Should Adventist Pastors Receive a Salary?

[Windsor]

I recall one sermon that John preached in which he stated that one of the proofs of Christianity was that the living blood of the crucified Christ had been discovered.

He probably bought into some of what Ron Wyatt claimed.

[Gregory Matthews]

Ron Wyatt: Exactly.

[jamesonofthunder]

Quote:

But I do not see anywhere in the Spirit of Prophecy that says we should be buying $250k homes for them to live in luxury. Most ministers in our denomination these days would be put to shame to see what conditions Mrs White was forced to live in much of her life because of the prejudice against her in those days inside our church. They would scrutinize her for buying a comfortable chair to sit in to write for hours on end the wonderful manuscripts God gave her for us. She gave all of the proceeds of her books, which would have made her very wealthy, to the cause.

In many places in the country, a $250,000 home is a very moderate one. It is clearly not expensive. The land that it sits on may be valued at $75,000.

In order to serve the congregation that a person pastors, that person should live in the same area of the church and congregation. Yet, some of our pastors cannot afford to do so.

Some travel 100 miles one way to get to the church. That does not provide good pastoral care.

Do you think that the pastor of a congregation in New York City could reasonably be expected to find adequate living quarters for family for $250,000?

\

Are you serious? I am connected with realtors around the country. I found 2,564 luxurious apartments ready to move into inside New York City limits in less than five minutes of searching, each with 3 bedrooms.

In my state Minnesota $250k can buy 2 acres of land with a five bedroom two car garage within 30 minutes of downtown Minneapolis.

The point was brother, what other $56,000 per year job gives you a house to live in for free? If you cannot make it on that then you are not living within your means as a pastor. Why does anyone need more than that? And most of these pastors only work for two days per week and take full time jobs on the side. Is that reasonable? When would they ever have time for the needs of their congregation doing that? It makes it obvious what their desire is and it is not to show humility or to serve in Christ's example.

The men who argue this point are always the ones pushing for more money and obviously do not see themselves as needing to be humble in my opinion. As a missionary many live on less than $10k per year. You want to know what pastors in Mexico live on? Why do SDA pastors in America think they are above the rest of the worlds needs?

Why are we the richest country yet give the least in proportion to our incomes in the mission fields? No one but Adventists come to our seminars any more here and they can cost $50K to have 3ABN set up their trucks, (I know I volunteered to run sound for them) with maybe two people being baptized who were going to be anyways.

quite frankly the pastors of America are leading the way for us to be Laodicea and it makes me sick. They all have some new scheme to build a mega church and be the next Doug Batchelor (who is anointed for the role but they covet his blessing). I have seen it all in our denomination.

[jamesonofthunder]

I think moving pastors every 4 yrs is a thing of the past. They probably have come to realize the cost. Moving one pastor usually involves moving at LEAST one other pastor, but since it is not a matter of just exchanging pastors, that usually means moving a few others as well.

Not only that, to find the right fit for the schism in our church, "are you traditional or celebrationist?" "Will you try to bring in women elders or rock and roll in the sanctuary?"

Other denominations are the example for the majority of our graduates from SDA theological studies. Many of our churches immediately send the new recruits to study at willow creek seminary, to learn modern techniques of evangelism which no true SDA should even consider, but it is being force fed by the leaders of our denomination to guide their future plans.

To see the future in our denomination look at our General conferences these days. Total christian rock fest.

I think in the end we are going to be shocked when God shows us how much satan had infiltrated our church these days.

[nuff sed]

"even his closest friends are doubting his story about finding the Ark of the Covenant."

His closest friends doubt the story because they can't find the passage. According to Ron, the angel said to leave the area and that the passage would be open when the time was appropriate for discovery.

I never knew Ron personally BUT in studying over the various materials available (www.anchorstone.com) I doubt that Ron was a Glory Hound nor Publicity Seeker. Time will tell. I pray that the Lord will give ME the same humble spirit and willingness to be led that Ron had.

