Romans 7

[Robert]

Then how much good does the natural man do? None. Although he hates the bad, how much good does he do? None.

He must be spiritualizing Romans 7, because he is not looking at the whole context.

Clearly, "the natural man" loves sin:

Romans 8:5 Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires.

Their minds loves sin - not hates sin!

Look at Eph 2:3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts.

Again loving sin, not hating it.

Jones was a great man, no doubt. He was very instrumental in presenting the subject of righteousness by faith to the SDA church, but that does not mean that all his expositions were right on the money.

“We are not to accept the opinion of commentators as the voice of God; they are erring mortals like ourselves. God has given reasoning powers to us as well as to them. We should make the Bible its own expositor.

“We must study the truth for ourselves. No man should be relied upon to think for us. No matter who he is, or in what position he may be placed, we are not to look upon any man as a criterion for us. Testimonies to Ministers, pp. 106 and 110

[Robert]

This is about a man who was satisfied with his law keeping until he realized the law requires perfect thoughts. That's because coveting isn't an action it's a cherished desire.

What did Paul's life look like before conversion?

Go to Phil 3:3 For we (i.e., we believers) are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh....

What's confidence in the flesh? Confidence in your attainments - your status - in your performance:

4 though I myself have reasons for such confidence. If anyone else thinks he has reasons to put confidence in the flesh, I have more:

5 circumcised the eighth day,

of the stock of Israel,

of the tribe of Benjamin,

a Hebrew of the Hebrews;

concerning the law, a Pharisee;

6 concerning zeal, persecuting the church;

concerning the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

7 But what things were gain to me (the list above) to me, these I have counted loss for Christ. and count them as rubbish (dung), that I may gain Christ 9 and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness (see verse 6), which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith....

So here Paul clearly contrasts before he was converted and after.

The point that I want you to remember is verse 6:

concerning the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

Now compare this to Romans 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh [my humanity]) nothing good dwells...22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man (a phrase Paul always uses for the converted man). 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 I thank God--through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.

Where's that proud, legalistic Pharisee? What happened to him? Answer: Conversion!

Now we see a humbled Paul; no longer claiming to be blameless before God's law.

[Robert]

22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man (a phrase Paul always uses for the converted man). 23 ...

2 Cor 4:16 Wherefore we faint not; but though our outward man is decaying, yet our inward man is renewed day by day.

Sounds like 2 Cor 3:18

But we all, with unveiled face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord (His agape love), are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord the Spirit.

[BobRyan]

Does Romans 7 speak about a person in the converted state or unconverted?

Both.

It talks about the lost and then it speaks to the point where they become saved - yet still in need of the Romans 8 "solution" for the saved person.

in Christ,

Bob

[Gerr]

He must be spiritualizing Romans 7, because he is not looking at the whole context.

Clearly, "the natural man" loves sin:

Rob, there is a whole range of "the natural man," from those who hate and have nothing to do with the law like the man of Rom 7, to those who who may "delight" in the law like the Pharisee in the Temple, or the rocky soil hearer, or the 5 foolish virgins. The man of Rom 7 say, "WRETCHED man that I am, Who will deliver me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then, I myself serve [douleuo - to be a slave tothe law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin."

A saved person CANNOT be "wretched." A saved person cannot be a slave to God and also be a slave to sin. "For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh..." Gal 5:13. "But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.... And those who belong to Christ have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires." Gal 5:16,24.

Does that mean a saved person never sins again? Not at all. The crucifixion of the flesh is a DAILY matter. One day it may get the best of me, but it is no longer the RULING master in the believer's life.

[Gibs]

It's the Pharisee that don't feel he is wretched. He is unashamed and proud and has no reason to be so. Yes I have come to hate sin and have put it away but my past sin is ever before me as David has said. And yes I still groan within myself realizing "oh what a wretched man I am". That realization only makes me hate the sin more and sets my resolve stronger to steer clear of it all.

When we are resurrected in that first reurrection then that will be taken from us and then there will be no more remembrance of our unworthiness.

The only thing that saves us oh wretched men that we are from falling back into the old wallow is, Christ in you our only hope of glory. Blessed Paul He and John made that clear to the Gentiles, Read,

Herein, Folks is our strength and stay and there is no other way for us weakened sinful creatures that we are.

Col 1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:

Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

Col 1:29 Whereunto I also labour, striving according to his working, which worketh in me mightily.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[skyblue888]

Continued from A.T. Jones on Romans 7 from the 1893 General Conference Bulletin:

"For I know that in me (that is in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing; for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not." Rom.7:18.

