Condemning that which is wrong?

[Stan]

"The Lord wants His people to follow other methods than that of condemning wrong. He wants us to do something more than to hurl at our adversaries charges that only drive them further away from the truth." Ellen White

Thanks to Charles Ed II Aguilar on facebook

[phkrause]

‎"The Lord wants His people to follow other methods than that of condemning wrong. He wants us to do something more than to hurl at our adversaries charges that only drive them further away from the truth." Ellen White

Thanks to Charles Ed II Aguilar on facebook

That's an excellent EGW quote. Its also interesting that many of those that have a high regard for her don't practice this quote at all. :(

[John317]

The battle is on. Satan and his angels are working with all deceivableness of unrighteousness. They are untiring in their efforts to draw souls away from the truth, away from righteousness, to spread ruin throughout the universe. They work with marvelous industry to furnish a multitude of deceptions to take souls captive. Their efforts are unceasing. The enemy is ever seeking to lead souls into infidelity and skepticism. He would do away with God, and with Christ, who was made flesh and dwelt among us, to teach us that in obedience to God's will we may be victorious over sin. {SpTB02 12.3}

Every form of evil is waiting for an opportunity to assail us. Flattery, bribes, inducements, promises of wonderful exaltation, will be most assiduously employed.

What are God's servants doing to raise the barrier of a "Thus saith the Lord" against this evil? The enemy's agents are working unceasingly to prevail against the truth. Where are the faithful guardians of the Lord's flocks? Where are His watchmen? Are they standing on the high tower, giving the danger signal, or are they allowing the peril to pass unheeded? Where are the medical missionaries? Are they co-workers with Christ, wearing His yoke, or are they wearing a yoke of human manufacture? {SpTB02 13.1}

Satan and his angels are making every effort to obtain control of minds, that men may be swayed by falsehood and pleasing fables. Are our physicians lifting the danger signal? Are the men who have been placed in prominent positions in our sanitariums lifting the danger signal? Or are many of the watchmen asleep, while mischievous tongues and acute minds, sharpened by long practise in evading the truth, are continually at work to bring in confusion, and to carry out plans instigated by the enemy? {SpTB02 13.2}

Please read Paul's exhortation to the Colossians. He speaks of his earnest desire that the hearts of the believers might be "knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgment of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ; in whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge," "And this I say," he declares." "lest any man should beguile you with enticing words. . . . As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in Him; rooted and built up in Him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily."

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{SpTB02 13.3}

Will the men in our institutions keep silent, allowing insidious fallacies to be promulgated, to the ruin of souls? The sentiments of the enemy are being scattered everywhere. Seeds of discord, of unbelief, of infidelity, are being sown broadcast. Shall our medical missionaries raise no barrier against this evil? Is it not time that we asked ourselves, Shall we allow the adversary to lead us to give up the work of proclaiming the truth? Shall we allow him to keep us from being channels through which the blessings of the gospel, as a current of life, shall flow to the world? Let every man now arouse, and work as he has opportunity. Let him speak words in season and out of season, and look to Christ for encouragement and strength in well-doing. {SpTB02 14.1}

The dangers coming upon us are continually increasing. It is high time that we put on the whole armor of God, and work earnestly to keep Satan from gaining any further advantage. Angels of God, that excel in strength, are waiting for us to call them to our aid, that our faith may not be eclipsed by the fierceness of the conflict. Renewed energy is now needed. Vigilant action is called for. Indifference and sloth will result in the loss of personal religion and of heaven. {SpTB02 14.2}

At this time the Laodicean message is to be given, to arouse a slumbering church. Let the thought of the shortness of time stimulate you to earnest, untiring effort. Remember that Satan has come down with great power, to work with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish. {SpTB02 14.3}

For years our physicians have been trained to think that they must not give expression to sentiments that differ from those of their chief. O that they had broken the yoke! O that they had called sin by its right name! Then they would not be regarded in the heavenly courts as men who, though bearing weighty

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responsibilities, have failed of speaking the truth in reproof of that which has been in disobedience to God's word. {SpTB02 14.4}

Physicians, have you been doing the Master's business in listening to fanciful and spiritualistic interpretations of the Scriptures, interpretations which undermine the foundations of our faith, and holding your peace? God says, "Neither will I be with you any more, unless you awake, and vindicate your Redeemer." {SpTB02 15.1}

My message to you is: No longer consent to listen without protest to the perversion of truth. Unmask the pretentious sophistries which, if received, will lead ministers and physicians and medical missionary workers to ignore the truth. Every one is now to stand on his guard. God calls upon men and women to take their stand under the blood-stained banner of Prince Emmanuel. I have been instructed to warn our people; for many are in danger of receiving theories and sophistries that undermine the foundation pillars of the faith. {SpTB02 15.2}

[phkrause]

Great quotes John.

