Gibs Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 We all have a tendency to forget the power of Christ that is in us to do all things of His will. Mr 10:27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible. Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Take hold of His power who is in you and any and all can put away all sin and disobediences! How do I know? Well folks, He showed us, He came as one of us with our fallen sinfull nature and overcame Satan as a man, and not as God. He took no power but what we can have to accomplish the task. Our fallback is we are not fully committed if we are failing. We have not totally killed self, we keep ole self partially resurrected and so we are powerless. He, His Spirit in us, must be the only King in the soul temple. Christ in you is your hope of Glory, for all must be an overcomer in the here and now. If He was going to make us to be overcomers, then He need not have come and showed us the only way that we could win eternal life! Don't you see if just believe and be saved was it, why it would not have been the few through the "srait" gate and up the narrow way! "strait" means narrow there, must be cleaned of excesses to get through! Things of the world are all left behind, only a cleaned heart is acceptable. That "strait" gate eliminates the many or most! There is a promise here, and is, He is your strength to overcome as He did. Then sweet victory is ours! 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 We all have a tendency to forget the power of Christ that is in us to do all things of His will. Mr 10:27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible. Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Take hold of His power who is in you and any and all can put away all sin and disobediences! How do I know? Well folks, He showed us, He came as one of us with our fallen sinfull nature and overcame Satan as a man, and not as God. He took no power but what we can have to accomplish the task. Our fallback is we are not fully committed if we are failing. We have not totally killed self, we keep ole self partially resurrected and so we are powerless. He, His Spirit in us, must be the only King in the soul temple. Christ in you is your hope of Glory, for all must be an overcomer in the here and now. If He was going to make us to be overcomers, then He need not have come and showed us the only way that we could win eternal life! Don't you see if just believe and be saved was it, why it would not have been the few through the "srait" gate and up the narrow way! "strait" means narrow there, must be cleaned of excesses to get through! Things of the world are all left behind, only a cleaned heart is acceptable. That "strait" gate eliminates the many or most! There is a promise here, and is, He is your strength to overcome as He did. Then sweet victory is ours! 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. While you know we disagree on the nature of Christ, we are agreed on the rest of your post. God has not left us powerless in the battle with sin. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 6, 2013 Author Share Posted February 6, 2013 Joeb if you can't put it together from scripture will you take it from EGW? "He took upon his sinless nature our sinful nature, that He might know how to succor those that are tempted.--Medical Ministry, p. 181. {7ABC 450.5} God was in Christ in human form, and endured all the temptations wherewith man was beset; in our behalf He participated in the suffering and trials of sorrowful human nature.--The Watchman, Dec. 10, 1907. {7ABC 450.7} 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Live4Him Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 Great thoughts Gibs. I often wonder why some deny God's power to cleanse us from sin. If God cannot cleanse us that means satan has more power than God, which would make Him a false god. Speaking as someone that went through an immense struggle of being a slave to sin for years I can attest that it is a huge relief now, as I let God work in me that the slavery I hate so much is slowly day by day losing it's control on me. I find joy in the Law of liberty and happiness. I have no idea why anyone would want to excuse a life under the law of sin and death, I found it a miserable life. I would like to bring something up here that might be valuable. In the past in our church this topic has been presented in a bad light causing a lot of people to reject the truth because of the manner it was presented in. I am not saying you present it in a bad way, I don't think that at all. I just thought it important to point out a verse to go along with this that I think would balance it out well. 1 Cor. 13:3 tells us that even if we give every thing we own to the poor or even if we die a martyrs death if we do not have God's love abiding in us then it was a wasted effort and we are still lost. Sister White talks about presenting the Law and the Gospel equally and I do believe that is important. I believe the Gospel explains to us the need of the Law and shows us that the Law is not just a set of harsh rules to live by. I realized that without strict obedience things happen like 1/3 of the angels fall. A whole world is plunged into thousands of years of misery, torture and death. The only way other worlds can live in perfect harmony and happiness is because they are in strict obedience to the Law of God. The core value in the Law is Love, putting others before self. Anyway, great post and hope more people will find how much happier life is when we give our will over to God and let Him guide and direct us. Quote Thy word is a lamp to my feet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 6, 2013 Author Share Posted February 6, 2013 Great