Debate Win: Obama or McCain?

[Dr. Shane]

I think Obama looked a lot better on the economy. McCain did very well on foreign affairs. I think both did good but I think Obama did more good for himself because I for one feel more comfortable with the idea of him being President.

I would have liked to see McCain defend himself better on the economy. I think I could have made a better argument for him than he did. I can't imagine that McCain's numbers are going to jump much because of this debate. The best McCain can hope for is that he doesn't lose any more in the polls.

[CyberGuy]

I think McCain did a better job all around. I watched the debates on Fox and you could see Obama being very impatient and very angryly shaking his head when McCain was making his points on the economy and foreign affairs.

McCain looked like the elder statesman and Obama looked like an impatient kid constantly interupting McCain instead of waiting his turn to speak. Obama was very rude interupting and muttering "that is a lie" into the microphone for the whole nation to hear on some of McCains counter points.

Democrat analylists stated before the debates that Obama had better not underestimate McCain for McCain is a wiley eperience debater who has lots of experience in the area of debating and knows how to bait his opponate and make him lose his cool. He did that several times to Obama.

[Neil D]

From FOXnews [!!], this says it all....

[Neil D]

And here is CBS, not really any suprise, giving it's results....

[Dr. Shane]

Round 1 in debates goes to Obama, poll says

A national poll of people who watched the first presidential debate suggests that Barack Obama came out on top, but there was overwhelming agreement that both Obama and John McCain would be able to handle the job of president if elected.

The CNN/Opinion Research Corp. survey is not a measurement of the views of all Americans, since only people who watched the debate were questioned and the audience included more Democrats than Republicans...

"It can be reasonably concluded, especially after accounting for the slight Democratic bias in the survey, that we witnessed a tie in Mississippi tonight," CNN Senior Political Researcher Alan Silverleib said. "But given the direction of the campaign over the last couple of weeks, a tie translates to a win for Obama.

[text from link, emphasis added]

[jasd]

I think Obama did good. Kudos. I would have rated the debate pretty even and suggest that McCain spend a bit more time preparing for the next debate. He was a little rough this time around. That said,

I appreciate polish on my silver, chrome, and credenza; however, per my President – I’d rather see meat and gristle – preferably, tough and stringy. Breakjaw meat. I want to be reassured that my President has experience and qualifications to match. Hope, change, and ‘vision’ make for nice rhetoric; however, they remain the stuff of bread and circuses when and where reality intrudes.

In this debate we saw one unafraid to forward his experience and qualifications... and the other, nar’ once addressing that largest of factors as concerning himself.

If bread and circus promises are one’s tea and petit fours – the choice is obvious. If one’s concerns are centered upon weightier matters, well, ...one need not say it.

>>I would have liked to see McCain defend himself better on the economy.<<

Pretty difficult even with those supposedly in charge of our National economy well-being. One supposes that it is not for nothing that the Fed together with and its functions are referred as “Secrets of the Temple” – and any Senator who advances that he or she is well-versed in such matters is simply blowin’ smoke.

The intricate weave of the International Money tapestry – is the Great Whore Babylon – is it not?

[Tom Wetmore]

Grading the First Presidential Debate

[Neil D]

Regarding Obama

Quote:

Overall: Went for a solid, consistent performance to introduce himself to the country. He did not seem nervous, tentative, or intimidated by the event, and avoided mistakes from his weak debate performances during nomination season (a professorial tone and long winded answers). Standing comfortably on the stage with his rival, he showed he belonged - evocative of Reagan, circa 1980. He was so confident by the end that he reminded his biggest audience yet that his father was from Kenya. Two more performances like that and he will be very tough to beat on Election Day.

Overall grade: A-

I will admit, there is some lack in Obama...he has not met with out military leaders. He needs this to help round out his understanding of the Iraq situation.

But over all, he dun gooooooooddd....

And the Republicans among you say "he dont have experience"......For shame....

Now, regarding McCAin-

Quote:

Overall: McCain was McCain - evocative, intense, and at times emotional, but also vague, elliptical, and atonal. Failed to deliver his "country first versus Obama first" message cleanly, even when offered several opportunities. Surprisingly, did not talk much about "change," virtually ceding the dominant issue of the race.

Overall grade: B-

McCain strikes me as a good senator. He knows what he needs to do to get a deal done.

.....but I fear that if he loses, and since he is well known on the hill, he may use his influence to impead the progress needed to get the US going again.

[Dr. Shane]

The quote doesn't address experience.

Obama's reference to his father wasn't applicable although most in the audience didn't likely catch that. He said his father is from AFRICA and when his father came here everyone thought America was great. But today America has lost that image in the world. Here is where Obama is in error. He father was from AFRICA and America's image in AFRICA remains very high. Polls have shown Bush with over a 50% approval rating in AFRICA. People in Kenya today have just as high opinion of America as they did when Obama's father was growing up there.

[Dr. Shane]

Quote:

.....but I fear that if he loses, and since he is well known on the hill, he may use his influence to impead the progress needed to get the US going again.

Like the Democrats have done? No, I don't think McCain will stoop to that level.

[carolaa]

The quote doesn't address experience.

Obama's reference to his father wasn't applicable although most in the audience didn't likely catch that. He said his father is from AFRICA and when his father came here everyone thought America was great. But today America has lost that image in the world. Here is where Obama is in error. He father was from AFRICA and America's image in AFRICA remains very high. Polls have shown Bush with over a 50% approval rating in AFRICA. People in Kenya today have just as high opinion of America as they did when Obama's father was growing up there.