[Gordon1]

"The Lord wants His people to follow other methods than that of condemning wrong. He wants us to do something more than to hurl at our adversaries charges that only drive them further away from the truth." Ellen White

Hi Stan. This phrase is incomplete, because it lacks context, as well as a source. It's likely the full context will provide instruction with the 'proper methods to follow'. So on it's own it mimics the evangelical cry so oft heard in SDA circles - "Don't criticize - love instead." This is too often a diversion to cover sin.

Please reveal the "other methods". I daresay they will involve shining light by speaking God's word. This was Christ's example.

[Woody]

Originally Posted By: Stan Jensen

"The Lord wants His people to follow other methods than that of condemning wrong. He wants us to do something more than to hurl at our adversaries charges that only drive them further away from the truth." Ellen White

So on it's own it mimics the evangelical cry so oft heard in SDA circles - "Don't criticize - love instead." This is too often a diversion to cover sin.

Please reveal the "other methods". I daresay they will involve shining light by speaking God's word. This was Christ's example.

From my experience God leads step by step. He does not expect us to be perfect in all areas at once. But rather He desires for us to be perfect at each step before going on to another step. Step by Step.

So to say that it is a "diversion to cover sin" is simply untrue from what I have observed. What happens is when people are working on what the Spirit is working with them on .... someone (Some zealous Christian) comes along and 'feels' they are not doing well enough in other areas of Chrsitian growth.

So they attack this person with all of the faults they observe. This causes the person to no longer be perfect in their growth. It causes them to give up in dispair. When this is totally contrary to what the Spirit of God was working on and with the person.

We need to let the Spirit be the Spirit and stop trying to do it's work

God is LOVE. We need to be also. Kind and gentle. (Well except for those overly zealous Christans who attack the weak. I have no sympathy for them.)

[phkrause]

From my experience God leads step by step. He does not expect us to be perfect in all areas at once. But rather He desires for us to be perfect at each step before going on to another step. Step by Step.

So to say that it is a "diversion to cover sin" is simply untrue from what I have observed. What happens is when people are working on what the Spirit is working with them on .... someone (Some zealous Christian) comes along and 'feels' they are not doing well enough in other areas of Chrsitian growth.

So they attack this person with all of the faults they observe. This causes the person to no longer be perfect in their growth. It causes them to give up in dispair. When this is totally contrary to what the Spirit of God was working on and with the person.

We need to let the Spirit be the Spirit and stop trying to do it's work

God is LOVE. We need to be also. Kind and gentle. (Well except for those overly zealous Christans who attack the weak. I have no sympathy for them.)

Excellent post Woody

[John317]

There are two extremes we must avoid: one is to be silent like a dumb dog that doesn't bark in regard to what's wrong and the other is to be an accuser of the brethren. If we follow Christ's example, we will never fear or fail to tell the truth, but we will always tell it with love, even if it is at the risk of causing people to be upset. Being upset now is to be preferred to being lost eternally.

Ellen White wrote:

"Those who stand in defense of the honor of God, and maintain the purity of truth at any cost, will have manifold trials, as did the Savior in the wilderness of temptation. The yielding tempeeraments, who have not courage to condemn wrong, but keep silent when their influence is needed to stand in the defense of right against any pressure, may avoid many heartaches and escape many perplexities, and lose a very rich reward, if not their own souls." ML 320

[LifeHiscost]

Very astute observation, PK. Shades of the Word.

"And so the Lord says,“These people say they are mine.They honor me with their lips,but their hearts are far from me.And their worship of me is nothing but man-made rules learned by rote."Isaiah 29:13 NLT

God blesses!

[LifeHiscost]

(Well except for those overly zealous Christans who attack the weak. I have no sympathy for them.)

Do I perceive a caveat here also, indicating, "except for me".

"Watch out! Remember the three years I was with you—my constant watch and care over you night and day, and my many tears for you."Acts 20:31 NLT

"...but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin."Hebrews 3:13 NLT

God blesses!

[hch]

Originally Posted By: Stan Jensen

"The Lord wants His people to follow other methods than that of condemning wrong. He wants us to do something more than to hurl at our adversaries charges that only drive them further away from the truth." Ellen White

Hi Stan. This phrase is incomplete, because it lacks context, as well as a source. It's likely the full context will provide instruction with the 'proper methods to follow'. So on it's own it mimics the evangelical cry so oft heard in SDA circles - "Don't criticize - love instead." This is too often a diversion to cover sin.

Please reveal the "other methods". I daresay they will involve shining light by speaking God's word. This was Christ's example.

