Perry: "I Don't Think You Have a Heart"

[Dr. Shane]

Perry: "I Don't Think You Have a He...egal Immigrants

Quote:

"If you say that we should not educate children who come into our state for no other reason than that they've been brought their through no fault of their own, I don't think you have a heart," Perry said. "We need to be educating these children because they will become a drag on our society. I think that's what Texans wanted to do. Out of 181 members of the Texas legislature when this issue came up [there were] only four dissenting votes. This was a state issue. Texas voted on it. And I still support it today."

Perry is right on!

The parents of these "illegals" actually live in Texas. They rent apartments and houses and thus indirectly pay property taxes. They buy gasoline and thus pay gas tax. They buy stuff and thus pay sales tax. Let's face it. The parents of these "illegals" are Texas tax payers. Letting their children have in-state tuition is the right thing to do.

And look at how the state legislature voted - 177 to 4. Clearly those that understand the issue most - state legislators - supported it.

I am glad he called those cold-hearted conservatives just what they are. I am not sold on Perry as the best candidate but it is good that he stands up to all the latino hatred being stirred up by some of the radical right-wingers.

[Kyran]

How does this work? Surely if you were to try to enrol at a school you'd need to produce documents proving who you were. And if you did have documents, they'd prove that you were illegal, so you'd get deported.

Does Texas not deport illegals?

[lazarus]

I am glad he called those cold-hearted conservatives just what they are. I am not sold on Perry as the best candidate but it is good that he stands up to all the latino hatred being stirred up by some of the radical right-wingers.

When I said I'm beginning to like Perry I was only half kidding. At least Perry doesn't cave in and pander to every prejudice and crazy idea his party has. There's the spark of leadership there.

[bonnie]

Perry is right on!

The parents of these "illegals" actually live in Texas. They rent apartments and houses and thus indirectly pay property taxes. They buy gasoline and thus pay gas tax. They buy stuff and thus pay sales tax. Let's face it. The parents of these "illegals" are Texas tax payers. Letting their children have in-state tuition is the right thing to do.

[Neil D]

How does this work? Surely if you were to try to enrol at a school you'd need to produce documents proving who you were. And if you did have documents, they'd prove that you were illegal, so you'd get deported.

Does Texas not deport illegals?

the problem is the concept of "illegals"....People cheated to get around the slow immigration and get to places that have jobs. And let's face it, the jobs that they take are jobs that our fellow unemployed americans are not willing to take...And our american employers are taking advantage of the illegals to pay them less than required by law.

Now, if we were able to round up all illegals, and deport them, our economy would suffer severe food shortages [since this is where most of the illegals are being illegally employed]. And many of us here, would not get our favorite foods that we are used to....

So, let's do something about illegal immigration. Let's give the resident illegals a real chance to become legal [yes, that's puts them ahead of the legal ones, but so what? they are not here, yet.] Let's first seal up the border and also let's give all americans and legal residents a REAL identification card.

And I liked what Shane said....which means that I guess Perry, when it comes to some immagration policies, is alright...

[bonnie]

Quote:

the problem is the concept of "illegals"....People cheated to get around the slow immigration and get to places that have jobs. And let's face it, the jobs that they take are jobs that our fellow unemployed americans are not willing to take...And our american employers are taking advantage of the illegals to pay them less than required by law.

It is not a concept.It is supposed to be a law.You follow certain rules to become a citizen of this country. There are also work visa's.Our fellow unemployed americans do not need to accept jobs they don't want to do.Months and months of welfare known as extended unemployment with food stamps That and more for those already on welfare eliminate the need to do what you have to do to take care of yourself and your own.

Quote:

Now, if we were able to round up all illegals, and deport them, our economy would suffer severe food shortages since this is where most of the illegals are being illegally employed]. And many of us here, would not get our favorite foods that we are used to....

No one is talking about the impossible task of rounding up and deporting all illegals. It is offering so many incentives to become illegal.

Our economy couldn't get much worse but if you told many of those on the dole you have sixty days to find a job. To bad if it is a job you don't like temporarily you would still find your favorite foods.

Quote:

So, let's do something about illegal immigration. Let's give the resident illegals a real chance to become legal [yes, that's puts them ahead of the legal ones, but so what? they are not here, yet.] Let's first seal up the border and also let's give all americans and legal residents a REAL identification card.

We can't seal the borders remember,the food source would dry up.Thousands and thousands of the legal ones are already here.They followed the process, they worked,assimilating at least as far as necessary to be able to obtain decent jobs.

Quote:

And I liked what Shane said....which means that I guess Perry, when it comes to some immagration policies, is alright...

There are many reasons to be opposed to Perry's policies that have nothing to do with hatred or cold heartedness.Neither Perry or Shane are of such a stature in this country that to disagree with them means either hatred or cold heartedness

[Guest]

Perry wants the illegal alien vote, but in the process of trying to get it, he may lose the conservatives like myself.