But Obama wasn't talking about America losing its image in Africa. He said America has lost its image in the WORLD, which is very sadly true.

[Neil D]

But Obama wasn't talking about America losing its image in Africa. He said America has lost its image in the WORLD, which is very sadly true.

Of which my world contacts concur. Our standing in the world has plummeted with Bush in power. It's not a pretty picture. To which, many americans do not understand....

[carolaa]

....nor do they care - the epitome of arrogance.

[Dr. Shane]

But Obama wasn't talking about America losing its image in Africa. He said America has lost its image in the WORLD, which is very sadly true.

But he used his father (being from AFRICA) to make that point. Let's say, for the sake of argument, what he says is true. It could be that all the world hated us except those in AFRICA when his father was growing up. Perhaps AFRICA has always loved us and all the world has always hated us. It is not like his father came from a country that loved us at one time but now hates us. So his use of his father fails to make the point he was trying to make. Kenya still loves us.

[carolaa]

I disagree. I think it's exactly as he stated it (according to your post). "He said his father is from AFRICA and when his father came here everyone thought America was great. But today America has lost that image in the world."

It's just an example of how the whole world felt at the time his father came to the U.S. and how that feeling is no longer there around the world.

[Dr. Shane]

How would his father know how the whole world felt? His father wouldn't know. All his father would know is how Kenya or perhaps AFRICA felt. And Kenya and AFRICA still feel the same way. I realize not everyone is as sharp as I am but I don't know how else to explain it.

[Neil D]

Shane, you are making this worse and more complicated than what it is... Look-

"He said his father is from AFRICA and when his father came here everyone thought America was great. Now here is where you got lost, and I have underlined it so that you know that there is a segway, thatis a change in thought.

But today America has lost that image in the world."

[Dr. Shane]

OK, let's answer a few questions.

Q: How did Obama's father know the world loved America when he came here?

A: He didn't. Obama's father was not a world traveler. He knew Kenya and perhaps the UK.

Q: Has American lost its image in AFRICA?

A: No. President Bush has an approval rating higher in AFRICA than he does in America.

Q: So the "world" of Obama's father loved the US then and still loves the US today?

A: Yes, Yes, Yes. AFRICA loved the US then and AFRICA loves the US today. In fact, AFRICA may well love the US more today than it did then.

[carolaa]

No one has insinuated that his father said or thought anything. Obama wasn't quoting his father; he was making his own observation that at the time his father came here, everyone [in the world] loved America, and today that is no longer the case. I think you are interpreting Obama to say that everyone [in Africa] loved America, but I don't see it that way.

Shane, I'm only going by your words, as I did not hear or see the quotation myself. Maybe Obama said it more like you have in mind, but according to your words, this is what I hear him saying.

[Neil D]

=Shane=OK, let's answer a few questions. ok, only I am going to do it in color to contrast my statments.

Q: How did Obama's father know the world loved America when he came here?

A: He didn't. Obama's father was not a world traveler. He knew Kenya and perhaps the UK.

"and when his father came here everyone [here] thought America was great."

Q: Has American lost its image in AFRICA?

A: No. President Bush has an approval rating higher in AFRICA than he does in America.

that is true. Africa apparently has a high approval rating....

Q: So the "world" of Obama's father loved the US then and still loves the US today?

A: Yes, Yes, Yes. AFRICA loved the US then and AFRICA loves the US today. In fact, AFRICA may well love the US more today than it did then.

No, no, no...you have jumped the tracks and are not following his logic. notice these words -But today [independent thought, new subject-'America', not dad from Kenya]- America has lost that image in the world." [separate thought, father was the segway into Americas lost reputation in the world, and I would dare say, the western and civilized worlds. And while YOUR THOUGHT maybe correct, it was not a part of the logic and point that Obama was trying to make.

[Dr. Shane]

What I took away from it (and I may have heard it wrong) was that Obama knows the world use to love us because he dad was from AFRICA and told him so.

However I do not agree that the world hates the US anyway. I work for an international company and there is still very much a demand for American services and technology. People still send their youth to American universities and the sick to American hospitals. Our allies ask for our military to train their military. America's critics may be loader than they were in the past and the uneducated masses may listen to them more. However those that have money and education still hold a very high opinion of America. We are still the beacon on a hill.

[carolaa]

Those who have money are trading in their dollars for euros and yen, gold and silver. Why do you think more and more of the South American countries are saying no to our trade agreements and forming their own alliances? Why do you think Iran is not afraid of us? Why do you think most of the world scoffs when we give them suggestions about human rights? OK, we may still be a beacon, but the beacon is flickering out.

[Neil D]

What I took away from it (and I may have heard it wrong) was that Obama knows the world use to love us because he dad was from AFRICA and told him so.

[carolaa]

By the way, I work for an import company, and I hear a few things too.

[Dr. Shane]

Quote:

Those who have money are trading in their dollars for euros and yen, gold and silver.

This has not been true throughout the Bush Adminstration's tenure. I am not even sure it is true at all. One of the reasons for the value of the dollar falling is that everyone wanted to buy dollars so the Federal Reserve just kept printing them to keep up with demand.

Quote:

Why do you think more and more of the South American countries are saying no to our trade agreements and forming their own alliances?

I am not aware of any that have BUT I know why many living in these countries want to. When I was in Costa Rica the unions shut down the streets of San Jose in protest to CAFTA. Why didn't they want a free trade agreement? It could be heard clearly over their load speakers. Because Americans would take their jobs. That's right. Americans would take their jobs! They know how efficient American factories are and how advanced American technology is and they fear it. They believe that free trade agreements will mean less jobs for them.