Nuff Sed...............

[phkrause]

"even his closest friends are doubting his story about finding the Ark of the Covenant."

His closest friends doubt the story because they can't find the passage. According to Ron, the angel said to leave the area and that the passage would be open when the time was appropriate for discovery.

I never knew Ron personally BUT in studying over the various materials available (www.anchorstone.com) I doubt that Ron was a Glory Hound nor Publicity Seeker. Time will tell. I pray that the Lord will give ME the same humble spirit and willingness to be led that Ron had.

Nuff Sed...............

[Stan]

"even his closest friends are doubting his story about finding the Ark of the Covenant."

His closest friends doubt the story because they can't find the passage. According to Ron, the angel said to leave the area and that the passage would be open when the time was appropriate for discovery.

I never knew Ron personally BUT in studying over the various materials available (www.anchorstone.com) I doubt that Ron was a Glory Hound nor Publicity Seeker. Time will tell. I pray that the Lord will give ME the same humble spirit and willingness to be led that Ron had.

Nuff Sed...............

I found it interesting that on my recent trip to Israel that the tour guide said that he had been given a lot of credibility recently. I was rather surprised to hear his name come up.

[ClubV12]

Jamesonofthunder, there is a reasonable and logical connection between what Gregory said,

"I recall one sermon that John preached in which he stated that one of the proofs of Christianity was that the living blood of the crucified Christ had been discovered."

and Ron Wyatts claim to have found some blood with unusual DNA characteristics.

The fact remains, there is a logical connection between the two events. Wyatt claiming to have found unique blood and a Pastor using that claim as "proof" for Christianity.

I'm sure both men believed what they said with deep conviction. I don't agree with the conclusion in either case. That doesn't mean I'm all mad and trashing either one of them or attacking their character or sincerity. The fact remains, no matter how religious, humble, God fearing, good men both of them were, in this instance, it remains my opinion they were wrong.

It's not a good idea to base the conclusion of truth or error on the character of the messenger. Sometimes good men make mistakes. Sometimes bad men get it right (Balaam comes to mind).

[jamesonofthunder]

I didn't mean to hijack this thread on this subject, and I will leave it at this.

I defend Mr Wyatt because he was a very devout Seventh Day Adventist. He loved Jesus with all his soul. When the subject of the death of Jesus would come up, Ron would literally tear up.

The facts are, the Noah's Ark discovery was validated by the Turkish government to the point of building a road and a tourist observation site to the sum of over 3 million dollars, giving him permission to enter their country over a hundred times to do the research.

The fact that an earthquake unveiled the site when he could not do excavations was divine.

The things that he discovered will be validated when Jesus comes. I have seen things from Ron that no man could know unless God revealed it to him.

I met him in Alaska in 1995 just after I had been led by God to discover the Sabbath with no man teaching me.

He was giving a lecture on his discoveries at a Baptist church. The Holy Spirit illuminated his face and the same wonderful presence of Jesus was upon him that taught me things. I came to him privately and shared with him what God had showed me in his face, and knowing the Holy Spirit was leading here I asked him, "You sound like a Seventh Day Adventist" and he looked surprised because at this point he kept that to himself so more people could hear the message. He said, "why are you?" and I said "of course". And he embraced me and gave his home phone number, and I got to talk to him about his discoveries till the day he died.

The death of the Jewish men who tried to take the Ark of the covenant was the most terrifying moment of his life. He felt shame for letting them go in there after giving them detailed information how to discover it without putting himself in their path. He was ashamed that he had brought this upon them. He assumed no one would be able to find it because no one could see the entrance before. He had to take their bodies out himself and he felt the displeasure of God because of it.

He also was ashamed that he had become afraid of the power of the videotape he left in the cave. And for the fact that he was trying to make money off the discovery. This I believe is why he died. He did not remain in the faith because of self glorification. He did repent after the cancer brought him to his death bed.

