bonnie Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 You did not offend me, I did not mean to sound harsh with you. There does not seem to be a problem with calling me by name from thread to thread. Perhaps it is time for one or the other straight out. Redwood, we like what you are doing and the constant pecking at Bonnie. It is funny. Redwood, we don't like it and we want it stopped, you are not funny. Pretty simple in my book Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Carolaa, having a set of rules in place will make it less "subjective" for those who, in the end, have to be the judge. I wonder what would happen if everyone on this forum would take it upon themselves to cease the nit-picking, complaining, and criticizing this very minute. Let's try to grow up and realize we don't have to take offense, or take every bit of bait that's offered to us. That is OUR choice, and when we keep it going, then we are part of the problem. I think you'll have to forever wonder, because it's not likely that everyone on this forum (or any forum, for that matter) will take this onus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 You did not offend me, I did not mean to sound harsh with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Maybe, instead of adding more rules, we could have a statement of some kind that spells out some of the areas (mentioned by several here) that have caused problems in the past. We don't have to *say* they have caused problems, but we could say they are examples of areas prone to cause offense. That way, we all have a better idea what to watch out for when we are posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 It is not offensive to most it is funny. If it were not it would have stopped, blame coatholders will get tired in time of holding the coat of Redwood Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Maybe, instead of adding more rules, we could have a statement of some kind that spells out some of the areas (mentioned by several here) that have caused problems in the past. We don't have to *say* they have caused problems, but we could say they are examples of areas prone to cause offense. That way, we all have a better idea what to watch out for when we are posting. This is not a case of being careful and watching when posting. This is systematic and constant. Let's call it by name and say we like it. Right straight out like grown ups, not some little wimp pretending, hiding behind mommy's skirt Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Maybe, instead of adding more rules, we could have a statement of some kind that spells out some of the areas (mentioned by several here) that have caused problems in the past. We don't have to *say* they have caused problems, but we could say they are examples of areas prone to cause offense. That way, we all have a better idea what to watch out for when we are posting. Carolaa, these are the things that will invariably happen over and over again--until and unless there are rules and disciplinary action set in place to prevent them. The example idea is great, insofar as much that they help the user to recognize when a post needs modification, or when a member needs disciplinary action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 few read more that 100 words in anyones long babble.. For a FACT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Originally Posted By: carolaa Maybe, instead of adding more rules, we could have a statement of some kind that spells out some of the areas (mentioned by several here) that have caused problems in the past. We don't have to *say* they have caused problems, but we could say they are examples of areas prone to cause offense. That way, we all have a better idea what to watch out for when we are posting. This is not a case of being careful and watching when posting. This is systematic and constant. Let's call it by name and say we like it. Right straight out like grown ups, not some little wimp pretending, hiding behind mommy's skirt Sometimes it takes a bigger person to just let it go instead of keeping it going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 I think you both mean well but when something like this stops it has to be stopped because it is known to be wrong. Not based on who is doing it and to who. If it cannot be called for exactly what it is, this mysterious "it" will go on and on. "You know in this medium it is so hard to tell" you can't be sure of what someone meant" Ifthere is fear to address the incidences going on and continuing there is no cure. It has already been decided it can't be stopped without a team of five patroling the forum, why not just give the green light and be done with it. Then those affected will at least have a straight forward answer. Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Koot Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Bravus, I have seen some good ideas posted here. However, a couple of those ideas would be problematic, based on recent history. For example, one person might say that another poster is simply repeating the same thing over, without adducing new evidence. The other person might quite disagree. This has actually happened. To attempt to restrict that exchange would seem to violate fair comment and freedom of expression. It could easily be abused to suit the purposes of a few. It would, however, be very appropriate and indeed called for to enforce rules prohibiting personal put-downs, ridicule, and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Adding on.... If anyone is gonna tease another, it would be hard to not violate any one of the many rules here, just to obtain a laugh... anyone who has a bad impression of someone else, could reem them thru the discipline process.....Sorry, guys, but the very first rule is to have fun first...If that is not followed, then all is in vain and not worth the time to be here.... Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve.  George Bernard Shaw  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Adding on.... If anyone is gonna tease another, it would be hard to not violate any one of the many rules here, just to obtain a laugh... I kind of think this is part of the problem. Personally I think teasing is fine as long as all involved take it as good natured teasing. What I think is happening is that someone will "tease" another and that other person isn't taking it as good natured fun. Then it becomes mean. "The rules" would be in place so that the "victim" has some recourse. For what will a man be profited, if he gains the whole world, and forfeits his soul? Mat. 16:26Please, support the JDRF and help find a cure for Type 1 Diabetes. Please, support the March of Dimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Try Matt.18 This will usually work if given a chance. May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Quote: What I think is happening is that someone will "tease" another and that other person isn't taking it as good natured fun. Then it becomes mean. "The rules" would be in place so that the "victim" has some recourse. Sorry, but there are some who just either a] don't get humor or B] have a negative attitude and are unable to appreciate humor. And I dont need to go any further on the obvious.....right? I mean, look there is one or two threads of late that is just ...oh never mind...don't want to hi-jack this thread anywhere else...so will just say...some people have no sense of humor...and rules become a way for vengence.... Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve.  George Bernard Shaw  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Try Matt.18 This will usually work if given a chance. Exactly, it should be the recourse to the rules that apply. For what will a man be profited, if he gains the whole world, and forfeits his soul? Mat. 16:26Please, support the JDRF and help find a cure for Type 1 Diabetes. Please, support the March of Dimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Don't worry Neil ... No one is going to try to get into anothers head and determine if was good natured teasing or bad natured teasing. They can't even stop the obvious and clear name calling. And they are not going to hire a full time baby-sitter. If in doubt ... Matt.18 can bring about a clear understanding with clarification. Apologizes can be made and then all can move on. No big deal. Misunderstandings happen. Be positive. Think the best of people. Follow Matt. 18 if you don't. Honestly ... I have nothing to say to someone who is not willing to follow Matt.18 The Bible says we are to treat them as a heathen. Not a bad start. May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 there are some who just either a] don't get humor or B] have a negative attitude and are unable to appreciate humor. I've noticed this seems to be true. Some people are just like that, and it's not a put-down, just a fact. It could be helpful to make a mental note of who those people are and avoid directing humor towards them. On the other hand, the rest of us shouldn't be held hostage by them and should be free to direct humor toward each other as we wish. Here are some more rules I thought of today. #1 - you must wait before responding to a perceived offense until you can do so with love and concern for the other person, and then it should be in the form of a PM. #2 - if you receive a PM about a perceived offense of yours, you must wait to respond until you can do so with understanding and kindness dripping from your keyboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 26, 2008 Author Moderators Share Posted January 26, 2008 I do like those, Carol: I know that the responses here that I really regret having written were all written in the heat of the moment, while I was angry. I've regretted them and apologised, but you really can never really reset the world back to the way it was before... Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 26, 2008 Share Posted January 26, 2008 I do like those, Carol: I know that the responses here that I really regret having written were all written in the heat of the moment, while I was angry. I've regretted them and apologised, but you really can never really reset the world back to the way it was before... No ... it is no longer the same ... but it IS better. I find that there is nothing more powerful than a sincere apology. The fact that a human can say they are sorry for something they have done is a powerful witness of the presence of God in ones life. Lives are changed when that happens. You should give yourself more credit .... May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 26, 2008 Author Moderators Share Posted January 26, 2008 OK, here goes my best hacking attempt. I've basically copied and pasted everyone's suggestions into one big document