What is it that is present with us? To will to do good. Then what did that putting of enmity there against Satan--what was that the doing of? Is not it setting the man free to will? Yes. Was it anything more than that? (Congregation: 'No.') Now think carefully of this; I mean on this point. There are other things in it, of course; but did that do any more for the man to enable him to do right things, and glorify God, did it do any more for him than to set free his will, that he might choose which master he would have? (Congregation: 'No.') It put the hatred there, and gave him the knowledge of something better. It gave the hatred of evil, led him out toward the good; but did it enable him to do the good? (Congregation: 'No.')

Now just another thought there. He hated the evil and declared he never will do it; and yet against his will, and against all his being for that matter, it was done. But what was it, and who was it, that actually did it? (Congregation: "Sin that dwelleth in me.') And who rules that? (Congregation: 'Satan.') Who is the master of that man? (Congregation: 'Satan.')

Now when the man is set free from that carnal mind, that mind of self and Satan, who controls that man? who then is his master? (Congregation: 'Christ.') Yes. He who sets him free. It is Christ Jesus. Then when we are free from Satan's mastery we become bound to another Master. Satan's mastery is slavery to sin; Christ's mastery is freedom and everlasting life, everlasting joy, and everlasting prosperity.

Now carry that thought a little further. When we had the mind of self and Satan and he was ruling, we said we would not do those evil things, but just those were done. Who did it? (Congregation: 'Sin that dwelleth in us.') We said we will do so and so. We did not. Who kept us from it? (Congregation: 'Satan.') But now in Christ we are free from him; we have the other mind. We say we will do that. Who does it? (Congregation: 'Christ.) While in the natural mind we refuse, and who does it? (Congregation: 'Satan.') And when in the mind of Christ, we choose and who does it? (Congregation: 'Christ.') Is that so? (Congregation: 'Yes.') It is God that worketh in you both to will and to do, of His good pleasure."

to be continued

[Robert]

to be continued

I'm looking at the whole picture. Jones was getting a point across using some texts from Romans 7. You need to understand the difference.

[Robert]

It's the Pharisee that don't feel he is wretched.

Bingo!

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Robert

22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man (a phrase Paul always uses for the converted man). 23 ...

2 Cor 4:16 Wherefore we faint not; but though our outward man is decaying, yet our inward man is renewed day by day.

Again, "the inward man" refers to the converted man. Here's another:

Eph 3:14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father, 15 from whom every family in heaven and on earth is named, 16 that he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, that ye may be strengthened with power through his Spirit in the inward man; 17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; to the end that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, 18 may be strong to apprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and height and depth, 19 and to know the love of Christ which passeth knowledge, that ye may be filled unto all the fulness of God

[Robert]

A saved person CANNOT be "wretched."

Keep in mind something Ellen White said:

"Self-righteousness is not the wedding garment. A failure to follow the clear light of truth is our fearful danger. The message to the Laodicean church reveals our condition as a people." [RH 12-15-1904]

Notice that this was written in 1904. Let me repeat her again:

"The message to the Laodicean church reveals our condition as a people."

To understand Laodicea we need to go to Rev 3:17-19

"Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing'--and you do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked-- 18 I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. 19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent."

In 1904 she stated that the the SDA church's condition was the same as that of Laodicea. Notice that they were "wretched" - even though they weren't aware of it. Why? Self-deception.

"What greater deception can come upon human minds than a confidence that they are right when they are all wrong! The message of the True Witness (to the Laodiceans) finds the people of God (SDA) in a sad deception, yet honest in that deception. They know not that their condition is deplorable in the sight of God. While those addressed are flattering themselves that they are in an exalted spiritual condition, the message of the True Witness breaks their security by the startling denunciation of their true condition." Testimonies for the Church 3:252-258.

If you go with your logic (and others) then the whole SDA was unconverted and lost. Keep in mind they weren't admitting "wretchedness" - they considered themselves in an exalted spiritual condition".

Weren't these folks keeping the law? Yes, they were keeping the law outwardly, but the law demands not only perfect outward performance, it also demands perfect motive and perfect thoughts. So they had a limited view of the law.

Here's EGW on the law:

"...The commandments of God are exceeding broad, and are discerners of the thoughts and intents of the heart. The apostle speaks words of encouragement to those who realize that they are sinners, and says, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all righteousness.” “If we say we have no sin,” when our thoughts, words, and actions, reflected from the law of God, the great moral mirror, reveal us as transgressors, we make God a liar, and prove that his word is not in us."