But he was very adamant that the discovery was real and the stone tablets will be revealed when the Sunday law comes. This is going to happen very soon. Then everyone in our church who persecuted that man, will see written in large letters "thou art weighed in the balance and found wanting".

Jesus, please reveal the truth to them soon so they can be spared.

Every discovery he was led to was divine. Every claim he made was the truth. This I will believe until Jesus comes.

[jamesonofthunder]

The one discovery the Israeli government does support Ron on was his discovery of the Burial pots off the coast of Ashkelon. This was a huge discovery for the Jewish people.

You want to know how he found them? The Holy Spirit led him there for proof of his divinely orchestrated leading.

Everywhere he went in the middle east he was LED directly to the discoveries. The Holy Spirit would come over him and tell him where to look. This cannot be a fluke. He could not take credit for the discoveries because it was God's doing not his.

The ziggurats where Sodom used to be with sulfur balls implanted in the surface. He was the one who found them, and now men like Doug Batchelor show these unique discoveries in their evangelistic meetings.

Pastor Batchelor believes this was Sodom, and Ron was the one who was led to find it.

[jamesonofthunder]

It is also interesting that no one had discovered the pin in the wall of the Garden tomb until Ron was shown.

The pin had been placed there by the Roman guard to seal the tomb of Jesus and men had known about that tomb for over a hundred years but Ron walks up and in minutes finds this huge discovery?

How did he know it would be there? Because the stone that he found near the cross hole had rolled down hill from that tomb and he saw it in his mind that the pin should be in the wall still. It is still there.

[phkrause]

The one discovery the Israeli government does support Ron on was his discovery of the Burial pots off the coast of Ashkelon. This was a huge discovery for the Jewish people.

You want to know how he found them? The Holy Spirit led him there for proof of his divinely orchestrated leading.

Everywhere he went in the middle east he was LED directly to the discoveries. The Holy Spirit would come over him and tell him where to look. This cannot be a fluke. He could not take credit for the discoveries because it was God's doing not his.

The ziggurats where Sodom used to be with sulfur balls implanted in the surface. He was the one who found them, and now men like Doug Batchelor show these unique discoveries in their evangelistic meetings.

Pastor Batchelor believes this was Sodom, and Ron was the one who was led to find it.

Interesting, I agree that I believe that Wyatt has been lead by the HS. I've read a book by Jonathan Gray called the "Ark of the Covenant." In that book Gray starts out to discredit Wyatt in his finds, but winds up not being able to discredit, not even one of Wyatts finds. I thought that was pretty cool.

[jamesonofthunder]

Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder

The one discovery the Israeli government does support Ron on was his discovery of the Burial pots off the coast of Ashkelon. This was a huge discovery for the Jewish people.

You want to know how he found them? The Holy Spirit led him there for proof of his divinely orchestrated leading.

Everywhere he went in the middle east he was LED directly to the discoveries. The Holy Spirit would come over him and tell him where to look. This cannot be a fluke. He could not take credit for the discoveries because it was God's doing not his.

The ziggurats where Sodom used to be with sulfur balls implanted in the surface. He was the one who found them, and now men like Doug Batchelor show these unique discoveries in their evangelistic meetings.

Pastor Batchelor believes this was Sodom, and Ron was the one who was led to find it.

Interesting, I agree that I believe that Wyatt has been lead by the HS. I've read a book by Jonathan Gray called the "Ark of the Covenant." In that book Gray starts out to discredit Wyatt in his finds, but winds up not being able to discredit, not even one of Wyatts finds. I thought that was pretty cool.

Yes, very cool.

