144,000 Sealed

[Truth Files]

Revelation

7:1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.

7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,

7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

These 144,000 sealed ethnic Israelites are a unique group composed of 12,000 from each of 12 tribes of the children of Israel. They are ethnic Israelites of the nation.

Many theories have been presented describing this group. Some Gentile Christian denominations have identified themselves as the 144,000 and there are those who advocate a general application which includes all believers.

Neither of these interpretations is correct. The 144,000 are 12,000 from each of the 12 tribes of the children of national Israel, they are believers, and they will be present during the coming tribulation period .... the Lord's hour of trial against an unbelieving world. [Revelation 7:1-8; 14:1-7]

These will be the first converts [fruits] of the Lord's during the coming tribulation period of His wrath. The link to their Israelite ancestry is given describing the practice of idolatry that prevailed where the kings of Israel [like Solomon] were led to worship foreign gods by women .... these 144,000 will not follow this course during the tribulation period, but will be loyal to the Lord.

These are the first part of the "many" of the remnant of believing Israelites noted in Daniel 9:27 .... it is the Lord who will confirm the covenant of the 70 weeks of years decreed for Israel by executing the 70th week and the 144,000 will be His first converts during the coming tribulation period [the time of "Jacob's trouble"] .... they will follow Him where ever He directs them proclaming the gospel of His soon coming kingdom on the earth [Mathew 24:14; Revelation 6:2; 7:1-8; 14:1-7]

Their mission will begin in Israel at the onset of the tribulation period [the 70th week decreed for the nation] and will reach other Middle East nations and beyond .... just after MBG's great city is destroyed at the very beginning of the tribulation period [Revelation 14:8; 17:16-18; 18:1-16] .... this great city of the gentiles will have already been destroyed as the 144,000 begin their mission [the land mass where this great city once stood will be revisited by the Lord and broken into 3rds during the battle of Armageddon [Revelation 16:17-21]

By the middle of the week they are seen in Jerusalem with the Lord [He will be present, but not seen by the world until the end of the period] and they will take the gospel to the whole world during the tribulation period. [Revelation 14:6-7]

There are a few direct explanations about this group, their purpose, and their activities appearing in the Book of Revelation, but no where else in scripture. These servants of the Lord are sealed with His protection.

Their sealing will include protection against the attacks by the angels of the abyss during the 5th trumpet judgment and all other dangers during the 70th week including the Lord's judgments and those instigated by satan and his agents. [Revelation 9:4]

They will also be the first fruits [first believers] of the tribulation period and will enter the Lord's millennial kingdom as surviving mortals. [Matthew 24:29-31; Revelation 14]

The 144,000 Israelites are not to be confused with the church [the 24 elders and the great multitude] which is composed of both Israelite and Gentile believers [Old and New Testament periods]. These will dwell in heaven during the Lord's coming time of judgment upon the earth [Revelation 4:4; 5:5-10; 7:9-17; 11:1; 12:12; 19:1-14; and 20:4 (those on thrones)]

Both of these groups will be protected from the judgments of the tribulation as the result of the Lord's immortalization of the church and the sealing of the 144,000 mortal Israelites on the earth. The Lord will enter the material world unexpectedly as a thief and execute both of these events. [1Corinthians 15; 1Thessalonians 4; Matthew 25:1-13; Revelation 3:10; 18:4; 7:1-8]

The 144,000 sealed Israelites will be set apart from all other unsealed mortals who will experience the tribulation. They will be the only living believers [first fruits of redemption] on earth at the beginning of the 70th week just after the church is taken by the Lord to heaven.

There will be other unsealed humans who will become believers during the tribulation and, but not many [most humans will not repent]. The Lord will resurrect those believers who die physically by beheading [martyred] at the end of the tribulation period. [Revelation 20:4 (those beheaded)]

All believers who remain alive [survive the tribulation] will enter His earthly kingdom as mortals. He will gather and sort out these believers from all of the humans left in the nations of the world just after the coming tribulation period. [Matthew 24:29-31; 25:31-46]

The "elect" will consist of believing Israelites [His brethren] and the sheep will be the believing Gentiles. These will all be mortals who will enter and populate His worldwide millennial kingdom which will last for 1,000 years.

