Robert Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Robert, Can you give me your definition of "agape" in this post fall world ..... You mean for the believer? Phil 2:4 "do not merely look out for your own personal interests, but also for the interests of others." Notice that God's grace covers our bent to self. Why? Because the believer has "been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by" (Rom 7:6) Otherwise the believer standing under the banner of justification by faith would stand condemned. Now, does this mean the believer can enjoy the flesh with all its desires and lusts? No! Gal 5:13 You, my brothers, were called to be free (free from under law). But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love. I think Ellen White sums it best in the following: "There was not one trace of selfishness in the life of Christ. All who are laborers together with God will have the same spirit (attitude) as their Master had. They will be continually growing away from selfishness, and renouncing self-indulgence, even in things that had once appeared innocent to them. . . [LHU 325] So believers, who are standing perfect in Christ by faith, are also experiencing growth away from selfishness and those things that once appeared innocent to them. It's a change of mind/heart. That's my best answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 9, 2012 Author Share Posted January 9, 2012 You mean for the believer? Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 9, 2012 Author Share Posted January 9, 2012 Robert,Can you give me your definition of "agape" in this post fall world and how one would go about it. Or are you arguing the impossible for the sake of arguing or trying to appease your own conscience? God loves all without reservation or preference.Can I do that? Am I supposed to love all as my husband,God does? The bible tells me to Honor my parents,God does not love some parents more than others. When God said to honor my parents He did not say honor all equally,did He mean that? We may disagree but having children is a awesome responsibility that parents assume,I think I was expected to do my best for them,not my best for the whole neighborhood. How could I do my best for all and not shortchange them all? God says if you are not faithful in little things,you won't be in bigger things. Doing your best to you is self-seeking as you are sure you know everyone's motives. Capitalism is something you try to avoid,what other system is out there?Capitalism as a system to me is a sin when abused.I can only stop me from abusing it.To you to engage in that and not give all equally is a sin.How do you explain the many texts in the bible that soundly disagree with you? Please no barrage of the same texts,just what it means to you. Please don't go down the road of accusing others of confusing capitalism and righteousness. Those are accusations you brought in without one whit of comment to imply that. You want to live as the early church,just waiting and hoping to find one.If this is such a heartfelt desire on your part,why aren't you doing something about it? It is possible you know,many people do just what you have done with a issue on both sides of the fence.You could find those that would follow. Robert,can you please go back and answer this.EW can't answer it for you.For all you hammer others you should be able to answer for yourself.I don't expect you to. I am of the opinion the hammer you use on others is empty words,used to pacify your own very selfish nature.So much you say God demands of others,impossible tho they are and I don't believe biblical you could be doing.Why aren't you.Don't ask EW,just speak for yourself. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 For all you hammer others.... I hammer the self-righteous. The far right are very self-righteous.....They play the religion card a lot. For example, they use the abortion issue, but they never try to outlaw big tobacco. Neither do they attempt to stop exploitation. They are mostly liars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 10, 2012 Author Share Posted January 10, 2012 I hammer the self-righteous. The far right are very self-righteous.....They play the religion card a lot. For example, they use the abortion issue, but they never try to outlaw big tobacco. Neither do they attempt to stop exploitation. They are mostly liars. Everyone that does not agree with your view of how others should live is self righteous in your opinion.Every statement,every belief,every opinion stated by anyone that is not willing to live under a bridge and give all is met with SELF SEEKING,SELFISH,SELF RIGHTEOUS. Personally I have never seen anyone come across more self righteous than you do They never try to outlaw big tobacco,you never try in your own corner to stamp out poverty.Your halo is slipping.If you have more than food and clothing you are sinning.Get rid of it. Many