teresaq Posted May 30, 2015 Share Posted May 30, 2015 But today we hear some in our remnant church teaching that men are to be "heads" in the church. Is it consistent? Does that mean all men are heads (mini-popes), or just some are considered heads (mini-popes) over other men? EJW PTUK August 5, 1897, p. 483.1 (The Present Truth, vol. 13) ... There is in the church of Christ no priestly class between God and the people; but “the Man Christ Jesus,“ the High Priest, “the One Mediator between God and men” (1 Timothy 2:5), and every believer is a priest. The whole body of true believers forms a “royal priesthood” (1 Peter 2:9), with Christ as Chief. In the church of Christ there are no ranks and classes,-none who are higher in position than others,-none who are specially privileged to make known the Gospel of God's grace, and to dispense to others its gifts. “To every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.” Ephesians 4:7. “The manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.” 1 Corinthians 12:7. There are many diverse gifts, “but all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as He will.” Verse 11. “Let him that heareth say, Come.” The case is very simple: each one who knows the Lord is to tell what He has seen and heard with the Lord. teresaq, Unchained and Kevin H 3 Quote facebook. /teresa.quintero.790 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted May 31, 2015 Share Posted May 31, 2015 But today we hear some in our remnant church teaching that men are to be "heads" in the church. Is it consistent? Does that mean all men are heads (mini-popes), or just some are considered heads (mini-popes) over other men? Actually it is the bible that states it "But I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." "And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church," "Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will grow to become in every respect the mature body of him who is the head, that is, Christ." "For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior." "And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy." "and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority." Where do these passages say or hint at a mini pope? If you want to stay consistent, if you want to mock husband/ man as the head, then you would have to apply the same reasoning towards God. In the present truth article you supplied, where would the bible restrain anyone from spreading the gospel of God's grace? Id this just a paid Pastors role? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teresaq Posted May 31, 2015 Author Share Posted May 31, 2015 In other words, claiming Peter and the Pope as heads of the church is OK? Cause I see it as the same thing. It seems those who founded this church did also. I am really not seeing the jump from the husband as head of his wife, to the head of any church....Your collection of verses just doesn't lead me, or many others, to that conclusion, never has. Perhaps one has to already have a "headship" mentality in order to see the supposed connection? phkrause 1 Quote facebook. /teresa.quintero.790 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 In other words, claiming Peter and the Pope as heads of the church is OK? Cause I see it as the same thing. It seems those who founded this church did also. I am really not seeing the jump from the husband as head of his wife, to the head of any church....Your collection of verses just doesn't lead me, or many others, to that conclusion, never has. Perhaps one has to already have a "headship" mentality in order to see the supposed connection? If you were to read scripture in light of scripture, you would not have come to this conclusion. The Pope actually violates the head of a man. The head of a man is Jesus Christ, not the Pope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teresaq Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 That didn't help me see the jump from husband as head of wife to all men as heads of all women in church. I don't even know what you mean by that. So that I am clear, you are stating that all men in church are equal to the pastors, elders, etc., but over women? Quote facebook. /teresa.quintero.790 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 (edited) That didn't help me see the jump from husband as head of wife to all men as heads of all women in church. I don't even know what you mean by that. So that I am clear, you are stating that all men in church are equal to the pastors, elders, etc., but over women? lets take this one step at a time, starting with your first quote But today we hear some in our remnant church teaching that men are to be "heads" in the church. Is it consistent? Does that mean all men are heads (mini-popes), or just some are considered heads (mini-popes) over other men? 1. To insert that men are heads is not found in scripture 2. Read the passage, and please note who the text says is the mans head? "But I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." -A man can't be a head because Jesus is his head. Edited June 3, 2015 by brotherly love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 lets take this one step at a time, starting with your first quote But today we hear some in our remnant church teaching that men are to be "heads" in the church. Is it consistent? Does that mean all men are heads (mini-popes), or just some are considered heads (mini-popes) over other men? 1. To insert that men are heads is not found in scripture 2. Read the passage, and please note who the text says is the mans head? "But I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." -A man can't be a head because Jesus is his head. Sorry, i meant to say a man cant be his own head because Jesus is his head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teresaq Posted June 4, 2015 Author Share Posted June 4, 2015 Finally we agree. God never ordained that human men should be heads in His church. Quote facebook. /teresa.quintero.790 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted June 4, 2015 Administrators Share Posted June 4, 2015 That just begs the question of why the misdirection of making up the straw man argument that WO is about seeking to be the head of anything? Kevin H and teresaq 2 Quote "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 (edited) Finally we agree. God never ordained that human men should be heads in His church. Jesus is the head of the church. A woman cant be the head of a man, or she covers the mans head -Jesus Christ. It is pretty simple Edited June 4, 2015 by brotherly love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 That just begs the question of why the misdirection of making up the straw man argument that WO is about seeking to be the head of anything? A pastor or elder is not the head of the church-Jesus Christ is the head. A pastor and elder is to be an example, and also govern and guide the church. The bride of Christ is likened to a family, and marriage. Feminism and cults of personality dont work in the family, and they also dont work in the body of Christ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teresaq Posted June 5, 2015 Author Share Posted June 5, 2015 Reposting the point: But today we hear some in our remnant church teaching that men are to be "heads" in the church. Is it consistent? Does that mean all men are heads (mini-popes), or just some are considered heads (mini-popes) over other men? Quote EJW PTUK August 5, 1897, p. 483.1 (The Present Truth, vol. 13) ... There is in the church of Christ no priestly class between God and the people; but “the Man Christ Jesus,“ the High Priest, “the One Mediator between God and men” (1 Timothy 2:5), and every believer is a priest. The whole body of true believers forms a “royal priesthood” (1 Peter 2:9), with Christ as Chief. In the church of Christ there are no ranks and classes,-none who are higher in position than others,-none who are specially privileged to make known the Gospel of God's grace, and to dispense to others its gifts. “To every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.” Ephesians 4:7. “The manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.” 1 Corinthians 12:7. There are many diverse gifts, “but all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as He will.” Verse 11. “Let him that heareth say, Come.” The case is very simple: each one who knows the Lord is to tell what He has seen and heard with the Lord. Quote facebook. /teresa.quintero.790 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherly love Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Reposting the point: But today we hear some in our remnant church teaching that men are to be "heads" in the church. Is it consistent? Does that mean all men are heads (mini-popes), or just some are considered heads (mini-popes) over other men? Ellen White seen the GC as popes "I have been shown that no man's judgment should be surrendered to the judgment of any one man. But when the judgment of the General Conference, which is the highest authority that God has upon the earth, is exercised, private independence and private judgment must not be maintained, but surrendered." - Testimonies For The Church, Vol. III page 492 {PC 422} (1875). This is false on many fronts. firstly you have a woman acting as the head, this would dishonor her husbands head which is Jesus Christ. Secondly, it has the GC set up like the catholic magisterium. If you accept this outside of scripture, but ignore what is contained in scripture, then you should be able to take a step back and identify a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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