The rest of the survivors will be unbelieving [goats] who will not enter the kingdom, but will be cast off into the outer darkness.

All unbelievers will be resurrected [the second type of resurrection to the second death] to face judgment and elimination. Their names will not be found in the Lord's book of life. [Revelation 20:6-15]

This is the resurrection that leads to the second death. The first resurrection type is the resurrection to life. The Lord was the first to experience this type of resurrection, the church will be next at His second advent to immortalize the believer, and the tribulation martyrs will be resurrected at the end of the period. [1Corinthians 15:22-58; Revelation 20:4 (those beheaded)]

There will also be a believing Israelite remnant who will be living in the land of Israel during Israel's defeat at the hands of the little horn [satan's beast].

It is these who will flee into the Jordanian wilderness when they see the abomination of desolation standing in the holy place [temple mount].

Their escape route will be along a great rift valley that is formed by the Lord who will split the Mount of Olives to the north and to the south. This event is recorded in Zechariah 14, Matthew 24:15-16, and Revelation 12.

These will be kept from the reaches of Abaddon-Apollyon [the beast in the little horn] whose armies will occupy and rule the nation of Israel for 42 months [1,260 days]. [Revelation 11:2; 13:5]

This Israelite remnant will receive the Lord as their Messiah during the tribulation period and will enter and populate His coming kingdom on the earth as mortals at the end of the end of it.

This remnant is not to be confused with the sealed 144,000 Israelites who will spread the gospel of the kingdom. The 144,000 will be active during the entire tribulation period. First to Israel, and then to the entire world. [Matthew 24:14; Revelation 14:1-7]

A more comprehensive understanding of the purpose of the 144,000 Israelites can be developed by researching Revelation for the Lord's continuous provision of individual salvation during the tribulation.

The coming tribulation period [the Lord's hour of trial] experienced by Israel and the nations will be a very confusing and perplexing time with regard to the events that will be taking place which will be very difficult for humans to understand and experience.

The Lord will provide a very strong measure of the truth about what is happening in proportion to the confusion, deception, and the judgments during the period.

The first seal that He opens is the symbol of the white horse which depicts one of six themes [seals] that will be characteristic of the conditions of the tribulation period. [Revelation 6:1-2]

The symbol of the white horse represents an ongoing communication of the truth about the Lord, personal salvation, and His soon coming 1,000 year earthly kingdom which will emerge in the wake of the destruction of human self rule.

This activity will begin at the onset of the Lord's hour of trial and will continue throughout the tribulation period. The white horse is the symbol of the Lord's conquering salvation.

The 144,000 will be a powerful force that the Lord will use to continue spreading the gospel of the kingdom and of individual salvation to an unbelieving world during the tribulation period.

They will also serve as an inspiration for those believers who will be present during the tribulation period. Many of these will be martyred for their faith. [Revelation 6:9; 14:13; 15:2; 20:4 (those beheaded)]

An angel will appear having the everlasting gospel that will be preached to all that live on the earth during the coming tribulation period. This angel will appear at the beginning of the period and the 144,000 Israelites will begin their mission in Israel and then will reach the whole world. [Matthew 24:14; Revelation 7; 14]

The message will be to fear and worship the Lord, that His judgment is in process, and that His visible appearance to establish His Kingdom is at hand. He said that this gospel of the kingdom will be preached to the whole world just before His visible return.

The 144,000 are seen by John on Mount Zion [in Jerusalem] with the Lord [the world will not see Him until just after the tribulation period is over]. Their sealing will take place just before the beginning of the tribulation period.

