Save The Human

[SivartM]

Only people in harsh areas really need animals to survive. In places like America where we can (and do) grow enough plant food (we just feed most of it to those billions of animals) we certainly don't need to eat animals to live.

[bonnie]

. In places like America where we can (and do) grow enough plant food (we just feed most of it to those billions of animals) we certainly don't need to eat animals to live.

No we don't.You still haven't explained who is going to feed all the animals and care for them for years without a return.

Those billions of animals will still eat the crops that are grown

whether you eat a animal or not.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

If you're a vegan, be sure and get enough vitamin B12. It's not found in fruits and vegetables. Be sure and eat your seaweed.

http://www.vegsoc.org/info/b12.html

[bonnie]

If you're a vegan, be sure and get enough vitamin B12. It's not found in fruits and vegetables. Be sure and eat your seaweed.

http://www.vegsoc.org/info/b12.html

The idea that the world stops eating meat and all will be well for our four legged friends is just plain silly.

Before sin nature was balanced,it certainly isn't now.

Every few years we have a mass hunting spree to thin out the deer. Little Bambi runs free and they breed and breed.Throw in a mild winter without much snow,the following year we have a explosion of deer. Causing many,many accidents and sometimes the death of a human.If they are not thinned out they cause havoc If there is not enough food available many starve. Peta and groups like that try to stop the hunt.

But those that feel so righteous about their diet really needs to see what other items that make their lives better in their home. You don't just have to eat it to be part of the group that causes animals to die

[teresaq]

Originally Posted By: bonnie

...It is expensive to feed without a return,takes time and space to care for them till they die a natural death. Of course if they are allowed to run free they have a nasty habit of continuing to breed. Pretty difficult to catch all those free roaming critters to neuter them.

hmmm, well they do make good, cheap "lawnmowers" for big fields. that helps prevent fires in fire weather...apparently they were quite easy to catch to castrate, since they were rounded up and castrated...im thinking they dont tend to breed like rabbits at any rate...

wonder how my God, Who created the animals, feels about such, what comes across as unfeeling and flippant, regard for a creation He put time and thought into-and continues to uphold....

[phkrause]

If you're a vegan, be sure and get enough vitamin B12. It's not found in fruits and vegetables. Be sure and eat your seaweed.

http://www.vegsoc.org/info/b12.html

According to Dick Nunez, Body & Spirit program on 3ABN we get our Vitamin B12 from the bacteria in our mouths over night. He says we should drink water before we use our mouth washes, this will give us our daily requirement of B12. I will try to find the DVD that has this info and post his exact words.

[bonnie]

1. raising livestock for human consumption,

2. wildlife,

3. or dairy cattle?

you appear to be throwing all under one heading. they are each different situations calling for different solutions...

once that is settled we can go on to address each of the issues you bring up...

No,same problem.

1.If you(general) would be successful you have thousands of animals to contend with even without being bred. Take up a large amount of space as compared to say a dog.They cannot be kept in confinement to live out their natural life.They cannot be turned loose to live out their natural lives.They consume great quanities of food that has to be produced by those you want to produce crops for human consumption.

2. Wildlife is a little better off but not entirely.

Deer really can multiply depending on winter weather conditions. During harsh winters they need to be thinned or starve. If there are those that don't understand how that happens,it is a bullet to the head.

Canadian geese are a big problem here. The apts and homes close to water can be over run with geese. You would not want to walk barefoot on their lawns or driveways. They can also terrify young children as geese can be vicious if they think their babies are threatened in any way. I suppose you can guess the solution.They no longer have their natural enemies so breed and breed.

Wolves in parts of MN are killing baby lambs. That is natural in the wild,but this is coming at the lambs for profit.

3 Dairy cattle are no different than those raised for human consumption. 50% of babies born are bull calves.Worthless unless fed for beef. Not all heifer calves are raised for milk. If she does not have the characteristics of a good milk producer,she has the same fate as bull calves.When the dairy cow reaches the age where milk production slows down they go the same place as the bull calves as well.

Sheep are the same. Sheep can easily have triplets.Some breeds will have babies every 13-15 months.

You keep only the best.

I had a flock of forty ewes.Not raised for human consumption but many certainly went for that.

Hand spinning has made a tremendous comeback and the fleece is what I raised and bred for.

