A New Denomination Not Needed - SDA Church is not Babylon

[mark1217]

A New Denomination Not Needed

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You will take passages in the Testimonies that speak of the close of probation, of the shaking among God’s people, and you will talk of a coming out from this people of a purer, holier people that will arise. Now all this pleases the enemy.... Should many accept the views you advance, and talk and act upon them, we would see one of the greatest fanatical excitements that has ever been witnessed among Seventh-day Adventists. This is what Satan wants.—Selected Messages 1:179 (1890). {LDE 51.1}

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The Lord has not given you a message to call the Seventh-day Adventists Babylon, and to call the people of God to come out of her. All the reasons you may present cannot have weight with me on this subject, because the Lord has given me decided light that is opposed to such a message.... {LDE 51.2}

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I know that the Lord loves His church. It is not to be disorganized or broken up into independent atoms. There is not the least consistency in this; there is not the least evidence that such a thing will be.—Selected Messages 2:63, 68, 69 (1893). {LDE 51.3}

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I tell you, my brethren, the Lord has an organized body through whom He will work.... When anyone is drawing apart from the organized body of God’s commandment-keeping people, when he begins to weigh the church in his human scales and begins to pronounce judgment against them, then you may know that God is not leading him. He is on the wrong track.—Selected Messages 3:17, 18 (1893). {LDE 51.4}

God Will Set Everything in Order

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There is no need to doubt, to be fearful that the work will not succeed. God is at the head of the work, and He will set everything in order. If matters need adjusting at the head of the work God will attend to that, and work to right every wrong. Let us have faith that God is going to carry the noble ship which bears the people of God safely into port.—Selected Messages 2:390 (1892). {LDE 52.1}

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Has God no living church? He has a church, but it is the church militant, not the church triumphant. We are sorry that there are defective members, that there are tares amid the wheat.... Although there are evils existing in the church, and will be until the end of the world, the church in these last days is to be the light of the world that is polluted and demoralized by sin. The church, enfeebled and defective, needing to be reproved, warned, and counseled, is the only object upon earth upon which Christ bestows His supreme regard.—Testimonies to Ministers and Gospel Workers, 45, 49 (1893). {LDE 52.2}

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The bulwarks of Satan will never triumph. Victory will attend the third angel’s message. As the Captain of the Lord’s host tore down the walls of Jericho, so will the Lord’s commandment-keeping people triumph, and all opposing elements be defeated.—Testimonies to Ministers and Gospel Workers, 410 (1898). {LDE 52.3}

God Hasn't Given Any Such Message - "But the word of God came from God to me, 'Believe them not, I have not sent them!'”

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There are those who pick out from the Word of God, and also from the Testimonies, detached paragraphs or sentences that may be interpreted to suit their ideas, and they dwell upon these, and build themselves up in their own positions, when God is not leading them. Here is your danger.

You will take passages in the Testimonies that speak of the close of probation, of the shaking among God’s people, and you will talk of a coming out from this people of a purer, holier people that will arise. Now all this pleases the enemy. We should not needlessly take a course that will make differences or create dissension. We should not give the impression that if our particular ideas are not followed, it is because the ministers are lacking in comprehension and in faith, and are walking in darkness.

Your mind has been on an unnatural strain for a long time. You have much truth, precious truth, but mingled with suppositions. Your extreme ideas and strong language often destroy the effect of your best efforts. Should many accept the views you advance, and talk and act upon them, we would see one of the greatest fanatical excitements that has ever been witnessed among Seventh-day Adventists. This is what Satan wants. - 1 Selected Messages, p.179

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Those who have proclaimed the Seventh-day Adventist Church as Babylon, have made use of the Testimonies in giving their position a seeming support; but why is it that they did not present that which for years has been the burden of my message—the unity of the church? Why did they not quote the words of the angel, “Press together, press together, press together”? Why did they not repeat the admonition and state the principle, that “in union there is strength, in division there is weakness”? It is such messages as these men have borne that divide the church, and put us to shame before the enemies of truth; and in such messages is plainly revealed the specious working of the great deceiver, who would hinder the church from attaining unto perfection in unity. These teachers follow the sparks of their own kindling, move according to their own independent judgment, and cumber the truth with false notions and theories. They refuse the counsel of their brethren, and press on in their own way until they become just what Satan would desire to have them—unbalanced in mind. {TM 56.1}

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“My brother, I learn that you are taking the position that the Seventh-day Adventist Church is Babylon, and that all that would be saved must come out of her. You are not the only man the devil has deceived in this matter. For the last forty years, one man after another has arisen, claiming that the Lord has sent him with the same message; but let me tell you, as I have told them, that this message you are proclaiming is one of the satanic delusions designed to create confusion among the churches. {TM 58.3}