The Lord will be present during the entire period of His hour of trial [He will not be seen by he world during this time frame] and He will lead the 144,000. He opens the seals, controls all of the judgment events of the period, and His visible appearance to the world is scheduled immediately after the tribulation period.

The Lord can have an invisible presence or a visible presence in relation to His involvement with the material world. Scripture records events and evidence of this unique ability at His first coming. He will function in the same manner during His involvement at the time of the end.

He can be present and invisible to humans during one encounter, and visible and present in another. He will be present and invisible during the tribulation period, and then visible to the world when He appears at the end of it.

Heaven is not a place in some far off corner of outer space .... it is a state of existence which allows for optional entry or exit of the material universe.

There is a great deal of confusion concerning the event of the Lord returning from heaven visibly at the end of the tribulation period. Some interpret this as nullifying the possibility of His invisible presence for involvement in the events of His hour of trial that will lead up to His visible appearance at the end of it.

His first action will be His unannounced and sudden invisible presence as a "thief" to immortalize dead and living believers of today's church. This action will take place just before the day of the Lord begins .... His judgment of an unbelieving world, and beyond.

The day of The Lord is not just one 24 hour day when He appears visibly to the world. His "day" will include bringing man's day [human rule] to a close at the end of this present age first .... and then He will establish millennial kingdom on the earth.

The primary mission of the 144,000 Israelites will be to communicate the message of personal salvation and the Lord's soon coming earthly kingdom.

[Lysimachus]

Instead of creating new topics, why not take out that time to deal with the challenges and objections I have posed against you in this thread:

http://clubadventist.com/forum/ubbthread...html#Post461640 ?

I'm still waiting for a response Truth Files. As I have pointed out, you are emanating induced Jesuit interpretations into these texts. You make the texts say what you want them to say, but you completely ignore the "signifying" nature of the book of Revelation (1:1).

[Musicman1228]

Truth Files said, "These 144,000 sealed ethnic Israelites are a unique group composed of 12,000 from each of 12 tribes of the children of Israel. They are ethnic Israelites of the nation."

This one sentence negates everything that followed it because as the premise for the entire writing it is fatally flawed.

The 144,000 CANNOT be ethnic Jews because Jesus took the Kingdom of Heaven away from the Jews and gave it to another people. The Jewish nation became just like any other nation IN the world when they rejected Jesus Christ as their Bridegroom. At the end of the 490 years prophecy in Dan. 9:24 which ended in 33 AD Israel was no longer the 'chosen people' of God.

The 144,000 come out of the NEW Kingdom of Heaven (the Third Kingdom) because Israel FELL two times which sealed their end.

Note the statement by God which immediately follows the revealing of the identity of the 144,000 in Rev.14:1-5.

Another angel, a second, followed, saying, “Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great, she who made all nations drink the wine of the passion of her sexual immorality.” Rev. 14:8.

Babylon is the Great City Jerusalem, which fell two times; the first sent the nation of Israel into captivity into the nation of the head of Gold-Babylon (not listed as 'the Great'), and the second time they fell is when they rejected Jesus as their Bridegroom at the end of the 490 years.

This New Kingdom of Heaven is seen in Dan. 2:44-45 and could not be literal Israel because it is cut out of the mountain in Heaven DURING the time of the FEET and 10 TOES. If it was literal Israel this Kingdom would have to have been created during the time before literal Babylon, when God took Israel out of Egypt.

Therefore, as previously stated, the 144,000 cannot possibly be all ethnic Jews. Now certainly there might be some ethnic Jews within them, but those people would be Born Again into the Kingdom of God just as everyone that is in God's Kingdom.

[Lysimachus]

Truth Files said, "These 144,000 sealed ethnic Israelites are a unique group composed of 12,000 from each of 12 tribes of the children of Israel. They are ethnic Israelites of the nation."

This one sentence negates everything that followed it because as the premise for the entire writing it is fatally flawed.