1 ram can service up to 45 ewes. 40 ewes would produce around a hundred lambs.50% ram lambs. Should I have raised those 50 ram lambs till they died a natural death. They went for human consumption.

Then of course there is what to do with all those businesses that have a thriving business using the by-products

Dairy cattle need to be bred every year to keep producing milk.

[teresaq]

Originally Posted By: teresaq(sda)

what exactly are you discussing?

1. raising livestock for human consumption,

2. wildlife,

3. or dairy cattle?

you appear to be throwing all under one heading. they are each different situations calling for different solutions...

once that is settled we can go on to address each of the issues you bring up...

No,same problem....

apparently you see only one solution for what you see as one problem-eat Gods critters...

i get the idea that you dont think others could see the issues differently, and that there could be different solutions for each situation. would that be correct?

[LifeHiscost]

He might be coming soon, but does that give us the authority to do whatever we want to his earth? We are the stewards here.

I pray that Jesus does come soon. In the end it really is the only fix to this ailing planet.

Which means tell 1 person about Jesus = saves the humans.

If every christian in the world told 1 person about Jesus we would be out of here very soon indeed.

"And the heathen (the nations) raged, but Your wrath (retribution, indignation) came, the time when the dead will be judged and Your servants the prophets and saints rewarded--and those who revere (fear) Your name, both low and high and small and great--and [the time] for destroying the corrupters of the earth."Revelation 11:18 AMP

"“And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring; men’s hearts failing them from fear and the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near.”" Luke 21:25-28 NKJV

Joy!!

[bonnie]

apparently you see only one solution for what you see as one problem-eat Gods critters...

i get the idea that you dont think others could see the issues differently, and that there could be different solutions for each situation. would that be correct?

Unless you are a magician the animals must be maintained even tho they are not producing or raised for human consumption.

I am waiting to hear your solution.

To maintain the flock of sheep I had for the purpose they were used for,the ewes needed to be bred and have babies.50% of those babies had no practical use for me or anyone else other than being sold for human consumption. Please do share where you would have kept 50 ram lambs that would grow to over 250 lbs within a year and what they would have eaten

[LifeHiscost]

How do you think the businesses would feel about bankruptcy? Or better yet what would they use to take the place. Not nearly as simplistic as you make it sound

Textiles,chemicals,

pharmaceuticals,drywall,medicines,car tires,medications,trypsin,treating allergies, corticotrophin,iron,lubricants and fluids for mechanical,industrial cleaners,fertilizers,printing ink,high gloss for magazines,car tires,asphalt for our roads

Sounds like a good reason to invite Jesus back to take those back home who love Him and are looking forward to living where money and possessions aren't king.

"For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows."1 Timothy 6:10 NKJV

"And He said to them, “Take heed and beware of covetousness, for one’s life does not consist in the abundance of the things he possesses.”"Luke 12:15 NKJV

"“Ho! Everyone who thirsts,Come to the waters; And you who have no money, Come, buy and eat. Yes, come, buy wine and milk Without money and without price." Isaiah 55:2 NKJV

Joy!!

[bonnie]

Sounds like a good reason to invite Jesus back to take those back home who love Him and are looking forward to living where money and possessions aren't king.

[bonnie]

apparently you see only one solution for what you see as one problem-eat Gods critters...

i get the idea that you dont think others could see the issues differently, and that there could be different solutions for each situation. would that be correct?

Can I take from this that you have stopped using products that came because someone raised God's creatures for meat? Eating a hamburger is not the only way to be a party to this. The list is very long.

[teresaq]

Originally Posted By: teresaq(sda)

apparently you see only one solution for what you see as one problem-eat Gods critters...

i get the idea that you dont think others could see the issues differently, and that there could be different solutions for each situation. would that be correct?

Unless you are a magician the animals must be maintained even tho they are not producing or raised for human consumption.

I am waiting to hear your solution.

To maintain the flock of sheep I had for the purpose they were used for,the ewes needed to be bred and have babies.50% of those babies had no practical use for me or anyone else other than being sold for human consumption. Please do share where you would have kept 50 ram lambs that would grow to over 250 lbs within a year and what they would have eaten

i didnt see the answer to my question above....did you misunderstand it possibly?