Unlike the man of Romans 7 they weren't admitting that they were "wretched" in comparison to Christ's selfless life. Because of this Christ was about to vomit them out (see Rev 3:16)

The man of Romans isn't self-deceived, but before conversion he was: "As to the righteousness in the law, blameless" [Phil 3:6]

If SDA weren't lost for being self-deceived, then the man of Romans, who admits his problem, surely couldn't be lost. Follow the logic?

[skyblue888]

Continued from A.T. Jones on Romans 7 from the 1893 General Conference Bulletin:

"For I know that in me (that is in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing; for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not." Rom.7:18.

What is it that is present with us? To will to do good. Then what did that putting of enmity there against Satan--what was that the doing of? Is not it setting the man free to will? Yes. Was it anything more than that? (Congregation: 'No.') Now think carefully of this; I mean on this point. There are other things in it, of course; but did that do any more for the man to enable him to do right things, and glorify God, did it do any more for him than to set free his will, that he might choose which master he would have? (Congregation: 'No.') It put the hatred there, and gave him the knowledge of something better. It gave the hatred of evil, led him out toward the good; but did it enable him to do the good? (Congregation: 'No.')

Now just another thought there. He hated the evil and declared he never will do it; and yet against his will, and against all his being for that matter, it was done. But what was it, and who was it, that actually did it? (Congregation: "Sin that dwelleth in me.') And who rules that? (Congregation: 'Satan.') Who is the master of that man? (Congregation: 'Satan.')

Now when the man is set free from that carnal mind, that mind of self and Satan, who controls that man? who then is his master? (Congregation: 'Christ.') Yes. He who sets him free. It is Christ Jesus. Then when we are free from Satan's mastery we become bound to another Master. Satan's mastery is slavery to sin; Christ's mastery is freedom and everlasting life, everlasting joy, and everlasting prosperity.

Now carry that thought a little further. When we had the mind of self and Satan and he was ruling, we said we would not do those evil things, but just those were done. Who did it? (Congregation: 'Sin that dwelleth in us.') We said we will do so and so. We did not. Who kept us from it? (Congregation: 'Satan.') But now in Christ we are free from him; we have the other mind. We say we will do that. Who does it? (Congregation: 'Christ.) While in the natural mind we refuse, and who does it? (Congregation: 'Satan.') And when in the mind of Christ, we choose and who does it? (Congregation: 'Christ.') Is that so? (Congregation: 'Yes.') It is God that worketh in you both to will and to do, of His good pleasure."

_______________

When I first stated that the Testimonies and both Jones and Waggoner taught that the experience described in Romans 7 was the experience of the man who is still in bondage to sin, I was challenged to produce the evidence.

As you know, I did provide clear evidence but now we are told that we must reject what the Testimonies and what Waggoner and Jones teach on this subject.

I am inviting you to once again compare what I have posted from A.T. Jones with what I have posted from Waggoner and compare that with the Testimonies I have quoted and decide for yourself who is telling the truth.

Here again is what brother Waggoner taught on Romans 7.

"In the latter part of the chapter, the apostle shows what that oldness of the letter is from which we must be delivered. 'I am carnal, sold under sin.' We do great violence to the apostle Paul, that holy man, when we say that in this he is relating his own Christian experience. He is not writing his own experience now that he is united with Christ. He is writing the experience of those who serve, but in the oldness of the letter, and while professedly serving God, are carnal, and sold under sin.

A person sold under bondage is a slave. What is the evidence of this slavery? 'For what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I... For the good that I would, I do not; but the evil which I would not, that I do.' Have we ever had any such experience as that in our so-called Christian experience? Yes; we have fought, but with all our fighting, did we keep the law? No, we have made a failure, and it is written upon every page of our lives. It is a constant service, but at the same time it is a constant failure.

I fall. I make a new resolution,--I break it, and then I get discouraged, then make a new resolution, and break it again. We cannot make ourselves do the thing we want to do by making a resolution. We do not want to sin, but we do sin all the time. We make up our minds we will not fall under that temptation again, and we don't--till the next time it comes up, and then we fall as before.

When in this condition, can we say that we have hope, and that we 'rejoice in hope of the glory of God'? We do not hear such testimonies,--it is solely of what we want to do, and what we have failed to do, but intend to do in the future. If a person has the law before him, and acknowledges that it is good, and yet does not keep its precepts, is his sin less in the sight of God than the sin of the man who cares nothing for the law? No.

