Members phkrause Posted November 18, 2013 Members Share Posted November 18, 2013 Inspired by NASA projections, Bible prophecy and historical accounts, Pastor John Hagee gazes into the sky and sees something you and I may not. He says there are four upcoming blood-red eclipses of the moon. What they portend for all of humankind is frightening. http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Gallerie..._term=yahoo.com Thought this was quite interesting Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Inspired by NASA projections, Bible prophecy and historical accounts, Pastor John Hagee gazes into the sky and sees something you and I may not. He says there are four upcoming blood-red eclipses of the moon. What they portend for all of humankind is frightening. http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Gallerie..._term=yahoo.com Thought this was quite interesting I believe that at least two of them have already occurred as reported on the weather channel and visibly seen from this part of the country, although they didn't have the brilliance as depicted in the URL. God cares! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Textus Receptus Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Nope: the honor of proclaiming God's final warning belongs to the SDA. The Dark Day, the moon as blood and the stars falling from the sky has come and passed, Mr. Hagee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeMo Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Just my opinion, but these manifestations, by the very fact that they are scientifically predicitble as eclipses, are probably NOT signs of the end. To be considered "miraculous or supernatural, it seems that these events should not be those predicted by astronomy. If we look at Matt. 24, Jesus presents an order of events: 1.People proclaiming to be Christ 2.Wars 3.Famines, earthquakes 4.Extreme persecution 5.Cosmic disturbances 6.2nd Coming/Rapture of the Church/Wrath of God on Wicked Compare this to the order of the 7 seals found in Revelation 6: First Seal - Revelation of the antichrist Second Seal - War Third seal - Food Shortage and inflation (famine?) Fourth Seal - More war, more famine, plagues Fifth seal - Extreme Persecution Sixth seal - Earthquakes, cosmic disturbances, rapture of church, wrath of God on wicked Notice a resemblance in the order of events? I agree that they may not match exactly; but "cosmic disturbances" comes late in the game in both scenarios. Yes, the 4 lunar eclipses ( as well as two solar eclipses) that appear on or around annual feast days in 2014/2015 might be "applications" of prophecy; but I would hesitiate in calling them "fulfillments". I'm not saying it ain't so; I'm just saying that there are other feasible interpretations of eschotology; and we need to keep our minds open to them, lest we might be blinded and miss the real deal. The last days may be close; but they are not yet upon us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Textus Receptus Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 Exactly JoMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted November 19, 2013 Administrators Share Posted November 19, 2013 Good points, JoeMo. I don't see the parallels between Matthew 24 and Revelation as coincidental. They are both from Jesus. The firsts comes in response to his disciples questions about the end in order to encourage and edify them. It is presented in plain language. And I see it as a key to understanding The Revelation of Jesus presented to John in coded symbolism to encourage and edify the early Church… and waiting Christians down through history. It is less about predicting the time of the end and more about predicting the end of time. When I have lead out in small group study of Revelation we begin in the gospels to understand what Jesus said in plain language. That helps to put in perspective and understand Revelation. It is not coincidence that John is the only gospel writer to not include the Matthew 24 narrative in his gospel account. He covers that in Revelation. But what he does include in his gospel in much greater detail is Jesus' specific words of encouragement, hope and promise also conveyed to the disciples on the same occasion. (John 13-17) That is also the heart of Jesus' message of Revelation. We too easily lose sight of that in focussing on the calamities, impostors and monsters. And on that mistake Jesus makes it clear in Matthew 24 that those things are not to be understood as the signs of the end but rather reminders of the evil that has always been with us since the beginning. They remind us not so much of the impending end, but rather the ever present need for God to bring an end to such things. The one thing Jesus does clearly proclaim as immediately preceding that end, a sure sign of the end, is "and this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world, and then shall the end come." The interesting thing about that "sign" is that we can only be superficially aware of its true accomplishment. We only see and hear gospel words spoken. The Gospel "preached" by actions and other means is not so much in our perception of things. That is a sign most evident to the God who reads the hearts and minds of all in order to know if the gospel seeds have been planted in that soil. Jesus said of the end, only God knows when time is up. Only God knows when the gospel has been truly preached in the whole world. Every eye shall see... If we search the sky for signs of the end, we might just miss the clues in the lives around us… The sun, earth and moon have been eclipsing each other in regular intervals since they were set in their paths at creation. The end is the gospel… Good news indeed! Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kevin H Posted November 19, 2013 Moderators Share Posted November 19, 2013 I have to look closer at MoJoe's post, but I like my first readings of it!!! You pointed out what I have not noticed before, thank you! While in principle I tend to agree with you Textus Receptus in your comment "The Dark Day, the moon as blood and the stars falling from the sky has come and passed" Now, I do not feel that these need to be "a happen once and that's it" prophecy. But there were also things going on in 1798 and 1833 that were connected to what was seen in the sky then... Exegetically the sun, moon and stars were the false gods. What Jesus was actually predicting was the false gods going dark, wounded and falling as the truth of the gospel is being spread into all the world. The disciples were shocked that the temple to the true God was going to fall. Jesus told them that while the temple to the true God was going to fall, that actually it was going to be the false gods, the sun, the moon and stars and what ever else was being worshiped in place of the true God was going to be wounded, go dark and fall to the light of the gospel. Gentiles were going to surround the temple. The temple will fall, but the God of the temple was going to conquer the false gods. In the late 1700s and early 1800s was the years of the great missionary movements. Robert Moffat, William Carey, Adoniram Judson etc. The start of the Sunday School movement to study the Bible deeper and to raise funds for mission work. With the work of these people the gospel was spreading and people were turning from the false gods to the true God. These were the true fulfillments of Prophecy. Since Archaeology was lost and many of the tools for exegesis needed to be rediscovered. People did not realize that the prophecy was being fulfilled. Thus God used the events of the dark day in 1798 and the intense meteor shower in 1833 to call people to the fact that this prophecy was being fulfilled. I believe that this prophecy is going to be fulfilled again in the latter rain. We may or may not see events like what is pointed out here and what was seen in 1798 and 1833, but it will be a time of mission work and spreading of the gospel that can only be compared to the early church, the missionary movement of the late 1700s and early 1800. but far exceed those movements. But we do not need to look to the sky for the fulfillment of these prophecies. We need to turn to the Bible to learn it better, and we need to share it in love, and the false gods will fall to the light of the gospel! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Textus Receptus Posted November 20, 2013 Share Posted November 20, 2013 Interesting analysis Kevin H. I also believe, like some, that there is a deeper meaning as to why these celestial events only occured in North America. The U.S, was created by Protestants who were escaping persecution; perhaps God wanted to embolden those who were diligently examining the scriptures to put two and two together in the hopes that they would undertand that His time as come. Perhaps in some way also throwing a wrench into what would later develop into the Second Beast of Revelations plans by igniting a fire in those who would understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted November 20, 2013 Share Posted November 20, 2013 Quote: The last days may be close; but they are not yet upon us. From a 2006 DVD revealing evangelist John Carter having upward of 25 t0 35 thousand people attending nightly in Russia, sometimes in the rain while turning thousands away because of a lack of room, then baptizing into Christ thousands upon thousands during that same time, I wouldn't feel confident in suggesting we're not in the last days. Government forces weren't idly standing by either, but making effort to close down the scheduled meetings, going so far as to say by one KGB official, that the meetings would only take place over his dead body. Forgot the exact amount of time stated but before the first meeting took place, the official died of a heart attack, while the meetings continued on schedule. "But when these things begin to take place, straighten up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”" Luke 21:28 NASB God cares!/Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted November 21, 2013 Author Members Share Posted November 21, 2013 going so far as to say by one KGB official, that the meetings would only take place over his dead body. Forgot the exact amount of time stated but before the first meeting took place, the official died of a heart attack, while the meetings continued on schedule. Ain't that a hoot!! Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzarkWoman Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Nope: the honor of proclaiming God's final warning belongs to the SDA. The Dark Day, the moon as blood and the stars falling from the sky has come and passed, Mr. Hagee. Exactly what is wrong with the denomination. The SDA denomination is not special. I hate to tell you but Heaven will not be filled with only SDA members. Glad that I will soon no longer be a member. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Textus Receptus Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 OzarkWoman, I didn't mean to offend. What I meant is that the SDA church was the only church which started to proclaim God's final warning to mankind. Rev 14: Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters. 8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication. 