then swirled it all around until all areas are covered and there's as little repetition as possible. I've used simple imperatives, as was done in the Ten Commandments, rather than suggestions, because that seems easiest to understand and follow. Thou Shalt: Rule 1: Have fun Rule 2: Read all posts in the most positive possible light. If there are two possible ways to take something, and one way is offensive, assume the poster meant the other way. This is particularly important, and challenging, if you have a history of conflict with the poster. Rule 3: Post an introduction! It's ok if you plan to lurk much of the time, but please post at least once. Mostly, we need to know that you're a real person, and not just a spammer, taking up space, and possibly adding questionable content to the site! Rule 4: Follow basic "housekeeping" rules, such as; watch your use of all caps (please don't shout at us!), and please do not edit your posts to change their content. It's possible that while you edit, someone else is responding, and that makes a mess. Just make a new post with a simple explanation. Rule 5: {this one may be more controversial, so feel free to discuss it}Speak to members, rather than about them: 'Bravus, I think that...' rather than 'Bravus needs to know that...' Rule 6: Before responding to a perceived offense, wait until you can do so with love and concern for the other person, and then do it in the form of a PM. If you receive a PM about a perceived offense of yours, wait to respond until you can do so with understanding and kindness. Thou Shalt Not: Rule 7: defame or libel others Rule 8: blaspheme the names of God Rule 9: harrass other members Rule 10: raise arguments or issues with moderators and administrators in open forum - take it to PM Rule 11: post racist, sexist or sexual jokes or statements. Keep the language family-friendly Rule 12: quote private e-mail messages or PMs in open forum without permission Rule 13: reveal personal information about any member in the forum that s/he has not first revealed Rule 14: post spam Rule 15: use veiled threats or jabs, name-calling and innuendo in disagreements - stick to the topic of discussion in an open way Rule 16: jump to conclusions about a poster's meaning, particularly if those conclusions are negative - ask Rule 17: threadjack (take a thread off topic). Start a new thread if necessary Rule 18: feed the trolls Rule 19: make negative statements (including in rhetorical questions and innuendo) about another's intelligence, motivation, moral condition, or Christian experience. Rule 20: fillibuster. Do not write the same things again and again with no new evidence, no new approach. Merely asserting again and again till everyone gives in. Rule 21: block: simply saying "No, no, no" to another's reasoning or conclusion, without counter evidence or logic, is counterproductive. Rule 22: "play the victim." Do not take statements about propositions and turn them into personal insults. Rule 23: talk about another member in a thread in which the second member is not involved. Some have said enforcement is needed, and sometimes it is, but honestly, self-enforcement is the only kind that truly works. So the *best* possible use of these is to look at each of your *own* posts and see whether it fits. The second-best use is to send a courteous PM to someone and say 'Are you sure your post fits within Rule 3?' or words to that effect, in as conciliatory way as possible. The *worst* possible use is continually PMing Stan and saying 'So-and-so contravened Rule 4, Word 7'. Last word comes from 'Letters to Sam' by Daniel Gottlieb: (my paraphrase) 'Seeking justice for ourselves leads to stress and dissatisfaction and anger. Seeking jusice for others leads to joy and peace and fulfilment.' Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted January 26, 2008 Share Posted January 26, 2008 I do like those, Carol: I know that the responses here that I really regret having written were all written in the heat of the moment, while I was angry. I've regretted them and apologised, but you really can never really reset the world back to the way it was before... #3 - Remember that whatever you say online will remain there for the entire world to see forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted January 26, 2008 Author Moderators Share Posted January 26, 2008 D'oh, I will add that one soon in the 'shalts', but let's see what happens to Rule 5 'cos it might save me re-numbering! Definitely a worthwhile reminder. OK, I'm now opening this thread up for discussion of this proposed set of rules. Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted January 26, 2008 Share Posted January 26, 2008 I like them all, including #5. One question, where are we supposed to post our introductions? Is there a forum for this, if so where? Am I just missing it? For what will a man be profited, if he gains the whole world, and forfeits his soul? Mat. 16:26Please, support the JDRF and help find a cure for Type 1 Diabetes. Please, support the March of Dimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted January 26, 2008 Share Posted January 26, 2008 Do Not ... Quote: raise arguments or issues with moderators and administrators in open forum - take it to PM I would expect the same in return then. Is that fair? May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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