[Dr. Shane]

How does this work? Surely if you were to try to enrol at a school you'd need to produce documents proving who you were.

You have to produce documents showing that you live in a school district. That can be simply a couple of bills like a power bill and a cable bill. Immigration laws are federal laws and it is not the responsibility or jurisdiction of a school district, municipality or state to enforce federal law. School districts do not ask for proof of citizenship.

Many of these children came here as children under the age of 10. They have grown up here and graduated from a Texas high school. I do not know if the colleges ask for citizenship status. I believe they just ask for residency status. If the student has graduated from a Texas high school and been attending school in Texas for three years, they get in-state tuition.

[Dr. Shane]

Illegal aliens are just that.Illegal.

[Dr. Shane]

And our American employers are taking advantage of the illegals to pay them less than required by law.

This practice is not nearly as wide-spread as many believe. Follow this logic.

An employer wants to write off his or her labor costs as a business expense. If he or she cannot write the labor costs off as a business expense, than he or she (the employer) will have to pay taxes on those costs that he or she cannot write off. If and when an employer illegally pays an employee (cash "under the table") that cannot be written off. So employers rarely do that.

Illegals normally buy stolen Social Security numbers and produce fake documents with stolen SSNs on them. The employer then thinks he or she is hiring someone who is here legally. The overwhelming majority of illegals here working are doing so with fake papers. Very very few are getting cash under the table.

Many of the jobs illegals work are in the field. They are not paid by the hour. They are paid by the quantity they harvest. The amount of money they earn is determined by the value of what they are picking. Carrots pay better than onions. Citrus pays very good. Thus the wages are market-driven. It is back-breaking work and most Americans don't want to do it. Some of the illegals do quite well in the fields and make more money during a harvest season then their American counterparts do during the same time. But it is seasonal so their annual income is still significantly under the average American.

[Dr. Shane]

Perry wants the illegal alien vote, but in the process of trying to get it, he may lose the conservatives like myself.

Are you suggesting that you may be ready to vote for Obama?

[Guest]

Originally Posted By: RLH

Perry wants the illegal alien vote, but in the process of trying to get it, he may lose the conservatives like myself.

Are you suggesting that you may be ready to vote for Obama?

...

[bonnie]

Of course we are talking about the children of illegals who never decided to come here and thus never decided to break any law.

[Dr. Shane]

Go thru the process and become a legal citizen of the US.

[bonnie]

So you agree that minors brought here illegally by their parents should be given a pathway to citizenship. Very good! I am impressed. God bless you. We need more compassionate souls that feel that way.

[Dr. Shane]

If they are adult enough to go to college they are adult enough to go thru the process. Not given "a pathway" especially designed for them.

[John317]

Lazarus, how do you think President Obama has done so far? Does he deserve another term?

[bonnie]

This is double-talk. You are losing credibility here. In order for them to go through "the process" we have to create "a pathway". You cannot say they need to go through a process that you refuse to create.

[Kyran]

School districts do not ask for proof of citizenship.

[Dr. Shane]

If they are here illegally,whether or not they have been here for years does not or should not exempt them from having to file for citizenship,whatever that process is currently.

[Dr. Shane]

If a business has a job that no one wants, they'd increase the pay (or other benefits) until someone is willing to take it

Many of these immigrants are working in commodity-based industries so their compensation is determined by the market. A farmer can only get so much money for his onions, carrots, sugar beets or oranges. The worker is paid based on the quantity they harvest. A worker can earn a good amount of money if they work hard and hustle. Most Americans do not want to work that hard. So we either let immigrants come and do the work, or the farmers find something else to grow on their land.

[bonnie]

So clearly you do not have a grasp on this subject. There is no current process. That is what many have been trying to establish for several years now but cold-hearted Republicans stand in the way. George W. Bush wanted to get this done his first year in office. When Pelosi became Speaker of the House, Bush was hopeful that he could get this accomplished with her. There is no process. There needs to be.

[bonnie]

A worker can earn a good amount of money if they work hard and hustle. Most Americans do not want to work that hard. So we either let immigrants come and do the work, or the farmers find something else to grow on their land.

And there is the rub.Take away all the props and incentives that allow one to choose to not work hard and you would see a little more hustle on the part of most Americans.

[Guest]

She's right you know...

[lazarus]

Lazarus, how do you think President Obama has done so far? Does he deserve another term?

President Obama has been too timid in his approach to the nations problems. I think he accepted to much of the rightwing flawed narrative. I think he was too optimistic about the prospects for the recovery.

Essentially the bail-outs saved the economy from depression but think we're going to get there anyway. McCain probably would not have reformed health care but we probably would have invaded Iran.

He deserves another term if he's going to take on Wall Street, break up the large banks, invest in infrastructure and have a bold vision in terms energy. He needs to stop trying to get the Tea people to like him.