Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted August 14, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 14, 2013 http://www.charismamag.com/blogs/fire-in-my-bones/7229-the-dark-side-of-submission Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoAspen Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Hmmmm...rather sad, but true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Quote: Latest from Charisma News: I've heard so many sickening versions of this scenario. In Kenya, several women told me their AIDS-infected husbands often raped them—and then their pastors told them they must submit to this treatment. In some parts of India, even some pastors believe it is acceptable to beat their wives if they argue with them or show any form of disrespect. And in some conservative churches in the United States, women are told that obedience to God is measured by their wifely submission—even if their husbands are addicted to alcohol or pornography or if they are involved in adulterous affairs. This reveals some scenarios plainly indicating how the enemy of souls has been successful in twisting the Word to give the God Who is Love a bad reputation, thereby taking away the incentive for sinners as myself, to yield their life to Him, thus enabling us to live where "...you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”" John 8:32 NKJB "Jesus *said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me." John 14:6 NASB God cares! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Naomi Posted August 14, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 14, 2013 Quote: Latest from Charisma News: I've heard so many sickening versions of this scenario. In Kenya, several women told me their AIDS-infected husbands often raped them—and then their pastors told them they must submit to this treatment. In some parts of India, even some pastors believe it is acceptable to beat their wives if they argue with them or show any form of disrespect. And in some conservative churches in the United States, women are told that obedience to God is measured by their wifely submission—even if their husbands are addicted to alcohol or pornography or if they are involved in adulterous affairs. This reveals some scenarios plainly indicating how the enemy of souls has been successful in twisting the Word to give the God Who is Love a bad reputation, thereby taking away the incentive for sinners as myself, to yield their life to Him, thus enabling us to live where "...you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”" John 8:32 NKJB "Jesus *said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me." John 14:6 NASB God cares! Quote If your dreams are not big enough to scare you, they are not big enough for God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Now that spousal abuse is solved in North America, we must fix others. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Naomi Posted August 14, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 14, 2013 We HAVE?!?! Stan, I seem to have missed that memo. Point well made. Quote If your dreams are not big enough to scare you, they are not big enough for God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olger Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 "3. Men who abuse their wives are out of fellowship with God. First Peter 3:7 is clear: "You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so your prayers will not be hindered." Wife abuse is no trivial sin. Any man who berates his wife, treats her as inferior or engages in abusive behavior (including hitting, kicking, raping, cursing at or threatening punishment) will jeopardize his fellowship with the Lord. He will feel frustrated and convicted until he repents." I absolutely agree with this. I also say to you that there are millions of marriages where husband & wife cheerfully walk in the unique roles that God has given them in Scripture. We don't hear about them very often - it is apparently 'sexier' to drumbeat the abuses and distortions of submission. rejoice always, G Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators debbym Posted August 14, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 14, 2013 yes there are plenty of wives forcing their husbands into submission, it goes both ways. the spirit of manipulation and coercion is the spirit of this world, not the Spirit of heaven. the dark side is the side of human nature in every one of us, we can all be like abraham, and make things happen according to your manipulation, we all pass through learning this is not God's way, his promise is enough, and he will bring about his will in our lives when we are in submission, willing glad submission to the loving authority of heaven. this does not destroy our will but strengthens it as it is in harmony with the will of God. Quote deb Love awakens love. Let God be true and every man a liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. T. Cross Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 I would suggest that anyone demanding their spouse "submit" has some deep issues that they really should seek some professional help for. They are pretty much ticking bombs for abuse and it is really only a matter of time before they explode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Textus Receptus Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Interesting article. Frankly, if we love our wives as the church, it would be a moot point. Obviously, Lucifer can twist any scripture to fit people to do his bidding. Shame on them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted August 14, 2013 Author Administrators Share Posted August 14, 2013 ...it is apparently 'sexier' to drumbeat the abuses and distortions of submission. rejoice always, G Weird use of the word 'sexier'?!?! So, if I am correctly hearing your discomfort with the point of this article, it is that it is showing how an idea taken to extremes is not fairly representative of the idea itself. Sort of like picking extremist environmentalist views as an a means of refuting any effort to advocate responsible stewardship of the environment? Or taking fringe/extremist examples of "political correctness" as defining all political correctness? Or comparing WO to radical secular feminism? Or prognosticating that advocating for WO will lead to promoting homosexuality because some extremist views try to link them together? Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johann Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Accounts from the Western World not older than 1924 reveal that even at that time Lutheran pastors with the Holy Bible in hand made similar claims, granting their blessings to abusive husbands. The sad thing is that even today certain "saints" in the Seventh-day Adventist church have not reached much further even though they claim to be searching for truth and sanctification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johann Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Interesting article. Frankly, if we love our wives as the church, it would be a moot point. Obviously, Lucifer can twist any scripture to fit people to do his bidding. Shame on them! A real danger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olger Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Several good points Deb. I like your reminder of the overarching requirement of believers -- namely submission to God which will lead to submission to the requirements in His Word. Forsooth, G Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Now that spousal abuse is solved in North America, we must fix others. I understand there are some missionaries from other countries, now coming to the U.S. to fulfill the gospel commission. Seems taking care of our own backyard is not isolated to any one different country. God cares! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted August 14, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 14, 2013 I wonder if their version of God's kingdom is run by fear the same as their castle. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 Quote: I also say to you that there are millions of marriages where husband & wife cheerfully walk in the unique roles that God has given them in Scripture. I have to admit I like the idea, and it does fulfill 1 Cor:13 in one respect,"Love is ever ready to believe the best of every person",I'm just wondering where the figures came from. God cares! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 Weird use of the word 'sexier'?!?! Not even. "Sexier" is often used in our society to describe a more attractive way of doing things. I have a hard time believing you've never seen this before. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olger Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 Originally Posted By: Tom Wetmore Weird use of the word 'sexier'?!?! Not even. "Sexier" is often used in our society to describe a more attractive way of doing things. I have a hard time believing you've never seen this before. RIGHT Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olger Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 Quote: I also say to you that there are millions of marriages where husband & wife cheerfully walk in the unique roles that God has given them in Scripture. I have to admit I like the idea, and it does fulfill 1 Cor:13 in one respect,"Love is ever ready to believe the best of every person",I'm just wondering where the figures came from. God cares! I don't know all of them G Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 Is that RIGHT or Riiiight? God Cares! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windsor Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 In the United States, more often than not, husbands submit to their wives because if mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy. Quote Remember Adventists Online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted August 17, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 17, 2013 In the United States, more often than not, husbands submit to their wives because if mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy. Happy wife, happy life? Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon1 Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 Men and women should each conduct their own due diligence inquiry before marriage. ...EGW says two years. Makes sense, it's a contract for life. Many are more careful in their worldly business than in choosing a life partner. Fortunately Adventists have been granted abundant light to aid the selection process. God wants us to be happy and functional. (The Adventist Home, Ministry of Healing, etc.) Unfortunately this light has been kept under a bushel. Many clergy and laity live in painful dysfunction which could have been avoided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators debbym Posted August 17, 2013 Administrators Share Posted August 17, 2013 Tom, reading the article and many following comments, my response is this, Much of what we make marriage to be is cultural. But without Christ's Spirit selfishness will persist and bring it down to a base thing. the divine principles of love, forbearance, kindness, mercy, forgiveness, and tenderheartedness, will make it possible to grow great peace and harmony and success in marriage even if we are experiencing it according to our culture. Males and females vary in many ways, in gifts, abilities, and skills. Love is something which has the power to bring out the best in your mate. the marriage is a place ideally where we grow and grow and learn and reach and increase in every way. it is in the government of God to preserve the freedom of the will, to respect it and to never violate the will. if this is what is happening in marriage in whatever way a male leads or serves, or initiates, then all is going to be ok. but when coercion or manipulation or control of the will of each other in any way is taking place, in the expression of "headship" then you have the work of another spirit, and this spirit is not the Spirit of God. For this principle is always in opposition to God's kingdom on earth or in heaven. Quote deb Love awakens love. Let God be true and every man a liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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