[Dr. Shane]

Heart disease, cancer and all kinds of terrible plagues come to those eating meat. And what do we get in exchange? A dying planet. Polluted streams, rivers, lakes and ground water.

So what are the first steps?

Step one is for humanity to drastically reduce their meat consumption. Farms are the most polluting. Wildlife leaves a very small footprint. So we need to eliminate cattle and dairy farms. But we, as individuals, can't do that. So we should just quit eating meat ourselves. A start would be to only eat wildlife. Boycott meat raised on farms.

Someone asked if I eat grass. Fields that grow grass can be used to crow corn, soy, wheat and other plant foods. Instead of feeding grass to a cow, letting it pass through the back end and pollute our water, we could be planting soy, wheat, corn and so many other products.

[bonnie]

[bonnie]

Heart disease, cancer and all kinds of terrible plagues come to those eating meat. And what do we get in exchange? A dying planet. Polluted streams, rivers, lakes and ground water.

So what are the first steps?

Step one is for humanity to drastically reduce their meat consumption. Farms are the most polluting. Wildlife leaves a very small footprint. So we need to eliminate cattle and dairy farms. But we, as individuals, can't do that. So we should just quit eating meat ourselves. A start would be to only eat wildlife. Boycott meat raised on farms.

Someone asked if I eat grass. Fields that grow grass can be used to crow corn, soy, wheat and other plant foods. Instead of feeding grass to a cow, letting it pass through the back end and pollute our water, we could be planting soy, wheat, corn and so many other products.

From where I live I don't see to much of a dying planet.Haven't heard of anyone getting sick or dying of polluted ground water.

We can only control what we do and what we eat. What someone chooses to eat is not my affair.I know many veggies and vegens

that need to seriously give consideration to their own diet first and how much they eat before they look at mine. I am not a meat eater as a rule.That doesn't seem to impact the number of animals raised for food.It does not seem to be a lack of grains that people eat meat.There is sufficient of that,people like meat period.

You obviously do not live where animals leave a big imprint. Like getting up some morning and guiding your children thru hundreds of geese and their droppings.

But as with the others have you stopped using the products that are a result of meat being raised for human consumption. It matters little whether they are raised for hamburger,your leather shoes,coat,textiles etc. Stop using,if there is no demand there will be no product

[SivartM]

Someone asked if I eat grass. Fields that grow grass can be used to crow corn, soy, wheat and other plant foods. Instead of feeding grass to a cow, letting it pass through the back end and pollute our water, we could be planting soy, wheat, corn and so many other products.

[teresaq]

apparently you see only one solution for what you see as one problem-eat Gods critters...

i get the idea that you dont think others could see the issues differently, and that there could be different solutions for each situation. would that be correct?

[bonnie]

Most cows in America don't eat grass. They eat corn. And we have too much of that, also.

[bonnie]

Quote:

bonnie, there is a difference between a statement and a question. what you copied was a statement. what you left out was the question bolded in my original post above. [/quote']

And you seem to want to play games By all means share your solutions,I asked for them before.I am anxiously waiting to see what I could have done with 50 ram lambs every year.

So please do share your solution to this problem.

Then maybe you can take the time to answer my question. If the raising of animals for meat bothers you so,have you quit using those products that benefit you from that practise.

[SivartM]

That is not quite right.You can only feed a cow so much corn and you will have a mighty sick cow,a little more corn and you are apt to have a dead one. Many,many cows eat grass. Take a trip thru WY and look at the number of beef on pasture.If they do not have access to grass they will be eating hay.

[SivartM]

And you seem to want to play games By all means share your solutions,I asked for them before.I am anxiously waiting to see what I could have done with 50 ram lambs every year.

So please do share your solution to this problem.

Then maybe you can take the time to answer my question. If the raising of animals for meat bothers you so,have you quit using those products that benefit you from that practise.

Please share your solution to get rid of all the waste these 60 billion animals produce. Maybe we could eat that too.

[bonnie]

Yes, it is right. The majority of cows in the United States live on factory farms and are fed corn or soy.

[bonnie]

Please share your solution to get rid of all the waste these 60 billion animals produce. Maybe we could eat that too.

I don't have one and haven't claimed to.You and others seem to think it is simple,everyone stop eating meat.