“My brother, you are certainly off the track. The second angel’s message was to go to Babylon [the churches] proclaiming her downfall, and calling the people to come out of her. This same message is to be proclaimed the second time. ‘And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, My people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.’ {TM 59.1}

“My brother, if you are teaching that the Seventh-day Adventist Church is Babylon, you are wrong, God has not given you any such message to bear. Satan will use every mind to which he can attain access, inspiring men to originate false theories or go off on some wrong tangent, that he may create a false excitement, and thus divert souls from the true issue for this time. I presume that some may be deceived by your message, because they are full of curiosity and desire for some new thing. {TM 59.2}

“It makes me feel sad indeed that you should be deceived in any way by the suggestions of the enemy; for I know the theory that you are advocating is not truth. In advancing the ideas you do, you will do great injury to yourself and to others. Do not seek to misinterpret, and twist, and pervert the Testimonies to substantiate any such message of error. Many have passed over this ground, and have done great harm. As others have started up full of zeal to proclaim this message, again and again, I have been shown that it was not truth. {TM 60.1}

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Dear Brother M,

[Letter to one who had come to the conclusion that the Seventh-day Adventist Church had fallen into the low spiritual state described as Babylon.—Compilers.]

Your letter addressed to me was received at the beginning of the Sabbath I should advise you to attend the school, and not to leave this country until you become thoroughly settled in your mind as to what is truth. I sincerely hope that you will attend this term of school and learn all you can in regard to this message of truth that is to go to the world. {2SM 63.1}

The Lord has not given you a message to call the Seventh-day Adventists Babylon, and to call the people of God to come out of her. All the reasons you may present cannot have weight with me on this subject, because the Lord has given me decided light that is opposed to such a message. {2SM 63.2}

I do not doubt your sincerity or honesty. I have written long letters at different times to those who were accusing the church of Seventh-day Adventists of being Babylon, that they were not handling the truth. You think individuals have prejudiced my mind. If I am in this state, I am not fitted to be entrusted with the work of God. But this matter has been brought before my mind in other cases where individuals have claimed to have messages for the Seventh-day Adventist Church, of a similar character, and the word has been given me, “Believe them not.” “I have not sent them, and yet they ran.” {2SM 63.3}

A Few Cases Recalled

Elder K, [see p. 96, also Selected Messages 1:176-184.] a dying man, had his room filled with interested people, while he was at the hospital at Battle Creek. Many were deceived. The man seemed to be inspired. But the light that was given me was, “This work is not of God. Believe not the message.” {2SM 64.1}

A few years since, a man named N, of Red Bluff, California, came to me to deliver his message. He said it was the loud cry of the third angel which was to lighten the earth with his glory. He thought God had passed all the leading workers and given him the message. I attempted to show him that he was mistaken. He said Seventh-day Adventists were Babylon, and when we told him our reasons and set the matter before him, that he was in error, he had great power come upon him, and he certainly gave a loud cry We had much trouble with him; his mind became unbalanced, and he had to be placed in the insane asylum. {2SM 64.2}

One, Garmire, [see ch. 9.] advocated and published a message in regard to the loud cry of the third angel; he accused the church in a similar manner to what you are now doing. He said the leaders in the church would all fall through self-exaltation, and another class of humble men would come to the front, who would do wonderful things. This man had daughters who claimed to have visions. {2SM 64.3}

This delusion was opened to me. This is an intelligent man, of an acceptable address, and self-denying and full of zeal and earnestness, and carrying an appearance of consecration and devotion. But the word of God came from God to me, “Believe them not, I have not sent them!” {2SM 64.4}

He claimed to believe the testimonies. He claimed them to be true, and used them in the same manner you have used them to give force and appearance of truth to his claims. I told them this message was not of God; but it was deceiving the unwary. He would not be convinced. I told them the visions of his daughter [Anna] were spurious, yet these visions, he claimed, were like the visions of Sister White, testifying to the same things. This daughter was deceiving the family and several others who believed these false messages. I was shown that the young girl was not virtuous; but was corrupt {2SM 65.1}

If ever a man that I looked upon was inspired, this man certainly was; but I told him plainly his inspiration was of Satan, not of God. His message bore not the divine credentials. {2SM 65.2}

In order for him to give this message broadcast to the world, he made an honest, conscientious young man believe it to be his duty to steal the Review and Herald list. This is a State-prison crime, and the young man ran away from Battle Creek. He did not dare return to Battle Creek for some time. The time was set [by this fanatical teacher] for probation to close, and as every prediction failed, the young man saw he had been deceived, and he confessed his sin and is now an honorable member of the Battle Creek church. {2SM 65.3}

