Environmentalism and Adventist Stewardship

[doug yowell]

Originally Posted By: abelisle

I'm curious about the reactionary rhetoric being expressed by some, like you karl, on this thread? I don't remember labeling myself at any time as an "environmentalist" but if anything an Adventist Christian who is concerned that we give hardly any credence to environmental issues when we speak about stewardship.

Your brother in Christ

Alex (no slogans here - just the Bible)

I like very much your concern about maintenance of the body. We understand that the USE of the body and mind is necessary for good health.

I'd like to see concern for the planet to take a similar focus - that using the resources God has provided is what He wants us to do. Put them to work. God made this environment for man.

I'd like for Adventists to understand that God didn't just make enough for us, He provided a superabundance. When you eat a grapefruit, those seeds in each fruit are potential trees that can provide thousands more grapefruit.

I'd like for Adventists to have faith in God as the Sustainer of nature, not just as its Creator. The environment you see around you is what derived from the near-total destruction of the pre-flood environment. Think about that a minute, just in case you were worried about the resilience of the earth or about God's ability to provide plenty in spite of destruction.

I'd like to see Adventists understand that there is a lot of disinformation out there about the environment. We need to think critically about these things rather than accepting gullibly the statements of those who really do not love their fellow man and who would use environmental issues to deprive us of our rights.

The most environmentally friendly thing each of us can do is to use the energy, talents, and strength we've been given to better the lot of ourselves and our fellow man, spiritually, physically and emotionally.

Karl,I'm stunned that you would even think something like this much less openly suggest it. If our church would adhere to your philosophy it could deprive hundreds,maybe thousands of our university students of anything to protest against in the coming months. It could potentially have the scarey effect of forcing many of them into primitive lives of Christian service. In fact, it might very well create a devastating redirection of our entire SDA educational system!! Hiding behind the facade of environmentalism can't hide your REAL agenda!

[karl]

I hate that nobody got the "off with your head" double entendre. Toilet talk just isn't what it used to be.

[SivartM]

I agree that the government should not keep people from being productive.

We should be smart enough on our own to know that we don't need to cut down entire forests in a day so we can process them and throw them into landfills. And that maybe turning everything into an industry is not the best idea ever.

And good point about the endangered animals, abelisle. Amphibians are rapidly disappearing... and they are believed to be like canaries in coal mines as far as environmental health goes.

[doug yowell]

I hate that nobody got the "off with your head" double entendre. Toilet talk just isn't what it used to be.

Yeah,I think that one went right over our... or maybe we were just too flushed with embarassment to pick it up.

[Guest]

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

I hate that nobody got the "off with your head" double entendre. Toilet talk just isn't what it used to be.

oh, I got it. Just didn't think it was worth responding to ...

[karl]

Originally Posted By: karl

I hate that nobody got the "off with your head" double entendre. Toilet talk just isn't what it used to be.

oh, I got it. Just didn't think it was worth responding to ...

C'mon Pam. When I deal you good cards.... That was a straight flush!!

[karl]

Sivart, I was wondering whether you would be checking my math on rain forest destruction. I was off by the power of 10.

In the next forty years, at the larger of the two rates of destruction noted in the UN studies (0.004% per year,) one sixth of one percent more rain forest will be cleared.

The UN report says that the rain forest is quite safe. And when the UN, a left-leaning, socialist dominated, global governance promoting institution, says the rain forest is safe, you can pretty much take that to the bank.

[doug yowell]

The UN report says that the rain forest is quite safe. And when the UN, a left-leaning, socialist dominated, global governance promoting institution, says the rain forest is safe, you can pretty much take that to the bank.

[karl]

Originally Posted By: karl

The UN report says that the rain forest is quite safe. And when the UN, a left-leaning, socialist dominated, global governance promoting institution, says the rain forest is safe, you can pretty much take that to the bank.

Yeah, that's what THEY do with the money they get from us.

Do you think the UN is the Image to the Beast? What current organization better fits the Biblical description? It is supranational, just like the RC church was, and it tries to affect the decisions of nations on moral grounds. And it is headquartered here in the US.

Rev 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed . 13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live . 15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak , and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed .

