Parade Orange Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 last fall i was at a christian/health retreat for many days and met a man on fire for the LORD! amen! he is in ministry with his church reaching out to a certain sect that cannot get to church and provides a boat to take them to church in ALASKA he has such an amazing TESTIMONY how GOD saved him from a biker life of crime and booze and booze 7 years ago or so i was immediatly drawn to him! i love hearing a man GLORY IN HIM i dont see that alot i was sharing my life experience with him and told him i was gay and celibate and have a buddy who is the same and the subject of gay marriage/civil unions came up i was very candid and spoke quietly that i have friends who want to get married/civil unions uh oh!!!!!!!!!!!!!! he got real nasty about me favouring my friends rights in america and got pushy about it WHY WHY WHY am i willing to let gays marry/civil unions when i myself dont want to partner up with a gay man myself he was suspicious! why do i want my friends to have rights? u can bleeeeed how much u love JESUS u can build a boat to take the people to church u can have a LIFE ALTERING encounter with JESUS! but! it doesnt mean anything to homosexuals if u look at them as less than human Quote All progress in the Spiritual Life is knowing and Loving GOD"there is non upon earth that I desire besides YOU" PS 73:25That perspective changes EVERYTHING-suffering and adversity are the means that makes us hungry for GOD. Disapointments will wean us away wordly occupations. Even sin(when repented of) becomes a mechanism to push us closer to HIM as we experience His Love and Forgiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overaged Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 but! it doesnt mean anything to homosexuals if u look at them as less than human Very true. I like your outlook. God is bound to bless any effort to treat everyone as human beings Quote "People [rarely] see...the bright light which is in the clouds..." (Job 37:21)"I cannot know why suddenly the stormshould rage so fiercely round me in it's wrathBut this I know: God watches all my pathAnd I can trust""God helps us to draw strength from the storm" - OveragedFaith makes things possible; it does not make them easy, Steps To Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 I guess you had to be there,,,, to see where the "biker" christian was coming from with gay folk. I'll take your word for it, his attitude was placing them on a less than human scale. Not good! Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't. I oppose gay marriage, I can do that with tears in my eyes and great compassion, but I still oppose it. That doesn't mean I think gays are less than human. There are lots of "rights" people are denied for various reasons. Like civil and criminal laws "restrict" some rights. But we need rules and laws for a community's well being, safety and the good of society. Any number of laws, it could be argued, are to restrictive, not needed or out dated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parade Orange Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 i saw he was placing them on less than human scale cause he was berating me why ME would stand up for their rights and not ME getting a darn thing out of it! whats in it for ME he pushed! u know that kinda thinking! we vote according to whats in it for MEEEEEEEEEEEE build a prison in my area! no no its about me and my sense of comfort and security build a school cause we have more kids than places to educate them! no no no its about MY pocketbook! me darling MOI! I myself not u MEEEEEEEEEEEEE! not others I I I I ! u know! the christian creed :love myself love me with all my heart strength mind and soul! me! protect my religious institution protect me from others who disagree with me protect my theology my understanding of GOD its all about me! i told him i am for them having their rights even though i wont get something out of it myself confused the blank out of him Quote All progress in the Spiritual Life is knowing and Loving GOD"there is non upon earth that I desire besides YOU" PS 73:25That perspective changes EVERYTHING-suffering and adversity are the means that makes us hungry for GOD. Disapointments will wean us away wordly occupations. Even sin(when repented of) becomes a mechanism to push us closer to HIM as we experience His Love and Forgiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overaged Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 i saw he was placing them on less than human scale cause he was berating me why ME would stand up for their rights and not ME getting a darn thing out of it! whats in it for ME he pushed! u know that kinda thinking! we vote according to whats in it for MEEEEEEEEEEEE build a prison in my area! no no its about me and my sense of comfort and security build a school cause we have more kids than places to educate them! no no no its about MY pocketbook! me darling MOI! I myself not u MEEEEEEEEEEEEE! not others I I I I ! u know! the christian creed :love myself love me with all my heart strength mind and soul! me! protect my religious institution protect me from others who disagree with me protect my theology my understanding of GOD its all about me! i told him i am for them having their rights even though i wont get something out of it myself confused the blank out of him Good for you bro! Excellent work! A little dose of "flabbergasting" never hurt anyone! Quote "People [rarely] see...the bright light which is in the clouds..." (Job 37:21)"I cannot know why suddenly the stormshould rage so fiercely round me in it's wrathBut this I know: God watches all my pathAnd I can trust""God helps us to draw strength from the storm" - OveragedFaith makes things possible; it does not make them easy, Steps To Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parade Orange Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 lol u funny OVERAGED actually my intenT wasnt to flabbergast him i was sharing myself cause i wanted to connect and to fellowship with a man of GOD Quote All progress in the Spiritual Life is knowing and Loving GOD"there is non upon earth that I desire besides YOU" PS 73:25That perspective changes EVERYTHING-suffering and adversity are the means that makes us hungry for GOD. Disapointments will wean us away wordly occupations. Even