Robert Posted April 10, 2010 Share Posted April 10, 2010 Our prophet says that Tithe is the "Test of heavenly fellowship" See EV 251 She also states that Faithfulness in tithe paying is a condition to answered prayers. See COL144 Dishonesty in tithing "is registered in the books of heaven as robbery toward Him." CS 77 In the church manual p. 135 Tithe paying is described as a "spiritual exercise in which we should all have a part of. It can't be separated from the message of salvation". Legalism....Heaven through payment....And we give the Catholics a hard time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted April 10, 2010 Author Share Posted April 10, 2010 Originally Posted By: SivartM I don't think the Bible says "healthy, wealthy, and wise". I think poor Richard said that. No, it wasn't me. Well can you at least verify for us that you are 'poor'? Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 10, 2010 Share Posted April 10, 2010 Yes, I thought I just did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 10, 2010 Share Posted April 10, 2010 Originally Posted By: Richard Holbrook Mal 3:8 Will a man rob God? Yet you have robbed me. But you say, How have we robbed you? In tithes and offerings. Old Covenant command! How do I know this? Gal 3:10 For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, "Cursed be every one who does not abide by all things written in the book of the law, and do them." Mal 3:8 But you say, 'How are we robbing thee?' In your tithes and offerings. 9 You are cursed with a curse, for you are robbing me; the whole nation of you. Now on the other hand if you belong to a church you should help support it..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 So you're saying that because Mal 3:8 has the word curse in it, that you no longer need to pay tithe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 So you're saying that because Mal 3:8 has the word curse in it, that you no longer need to pay tithe? It's old covenant....Let me give you EGW's own words: The terms of the “old covenant” were, Obey and live: “If a man do, he shall even live in them” (Eze. 20:11; Lev. 18:5); but “cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them.” Deut. 27:26. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Rich Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 Richard, Matthew 21:43 points out that the Kingdom of Heaven was taken away from the Jews/Israel, and therefore there is NO MORE NEED OF TITHE to pay for the Priests who could NOT own anything. The verses you quoted were and are well known as a 'tool' to beat in the heads of people who don't or can't pay a tithe or can't or don't pay as much as what the corporate church wants them to pay BECAUSE THE SDA CHURCH IS A BUSINESS. Instead, Jesus gave us a new command and that is give to God what is God's and to the King, what is his. Well, I for one take this serious. I do not own anything anymore, nor do I even work for myself anymore nor do I even have a bank account. It all belongs to God! I totally work for God and TRUST in Him to take care of me IF I do my part for Him. Now, IF everyone did this there would not be any need for any tithe, would there? (Oh, by the way, the SDA Church is NOT God's, for most of them belong to the Father of all lies.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 The verses you quoted were and are well known as a 'tool' to beat in the heads of people who don't or can't pay a tithe or can't or don't pay as much as what the corporate church wants them to pay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman1228 Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 Here is what God said to do with your tithe: “You shall tithe all the yield of your seed that comes from the field year by year. (23) And before the LORD your God, in the place that he will choose, to make his name dwell there, you shall eat the tithe of your grain, of your wine, and of your oil, and the firstborn of your herd and flock, that you may learn to fear the LORD your God always. (24) And if the way is too long for you, so that you are not able to carry the tithe, when the LORD your God blesses you, because the place is too far from you, which the LORD your God chooses, to set his name there, (25) then you shall turn it into money and bind up the money in your hand and go to the place that the LORD your God chooses (26) and spend the money for whatever you desire—oxen or sheep or wine or strong drink, whatever your appetite craves. And you shall eat there before the LORD your God and rejoice, you and your household. Deut.14:22-26. Each year Israel was to go to a location that God would specify and take the tithe of their increase and eat and drink (strong drink) and make merry before the Lord and rejoice. Now, as fun as all this sounds this was ONLY for Israel and not for us. The requirement to 'tithe' was set aside at the time Israel rejected their King, at the end of the 490 year prophecy of Dan.9:24. There is no longer any requirement to tithe. That is not to say that one should not be generous, but we should not let ourselves be bullied into paying extortion to any church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Rich Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 Why don't you answer the question yourself Richard? After you read MM's TRUE account of tithe, then if you want to repent, do it--it is your choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsailor29 Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 interesting discussion about tithe. Perhaps the church should call it dues or fees. Since the church has a higher percentage of poor, perhaps a flat rate fee would bring in a higher yield. Then of course, an appeal to reason would replace the faulty chapter and verse logic of the current system. Quote Prs God, frm whm blssngs flw http://www.zoelifestyle.com/jmccall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman1228 Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 We could also do it like a local church in a