[SivartM]

It's sad how off topic this has gotten.

So... why do you all think we never talk about environmental stewardship?

Wait, I know why! Because when we say the word "environment", conservatives everywhere start shouting and calling us hippies!

[abelisle]

It's sad how off topic this has gotten.

So... why do you all think we never talk about environmental stewardship?

Wait, I know why! Because when we say the word "environment", conservatives everywhere start shouting and calling us hippies!

Touche! or "bump?"

[Tom Wetmore]

Yep, and I am afraid those possessed of their myopic political agenda have pushed this topic one step away from the edge before they will make it fall into that great evil abyss, the political poo pile...

It really is a crying dirty shame...

Is their anyone willing to yank it back from certain destruction before it is too late?

Quick...

[SivartM]

There's a website I see advertised on the sidebar here occasionally called Creation Care for Pastors. You might want to check it out. How's your sermon coming, abelisle?

http://www.creationcareforpastors.com/

[abelisle]

Thanks Sivart!

My sermon will be more of a conversation between myself an another elder discussing the key elements of both sides of the stewardship message. He will focus of the traditional financial piece and I'm going to try to focus on the Biblical underpinnings that speak to conservation of both the Earth and our bodies (an interesting articulation with our health message)

Your link is very useful!

Alex

[abelisle]

Here's an interesting and poignant quote from that site:

God’s Future Kingdom: A New Creation

Our destiny is not to be separated from the earth in a disembodied, purely spiritual existence, but to live in a renewed and redeemed creation. In the Bible, life begins in a garden and culminates in a garden city. In the same way that we are to care for our mortal bodies because they are the temple of the Holy Spirit, we are to care for the earth, because it is to become the dwelling place of God.

Couldn't have said it better myself!

Alex

[SivartM]

n the same way that we are to care for our mortal bodies because they are the temple of the Holy Spirit, we are to care for the earth, because it is to become the dwelling place of God

Oh, no no no! Don't you know that God will take care of our bodies for us? The World Health Organization says we're all mostly kind of just fine anyway.

Really, that is a good quote. And you're welcome for the link. :)

[karl]

Yep, and I am afraid those possessed of their myopic political agenda have pushed this topic one step away from the edge before they will make it fall into that great evil abyss, the political poo pile...

It really is a crying dirty shame...

Is their anyone willing to yank it back from certain destruction before it is too late?

Has anyone prevented you, Alex, or you, Sivart or you, Tom from presenting your plan for environmental wonderfulness?

Instead of complaining about what others are doing or not doing, why don't you present a plan? I'm trying to do what I can where I am, and I listed what I would like to see the church do and know, but apparently that does not resonate with you, so.... get with it and tell us what you want to happen.

Here's a little thought from a song I wrote. It's based on the EGW quote below that.

"If we're lookin for man to find a better way

The deception will come that this planet can be saved

Well brothers and sisters there's news for you

On this the Scripture is clear

Whatever is left after sin is through

Will just melt when His glory appears.

God promised to Abraham, and his seed after him, that they should have possessions and lands, and yet they were only strangers and sojourners. The inheritance and lands that are to be given not only to Abraham but to the children of Abraham will not be until after this earth is purified. Abraham will then receive the title to his farm, his possessions; and the children of Abraham will have a title to their possessions. Every one of us should constantly bear in mind that this earth is not our dwelling place, but that we are to have an inheritance in the earth made new. The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah symbolizes to us how this world will be destroyed by fire. It is not safe for any one of us to build our hopes in this life. We want first to seek the kingdom of God and His righteousness. . . . Christ Triumphant (1999), page 80, paragraph 2

[Guest]

Amen!

[abelisle]

"Has anyone prevented you, Alex, or you, Sivart or you, Tom from presenting your plan for environmental wonderfulness?

Instead of complaining about what others are doing or not doing, why don't you present a plan? I'm trying to do what I can where I am, and I listed what I would like to see the church do and know, but apparently that does not resonate with you, so.... get with it and tell us what you want to happen."

Speaking for myself, I never addressed any individual or groups of individuals. My primary goal was to raise the spirtual consciousness level here in this forum and of the church (my local one and my conference) in this regard.