The 144,000 CANNOT be ethnic Jews because Jesus took the Kingdom of Heaven away from the Jews and gave it to another people. The Jewish nation became just like any other nation IN the world when they rejected Jesus Christ as their Bridegroom. At the end of the 490 years prophecy in Dan. 9:24 which ended in 33 AD Israel was no longer the 'chosen people' of God.

The 144,000 come out of the NEW Kingdom of Heaven (the Third Kingdom) because Israel FELL two times which sealed their end.

Note the statement by God which immediately follows the revealing of the identity of the 144,000 in Rev.14:1-5.

Another angel, a second, followed, saying, “Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great, she who made all nations drink the wine of the passion of her sexual immorality.” Rev. 14:8.

Babylon is the Great City Jerusalem, which fell two times; the first sent the nation of Israel into captivity into the nation of the head of Gold-Babylon (not listed as 'the Great'), and the second time they fell is when they rejected Jesus as their Bridegroom at the end of the 490 years.

This New Kingdom of Heaven is seen in Dan. 2:44-45 and could not be literal Israel because it is cut out of the mountain in Heaven DURING the time of the FEET and 10 TOES. If it was literal Israel this Kingdom would have to have been created during the time before literal Babylon, when God took Israel out of Egypt.

Therefore, as previously stated, the 144,000 cannot possibly be all ethnic Jews. Now certainly there might be some ethnic Jews within them, but those people would be Born Again into the Kingdom of God just as everyone that is in God's Kingdom.

Well said musicman. All good, except for your faulty 458 starting date (which I have learned over years cannot work no matter how hard one tries--the math fails every time), but aside from that, it's all good. :)

[Dr. Rich]

Can you show what is wrong with the date of 457 or 458 as the starting point, please?

[Lysimachus]

Can you show what is wrong with the date of 457 or 458 as the starting point, please?

I responded to your question here so we can put the discussion in the right topic:

http://www.clubadventist.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/462130/Re_70_x_7.html#Post462130

[jasd]

Quote:

Quote: Truth Files

These 144,000 sealed ethnic Israelites are a unique group composed of 12,000 from each of 12 tribes of the children of Israel. They are ethnic Israelites of the nation.

Quote:

Quote:Musicman 1228

This one sentence negates everything that followed it because as the premise for the entire writing it is fatally flawed.

The 144,000 CANNOT be ethnic Jews...

You’ve conflated “ethnic Israelites” with “ethnic Jews”. Although Jews are Israelites – not all Israelites are Jews. Gad, Asher, Simeon, Joseph, Manassas, etc – were never and are not now Jews. Moreover,

according to the Jewish historian Koestler – more than 90% of Jews who identify themselves as Jews today are not bloodline ethnic Jews.

Supposedly, we will have to wait until DNA testing is economically feasible before universal testing becomes commonplace.

Riddles wrapped in mysteries inside enigmas... There is much of Bible prophecy that will only be understood in the absolute ending of the age.

[Dr. Rich]

Ya, I think we all know this. But thanks anyway.

[Aliensanctuary]

Quote:

These 144,000 sealed ethnic Israelites are a unique group composed of 12,000 from each of 12 tribes of the children of Israel. They are ethnic Israelites of the nation.

or, genetic descendents of Jacob. We may not be able to determine this, but the LORD can, and will. Some denominations, whose members are unrelated genetically to Jacob, may fancy themselves as comprising the 144K, thus making the author of Rev a liar. The 144K will just be one of many surprises most, if not all, religions will face. Their errant doctrines will have misled them all.

[Truth Files]

"Supposedly, we will have to wait until DNA testing is economically feasible before universal testing becomes commonplace"

>The Lord does not need DNA testing .... and He obviously already knows who the 144,000 children of Israel will be for His selection

>Many proprietary professing christian movements have claimed membership of the 144,000 .... JWs, SDAs, Mormons, MSOG movements, etc.