[Windsor]

Anyone looking for Noah's Ark in Mount Ararat in Turkey will be sorely disappointed as there is no Mount Ararat in the Bible. The Bible mentions the mountains of Ararat. Mount Ararat in Turkey is not a mountain range. Secondly, according to Genesis 11:2, Noah's family journeyed from the East until they found the land of Shinar. Shinar is the land of Babylon, today known as Iraq. Hence the mountains of Ararat must be west of Babylon in modern day Iran. Mount Ararat in Turkey is north of Shinar.

[ClubV12]

I suppose the counsel Sister White offers on this subject could be interpreted in a couple of different ways. Obviously Wyatt interprets it differently than myself.

I see the counsel as meaning the ten commandments won't be revealed to mankind until the time of judgment. The time for repentance will have already passed.

"The tables of stone are hidden by God, to be produced in the great judgment-day, just as he wrote them."

The Review and Herald, March 26, 1908

There is another quote that suggests the tables of stone are currently "hidden" in the heavenly sanctuary and not even on the earth.

[jamesonofthunder]

I suppose the counsel Sister White offers on this subject could be interpreted in a couple of different ways. Obviously Wyatt interprets it differently than myself.

I see the counsel as meaning the ten commandments won't be revealed to mankind until the time of judgment. The time for repentance will have already passed.

"The tables of stone are hidden by God, to be produced in the great judgment-day, just as he wrote them."

The Review and Herald, March 26, 1908

There is another quote that suggests the tables of stone are currently "hidden" in the heavenly sanctuary and not even on the earth.

You are correct in the quotes, but Mrs White did say they would be revealed, "in the great judgment day".

"These are they of whom the prophet declared, in his vision of the great judgment day, “A man shall cast the idols of his silver, and the idols of his gold [margin]; which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats; to go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the Lord, and for the glory of His majesty, when He ariseth to shake terribly the earth.” Isaiah 2:20, 21. {COL 372.2}

So the Great Judgment Day is the time of trouble, just before the plagues fall. The end of Probation comes in Phases. Remember ezekiel seeing the angel with the writer's inkhorn setting the mark on the foreheads of those who sigh and cry for the abominations done in the sanctuary and the angels with the destroying weapons in their hands, who got marked first? "Begin at my sanctuary". The end time church gets brought to the great day of judgment first. The 144,000 will be the only ones from the Adventist church to make it. They proclaim with a loud cry Babylon Has become inhabited by demons and the vast multitude come out of her. This would be the ideal time to show the ten commandments, during the loud cry.

I believe Mr Wyatt was correct. There would be no time for repenting for the ones who received the mark of the beast, but God would not wait until everyone was sealed for destruction before giving the very last warning would He? We are the ones who have the last day message and those who have neglected the message are cut off. The 144,000 would be formidable with the Ten commandments written by the finger of God in their hands.

And about the quote of the Ark Being in heaven, did you read how when Mr Wyatt was in the room and was told to remove the lid or Mercy seat from the Ark, that that walls became translucent and began glowing in rainbow colors?

Here is something it takes faith to receive, but the Eastern gate of Jerusalem was where the gate to heaven once stood.

When Adam was escorted out of Eden, and the angel was posted to protect the way the tree of life, he could see paradise while standing on earth like it was right there. He could not access it but the gate was right in front of Him. Does this mean Paradice was still on earth? No, there was no great wall that kept people out, but the gate was here.

There is no mention of angels taking the Ark to heaven, but there is plenty of Evidence that before the fall to Babylon the shekinah glory was witnessable here on earth. Was God the Father here? Through the person of His son he was.

My point is there is a lot of evidence that heaven is just beyond our view. Angels are all around us. It takes faith to know they are there, but we cannot see them unless God reveals Himself or them to us.

The same with the ark. It is possible for the Ark made with hands to be here and in heaven simultaneously with the ark made without hands of which the earthly ark was a model.

Mr Wyatt said the angels that have been protecting the ark have been there next to it since it was made. Beyond our understanding.