Live4Him, Yes when that law of love is in our hearts it has become our law too. For when we truly have love we don't need them written anywhere as they are written in our heart. When we love Him with all our heart and soul and it is top priority to please Him and then to love our fellow man as ourself. Yes, I know what you are saying, I was about as deep in sin as one can get and it is a process of casting out the old self and we can do it, as with Him within all things are possible. Now I keep self "killed" and allow Him only to be the Master in the soul temple. Oh! you know as well as I self is so easy to resurrect that we must always be alert not too. We must have a mindset to be quickened by Him only! Ro 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? Dead to sin and alive in HIM! And does ole Satan throw at you the things he knows where one is weak. I know I am weak and must have Him to give me the strength, His strength and Satan is defeated! Blessings I pray for you and yours, Live4Him, and enjoy your stay and posting comments and threads here. 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 Joeb if you can't put it together from scripture will you take it from EGW? "He took upon his sinless nature our sinful nature, that He might know how to succor those that are tempted.--Medical Ministry, p. 181. {7ABC 450.5} God was in Christ in human form, and endured all the temptations wherewith man was beset; in our behalf He participated in the suffering and trials of sorrowful human nature.--The Watchman, Dec. 10, 1907. {7ABC 450.7} 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Gibs, I'm not going to continue to play dueling quotes with you. You know what I think and why. I've given you quote after quote showing you that your reading of what she says there cannot be harmonized with the rest of her writings on the subject. The only way that quote can be harmonized with the rest of her statements on the nature of Christ is to understand that she is talking about our degraded physical nature in that quote. You know that. I know that. So stop with the acting like your argument is unanswerable. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 7, 2013 Author Share Posted February 7, 2013 Hey, Joeb, that isn't the only place she stated that. Too many want to make it Christ had an advantage over what He has given us to overcome. Well that is very very false. In our words, He did it in our shoes, from where we are and had no advantage over us. As a matter of fact we now have an advantage over what He had to overcome as now the Devil and his angels are defeated foes as they can see Christ dwelling in you. Don't put Christ out and you easily can come off the victor now! Yes He made His Way for us easy and the yoke very light to bear. Granted Christ never stooped to sin. He forgives us all our sin at repentance and we then with Him within can walk as He did. Yes He showed us it could be done. He walked in the Way He made to show us and prove to us it could be done. Satan was on Him with far more than he would ever be with one of us. Take up the Way He has made and come off victor, it is easy and the burden light! 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 7, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 7, 2013 If you are still preaching total sinless perfection, been there, done that. It is a totally hopeless and useless pursuit of a chimera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 8, 2013 Author Share Posted February 8, 2013 Come on now, notice ALL things, Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Christ in you and you have His Power and if you really, really want to it is not impossibe, but the verse states, "can do all things". 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted February 8, 2013 Members Share Posted February 8, 2013 Come on now, notice ALL things, Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Christ in you and you have His Power and if you really, really want to it is not impossibe, but the verse states, "can do all things". 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. That's not what's being said at all. Yes we can do all things through Christ. Have not seen anyone say the opposite! Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Oplinger Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Originally Posted By: Gibs Come on now, notice ALL things, Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Christ in you and you have His Power and if you really, really want to it is not impossibe, but the verse states, "can do all things". 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. That's not what's being said at all. Yes we can do all things through Christ. Have not seen anyone say the opposite! pkrause - in order for Gibs to promote his theological thought here, he must necessarily think we say the opposite, no matter what we actually do say. Blessings, Quote "As iron sharpens iron, so also does one man sharpen another" - Proverbs 27:17 "The offense of the cross is that the cross is a confession of human frailty and sin and of inability to do any good thing. To take the cross of Christ means to depend solely on Him for everything, and this is the abasement of all human pride. Men love to fancy themselves independent. But let the cross be preached, let it be made known that in man dwells no good thing and that all must be received as a gift, and straightway someone is offended." Ellet J. Waggoner, The Glad Tidings "Courage is being scared to death - and saddling up anyway" - John Wayne "The person who pays an ounce of principle for a pound of popularity gets badly cheated" - Ronald Reagan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 8, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 8, 2013 Come on now, notice ALL things, Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Christ in you and you have His Power and if you really, really want to it is not impossibe, but the verse states, "can do all things". 