>But these 144,000 will be of the children of national Israel just as Revelation 7:1-8; 14:1-7 tells .... the first believers [first fruits] of a remnant part of Israel during the coming tribulation period [Matthew 24:21]

>These will be mortals who will preach the gospel of the Lord's coming millennial kingdom on the earth [Matthew 24:14] and they will need the sealing for protection from the wiles of the tribulation period [Revelation 7:1-3; 9:4]

[jasd]

Quote:

Quote: Truth Files

These 144,000 sealed ethnic Israelites are...

Quote:

Quote:Musicman 1228

The 144,000 CANNOT be ethnic Jews...

Quote:

Quote:jasd

You’ve conflated “ethnic Israelites” with “ethnic Jews”. Although Jews are Israelites – not all Israelites are Jews. Gad, Asher, Simeon, Joseph, Manassas, etc – were never and are not now Jews.

>>Ya, I think we all know this. But thanks anyway.<<

Guess my cognition lost its ignition – more fool me

[jasd]

>>We may not be able to determine this, but the LORD can, and will.<<

Indeed, the LORD can and will; however, indications are that we will also be able to determine this – one day – perhaps, sooner than later.

There is DNA testing going on right now – seeking Cohens – to serve in the ‘third’ Temple, which interested parties are planning to build.

>>Their errant doctrines will have misled them all.<<

Probably, but they cannot accept that.

[Dr. Rich]

How come people read Rev. 1:1 and don't see that Jesus gave this information to be understood only by the 144k? When one of the 144k tells you something perhaps one should take heed!

[jasd]

>>How come people read Rev. 1:1 and don't see that Jesus gave this information to be understood only by the 144k?<<

How do you make the leap from “servant” to “144,000”?

Do you not recall that Gd called Nabuchadnezzar His servant? Seems that Gd’s idea of servant is rather encompassing, yes?

>>When one of the 144k tells you something perhaps one should take heed!<<

One of the 144,000? Mebbe, you're the one to ask about the virginal status of the 144,000...?

So, what tribe is yours?

[phkrause]

>>How come people read Rev. 1:1 and don't see that Jesus gave this information to be understood only by the 144k?<<

How do you make the leap from “servant” to “144,000”?

Do you not recall that Gd called Nabuchadnezzar His servant? Seems that Gd’s idea of servant is rather encompassing, yes?

>>When one of the 144k tells you something perhaps one should take heed!<<

One of the 144,000? Mebbe, you're the one to ask about the virginal status of the 144,000...?

So, what tribe is yours?

[skyblue888]

We already know who the 144k will be. They will be those who will have received the final seal at the time of the great final test, at the end of the loud cry, thus passing the scrutiny of the judgment of the living. By that time the full corn of Christ's character will be in the ear and they will be prepared to go through the time of Jacob's trouble and be translated without seeing death.

In order to become a member of the 144k one must first receive both the early and latter rain which will in turn enable him/her to take part in giving the loud cry to the world. This is the first seal. It is a settling into the truth, both intellectually and spiritually so that he/she cannot be moved. Then comes the judgment of the living at the end of the loud cry. None but those who successfully pass the scrutiny of this judgment can be numbered among the 144k.

"When the mission of the Gospel is completed, the judgment will accomplish the work of separation... When the work of the Gospel is completed, there immediately follows the separation between the good and the evil, and the destiny of each class is forever fixed." C.O.L.123.

Then this sentence will be pronounced:

"He that is unjust, let him be unjust still; and he that is filthy, let him be filthy still; and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still; and he that is holy, let him be holy still." Rev.22:11.

This is the final seal.

sky

[jasd]

>>the time of Jacob's trouble<<

Curious. Who, specifically, do you suppose are those of Jacob - who will go through such trouble?

I propose that they are of the tribes of Ephraim and Manassas - because although all the progeny of Jacob/Israel were Israelites - Jacob singularly blessed the sons of Joseph by pronouncing his birthgiven name upon them. The were by default already Israelites...