[Kevin H]

Anyone looking for Noah's Ark in Mount Ararat in Turkey will be sorely disappointed as there is no Mount Ararat in the Bible. The Bible mentions the mountains of Ararat. Mount Ararat in Turkey is not a mountain range. Secondly, according to Genesis 11:2, Noah's family journeyed from the East until they found the land of Shinar. Shinar is the land of Babylon, today known as Iraq. Hence the mountains of Ararat must be west of Babylon in modern day Iran. Mount Ararat in Turkey is north of Shinar.

Exactly, Mt. Ararat in Turkey became Mt. Ararat as Christianity spread and several countries claimed to have Mt. Ararat so that part of the Bible took place in their country. The one in Turkey became traditional because it was on the path of the crusades and the crusaders would talk about seeing Mt. Ararat. Had they had a different route they would have come across other claims for Mt. Ararat and that would have become the famous one. However the Mt. Ararat in Turkey contradicts where the Bible says the mountains of Ararat are located.

[Gregory Matthews]

Quote:

Are you serious? I am connected with realtors around the country. I found 2,564 luxurious apartments ready to move into inside New York City limits in less than five minutes of searching, each with 3 bedrooms.

In my state Minnesota $250k can buy 2 acres of land with a five bedroom two car garage within 30 minutes of downtown Minneapolis.

I am very serious. In the United States, there are many places where our pastors cannot afford to live in the area of their chruch building. Yes, some do attempt to do ministry while driving 100 miles.

Quote:

The point was brother, what other $56,000 per year job gives you a house to live in for free? If you cannot make it on that then you are not living within your means as a pastor. Why does anyone need more than that? And most of these pastors only work for two days per week and take full time jobs on the side. Is that reasonable? When would they ever have time for the needs of their congregation doing that? It makes it obvious what their desire is and it is not to show humility or to serve in Christ's example.

1) A feee house? Not in the United States.

2) Most pastors work only 2 days a week: 100% false.

3) Most pastors take other full-time jobs: false

You clearly lack knowledge, are not aware of the facts and have an agenda.

Quote:

The men who argue this point are always the ones pushing for more money and obviously do not see themselves as needing to be humble in my opinion. As a missionary many live on less than $10k per year. You want to know what pastors in Mexico live on? Why do SDA pastors in America think they are above the rest of the worlds needs?

1) Pastors in Mexico: Yes I know. I remind you that I have lived in Central America and know well about our pastors there. My comments have been directed at the U.S. C ertainly there are other countries where a $250,000 home would be a mansion.

2) Missinaries living on less than $10,000 per year: There are no missionaries sent from the North Americana Division who live on that little. Yes, there are semi-volunteer workers sent from the North American Division who love on less. I have a son who as a semi-volunteer recieved about $6,000 for his year of service. No he did not get free food. And he had to pay for the gasoline that he used to do the job that he took.

Quote:

Why are we the richest country yet give the least in proportion to our incomes in the mission fields? No one but Adventists come to our seminars any more here and they can cost $50K to have 3ABN set up their trucks, (I know I volunteered to run sound for them) with maybe two people being baptized who were going to be anyways.

Well you raise valid questions about how to do evangelism in North America.

Quote:

quite frankly the pastors of America are leading the way for us to be Laodicea and it makes me sick. They all have some new scheme to build a mega church and be the next Doug Batchelor (who is anointed for the role but they covet his blessing). I have seen it all in our denomination.

Well, you do have an agenda. That speakes for itself. You claim to understand, yet you demonstrate that you do not.

[Gregory Matthews]

As to the claims of Mr. Wyatt:

1) Over and over he made claims that could not be documented.

2) He made claims that clearly reflected ignorance of the subject that he was talking about. The issue of the living blood of Christ and Brownian Movement was only one of this kind.

3) The net result is that very little of what he claimed can be shown to be accurate.