9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, It was only this church from the very begining shouted for people to keep the commandemnts, including the sabbath and are the continuation of the Reformation. Of course there will be others that will be Heaven who die before the start of probation. However, if they reject the commmandments before the start of probation, well, scripture makes it clear what will happen. Also, there will be many SDA who will not be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzarkWoman Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 You didn't upset me. BTW I know that the SDA church was NOT the first church to focus on the Sabbath and the Commandments of God. You should learn more about the 7th day Baptists, who have been around since 1671, long before the SDAs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Seventh-day Adventist continued the reformation. Lutherans stopped, so did Seventh Day Baptists and EVERY other Church. Seventh-day Adventist Church is not only special, it is THEE chosen people ordained of God to carry the last message to mankind. The ONLY Church on earth that preaches and teaches the correct doctrine of salvation. As the Jews were the chosen people, until their rejection, so it is today with Seventh-day Adventists. I make no apology for the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Quote: Glad that I will soon no longer be a member. "And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’” Luke 16:30-31 NKJV "While he was still speaking, a bright cloud overshadowed them, and behold, a voice out of the cloud said, “This is My beloved Son, with whom I am well-pleased; listen to Him!”"Matthew 17:5 NASB God cares!/Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I think God is proclaiming his very existence from the skies. Within the past few years, astronomers using the Hubble Space Telescope discovered something startling which has set physics back on its ear. The Big Bang Theory predicted an original explosion followed by expansion of the universe that gradually slows down under the influence of gravity. The Hubble showed that not only was the expansion of the universe not slowing down, but that expansion was accelerating at a rate that is not so fast that the universe tears itself apart, not too slow so that it collapses, but at a speed which is "just right" to maintain the stability of the cosmos. I call it the The Goldilocks Constant . Astro-physicists call it "Dark Energy" a term which actually means "We don't know what in heck is making this happen." Because physicists start with the presumption that there is no God, they cannot even entertain the influence of the hand of God as a possible explanation. The cumulative evidence, that science is uncovering, has made many a scientist uncomfortable with their previous assumption that intelligent design is impossible. The evidence is becoming increasingly problematic that this assumption is valid. We could have told them that..... Quote Tom King Texas native Amazed by Grace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzarkWoman Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Seventh-day Adventist continued the reformation. Lutherans stopped, so did Seventh Day Baptists and EVERY other Church. Seventh-day Adventist Church is not only special, it is THEE chosen people ordained of God to carry the last message to mankind. The ONLY Church on earth that preaches and teaches the correct doctrine of salvation. As the Jews were the chosen people, until their rejection, so it is today with Seventh-day Adventists. I make no apology for the truth. As I said, and that is exactly what is wrong with so many people. ..., but you are wrong. There are other denominations out there that are teaching almost the same stuff... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzarkWoman Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Quote: Glad that I will soon no longer be a member. "And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’” Luke 16:30-31 NKJV "While he was still speaking, a bright cloud overshadowed them, and behold, a voice out of the cloud said, “This is My beloved Son, with whom I am well-pleased; listen to Him!”"Matthew 17:5 NASB God cares!/Jesus saves! Yes, God does care and one does not have to be part of the SDA denomination to be part of God's family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted November 23, 2013 Author Members Share Posted November 23, 2013 I think God is proclaiming his very existence from the skies. Within the past few years, astronomers using the Hubble Space Telescope discovered something startling which has set physics back on its ear. The Big Bang Theory predicted an original explosion followed by expansion of the universe that gradually slows down under the influence of gravity. The Hubble showed that not only was the expansion of the universe not slowing down, but that expansion was accelerating at a rate that is not so fast that the universe tears itself apart, not too slow so that it collapses, but at a speed which is "just right" to maintain the stability of the cosmos. I call it the The Goldilocks Constant . Astro-physicists call it "Dark Energy" a term which actually means "We don't know what in heck is making this happen." Because physicists start with the presumption that there is no God, they cannot even entertain the influence of the hand of God as a possible explanation. The cumulative evidence, that science is uncovering, has made many a scientist uncomfortable with their previous assumption that intelligent design is impossible. The evidence is becoming increasingly problematic that this assumption is valid. We could have told them that..... Excellent, excellent post. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Quote: There are other denominations out there that are teaching almost the same stuff. Get over yourself! You should actually be ashamed of yourself for that pride filling your small ego making you think as you shouldn't underlined mine LHC Praise the Lord for all those who are spreading the good news, that which they have received. However "almost" won't cut it when it comes to accepting the message necessary to be included in the generation saved, thought to be the last before Jesus returns to take His children home with Himself. That would include the three angels messages from Revelation and the investigative judgement. "And I looked, and I heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, “Woe, woe, woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the remaining blasts of the trumpet of the three angels who are about to sound!”Revelation 8:12 NKJV "Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds."Rev 20:11-13 NASB Please, if you would, let us know who is sharing this message along with Seventh Day Adventists. One doesn't need to have an ego when proclaiming Truth of which they are aware. "And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."John 8:32 NKJV God cares!/Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windsor Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 You didn't upset me. BTW I know that the SDA church was NOT the first church to focus on the Sabbath and the Commandments of God. You should learn more about the 7th day Baptists, who have been around since 1671, long before the SDAs. This is not a surprise to any Seventh-day Adventist as the former 7th Day Baptist (and SDA convert) Rachel Oakes holds a place of honor in our history. Quote Remember Adventists Online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted November 23, 2013 Author Members Share Posted November 23, 2013 Quote: There are other denominations out there that are teaching almost the same stuff. Get over yourself! You should actually be ashamed of yourself for that pride filling your small ego making you think as you shouldn't underlined mine LHC Praise the Lord for all those who are spreading the good news, that which they have received. However "almost" won't cut it when it comes to accepting the message necessary to be included in the generation saved, thought to be the last before Jesus returns to take His children home with Himself. That would include the three angels messages from Revelation and the investigative judgement. "And I looked, and I heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, “Woe, woe, woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the remaining blasts of the trumpet of the three angels who are about to sound!”Revelation 8:12 NKJV "Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds."Rev 20:11-13 NASB Please, if you would, let us know who is sharing this message along with Seventh Day Adventists. One doesn't need to have an ego when proclaiming Truth of which they are aware. "And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."John 8:32 NKJV God cares!/Jesus saves! I definitely agree LHC. We have gone to a few other churches and none even preach the 3 AM, let alone some of the other great doctrines of the Bible. As a matter of fact a number of other churches have gone back to the "mother church" that they had broken off with many years ago. Compromise is becoming new new truth. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windsor Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 We could have told them that..... In fact we have been for over 170 years through the first angel's message. Quote Remember Adventists Online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeMo Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Sorry for taking so long to get back here. You understand that if what I proposed in post #676935 on the first page of this thread is reasonable, then it is reasonable that all fulfillment of the seals, trumpets, cosmic disturbances, etc. could be future events. This is not traditional SDA thinking. I'm no theologian, but my impression is that SDA's teach that almost all events in Daniel and Revelation occurred between Daniel's time and 1844; and we are somewhere in time between the 6th and 7th seal. Is that a fair statement? For example, the "Final Warning From the Sky" theme here. I don't think any of the current signs in the sky can be considered cosmic disturbances at the level of intensity that God is talking about in Matt. 24, Revelation, and elsewhere. What God has in mind will leave no doubt for speculation by the inhabitants of earth on its supernatural origin. Another example is the rider on the white horse of the first seal being Christ (or as some say the antichrist in the person of the papacy). If the first seal is the revelation of the antichrist, even though I consider the papacy to be a viable contender, I have seen nothing in the past couple of centuries from the papacy or Catholicism that would even hint at the increasing levels of power that the Antichrist would wield. (Islam on the other hand...) In my strange little world, one alternative is that the Antichrist has not yet been clearly revealed; therefore the first seal could not yet be open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. T. Cross Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Crazy people all think the end is nigh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.