Those who bear his birthgiven name will be the crux of those who go through the time of Jacob's trouble.

...Ephraim and Manassas, the American and the British peoples (including Britain's former colonists) are, specifically, the sons of Jacob - two sister tribes.

[Sonny]

Read

[Truth Files]

"What Bible do you use?—mine doesn’t have a verse 19."

Neither does mine?

I have a question .... if there are only 144,000 who are "bond servants" what about the rest of the million or so SDA membership today .... is there a pecking order?

And what about the defilment by women that these exclusive bond servants seem to escape .... how does this work?

Who are the women and how do the servants avoid them?

... and it does seem strange that there are only 144,000 ..... does this mean that very few have made the grade since 1844, or are these just those living and worthy at a specified time?

And what about the JW organization claiming the position of the 144,000 .... who is right and who is wrong? .... or will the honor be shared with the SDA?

I also wonder about tribal identification .... how does an SDA know which tribe of the 12 that they generate from?

[John317]

And what about the JW organization claiming the position of the 144,000 .... who is right and who is wrong? .... or will the honor be shared with the SDA?

The position of the JW organization and the view of SDAs about the 144,000 aren't even similar. JWs believe the 144,000 are all spirit beings who go directly to heaven after death. They believe that number is almost completely made up, and that they are the only people who have a "heavenly hope." Jehovah's Witness have no valid biblical evidence for this belief.

SDAs don't think anything like this. SDAs do not all agree exactly alike in regard to the 144,000. We don't have an official belief on the topic, at least not in their details.

[John317]

I also wonder about tribal identification .... how does an SDA know which tribe of the 12 that they generate from?

They aren't literal Jews, so your question is based on a false assumption.

[Truth Files]

"They aren't literal Jews, so your question is based on a false assumption"

How do you know this for a fact? ..... the scripture states of all of the tribes of the children of Israel

The Lord's church is never described by tribal associations

You say they are not literal Jews .... and you have to make this assumption

[Truth Files]

JW's claim they are the 144,000 and always have .... this ruse was taught by Charles Russell

Is it not true that the SDA claims the same?

[Aliensanctuary]

Seal, according to Strong's:

to stamp (with a signet or private mark) for security or preservation

a stamp impressed as a mark of genuinness, or protection from fraud

Looks like this will be a visible, readily identifiable mark of God's design, making its bearers an easy target. It might have a twelve or a seven of something, maybe stars. Maybe it's the logo, or brand, of the Kingdom of God, used to indicate his ownership.

[Musicman1228]

"They aren't literal Jews, so your question is based on a false assumption"

How do you know this for a fact? ..... the scripture states of all of the tribes of the children of Israel

The Lord's church is never described by tribal associations

You say they are not literal Jews .... and you have to make this assumption

They are not literal Jews because the nation of Israel is no longer the Kingdom of Heaven, they are no longer God's 'chosen' people. They lost that title at the end of 33 CE after they rejected their King, and participated in putting Him on the cross. The 70 weeks prophecy of Dan. 9:24 was a probation period for Israel to accomplish what God set out for them to accomplish, and at the end of that probationary period in 33 CE the Trusteeship of the Covenant was removed from them, to be given to another people who would bear the fruit of the Kingdom of Heaven.

The people of the Covenant are always the Kingdom of Heaven. When Israel rejected the Covenant God took away their part in the Kingdom of Heaven.

The prophecy in Rev. 7 that speaks of the 144,000 coming from all the tribes of Israel is speaking of the Kingdom of Heaven NOT literal Israel which no longer exists, therefore it must be speaking of the 'new' Kingdom of Heaven out of which the 144,000 come.

Note that the table of contents of the Tribes of Israel is different in Rev. 7 than it is in Exodus, and is also different than the names of the Tribes that came out of Egypt. This is another indication that it is not the same Israel as Ancient Israel.