Moderators Bravus Posted November 9, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 9, 2011 For any here who identify as former Adventists, this might be of interest: Quote: You are invited to participate in an online survey of former Adventists at https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/K5T52NM. The survey is designed to collect and analyze information about the circumstances, demographics, and beliefs of individuals who are no longer members of the Seventh-day Adventist church. The site also provides an opportunity to ask for a summary of the results. Please help us obtain as large a sample size as possible by reposting this invitation in places where other former Adventists might see it: your FB page or a web site, blog, or support group directed toward former Adventists. Questions or suggestions can be sent to FormerAdventistSurvey@gmail.com The survey can be done in 10-15 minutes, but I think I took nearly an hour: there are boxes for longer responses and I wrote a reasonable amount. It was a worthwhile activity for me just in terms of reflecting on my own ideas and beliefs. I think there's value in the church having a better understanding of why people leave and where they end up. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted November 9, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted November 9, 2011 The survey is nothing to do with me, by the way. I was just invited to do it. The people who made it have sent out some preliminary results to those who did it, and it's interesting to me that 85% left for doctrinal reasons, and for 74% the main thing leading to leaving was intensive Bible study... Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted November 9, 2011 Members Share Posted November 9, 2011 I checked it out, interesting to say the lest. I'm going to be interested in the results. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoAspen Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 From people I have encoutered, that have left the SDA church, doctrinal was the biggie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted November 9, 2011 Members Share Posted November 9, 2011 I'm really interested in what doctrines they mention. That will be very interesting. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted November 9, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted November 9, 2011 Yeah, if you saw the survey, participants get a chance to comment on each of the 28. It'll be fascinating to see a full report. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted November 9, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 9, 2011 I would be very curious as to which church/churches they now belong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted November 9, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted November 9, 2011 There is a question on that, too. Will report in with more when I hear more. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted November 9, 2011 Administrators Share Posted November 9, 2011 Although one doesn't need to double dare me to do a survey, I did give them my e-mail address for the results. Thanks, Bravus! Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Most who have left have joined with dissenting ministers and I could name some and I think you all could and many are now home churchers. I doubt that many gave up on God. I happen to know of many and I am one too and a home churcher. Most of us were pushed out because of our testimony that they couldn't refute. But oh yes they didn't want to take your name off the books. They disfellowshipped a few that really tore up their hair but not many. I had to have them take my name off. Bro. Gibs. 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. T. Cross Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 I was 19 when I was told my name was being removed. I have no idea if it was or not - how would I even find that out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 I was 19 when I was told my name was being removed. I have no idea if it was or not - how would I even find that out? I don't think that would be difficult to find out...write a letter to the conference or church of the last place you were a member in, I would think....Ask to see if your name were removed or if you are a current member in the church.... But be warned...they may ask you a couple of times to come back...expect this...They may encourage you to come to church.... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Most who have left have joined with dissenting ministers and I could name some and I think you all could and many are now home churchers. I doubt that many gave up on God. I happen to know of many and I am one too and a home churcher. Most of us were pushed out because of our testimony that they couldn't refute. But oh yes they didn't want to take your name off the books. They disfellowshipped a few that really tore up their hair but not many. I had to have them take my name off. Bro. Gibs. In your 80 years of associating with a family, have you ever known anyone who got along with all without ever having a disagreement? Should church be any different? Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibs Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Well Hamilton, I didn't expect that all would agree with me and when I laid scripture to show my point I became ignored. First NLP came in and I fought against that and then Lab 1,2 and 3 came in and I fought against that and then we got a pastor who preached we had to be saved in sin and I told him no way and discussed that with him face to face several times and the church for the most part were with him, I was a loner there but I assure you not with Christ. Me and another put a stop to lab 1-2-3 and then the Wednesday night prayer meetings that pastor stopped because most there were with me that now is when the Christian is to be the overcomer. Then many of them left the church and not long after that, that pastor left and another came in with the same theology and I was so disliked and shunned I eventually left and joined a home church that just had gotten organized. Independent dissenting ministries sprang up everywhere and many are still going strong. The local SDA churchs here have fallen way off in membeship and the schools they have are about to fade completly out. The need is to get back to sound doctrine of the theologies that have come in. Will it ever happen? I wish but know that it will never. I could tell you why but I don't know you and if you could receive it. I had them remove my membership, wasn't easy, they want your name on the books. My name on the books of a denominational church does not save me, My name writen on His book and not Blotted out is where it counts. I have become a fighter for the everlasting Truth as it is in Him more solid than any time in my life and He has kept me I'm sure for that very reason. My story is a long one and will drop it now as that is not important, our salvation though is. We are at the finish line and the church isn't warning any here, I hope yours is. His Blessings to all of you to find the true way everlasting. Bro. Gibs. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted November 10, 2011 Administrators Share Posted November 10, 2011 There are many that are like you... I think that it is significant when you say that they have not left Jesus. IOW, they still have a faith, they worship in home churches, but their names are not included on the earthly books. You just might find a home here! Having said that, there have been many changes over the years. Do you keep in touch at all with regular church members? Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SivartM Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 First NLP came in and I fought against that and then Lab 1,2 and 3 came in Just out of curiosity: I'm assuming that NLP is neuro-linguistic programming, but what is "Lab 1, 2, 3"? Quote "Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde�Do to others whatever you would like them to do to you. This is the essence of all that is taught in the law and the prophets." - Jesus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 When slaves from Ceasers palace were converted to christianity the early church did not try to hide them or make room for them in their homes, they were told to return to Ceaser and do their job. Daniel live a life honoring God while a slave surrounded by the ungodly everyday. Joseph honored God even while in prison. Is it to hard to be a Seventh-day Adventist christian and follow EVERY aspect of that life that the Lord convicts you of AND attend an organized, Conference supported Seventh-day Adventist church? No, it is not. It not only CAN be done, people ARE doing it. I understand the need for a home church, in an area where there are no Seventh-day Adventists and your "church building". A county, a country, a State with no Seventh-day Adventists for hundreds of miles with a goal of establishing an official Seventh-day Adventist church. If the goal is to avoid God's chosen church because there are in "apostasy" and no longer "favored of God" and they "don't like you" and so you reject them? Joshua and Caleb didn't leave God's people, they stayed, and waited, and waited, choosing to suffer affliction with the people of God. Until at last, they entered the land. I'm a Seventh-day Adventist, I support the General Conference. I am not blind to what I see in the church. I understand the delima good people face, the difficulties of living the life, the blue print outlined by Ellen White. I worry about how my tithe is being used (I give it to God, the men are responsible to Him, not me), our schools, our sanitariums, our hospitals SO far off the track and the counsel of the prophet. But I choose to stay, to suffer affliction with Gods chosen people. I will not leave them until we see that promised land, no matter what. I don't look to "people" for my standard, I look to Jesus and the counsel He has provided in the bible and in the Spirit of Prophecy for my standard. Though I may fall short, I will strive toward the goal. And it CAN be done, it WILL be done, right there in Ceasers court, and Daniels court, in the wilderness, in prison, under extreme adversity,,, even right in your local Seventh-day Adventist church! Just presenting an opposing view to home churches. It's a serious issue, and when children and families are involved, a very tough decision on what to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gerr Posted November 11, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 11, 2011 There are many that are like you... I think that it is significant when you say that they have not left Jesus. IOW, they still have a faith, they worship in home churches, but their names are not included on the earthly books. You just might find a home here! I would venture to say that for most who leave the SDA church, home churching or establishing a church with other ex-SDAs would be just about the only alternative unless one just leaves religion altogether. After I became a SDA, I left the church once, but couldn't fit in with any of the other churches. I couldn't go back to the church I was raised in because I couldn't go back to praying to Mary and the saints. There was no way I could fit in with the other protestant churches with their forever and ever torture of lost sinners. And the 4th commandment kept saying, "Remember...." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Interesting early analysis on the survey Bravus. High percentages leave over: Doctrine: It might tie in to reason #2. People don't study enough to really know what the doctrines are. Where they came from. How the church established them. There taking someones word on it, the Pastor, the Sabbath school leader, the Elders, but they themselves don't really know if these things are really true or not. Because.... To much Bible study: It's hard work, requiring real effort. Lots of folks avoid hard work in general. I am still amazed by the number of Adventist I meet in my various local churches who aren't really sure about the details of our most basic doctrines. They haven't studied these things for themselves. The reason for their faith is because the "church said so". Digging for buried treasure is about as hard as it gets. Your not going to find it in the first hole you dig. The treasure map is complicated and hard to figure out. Your guide makes to much of this or that and you grow weary of the search. The sacrifice is to great, you would rather just have a BBQ at the house, maybe some leeks and onions on the grill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Drifting off topic here and tempted to start a new thread about the Home Church thing. It's something I've been studying and I find a very common thread: Sincere folks trying to follow the "blue print" the Lord, through Sister White has layed down. Many, if not MOST, of these folks are genuine reformers. Thats a good thing. Dress reform. Health reform. Schooling reform. Shunning worldy goods and goals. Little or no TV/Internet. Gardening, etc. etc. Very devoted sincere folks,,,, who have left the church for all kinds of "good reasons". And THERE is a MAJOR problem!!! I think many, if not most, are sincerely mistaken. By their example, their chosen lifestyle they are saying the Seventh-day Adventist church is in apostasy, by their example they are calling others out of the church. The church is not in apostasy, some of the members, even most if you want to conclude that, are. But NOT the church!!! God is in control, oh yee of little faith. Daniel, Joseph, Joshua, Caleb and a host of others approve this message. Here's my take on it: Limit your personal, family and childrens contact with the local church. Live the reforms, home school your kids, move to the country, plant that garden. PAY YOUR TITHE to the General Conference! Your not a prophet with the prophets insight, don't justify robbing God so you can do your own version of soul saving with your own money your way. It's not up to you where the tithe money goes, give it to God through His appointed agencies, what becomes of it is up to Him. GO to church on Sabbath, take your family, leave your "they don't like us" attitude at the door and join with Gods chosen people, the SINGLE object of His supreme effection, in worshiping the creator. Be the salt of the earth within the church. There are many there who have not bowed the knee to Baal, keep your eyes open, find them, invite them home for lunch. You don't need to support the local church basketball team, or attend the church "carnival" or the latest "good movie" in the gym, LIMIT your contact. But DON'T be like Timothy Leery and "drop out" so you can "turn on" to God and withdraw your influence from God's people. Thats a cop out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted November 11, 2011 Author Moderators Share Posted November 11, 2011 I think you might have misread the data I presented, ClubV12: it wasn't that people left because they didn't like intensive Bible study, it was that what they discovered through intensive Bible study caused them to leave. Worth thinking about. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators John317 Posted November 11, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 11, 2011 You apparently no longer consider yourself an Adventist. Co-Aspen's definition on another thread is that an Adventist is a member of the SDA church. Are you OK with that definition? You mention "where they [former members] end up." Where have you ended up so far? Are you attending another church? I think you've said something about this before, but I don't recall the specifics. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators John317 Posted November 11, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 11, 2011 ....The survey can be done in 10-15 minutes, but I think I took nearly an hour: there are boxes for longer responses and I wrote a reasonable amount. It was a worthwhile activity for me just in terms of reflecting on my own ideas and beliefs. I think there's value in the church having a better understanding of why people leave.... It sounds like you left primarily because of disagreements with the doctrines of the SDA Church. Do you believe the church should change its doctrines in order to keep people in the church or to attract people back to it? Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators John317 Posted November 11, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 11, 2011 Dropping out is what the shaking is all about-- some are shaken out and others are shaken in. We know who is influencing people to drop out of the church, and it is not God. Jesus did not tell the people of that time to stop paying their tithes to the synagogue or to drop out of the church because many were hypocrites or false teachers. If we know what is right, then we have an even greater resposibility to do right-- not make accusations against the leaders and quit the church. We need to pray earnestly and continually for our leaders and for each other. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators John317 Posted November 11, 2011 Moderators Share Posted November 11, 2011 ...it wasn't that people left because they didn't like intensive Bible study, it was that what they discovered through intensive Bible study caused them to leave. Worth thinking about. OK, let's think about this. What discovery did you make through intensive Bible study that caused you to leave? Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.