[John317]

(quotingEGW):

He who expects to enlighten a deceived people must come near to them and labor for them in love. He must become a center of holy influence. {6T 122.1}

In the advocacy of the truth the bitterest opponents should be treated with respect and deference. Some will not respond to our efforts, but will make light of the gospel invitation. Others--even those whom we suppose to have passed the boundary of God's mercy--will be won to Christ. The very last work in the controversy may be the enlightenment of those who have not rejected light and evidence, but who have been in midnight darkness and have in ignorance worked against the truth. Therefore treat every man as honest. Speak no word, do no deed, that will confirm any in unbelief. {6T 122.2}

Excellent quote, well worth posting again.

[teresaq]

We need to be very sure that we are close to the Lord before we march where angels fear to tread. Many times we are reproving for Christ in the spirit of Satan-and oblivious to that fact, much like Saul/Paul.

There is so much of Ellen White's writings that are unknown as well as the examples of both the disciples and our pioneers in reproving wrong.

We tend to read the bible/SOP according to our own spirit instead of the Spirit of Christ, the One Who had tears in His voice...

[John317]

According to the book of Acts and the writings of Ellen White, when we share Christ with people, it sometimes means having to point out what the Bible teaches about righteousness and sin.

If someone comes to you and tells you that they are willfully practicing sin and ask you what the Bible teaches about the continued practice of willful and deliberate sin, I believe the follower of Christ has an obligation to tell what he honestly understands the Bible to teach.

We have to take seriously what God has revealed to us on this subject in Ezekiel.

Ezekiel 3:16-21

And at the end of seven days, the word of the Lord came to me: [17] "Son of man, I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me. [18] If I say to the wicked, 'You shall surely die,' and you give him no warning, nor speak to warn the wicked from his wicked way, in order to save his life, that wicked person shall die for his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. [19] But if you warn the wicked, and he does not turn from his wickedness, or from his wicked way, he shall die for his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul. [20] Again, if a righteous person turns from his righteousness and commits injustice, and I lay a stumbling block before him, he shall die. Because you have not warned him, he shall die for his sin, and his righteous deeds that he has done shall not be remembered, but his blood I will require at your hand. [21] But if you warn the righteous person not to sin, and he does not sin, he shall surely live, because he took warning, and you will have delivered your soul."

[John317]

I don't think it's a question of seeking out wrong for the purpose of condemning people. Often the wrong is staring you in the face and individuals are asking you what you think of it and of what you believe the Bible teaches about it. Under those circumstances, I think the most important thing to do is tell the truth, not let my concern about how people may react keep me from telling the truth.

[LifeHiscost]

I don't think it's a question of seeking out wrong for the purpose of condemning people. Often the wrong is staring you in the face and individuals are asking you what you think of it and of what you believe the Bible teaches about it. Under those circumstances, I think the most important thing to do is tell the truth, not let my concern about how people may react keep me from telling the truth.

When we are close to the Word with a desire to give God glory, even when failure pointed out is true, we are grateful for the correction lest not having known and continued on in ignorance, we turned away from the kingdom the very ones that might have had opportunity to be saved along with we ourselves had they been aware of their needs.

God blesses!

[hch]

When we are close to the Word with a desire to give God glory, even when failure pointed out is true, we are grateful for the correction lest not having known and continued on in ignorance, we turned away from the kingdom the very ones that might have had opportunity to be saved along with we ourselves had they been aware of their needs.

God blesses!

[hch]

But I would like to ask, How dare finite human intelligences speak careless and venturesome words that will stir up the powers of hell against the saints of God, when Michael, the archangel, durst not bring against Satan a railing accusation, but said, "The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan"? It will be impossible for us to avoid difficulties and suffering. Jesus said, "Woe unto the world because of offenses! for it must needs be that offenses come; but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh!" But because offense will come, we should be careful not to stir up the natural temperament of those who love not the truth, by unwise words and by the manifestation of an unkind spirit. The truth works by love and purifies the soul . It is the privilege and duty of every child of God to have spiritual apprehension. If we are children of the light, we should walk in the light as Christ is in the light, and testify before the world, before angels and men, that the truth has power to transform human character, and to cause men to represent Christ. With David our testimony should be, "Thy gentleness hath made me great." O that we might have divine perceptions, and be able to appreciate the holy, sacred efficiency of the truth which fell from the lips of Christ! O that a permanent impression might be made upon the hearts of all! {SpTA03 25.2}

[hch]

When we are close to the Word with a desire to give God glory, even when failure pointed out is true, we are grateful for the correction lest not having known and continued on in ignorance, we turned away from the kingdom the very ones that might have had opportunity to be saved along with we ourselves had they been aware of their needs.

God blesses!

Some people are comforted by their ignorance? They do not venture out of their comfort zone. But if my research is right things are about to get interesting:

http://clubadventist.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/425907/Re_Egypt.html#Post425907