Only two years since another man, by the name of O, from Connecticut, came out with a message which he called new light in regard to the message of the third angel. This intelligent family have, through this delusion, separated from the Seventh-day Adventist Church. Because I had borne a decided testimony against this new light, so-called, in _____, Connecticut, where he lived, he opposed me and my work and testimonies. {2SM 65.4}

The father of the O children attended the Conference and Ministers’ Bible Institute held in Battle Creek; but he held himself aloof and did not harmonize with the spirit of the meeting. He left for his home, and began to leaven the little church in _____. If I had not labored in that place they might have broken up the whole church with their repudiating the truth and position of Seventh-day Adventists, and Mrs. White in particular. {2SM 65.5}

At this same time, one, Mrs. P, came from Washington, D.C., claiming to be wholly sanctified and to have the power of healing. This spirit led many to become bewildered. The same accusing spirit was with them—that is, that the church was all wrong and God was calling out a people who would work miracles. A large class of our people in Battle Creek were being severed. I was moved upon by the Spirit of God, in the night season, to write to our people in Battle Creek. {2SM 66.1}

The Message to the Laodiceans

God is leading out a people. He has a chosen people, a church on the earth, whom He has made the depositaries of His law. He has committed to them sacred trust and eternal truth to be given to the world. He would reprove and correct them. The message to the Laodiceans is applicable to Seventh-day Adventists who have had great light and have not walked in the light. It is those who have made great profession, but have not kept in step with their Leader, that will be spewed out of His mouth unless they repent. The message to pronounce the Seventh-Day Adventist Church Babylon, and call the people of God out of her, does not come from any heavenly messenger, or any human agent inspired by the Spirit of God. {2SM 66.2}

The True Witness says, “I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock; if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne” (Revelation 3:18-21). {2SM 66.3}

“I Rebuke and Chasten”

Jesus is coming in to give the individual members of the church the richest blessings, if they will open the door to Him. He does not once call them Babylon, nor ask them to come out. But He says, “As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten” (with messages of reproof and warning) (Revelation 3:19). These reproofs I am not ignorant of. I have given warnings because the Spirit of the Lord has constrained me to do so, and have uttered reproofs because the Lord has given me words of reproof. I have not shunned to declare the whole counsel of God, which has been given me for the church. {2SM 67.1}

I will say in the fear and love of God, I know the Lord has thoughts of love and mercy to restore and heal them of all their backslidings. He has a work for His church to do. They are not to be pronounced Babylon, but to be as the salt of the earth, the light of the world. They are to be the living messengers to proclaim a living message in these last days. {2SM 67.2}

[Light Fox]

Just a note: Many of the quotes you've put up are either copies of, or from the same era / context as, the ones Stan provided in an almost identical thread in this section ("Is the Church Babylon?")

You can find several of these quotes there, along with the replies of myself and some others a couple posts down. If you'd be interested in picking up where Stan left off in this thread, I'd be open to that. I'm disinclined to unneccesarily rewrite my replies to the same quotes in several threads, of course. :)

[Pastor_Chick]

dg,

I just noticed you are from Dickson, TN. I may have met you in person at some time, since I used to visit churches throughout Tennessee on Sabbaths.

I have a relatively unpleasant memory of Dickson as I chose to appear before the court there one time in-lieu of paying a fine. I had received a ticket from the TN Highway Patrol, and a judge in east TN advised me to contest it, because he thought I had a case, and the fine was a significant $100. At the hearing, when I presented my arguments, pictures, etc., the judge called for the statues and read with silence for what seemed like 15 minutes. He looked up and asked the patrolman that stopped me, "Patrolman ______, is I40 a 'controlled-access highway'?" The patrolman answered, "NO." The judge then ruled against me and said if I wished to appeal, it would require a $500 bond. I humbly paid the $100 and left town quickly.

Anyway, I used to like living in TN. I was born in Knoxville and raised there part of my early years. Most recently, I lived in Michie and the movie-famous "town" of Guys.

[Pastor_Chick]

dg,

Thank you for the response. Of course, I did not intend to sound negative about Tennessee. I have so many good memories of my life in Tennessee. It was in Tennessee that I discovered the Life of victory in Christ.

Sadly, because of the actions of the GC, I will probably never have opportunity to visit my home town, family, etc. in Tennessee. And, really, that is not such a "bad" thing since I believe in the soon coming of the Savior. I find it better to "rejoice in all things" and look forward to the "glory of YAHWEH."