things you condemn others for not doing are well within your capabilities.You don't,you self righteously condemn others. You are afraid to answer direct questions.Using EW and the same bible texts over and over. You have been articulate enough in your self righteous condemnation of everyone else,but cannot articulate some simple answers to some simple questions. Exploitation?? You have it down to an art.I wouldn't worry to much about others till you get a handle on exploiting a few chosen bible texts to serve what looks like some very selfish motives.Must also exempt you from being a man of your word. You did say you would answer,yet refuse.Nothing you say has the ring of personal truth Your continual preaching has a very hollow ring.Has it been hard work to come up with a belief that sets you above those doing far more than you are? Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Everyone that does not agree with your view of how others should live is self righteous.... They are not my views.....Christ is the fulfillment of the law. Live His life (which answered the law) and you have righteousness. There was no self-seeking in His life! Comprehend? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Originally Posted By: bonnie Everyone that does not agree with your view of how others should live is self righteous.... They are not my views.....Christ is the fulfillment of the law. Live His life (which answered the law) and you have righteousness. There was no self-seeking in His life! Comprehend? What's you're point Robert? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 What's you're point Robert? That there's none righteous (compared to Christ).... My point (and I've drifted) is that the Republican party plays the religion card. They pick things like abortion and gay marriage as wedge issues. They try to divide. This is self-righteous because these same folks take millions from big tobacco - they take millions from corporations wanting to exploit folks not under our rule of law. Now don't get me wrong, the Democrats are not with out sin. They too lie! Obama acts like he is for the little guy and then goes and eats with his Wall Street billionaire buddies. Again, we do not have a democracy. We have plutocracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 The Dims play the race card AND the class warfare card. But tell me how the Pubs play a so called "religion" card, Robert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 The Dims play the race card AND the class warfare card. But tell me how the Pubs play a so called "religion" card, Robert. It is a little tough to follow as no one that I know of has claimed to be righteous.That is a accusation Robert makes and then says SEE. If Robert sees himself as the self appointed right hand hammer of God and gets satisfaction from that I guess who are we do deprive him. For myself I get a lot more inspiration out of those I come in contact with that actually don't talk much about their walk,just go about day to day doing what Robert rails against. Robert at one time was very fond of a quite expensive vehicle,I find the Salvation Army approach a lot more uplifting.They work with local repairmen to provide needed repairs at a reduced cost and use the donations of the "self righteous" to provide much needed transportation for those otherwise without. Two churches locally have a very active program for young pregnant women.Not railing about the evils of abortion,which they are strongly against,but actually making a huge difference. Actively seeking donations for needed items for newborn care,layettes and offering free babysitting services for a stressed young mother.Safe homes if a young mother feels threatened by boyfriend Robert rails against tobacco,which is not a republican/right wing endeavor,the local Baptist church puts their money where Roberts mouth is. After classes and the like they have come up with a strong buddy system to try to help them not slip back. The church food distribution actually feeds hundreds a week.No whining/crying and condemning the self righteous there.In our area we don't have a great deal of homeless sleeping under bridges,but they do have bedding and warm clothing for those that have a need for whatever reason. There is a noticeable difference in their attitude and that of what Robert presents here. They don't claim to be righteous as far as I know. Don't claim they are going to heaven based on their works. Don't talk a talk that others are supposed to walk.They don't have the self appointed task of hammering the "self righteous" so maybe that explains the drastic difference and why they have the time to actually do something. Wonder who will hear "Well done thou good and faithful servant,enter into the joy of the Lord".Those actually doing or those doing the hammering Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted January 11, 2012 Members Share Posted January 11, 2012 Wonder who will hear "Well done thou good and faithful servant,enter into the joy of the Lord".Those actually doing or those doing the hammering Well if we go by what the Bible says it will be those that keep hammering others! Does not the Bible say we will be judged as we judge others?? Pretty self explanatory if you ask me. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 Originally Posted By: bonnie Wonder who will hear "Well done thou good and faithful servant,enter into the joy of the Lord".Those actually doing or those doing the hammering Well if we go by what the Bible says it will be those that keep hammering others! Does not the Bible say we will be judged as we judge others?? Pretty self explanatory if you ask me. Not sure I am following.I somehow don't think it will be those banging others with the hammers Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted January 11, 2012 Members Share Posted January 11, 2012 Originally Posted By: pkrause Well if we go by what the Bible says it will be those that keep hammering others! Does not the Bible say we will be judged as we judge others?? Pretty self explanatory if you ask me. [/quote'] Sorry, I left out the word "not" between will and be in the above statement. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 The Dims play the race card AND the class warfare card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 They don't have the self appointed task of hammering the "self righteous" so maybe that explains the drastic difference and why they have the time to actually do something. Unless one understands the gospel, everything one does will be based in iniquity, period! As Jack states, mankind is legalistic by nature. We are proud by nature and we expect a reward. The gospel places the glory of mankind in the dust. It's God doing the hammering. And He does it through the Bible (especially the law).... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Robert rails against tobacco,which is not a republican/right wing endeavor.... "the tobacco companies gave more than $6 million in soft money, mainly to the Republican Party." (Up in Smoke - Tobacco Industry Saves on Soft Money, Spends On Advertising and Lobbyists by Chris Berdik, Special to Corpwatch) The repubs play the righteous card....Thing is they are hypocrites. They are modern day Pharisees. "All they do is to be seen of men". It will be this type that bring in the dreaded Sunday law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 Unless one understands the gospel, everything one does will be based in iniquity, period! As Jack states, mankind is legalistic by nature. We are proud by nature and we expect a reward. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 "the tobacco companies gave more than $6 million in soft money, mainly to the Republican Party." (Up in Smoke - Tobacco Industry Saves on Soft Money, Spends On Advertising and Lobbyists by Chris Berdik, Special to Corpwatch) The repubs play the righteous card....Thing is they are hypocrites. They are modern day Pharisees. "All they do is to be seen of men". It will be this type that bring in the dreaded Sunday law. What has been given to democrats thru various means? Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 Tobacco,as bad as it is,is the personal choice of those using the product as is alcohol. Democrats have a hefty support for a practice that the victim has no choice. Personally I am pro-life. I understand there are some very personal reasons that some choose abortion.Some do so because of convenience. You and I are forced largely because of the democratic party to help fund all that. Recently a freezer was found to contain dead whatever they call them when it is decided to stick a scissors in the back of their skull.Just has to be done before the child is fully expelled. For me,if I have to tie myself in knots as you are,it will be over a freezer full of dead babies that the taxpayer in many cases have been forced to fund. Planned Parenthood Contributions to Federal Candidates Select a Cycle: House Total to Democrats: $255,301 Total to Republicans: $10,000Recipient ↓ Total ↓ Adler, John H (D-NJ) $6,000 Arcuri, Michael (D-NY) $3,000 Baker, Judith W (D-MO) $4,000 Barnes, Kay (D-MO) $6,000 Bean, Melissa (D-IL) $2,000 Berkowitz, Ethan A (D-AK) $7,000 Brown, Charles D (D-CA) $2,500 Burner, Darcy (D-WA) $10,000 Carnahan, Russ (D-MO) $1,000 Carson, Andre (D-IN) $1,000 Clyburn, James E (D-SC) $1,000 Cohen, Stephen Ira (D-TN) $1,225 Connolly, Gerry (D-VA) $2,000 Courtney, Joe (D-CT) $2,000 DeGette, Diana (D-CO) $1,000 Derby, Jill T (D-NV) $2,000 Edwards, Donna (D-MD) $1,000 Emanuel, Rahm (D-IL) $1,000 Foster, Bill (D-IL) $5,000 Giffords, Gabrielle (D-AZ) $9,000 Gillibrand, Kirsten (D-NY) $8,000 Grayson, Alan (D-FL) $5,000 Greenwald, Rebecca (D-IA) $1,000 Hall, John (D-NY) $2,000 Halvorson, Deborah (D-IL) $5,000 Heinrich, Martin (D-NM) $2,000 Herseth Sandlin, Stephanie (D-SD) $1,000 Hodes, Paul W (D-NH) $3,000 Hoyer, Steny H (D-MD) $1,000 Jennings, Christine (D-FL) $2,000 Kilpatrick, Carolyn Cheeks (D-MI) $1,000 Kilroy, Mary Jo (D-OH) $5,000 Kirk, Mark (R-IL) $10,000 Kirkpatrick, Ann (D-AZ) $7,000 Klein, Ron (D-FL) $2,000 Kosmas, Suzanne (D-FL) $6,000 Kratovil, Frank M Jr (D-MD) $2,000 Kryzan, Alice J (D-NY) $3,000 Lee, Barbara (D-CA) $1,000 Leibham, Nicholas Alexander (D-CA) $3,000 Lord, Bob (D-AZ) $5,000 Lowey, Nita M (D-NY) $1,000 Madia, Ashwin (D-MN) $6,000 Maffei, Dan (D-NY) $6,000 Mahoney, Tim (D-FL) $2,000 Markey, Betsy (D-CO) $6,000 Massa, Eric (D-NY) $3,000 McNerney, Jerry (D-CA) $7,000 Minnick, Walt (D-ID) $5,000 Mitchell, Harry E (D-AZ) $7,000 Moore, Gwen (D-WI) $1,000 Morgenthaler, Jill (D-IL) $500 Murphy, Christopher S (D-CT) $3,000 Murphy, Patrick J (D-PA) $3,192 Neuhardt, Sharen Swartz (D-OH) $1,000 Nye, Glenn (D-VA) $2,500 Pelosi, Nancy (D-CA) $1,000 Peters, Gary (D-MI) $7,000 Pingree, Chellie (D-ME) $1,009 Richardson, Laura (D-CA) $500 Rodriguez, Ciro D (D-TX) $3,000 Sarvi, Steve (D-MN) $500 Schakowsky, Jan (D-IL) $1,000 Schauer, Mark (D-MI) $6,000 Schrader, Kurt (D-OR) $5,000 Schultz, Debbie Wasserman (D-FL) $1,000 Sestak, Joseph A Jr (D-PA) $1,000 Shea-Porter, Carol (D-NH) $8,000 Shulman, Dennis G (D-NJ) $1,000 Slaughter, Louise M (D-NY) $1,000 Solis, Hilda L (D-CA) $1,000 Stender, Linda D (D-NJ) $6,000 Taddeo, Annette (D-FL) $500 Teague, Harry (D-NM) $1,000 Titus, Dina (D-NV) $6,000 Tonko, Paul (D-NY) $500 Tsongas, Niki (D-MA) $500 Van Hollen, Chris (D-MD) $1,000 Walz, Timothy J (D-MN) $5,000 Waxman, Henry A (D-CA) $1,000 Weirauch, Robin (D-OH) $1,375 Wulsin, Victoria Wells (D-OH) $2,000 Yarmuth, John A (D-KY) $5,000 Zeitz, Joshua M (D-NJ) $500 Senate Total to Democrats: $96,575 Total to Republicans: ($3,000)Recipient ↓ Total ↓ Allen, Tom H (D-ME) $320 Baucus, Max (D-MT) $5,000 Begich, Mark (D-AK) $7,500 Boxer, Barbara (D-CA) $9,918 Chafee, Lincoln D (R-RI) ($3,000) Clinton, Hillary (D-NY) $1,837 Durbin, Dick (D-IL) $1,000 Franken, Al (D-MN) $9,000 Hagan, Kay R (D-NC) $5,000 Harkin, Tom (D-IA) $6,000 LaRocco, Larry (D-ID) $500 Lautenberg, Frank R (D-NJ) $1,000 Levin, Carl (D-MI) $1,000 Martin, James Francis (D-GA) $9,000 Merkley, Jeff (D-OR) $7,500 Reed, Jack (D-RI) $1,000 Shaheen, Jeanne (D-NH) $10,000 Udall, Mark (D-CO) $10,000 Udall, Tom (D-NM) $10,000 Whitehouse, Sheldon (D-RI) $1,000 Presidential Total to Democrats: $3,674 Total to Republicans: $0Recipient ↓ Total ↓ Edwards, John (D) $1,837 Obama, Barack (D) $1,837 Based on data released by the FEC on July 13, 2009. Center for Responsive Politics. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Wow!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Tobacco,as bad as it is,is the personal choice of those using the product.... This is pure baloney. It's worse than brainwashing. It's down right hypocrisy. If smoking is a personal choice than abortion is a personal choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Quite frankly I have little interest in what "Jack" says. And very frankly I could care very little about what you say because it's purse nonsense. You're against certain sins, but not those that expose you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 12, 2012 Author Share Posted January 12, 2012 Originally Posted By: bonnie Tobacco,as bad as it is,is the personal choice of those using the product.... This is pure baloney. It's worse than brainwashing. It's down right hypocrisy. If smoking is a personal choice than abortion is a personal choice. Really? I know a lot of people that smoke and not one was dragged into a store to purchase and then forced to inhale. But those that smoke generally have years of life to make the decision to quit. Abortion is the personal choice of the mother according to current law.That personal choice of hers results in one very dead baby that will never have a choice of any kind to make Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 12, 2012 Author Share Posted January 12, 2012 And very frankly I could care very little about what you say because it's purse nonsense. You're against certain sins, but not those that expose you! I know this is going to be interesting and I probably shouldn't ask,but what sins do I endorse that expose me?Do you assume that because I am not slapping people upside the head with a verbal hammer as "Christ"? did or Robert does I am somehow for certain sins What certain sins am I against. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted January 12, 2012 Author Share Posted January 12, 2012 And very frankly I could care very little about what you say because it's purse nonsense. You're against certain sins, but not those that expose you! My time is limited and I read a book that has authors I can trust Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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