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. The law demands righteousness, and this the sinner owes to the law; but he is incapable of rendering it.The only way in which he can attain to righteousness is through faith. By faith he can bring to God the merits of Christ, and the Lord places the obedience of His Son to the sinner's account. Christ's righteousness is accepted in place of man's failure, and God receives, pardons, justifies, the repentant, believing soul, treats him as though he were righteous, and loves him as He loves His Son. This is how faith is accounted righteousness; and the pardoned soul goes on from grace to grace, from light to a greater light. He can say with rejoicing, "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; which He shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; that being justified by His grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life" (Titus 3:5-7). {FW 101.1} You might want to rethink your view of the kind of righteousness that God demands. Your ONLY hope and mine is in the righteousness of Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 The law demands righteousness, and this the sinner owes to the law; but he is incapable of rendering it.The only way in which he can attain to righteousness is through faith. By faith he can bring to God the merits of Christ, and the Lord places the obedience of His Son to the sinner's account. Christ's righteousness is accepted in place of man's failure, and God receives, pardons, justifies, the repentant, believing soul, treats him as though he were righteous, and loves him as He loves His Son. This is how faith is accounted righteousness; and the pardoned soul goes on from grace to grace, from light to a greater light. He can say with rejoicing, "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; which He shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; that being justified by His grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life" (Titus 3:5-7). {FW 101.1} You might want to rethink your view of the kind of righteousness that God demands. Your ONLY hope and mine is in the righteousness of Christ. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 9, 2013 Author Share Posted February 9, 2013 He has enabled any and all of us who will be His and He will then impart His Divine Nature in you and then you have all the power needed to overcome! None, not one need come up short! 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 9, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 9, 2013 Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo The law demands righteousness, and this the sinner owes to the law; but he is incapable of rendering it.The only way in which he can attain to righteousness is through faith. By faith he can bring to God the merits of Christ, and the Lord places the obedience of His Son to the sinner's account. Christ's righteousness is accepted in place of man's failure, and God receives, pardons, justifies, the repentant, believing soul, treats him as though he were righteous, and loves him as He loves His Son. This is how faith is accounted righteousness; and the pardoned soul goes on from grace to grace, from light to a greater light. He can say with rejoicing, "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; which He shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; that being justified by His grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life" (Titus 3:5-7). {FW 101.1} You might want to rethink your view of the kind of righteousness that God demands. Your ONLY hope and mine is in the righteousness of Christ. Gerry, I'd like to point out that Ellen White is speaking of the natural/unconverted man in your quote. Here's what she says about someone who has truly experienced justification: Quote: We do not earn salvation by our obedience; for salvation is the free gift of God, to be received by faith. But obedience is the fruit of faith. “Ye know that He was manifested to take away our sins; and in Him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in Him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen Him, neither known Him.” 1 John 3:5, 6. Here is the true test. If we abide in Christ, if the love of God dwellsin us, our feelings, our thoughts, our purposes, our actions, will be in harmony with the will of God as expressed in the precepts of His holy law. “Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as He is righteous.” 1 John 3:7. Righteousness is defined by the standard of God’s holy law, as expressed in the ten precepts given on Sinai. Steps to Christ p. 61 Is the believer a sinner? Then what I quoted applies to the believer also. Does your obedience as a believer earn you ONE iota of merit for salvation? If not, why not? Here is another translation of the passage you just quoted: Everyone who habitually commits sin, also habitually commits lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. And you know absolutely that that One was manifested in order that He might take away our sins; and sin in Him does not exist. Everyone who in Him is constantly abiding is not habitually sinning. Everyone who is constantly sinning has not with discernment seen Him, nor has he known Him, with the result that that condition is true of him at present Wuest, K. S. (1961). The New Testament: An expanded translation (1 Jn 3:4–8). Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans. If you mean can we stop willful/intentional/premeditated/habitual sinning, then I agree with you and Gibs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 9, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 9, 2013 He has enabled any and all of us who will be His and He will then impart His Divine Nature in you and then you have all the power needed to overcome! None, not one need come up short! 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Does your purported "perfect" obedience earn you ONE iota of merit for salvation? If not, why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 9, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 9, 2013 He has enabled any and all of us who will be His and He will then impart His Divine Nature in you and then you have all the power needed to overcome! None, not one need come up short! 23 For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard. Tyndale House Publishers. (2007). Holy Bible: New Living Translation (3rd ed.) (Ro 3:23). Carol Stream, IL: Tyndale House Publishers. ESV | ‎Ro 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, ‎‎NASB95 | ‎Ro 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, ‎‎NIV84 | ‎Ro 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, ‎‎NRSV | ‎Ro 3:23 since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God; ‎‎KJV 1900 | ‎Ro 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; "Fall short" is present tense in the Gk. That means we will ALWAYS be falling short until the day we die. In this life, however much you claim you can meet God's standard, that's an illusion and a delusion. The ONLY way you and I are enabled to meet the standard is with the perfect righteousness of Christ. " When it is in the heart to obey God, when efforts are put forth to this end, Jesus accepts this disposition and effort as man's best service, and He makes up for the deficiency with His own divine merit. But He will not accept those who claim to have faith in Him and yet are disloyal to His Father's commandment. We hear a great deal about faith, but we need to hear a great deal more about works. Many are deceiving their own souls by living an easy-going, accommodating, crossless religion." {FW 50.1} This is how you & I are enabled to meet the divine standard. You obey from the heart but it always falls short. The Christ makes up the difference with His divine merit. The saving righteousness is the righteousness of Christ alone, from beginning to end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 9, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 9, 2013 Great thoughts Gibs. I often wonder why some deny God's power to cleanse us from sin. If God cannot cleanse us that means satan has more power than God, which would make Him a false god. Speaking as someone that went through an immense struggle of being a slave to sin for years I can attest that it is a huge relief now, as I let God work in me that the slavery I hate so much is slowly day by day losing it's control on me. I find joy in the Law of liberty and happiness. I have no idea why anyone would want to excuse a life under the law of sin and death, I found it a miserable life. I would like to bring something up here that might be valuable. In the past in our church this topic has been presented in a bad light causing a lot of people to reject the truth because of the manner it was presented in. I am not saying you present it in a bad way, I don't think that at all. I just thought it important to point out a verse to go along with this that I think would balance it out well. 1 Cor. 13:3 tells us that even if we give every thing we own to the poor or even if we die a martyrs death if we do not have God's love abiding in us then it was a wasted effort and we are still lost. Sister White talks about presenting the Law and the Gospel equally and I do believe that is important. I believe the Gospel explains to us the need of the Law and shows us that the Law is not just a set of harsh rules to live by. I realized that without strict obedience things happen like 1/3 of the angels fall. A whole world is plunged into thousands of years of misery, torture and death. The only way other worlds can live in perfect harmony and happiness is because they are in strict obedience to the Law of God. The core value in the Law is Love, putting others before self. Anyway, great post and hope more people will find how much happier life is when we give our will over to God and let Him guide and direct us. Since God is omnipotent, why can't believers enter heaven in their natural flesh and blood? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cardw Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 The reason god is powerless to help anyone overcome sin is because there is no god doing that. Why do you think there is all this discussion about overcoming sin. It's because it's not working. Why would any intelligent being communicate in such a hap-hazard way. What this and other discussion like it demonstrate is that you have this really tricky quiz of salvation. That alone should inform you that it's all made up. The only change I see in my life is change that I did. Much of it was simply a by product of experience and growing up. There's no god behind the curtain. There's just a con man controlling a really scary image of god blustering nonsense telling you to pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. Quote Rich http://tiny.cc/CM2j8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted February 9, 2013 Moderators Share Posted February 9, 2013 You can deny Him all you want, Richard, but someday you will meet Him face to face, only you won't dare look Him in the eye. Only His power has kept me from the power of the flesh. This fact I KNOW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 9, 2013 Author Share Posted February 9, 2013 Christ in you is all the power you need to overcome the world and sinning, Zec 10:12 And I will strengthen them in the LORD; and they shall walk up and down in his name, saith the LORD. Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus: 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cardw Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 You can deny Him all you want, Richard, but someday you will meet Him face to face, only you won't dare look Him in the eye. Only His power has kept me from the power of the flesh. This fact I KNOW. If, I I highly doubt it, I ever face Him face to face I will ask him why he is powerless to stop people endorse such cruelty in his name. Why did he not provide some evidence for his existence? Secondly this is not a fact since it cannot be independently confirmed. It, like most of religion, is something you make up in your mind. Playing word games does little to make your case. What evidence do you have that it is god who does this in you? I know you have none. I don't want to stop you from being a good person, but I am quite sure that when my life has improved that it was not god doing it in me. My improvements can be clearly traced to acting on knowledge and experience that is freely available to everyone. We live in a cause and effect world. I find it far more reasonable to act on the clear premise to cause no harm, rather than because some god had to tell me so. Quote Rich http://tiny.cc/CM2j8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Is the believer a sinner? Then what I quoted applies to the believer also. Does your obedience as a believer earn you ONE iota of merit for salvation? If not, why not? Here is another translation of the passage you just quoted: Everyone who habitually commits sin, also habitually commits lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. And you know absolutely that that One was manifested in order that He might take away our sins; and sin in Him does not exist. Everyone who in Him is constantly abiding is not habitually sinning. Everyone who is constantly sinning has not with discernment seen Him, nor has he known Him, with the result that that condition is true of him at present Wuest, K. S. (1961). The New Testament: An expanded translation (1 Jn 3:4–8). Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans. If you mean can we stop willful/intentional/premeditated/habitual sinning, then I agree with you and Gibs. So, if I modify what Ellen White said, you'll agree with me? Huh? There was nothing of my making in that quote. Here's some more that's not from me.... Whosoever abideth in Him sinneth not. Do you start to catch the idea that the power over sin is in the closeness and constancy of our abiding relationship with Christ? Both John and Ellen White are teaching the same thing. Abiding in Christ means a total change in life, attitude, character, etc..., but it is not of our making, our struggle. Our struggle is in staying in the abiding relationship and surrendering self whenever the Holy Spirit shows us something that must change. Whether you will accept that or not, and it is Biblical for Paul, Ezekiel, Jeremiah, and others, teach the same thing, is up to you. I have no idea as to what Gibs really believes on this subject. I mean, I didn't even realize he was a non-trinitarian or what he believed about the nature of Christ until very recently. I also thought he believed in Ellen White enough to modify his beliefs to agree with her when given the evidence. He obviously doesn't. Do you? Equivalents to the quote I gave from Steps to Christ are all throughout her writings. This is righteousness by faith, minus all the terminology. Carefully read Steps to Christ in its entirety again and see what her overall belief on this subject is as that book is one resource that gives a very thorough explanation of her position on this in a fairly condensed format. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted February 9, 2013 Author Share Posted February 9, 2013 His prophecy proves Him to us. Yes the prophecy of the time allotted to the Jews and their and our Redeemer dying exactly on time proves Him. Isaiah 53: the first Gospel around 600 yrs before He the Redeemer came is another adequate proof. Only 12 verses long, but check it out, then read the four Gospels of Matt, Mark, Luke and John. Here is Isaiah 53:, Isa 53:1 ¶ Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? Isa 53:2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. Isa 53:3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Isa 53:4 ¶ Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. Isa 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. Isa 53:6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. Isa 53:7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. Isa 53:8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. Isa 53:9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. Isa 53:10 ¶ Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. Isa 53:11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities. Isa 53:12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors. Also the Messiah wa prophesied in Genesis! Ge 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. The seed of David, Mary gave birth to the Christ Child who grew up with the Father of all in Him, the wonderful and Great Redeemer! This Redeemer who is now Spirit, comes and dwells in all who will receive Him and now are overcomers! 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cardw Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 This video presents why Christianity is powerless to do any real change. It is clear that fear and irrationality are at its core. Quote Rich http://tiny.cc/CM2j8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.