Here is one statement about him:

Quote:

. . .[P]seudoarchaeologists. . . attempt to subvert archaeological methods in order to prove the Bible isn't mythology, but historically accurate fact. However, the majority of the sources cited by the pseudoarchaeologists appear to be speculation, inaccurate scientific readings, or quite simply nonexistent. One example is Ron Wyatt, who supposedly discovered Noah's ark, the graves of Noah and his wife, the location of Sodom and Gomorrah, the Tower of Babel, and myriads of other findings during his lifetime. However, he lacks evidence for the majority of his findings, and so was dismissed by most Bible scholars, scientists, and historians.

The bottom line: The majority of Ron Wyatt's claims cannot be documented.

[jamesonofthunder]

As to the claims of Mr. Wyatt:

1) Over and over he made claims that could not be documented.

2) He made claims that clearly reflected ignorance of the subject that he was talking about. The issue of the living blood of Christ and Brownian Movement was only one of this kind.

3) The net result is that very little of what he claimed can be shown to be accurate.

Here is one statement about him:

Quote:

. . .[P]seudoarchaeologists. . . attempt to subvert archaeological methods in order to prove the Bible isn't mythology, but historically accurate fact. However, the majority of the sources cited by the pseudoarchaeologists appear to be speculation, inaccurate scientific readings, or quite simply nonexistent. One example is Ron Wyatt, who supposedly discovered Noah's ark, the graves of Noah and his wife, the location of Sodom and Gomorrah, the Tower of Babel, and myriads of other findings during his lifetime. However, he lacks evidence for the majority of his findings, and so was dismissed by most Bible scholars, scientists, and historians.

The bottom line: The majority of Ron Wyatt's claims cannot be documented.

How would you know anything about the Brownian movement and the Ark of the Covenant? Did you see the evidence? You act like you know intimate details about the situation, but I know for a fact where you got that information online. Google is very dangerous to the misinformed. The thing that gets me is, there are men who spend a lot of time developing arguments in ignorance and putting those websites and blogs online.

What happens when you type in Ellen G white on Google? There are as many 'nay sayer websites' as there are SDA hits that you get on the first several pages in the results. Should we listen to them too? The way Google works is based off of the most interest generated on any subject. When Mr Wyatt was alive the only results were positive on Google searches for him. Now it is all negative for pages. The people who were not deeply involved are the only survivors, and the ones who were deeply involved have been so chastised for their involvement they would rather keep their heads down then go through abuse people have been putting them through. The pictures are missing the evidence has come up missing on a lot of items, the disinterested and incredulous have been in charge. What do you think would be the result of this kind of neglect?

The pictures were very important and after Ron died they disappeared, someone neglected to keep the website up durring the infighting.

I warned Ron he should have given the pictures to someone he could trust inside the SDA church, but when he died the men who left in charge were not SDA's and they fell away quickly.

You should have seen the detail in those pictures. Now there are reprints of reprints on grainy compressed mpg images online and that's all you can find. I personally saw pictures of the tombstones of Noah and His wife that had great detail. You cannot find those any more. And where is the picture of the skull he found in the hotel after they discovered the graves had been robbed? GONE!

But You do realize that you just admitted that he had to have discovered something to be able to bring any conclusion of a substance on the top of this, as you would say, make believe object.

How can you have it both ways? If he didn't find anything then how would he have discovered "brownian Movement" on the top?

I am amazed at people like you. So intent on correcting others on things you dismissively and passively look for in ten minutes on a google search, looking for the most damaging information you can find to disqualify the testimony of those who have spent years doing the research. Shame on you.

I'm done here.

[Gregory Matthews]

James Said:

Quote:

How would you know anything about the Brownian movement and the Ark of the Covenant? Did you see the evidence?

Brownian Motion: I have been trained in that area of science. I know what it looks like when I personally see it under a microscope.

Did you see the evidence: I have seen what Ron Wyatt claimed was the evidence, years ago while he was still alive.