My desire is a simple one - to hear for the 1st time someone in the pulpit speak about stewardship without primarily focusing on finances, I mentioned this to my conference President and Executive Secretary and discussed my plans with them. They acknowledged the Biblical soundness of what I presented but clearly displayed their reluctance to even briefly step away from the financial piece.

So, as you can see, I did not raise this issue to participate in a one-upmanship contest with anyone here, but rather simply to rause the spiritual consciousness and awareness levels in this forum. If I am guilty of fomenting rancor in the midst, I ask both from you and from God forgiveness.

Your brother in Christ

Alex

[doug yowell]

It's sad how off topic this has gotten.

So... why do you all think we never talk about environmental stewardship?

Wait, I know why! Because when we say the word "environment", conservatives everywhere start shouting and calling us hippies!

[Tom Wetmore]

I am glad you got it!

Too often such efforts are all for naught...

[Woody]

Quote:

Ah ha! I knew you guys were hippies!! Peace.

Yes. We do have a number of political hippies here. May God Bless them and give them peace. Perhaps if they can find peace they will give some of it to us.

[Guest]

Get a haircut.

[abelisle]

"What does your pastor say about climate change?"

I have gotten that question a few times. Maybe you are the pastor that has been on the receiving end of climate change questions. Global warming and climate change questions will not go away anytime soon. In fact, they will likely grow in prominence. Regardless of the ebb and flow of public opinion, scientific reports and political posturing, Christian leaders need to be prepared. Pastors must address the message of biblical stewardship of our environment from the pulpit. They have a captive audience that needs to hear environmental messages somewhere other than secular media.

But some pastors are reluctant; a common concern is the polarizing effect on the congregation, which often contains "tree hugger" progressives and "climate skeptic" conservatives. Many climate change skeptics see global warming issues as championed by left-wing radical environmentalists. You know, those tree huggers like Al Gore, always trying to nail the skeptics to a cross with the "climate hammer."

The tree hugger congregants in the opposite pew see the denial of climate change as the industrial complex plot to destroy the earth for monetary gain. You know, those stone-hearted capitalists, always crying "no new taxes," to anything the tree huggers want that would cost a nickel more.

The topic remains steeped in turmoil. The problem is the perceived hijacking of "environmental" issues by both progressives and conservatives. Both see themselves as captives to the other's agenda. Is it worth it for "the church" to get into the middle of it?

If the Bible is used to seek the Lord's will, then the answer is yes. We need to look to biblical stewardship and beyond the stereotypes that captivate and ensnare us. We can and should tackle environmental issues- if we keep the focus on the cross of Jesus Christ. I talk about this at length in my book An Inconvenient Purpose - Linking Godly Stewardship and Alternative Energy.

However, as Christian leaders, we understand that we are dealing with "climate change captives" on both sides of the wall. Captives cannot see past the walls around them. Without Scripture and Christian leadership, captives on both sides will fail to break down the walls that divide them from each other, and from God's plan. 2 Timothy 2:23-26 (New International Version) states our mission as God's servants clearly:

"Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels.And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will."

The captives are on both sides of the climate change debate. Whether dealing with the liberal progressives who sometimes go to far or the staunch conservatives who sometimes don't go far enough, we are all captive to sin. Worshiping the creation rather than the creator is a sin (Romans 1: 25), but so is ignoring God's command to care for our fellow man and God's creation (Genesis 2:15, Luke 12:47-48 and Rev 11:18).

No matter the general persuasion of the congregation, the focus should be on commands God gave long before there were conservative or progressive stereotypes.

In Genesis 1:28 we were told to populate the earth and subdue it. This command existed before Adam and Eve fell into sin. The timing means that the term "subdue" does not mean harsh or overbearing rule, but to govern wisely.

The discussions about climate change will crescendo in government, boardrooms, and at the water cooler. The church needs to focus the discussion squarely on Christ, while remembering there are climate change captives in both the left pews and right pews.

Richard Gasaway is a Professional Electrical Engineer and author of the 2009 award winning book, An Inconvenient Purpose - Linking Godly Stewardship and Alternative Energy.

www.aninconvenientpurpose.com