sin(when repented of) becomes a mechanism to push us closer to HIM as we experience His Love and Forgiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parade Orange Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 u make a good point that i have seen over and over again in too many christian circles being flabbergasted that GOD LOVES AND SAVES HOMOS and they didnt instantly become hetero for their own comfort Quote All progress in the Spiritual Life is knowing and Loving GOD"there is non upon earth that I desire besides YOU" PS 73:25That perspective changes EVERYTHING-suffering and adversity are the means that makes us hungry for GOD. Disapointments will wean us away wordly occupations. Even sin(when repented of) becomes a mechanism to push us closer to HIM as we experience His Love and Forgiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overaged Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 u make a good point that i have seen over and over again in too many christian circles being flabbergasted that GOD LOVES AND SAVES HOMOS and they didnt instantly become hetero for their own comfort Ha ha! Well I can't help it - I have to say it again. A little flabbergasting in this way won't hurt anyone either! It's great to read your enthusiasm for Jesus in your posts! Quote "People [rarely] see...the bright light which is in the clouds..." (Job 37:21)"I cannot know why suddenly the stormshould rage so fiercely round me in it's wrathBut this I know: God watches all my pathAnd I can trust""God helps us to draw strength from the storm" - OveragedFaith makes things possible; it does not make them easy, Steps To Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Gay marriage is no more of a threat to my religious liberty than the marriage of athiest, pagens, ect. Of course our religious liberty departments disagree with this sentiment. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overaged Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Originally Posted By: shelly Gay marriage is no more of a threat to my religious liberty than the marriage of athiest, pagens, ect. Of course our religious liberty departments disagree with this sentiment. I have always thought that if it's "gay" then it's not "marriage;" it is something else. I do however see the the point that Parade Orange is making, and I have no trouble agreeing with his desire to support others who see this differently. Quote "People [rarely] see...the bright light which is in the clouds..." (Job 37:21)"I cannot know why suddenly the stormshould rage so fiercely round me in it's wrathBut this I know: God watches all my pathAnd I can trust""God helps us to draw strength from the storm" - OveragedFaith makes things possible; it does not make them easy, Steps To Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 I don't see gay marriage as a threat to my religious liberty. A Catholic adoption agency is forced to place children with gay couples or close its doors. Is that not an issue of religious liberty? Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overaged Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Originally Posted By: John317 I don't see gay marriage as a threat to my religious liberty. A Catholic adoption agency is forced to place children with gay couples or close its doors. Is that not an issue of religious liberty? Yes; I think that is. Quote "People [rarely] see...the bright light which is in the clouds..." (Job 37:21)"I cannot know why suddenly the stormshould rage so fiercely round me in it's wrathBut this I know: God watches all my pathAnd I can trust""God helps us to draw strength from the storm" - OveragedFaith makes things possible; it does not make them easy, Steps To Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 WHY WHY WHY am i willing to let gays marry/civil unions when i myself dont want to partner up with a gay man myself I have two issues with gay marriage. The most important is its infringement on religious liberty. If gay marriage laws were drafted in such a way to protect religious liberty I would be much more willing to support them. My second issue, which is not as important, is immigration. The average length of a heterosexual marriage that ends in divorce is 11 years. (of course the marriages that don't end in divorce are much longer.) The average length of a gay marriage or partnership is about 6 years. However if gays were allowed to marry foreign nationals and bring them to the US as heterosexuals do. Many could change spouses every two years and we would have a steady flow of homosexuals coming into the country. I am not sure what impact that would have on society as the percentage of gays would continually increase over time. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators John317 Posted June 28, 2011 Moderators Share Posted June 28, 2011 Originally Posted By: John317 I don't see gay marriage as a threat to my religious liberty. A Catholic adoption agency is forced to place children with gay couples or close its doors. Is that not an issue of religious liberty? Yes, it is. If they're going to make laws allowing gay couples to marry, they need to make the laws so that people aren't punished for not placing children with gay couples. The laws should also be made so that churches and pastors aren't forced to perform those weddings. I'm afraid that churches will eventually be compelled to stop preaching or teaching that the practice of homosexuality is wrong. These rights need to be guaranteed in the laws. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parade Orange Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 oh dear the gays coming into our country by the boatloads! everywhere u go u will see gay this and gay that cupcake shops and wig stores sprouting up like weeds men with pearls women in plaid there might even be more parades and glitter on the streets and the christian church can rise with the unction of the HOLY SPIRIT and love and save and heal more homosexuals in our fair free country Quote All progress in the Spiritual Life is knowing and Loving GOD"there is non upon earth that I desire besides YOU" PS 73:25That perspective changes EVERYTHING-suffering and adversity are the means that makes us hungry for GOD. Disapointments will wean us away wordly occupations. Even sin(when repented of) becomes a mechanism to push us closer to HIM as we experience His Love and Forgiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted June 28, 2011 Members Share Posted June 28, 2011 Could someone please explain to me just *why* it is necessary for people to know someone is gay? Why do gays flaunt their "gaiety" in parades? Have a legal civil union, and be done with it. Personally, I kinda resent having someone push their sexual orientation in my face, be it gay or straight. It's really none of my business, and I'd like to keep it that way. Quote Pam      Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overaged Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Could someone please explain to me just *why* it is necessary for people to know someone is gay? Why do gays flaunt their "gaiety" in parades? Have a legal civil union, and be done with it. Personally, I kinda resent having someone push their sexual orientation in my face, be it gay or straight. It's really none of my business, and I'd like to keep it that way. Well said Pam Quote "People [rarely] see...the bright light which is in the clouds..." (Job 37:21)"I cannot know why suddenly the stormshould rage so fiercely round me in it's wrathBut this I know: God watches all my pathAnd I can trust""God helps us to draw strength from the storm" - OveragedFaith makes things possible; it does not make them easy, Steps To Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted June 28, 2011 Moderators Share Posted June 28, 2011 Are you questioning the genuineness of this man's relationship with God because he doesn't see gay rights the way you do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight II Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Biblically, any state that supports homosexuality and promotes it receives Gods wrath. Since when does a state stop being answerable to God? Can we as Christians say that once a "government" is formed, God has no right to judge that state? As God does not condone state sponsored homosexuality, why should we argue that the state should have the right to do so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight II Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 If God says it is wrong. Then it is wrong. Any state that then supports and promotes that is clearly in defiance of Gods Law. So the idea that "religious liberty" gives us a right to sin is a false concept. At best we have a "limited time of liberty" to accept or reject the gospel. But why do we think that the "option" to choose sin is the same as the "right" to choose sin. And that we should actively encourage people with the idea that they have the "right" to choose sin? That in fact is incorrect. No one has the "right". So arguing that someone has "human rights" to sin, is a false argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abelisle Posted June 28, 2011 Author Members Share Posted June 28, 2011 I think the discussion has gone off track. This is about whether homosexuals have the same civil rights as heterosexuals? This isn't about condoning sin. I find it ironic that we speak constantly of loving the sinner but not the sin, yet it seems that homosexuals aren't really welcome in our churches and I personally don't know of any specific ministeries aimed at them? So, maybhe we have have got hung up on semantics? Maybe we should be addressing the "Public Affairs" part of our religious liberties message? Alex Quote We are our worst enemy - sad but true. Â http://abelisle.blogspot.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted June 28, 2011 Members Share Posted June 28, 2011 My second issue, which is not as important, is immigration. The average length of a heterosexual marriage that ends in divorce is 11 years. (of course the marriages that don't end in divorce are much longer.) The average length of a gay marriage or partnership is about 6 years. However if gays were allowed to marry foreign nationals and bring them to the US as heterosexuals do. Many could change spouses every two years and we would have a steady flow of homosexuals coming into the country. I am not sure what impact that would have on society as the percentage of gays would continually increase over time. I guess I've been misinformed all these years, about gay unions! Had heard quite a few years ago that gays have a better rate for staying together than heteros did! This was one of the major reasons they said to allow gay marriage, or at least the argument. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted June 28, 2011 Members Share Posted June 28, 2011 I think the discussion has gone off track. This is about whether homosexuals have the same civil rights as heterosexuals?This isn't about condoning sin. I find it ironic that we speak constantly of loving the sinner but not the sin, yet it seems that homosexuals aren't really welcome in our churches and I personally don't know of any specific ministeries aimed at them? So, maybhe we have have got hung up on semantics? Maybe we should be addressing the "Public Affairs" part of our religious liberties message? Alex ab you know that always happens no matter what. Someone mentions one thing and than this and off we go. I personally have no problem with discussions going where they lead, even if they seem to go off topic. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted June 28, 2011 Administrators Share Posted June 28, 2011 I know a couple of women who have lived together for as long as I can remember. I have no idea whether they are gay or not, but they are raising a Romanian girl that one of them adopted. they have just never married, singles who are active members of the Adventist church. Sometimes I wonder whether they should be entitled to some kind of benefit for their long-term relationship, civilly-speaking. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted June 28, 2011 Members Share Posted June 28, 2011 I know a couple of women who have lived together for as long as I can remember. I have no idea whether they are gay or not, but they are raising a Romanian girl that one of them adopted. they have just never married, singles who are active members of the Adventist church. Sometimes I wonder whether they should be entitled to some kind of benefit for their long-term relationship, civilly-speaking. I definitely agree with you. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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