town near here. If you want to join this church you have to sign a contract that stipulates a certain amount per month based on your income. If you don't pay they can and do sue to get 'their' money. This is pretty bad, but better than the extortion that SDA's put up with at least twice a year when the conference has their 'special' offerings. You know, maybe honesty would work better. As bad as this is it is not a patch on some of the private ministries that go after old folks, getting them to sign over all their holdings, leaving none for the family members. This happens all too often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Rich Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 Yes, MM, you are correct. I have attended and heard from people who were hired by these private ministries that they target the older folks, and those who have lost a mate, with the 'thought' put in their mind that "If you want to make sure you go to heaven, then you must make plans for all of your wealth/assets to go to our ministry when you die, because our ministry reaches people all over the world in our radio and/or TV programs". Talk about theft??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayfinder Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 Most don't even wait until they die, they take the money right now and leave the poor person destitute! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnattmbtc Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Not at all....I'm not the hypocrite...it is you! Why? You, along with many SDA, insist that the law is binding on the believer. If so start living Christ's life...live His life, which answer all the law.... Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 If we have accepted Christ, then we live His life. If we are not living His life, then we have not accept Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnattmbtc Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 R:If we have accepted Christ, then we live His life. If we are not living His life, then we have not accept Him. p:Then you are hopelessly lost....This is legalism! Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 No, Robert. If I don't have Christ, *then* I'm hopelessly lost. Not having Christ is what equals legalism. Having Christ equals having life. Now you're twisting....You said, "If we are not living His life, then we have not accept Him." Living Christ's life is doing as He did...period! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnattmbtc Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Jesus did not live for Himself. Unlike you He didn't have a home...in fact He only had the clothes on His back. Why not more? He was too busy loving everyone else - not Himself. Self-love is sin....It is the root of all sin. It is Lucifer's invention. If you love self you are a sinner. If you are free from the love of self you are righteous. If you say you are righteous you are deceived. Face it, dude, we are self-centered and sinful in comparison to Christ. The sooner you see this the better.... God calls people to do different things. Not everyone is called to a ministry such as Christ had, or such as Christ called the RYR. This is evidenced by Christ Himself, who, during most of His adult life, worked as a carpenter and lived in a home. He was just as saved while doing so (and just as generous) as during His ministry, when He didn't have a home. Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 You cannot be Christ's and live unlike Christ. How did you obtain the things you have? Was it an accident? Tell me you didn't think of yourself a lot! Tell me all your education wasn't with you in mind! Tell me you got all these things by thinking solely of others and I'll tell you that you are lying.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Not everyone is called to a ministry such as Christ had, or such as Christ called the RYR. Christ wasn't called to be poor! He came to save humanity and He did so by living a perfect life in obedience to God's agape love while in our fallen humanity. Now, if you live Christ's life you too will experience poverty....Why? "Jesus...thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself." If you guys lived Christ's life here on earth you would share His poverty as well. Hence, "those who follow Him must share his poverty." To follow Christ means to walk in His footsteps of self-denial....That's commandment keeping. Loving self...living for self comes from our bent to self. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Christ Himself, who, during most of His adult life, worked as a carpenter and lived in a home. So? He lived for others....He didn't build personal wealth. In the case above He lived also for his parents. It wasn't His home....He didn't compete...He didn't try and out do others as we do in this Capitalistic system....It's a dog eat dog world and Christ never was of this world..... If I gave you my home that wouldn't make it sinful for you to live in it. But if you covet after your own things that is being bent to self. The early church had all things in common. There was no this is mine and that is yours. That is how it will be in heaven.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Rich Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 Hey Robert, can you support your belief without Paul's words and without Hebrews? Just wondered. Have you read any of the dead sea scrolls? If so, what is your overall opinion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 Hey Robert, can you support your belief without Paul's words and without Hebrews? Just wondered. Have you read any of the dead sea scrolls? If so, what is your overall opinion? He can't even support it WITH Paul's words and Hebrews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 His position can't be supported. Because it's straight out of babylon. Which means it originated with satan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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