Woody Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 Maybe if gay activists like, Perez Hilton, would stop trying to shove the issue down everyone's thoughts, the nation wouldn't seem so obsessed with what gay people do. Carrie Prejean Quote: "We live in a land where you can choose same-sex marriage or opposite. And you know what, I think in my country, in my family, I think that I believe that a marriage should be between a man and a woman. No offense to anybody out there, but that's how I was raised." I think we need to be reminded of who it is we are talking about .... Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 You just like looking at her picture Uncle Red, hang on a minute....let me get Aunt Blanche on the phone... Quote For what will a man be profited, if he gains the whole world, and forfeits his soul? Mat. 16:26Please, support the JDRF and help find a cure for Type 1 Diabetes. Please, support the March of Dimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 You just like looking at her picture Uncle Red, hang on a minute....let me get Aunt Blanche on the phone... Ahhh. She knows I am a red blooded American male. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 I am glad I didn't post the picture of her in most of the news stories - in a bikini. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Quote: if you could just recognise that gay men have the same reaction to a picture of Brad Pitt that you have to that picture, we could move on a long way... If reactions are what defines things, then all such reactions are equal. Like the reaction of a pedophile to a baby. The reaction of a sadist to pictures of torture. The reaction of (what's the noun form of beastiality?) to farm animals. Alcoholics have a reaction to alcohol, heroin addicts to heroin. No, I'm not equating them. I'm simply pointing out that reactions do not justify a behavior. I don't know anyone who is trying to justify the behavior. Some are trying to explain it. Two different things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted April 23, 2009 Moderators Share Posted April 23, 2009 I was really just trying to encourage a little empathy. I don't think anyone here but John317 really understands what we ask of homosexual people when we ask them to embrace lifelong celibacy. I also don't think people really believe there are such things as homosexual people... someone said earlier in this thread 'all the gay people need to do is look at this picture (of an attractive young woman) and we won't have an issue with same-sex marriage' or words to that effect. I know it was a joke, but it reveals a truth. Just the simple act of empathy required to recognise some of the ways in which gay people experience attraction would move us forward. And Ed D/ichabod/there buster/whatever misses it as usual, displays contempt for others as usual, makes no worthwhile contribution, as usual. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outta Here Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Yup, never get it...I didn't notice anyone on the forum asking to be updated on the comments of some contestant in a beauty contest.... Speaking of beauty contests, anyone else find the whole concept of beauty pageants absurd? It seems to me that God asks us to look on the hearts of men (and women) and not on their outward appearance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 I understand and empathize with obsessive/compulsive disorders. I am not gay but I am alcoholic and I have lived with two gay men in the past who were also alcoholics. The success rate for recovering from alcoholism isn't that much better than the success rate exit ministries have with gays. I think I heard a statistic once that one out of every thirty six people that attend an AA meeting end up dying sober. That is not a very good success ratio. But we don't give up treating alcoholics because we know that there is a way out. It is not easy. I praise God that I am alcoholic and not gay because at least with my disorder society told me that I could change and that I had to. Gays are told they can't change and they should accept the way they are. It is no wonder they have such a high suicide rate. They are given no hope. Life without hope is bitterness. No small wonder so many gay activists are so bitter. They have no hope. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I was really just trying to encourage a little empathy. Empathy seems to be hugely lacking in several threads right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 The poster did not ask Perez Hilton to inject homosexuality into the Miss. America contest. The poster doesn't bury his head in the sand to the issues going on in the society around him. The poster ran a gay-outreach ministry for three years. The poster had two gay roommates while in college. The poster has a very firm grasp in the issue. "Acceptance of one's self is primary to reducing tendencies in any one contemplating suicide." Really? In the Biblical tradition we are taught to reject one's self. Our good works are but as filthy rags. There is nothing in us that is good. Paul says, I am crucified with Christ therefore I no longer live but Jesus Christ now lives in me. The old man - self - must die. Our hope lies in Christ Jesus. Jesus said the first shall be last and the last shall be first. He that dies shall live. "Accepting of one's self" is pop-psychology puke which is completely rejected by the Biblical worldview. I am a sinner. I must reject self and accept Christ. There lies my Hope. When we tell an alcoholic that he must keep drinking, a prostitute that she must keep turning tricks or a gay man that he must continue to engage in gay sex - we extinguish their hope. Gays are seven times more likely to commit suicide than the average American. That is greater than alcoholics. Why? Because society tells them they have no hope. They are born gay, they can't change and they have live the gay lifestyle. Who is uninformed on this topic? I am not the one drinking the politically correct kool-aid. I am the guy that has worked in the ministry with gay people. I have prayed and cried with them. I love gay people and covet their souls for Jesus. I will not lie to them and tell them they cannot change and they have no hope. I know better. I have seen the transformation. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outta Here Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Society (in general) does not tell them they have no hope; a large portion of society tells them they are inferior human beings and are not worthy of love and acceptance--that they are somehow second-class citizens. It is the Christian sector of society that tells them they have no hope. Though I've not spent time studying the in's and out's of the reasoning behind the greater numbers of suicides among homosexuals, I have a feeling that the reasons these numbers are higher (if indeed, they are higher than the rest of society) has a greater correlation to the ridicule and degradation they face daily by a society that does not accept them as equals, than it does to the "no hope" premise offered by the Christian realm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Gays are seven times more likely to commit suicide than the average American. That is greater than alcoholics. Why? Because society tells them they have no hope. They are born gay, they can't change and they have live the gay lifestyle. Well, I don't have the credentials that you seem to have, but from what I have observed, I'm more inclined to think that gays are more likely to commit suicide because society rejects them. I wonder how old that statistic is and how the current statistics compare with 20 or 30 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I agree with everything you said, but I think Shane is trying to say that it is the Christians who are the ones offering hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Maybe if gay activists like, Perez Hilton, would stop trying to shove the issue down everyone's thoughts, the nation wouldn't seem so obsessed with what gay people do. Carrie Prejean Quote: "We live in a land where you can choose same-sex marriage or opposite. And you know what, I think in my country, in my family, I think that I believe that a marriage should be between a man and a woman. No offense to anybody out there, but that's how I was raised." Let's not forget who we and what we are talking about. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Redwood, maybe you need to make that picture your screensaver. Personally, I've seen enough of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outta Here Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Redwood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 I'm more inclined to think that gays are more likely to commit suicide because society rejects them. Today we live in a society that does accept gays. Even Miss California's answer to the question was very accepting of gays. Certainly today's acceptance of gay has decreased the suicide rate some. Since many gays are not out of the closet, it is really hard to really determine an exact suicide rate among them. The acceptance a gay person really needs is that of his family and God. In fact, the lack of this acceptance is one of the contributing factors in causing a male to become gay. (I know very little about lesbianism) Gay exit ministries are very loving toward gays. They do not take a harsh, judgmental view toward homosexuality. Homosexuality is a sin but God wants to forgive. Many gays believe God wants to condemn them when the exact opposite is true. God wants to forgive. That is the acceptance they need. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Redwood, maybe you need to make that picture your screensaver. Personally, I've seen enough of it. It IS the topic of this thread. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Quote: Many gays believe God wants to condemn them when the exact opposite is true. God wants to forgive. That is the acceptance they need. God may forgive them but the church does not ... unless they change their ways before coming to church. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 Many churches are still judgmental. However progress is being made. That said, gay-exit ministries exist all over and are a resource for gays. That is not to say it is easy for them to leave the lifestyle. It is not. It is hard - very hard. It is a struggle almost always marked with many failures and successes. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolaa Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 And even then they are looked upon with suspicion for the rest of their lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Quote: It is a struggle almost always marked with many failures and successes. If they had support from the church instead of condemnation ... perhaps the successes would be greater. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 Well that support starts with you and me. One person at a time. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olger Posted April 24, 2009 Share Posted April 24, 2009 Originally Posted By: CoAspen Yup, never get it...I didn't notice anyone on the forum asking to be updated on the comments of some contestant in a beauty contest.... Speaking of beauty contests, anyone else find the whole concept of beauty pageants absurd? It seems to me that God asks us to look on the hearts of men (and women) and not on their outward appearance. I agree, Madam. Borders on soft pornography. og out Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planey Posted April 24, 2009 Share Posted April 24, 2009 Got sick of looking at the same picture of Carrie Prejean Decided to give us a more cultural aspect. And again: Graeme Quote Graeme____________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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