. Understand that means that Nancy Pelosi could not sell Obama's single-payer health-care system to her fellow Democrats so they ended up having to use an idea from the conservative Heritage Foundation. Nancy Pelosi's job was easier than Gingrich's job was because Gingrich had to get bills passed that were deals made with the Clinton Administration. Pelosi should have had no problem getting Democrats in the House to vote for bills coming out of a Democrat White House. I certainly have issues and concerns about Gingrich but leadership is not one of them. In fact, his ability to lead should make his position on church and state all that much more worrisome. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 I agree, this is what I've seen these past 2 1/2 years. The Republicans have only controlled the House this past year. Before January of this year, Democrats controlled both houses of Congress. They can't blame Republicans for their failure to get things done during that time. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 22, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 22, 2011 I certainly have issues and concerns about Gingrich but leadership is not one of them. You should be concerned since people who are members of his own party raise these concerns. They actually worked with him. “There’s all types of leaders. Leaders that instill confidence, leaders that are somewhat abrupt and brisk. Leaders that have one standard for the people that they’re leading and a different standard for themselves. I just found his leadership lacking,” Coburn. Newt Gingrich was a disaster as speaker," said Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y. "Everything was self-centered. There was a lack of intellectual discipline," King said. "Even though Newt liked to talk about team-building and quality management, the theory he really subscribed to was management by chaos," Molinari wrote. "He loved chaos, and even when he didn't create it knowingly and intentionally, he managed to leave it in his wake after every meeting, after every press conference, after every phone call." Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Every man has a critic. I was probably more involved with politics during the Gingrich years than any other time in my life. The man was the most powerful Speaker since the Civil War. A lot of folks didn't like what he did or how he did it but he got things done. That is what a leader does. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 23, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 23, 2011 A lot of folks didn't like what he did or how he did it but he got things done. That is what a leader does. Clearly members of his own party don't want the country to pay the price of his style of leadership. I think the GOP base is beginning to see it. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 ANY leadership would be better than what we have no - which is NO leadership. We are sinking as a nation due to lack of leadership. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 23, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 23, 2011 ANY leadership would be better than what we have no - which is NO leadership. We are sinking as a nation due to lack of leadership. Woody, that's a lame GOP talking point. Dems and Gopers have been complicit in the collapse that is underway. Do you really think a republican would have been much different to Obama. My guess is that we would be at war with Iran, Syria and perhaps Russia right now if Mc Cain had won. The crisis is world wide and not simply the result of one man's lack of leadership. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Clearly members of his own party don't want the country to pay the price of his style of leadership. I think the GOP base is beginning to see it. We have a number of Republican candidates at this point and Republicans are divided over who they want to put up as a candidate. That is the whole purpose of the caucus and primary process. Gingrich has a lot of negatives. There are some that like his style of leadership but dislike many other things about him. He got things done. He got a very popular President impeached. That itself was a huge task that took enormous leadership. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Do you really think a Republican would have been much different to Obama? I think Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton or even Nancy Pelosi would have been able to do a better job than Obama. Obama is not a leader. He couldn't even get a single-payer, health-care system passed when he had super majorities in both houses of Congress. Future political science textbooks will define failure as Obama. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 23, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 23, 2011 There are some that like his style of leadership Like who? Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Like who? Those that plan to vote for him in the caucuses and primaries. Those that are donating money to his presidential campaign. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 26, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 26, 2011 Originally Posted By: lazarus Like who? Those that plan to vote for him in the caucuses and primaries. Those that are donating money to his presidential campaign. Oh, of course. There are those who plan to vote for Michelle Bachmann too! Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted December 26, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted December 26, 2011 I think Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton or even Nancy Pelosi would have been able to do a better job than Obama. You could begin with some credibility to argue that point with the name Clinton but neither of the other two. Hypothetical is a word you would probably use here. Quote: Future political science textbooks will define failure as Obama. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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