Quote:

You act like you know intimate details about the situation, but I know for a fact where you got that information online. Google is very dangerous to the misinformed. The thing that gets me is, there are men who spend a lot of time developing arguments in ignorance and putting those websites and blogs online.

Read the above. I did not get it after Ron died. I have seen what he alleged was his evidence.

Quote:

What happens when you type in Ellen G white on Google? There are as many 'nay sayer websites' as there are SDA hits that you get on the first several pages in the results. Should we listen to them too? The way Google works is based off of the most interest generated on any subject. When Mr Wyatt was alive the only results were positive on Google searches for him. Now it is all negative for pages.

Ellen White: Not related to this issue.

Google only positive while Ron Wyatt was alive: Not true. While Wyatt was alive, he was contraversal. But it does not matter. I have not raised specific objections on issues outside of my knowledge. I have raised questions, such as his living shed blood of Christ in areas where I was responding to Wyatt's claims and I had the knowledge to do so. AS to Brownian Motion, I have that knowledge.

Quote:

The pictures are missing the evidence has come up missing on a lot of items, the disinterested and incredulous have been in charge. What do you think would be the result of this kind of neglect?

From the beginning, while Wyatt was alive, he failed to provide evidence for much of what he claimed. IOW, the pictures and evidence were missing before he died.

Quote:

The pictures were very important and after Ron died they disappeared, someone neglected to keep the website up during the infighting.

Yes, after his death intelligent and informed people have removed some of his claims that could most easily be demonstrated to be false.

Quote:

You should have seen the detail in those pictures. Now there are reprints of reprints on grainy compressed mpg images online and that's all you can find. I personally saw pictures of the tombstones of Noah and His wife that had great detail. You cannot find those any more. And where is the picture of the skull he found in the hotel after they discovered the graves had been robbed? GONE!

You should have seen the detail: I have. That is what convinced me that Ron's claim of discovery of the living blood of Jesus was actually Brownian Motion.

Quote:

But You do realize that you just admitted that he had to have discovered something to be able to bring any conclusion of a substance on the top of this, as you would say, make believe object.

Of course I would say that Ron discovered something. No question about that. What he typically discovered was not what he thought it was. That is the problem. Brownian Motion is not living blood.

Ron's problem was never that he discovered something make believe. It was that he did not know what he had discovered. He made claims for what it was that he did not document.

Quote:

How can you have it both ways? If he didn't find anything then how would he have discovered "brownian Movement" on the top?

Brownian Motion was known to exist long before Wyatt was born. If he had any knowledge of looking through a microscope, he would have recognized it immediately. that is his problem, over and over. He spoke on subjects outside his range of knowledge.

Quote:

I am amazed at people like you. So intent on correcting others on things you dismissively and passively look for in ten minutes on a google search, looking for the most damaging information you can find to disqualify the testimony of those who have spent years doing the research. Shame on you.

False. Read my previous comments. My comments about Brownian Motion came from my personal review of his alleged evidence and my personal knowledge. That was just one example. Personal knowledge and a review of his alleged evidence in many areas clearly shows him to have failed to document his claims and to miss-identify objects that he found.

Quote:

I'm done here.

We shall see. At least you have not stated this in the name of Jesus.

[nuff sed]

It is interesting that not only did the Turkish government declare that the "Wyatt site' was in fact the site of Noah's Ark but they DID build a road to an area overlooking it. About ten years ago when I visited the area I heard a declaration directly from the lips of the Turkish Minister of Culture ( at the Noah's Ark Vistor Center subsidized by Anchorstone International)) that he would try to provide $US1M the following year to repair/improve the road to the site. Interesting.......Nuff Sed

[Stan]

I am not a fan either way with Wyatt,

I got back from Israel not to long ago Tour Guide spoke of recent verifications to his work, having his name brought up was rather shocking to me, and had him repeat it. I was not listening that close until the name was mentioned, but I think it had something to do with Sodom and Gomorrah.