What is the difference between the would-be Christian, who knows the law, but does not keep it, and the worldling who does not keep the law, and does not acknowledge that it is good? Simply this: We are unwilling slaves, and they are willing slaves. We are all the time distracted and sorrowful, and getting nothing out of life at all, while the worldling does not worry himself in the least.

If one is going to sin, is it not better to be the worldling, who does not know that there is such a thing as liberty, than to be the man who knows that there is liberty, but cannot get it? If it has got to be slavery, if we must live in the sins of the world, then it is better to be in the world, partaking of its pleasures, than to be in a miserable bondage, and have no hope of a life to come." E.G. Waggoner, Bible Studies on the Book of Romans, p.53,54.

sky

The testimonies on Romans 7:

"It is not enough to perceive the loving-kindness of God, to see the benevolence, the fatherly tenderness of His character. It is not enough to discern the wisdom and justice of His law, to see that it is founded upon the eternal principle of love. Paul the apostle saw all this when he exclaimed, "I consent unto the law that it is good' 'The law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.' But he added, in the bitterness of his soul-anguish and despair, 'I am carnal, sold under sin.' Romans 7:16,12,14. He longed for the purity, the righteousness, to which in himself he was powerless to attain, and cried out, 'O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from this body of death?' Romans 7:24. Such is the cry that has gone up from burdened hearts in all lands and in all ages. To all, there is but one answer, 'Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.'" (John 1:29) Steps to Christ,19.

"Education, culture, the exercise of the will, human effort, all have their proper sphere, but here they are powerless. They may produce an outward correctness of behavior, but they cannot change the heart; they cannot purify the springs of life. There must be a power working from within, a new life from above, before man can be changed from sin to holiness. That power is Christ. His grace alone can quicken the lifeless faculties of the soul, and attract it to God, to holiness." Ibid, p.18.

"There are many who realize their helplessness, and who long for that spiritual life which will bring them into harmony with God; they are vainly striving to obtain it. In despair they cry, 'O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from this body of death?' Rom.7:24." Desire of Ages, p.203.

[Robert]

As you know, I did provide clear evidence

[Robert]

Romans 7:1 (RSV) Do you not know, brethren--for I am speaking to those who know the law--that the law is binding on a person only during his life?

Other versions say that the law is binding "over a man only as long as he lives". In other words if you're dead the law can't demand anything of you.

Who is Paul writing to? The believers in Roman. Many of them were Jews who, through Judaism, were very acquainted with the law.

So the minute you are born the law comes to you and says, "obey & live, disobey & die". There's no escaping the law. After all the law was not abolished.

[Robert]

Romans 7:1 (RSV) Do you not know, brethren--for I am speaking to those who know the law--that the law is binding on a person only during his life?

Other versions say that the law is binding "over a man only as long as he lives". In other words if you're dead the law can't demand anything of you.

Who is Paul writing to? The believers in Roman. Many of them were Jews who, through Judaism, were very acquainted with the law.

So the minute you are born the law comes to you and says, "obey & live, disobey & die". There's no escaping the law. After all the law was not abolished.

verse 2

For example, by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage.

Now Paul presents an illustration in verses 2 and 3. It’s a difficult illustration, but it is one that we need to understand in the context of the Bible.

By the law of marriage, a woman is bound to her husband as long as he is living, but if he dies, she is released from that law.

[Robert]

verse 3

So then, if she marries another man while her husband is still alive, she is called an adulteress. But if her husband dies, she is released from that law and is not an adulteress, even though she marries another man.

Common sense when dealing with the law of marriage, right? In other words the woman is bound to her husband until one of them dies.

[Robert]

verse 3

So then, if she marries another man while her husband is still alive, she is called an adulteress. But if her husband dies, she is released from that law and is not an adulteress, even though she marries another man.

Common sense when dealing with the law of marriage, right? In other words the woman is bound to her husband until one of them dies.

verse 4

So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead..." (I'll touch on the rest of verse 4 in the next post)

Keep in mind verse 1 - that the law is binding on anyone who is living. The problem with being "under law" is that all have sinned and therefore all must die the wages of the broken law.

Now, in the marriage illustration given by Paul, the woman represent us. The 1st man represents the law and the 2nd man represents Christ.

So then, we (i.e., the woman), are born "bound" to the law (the 1st husband) as long as we live. How can we marry the 2nd man, Christ, without spiritually committing adultery? That's the question!!

Well, we can't do away with the law! Why? Matt 5:18

I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

So the law (the 1st man) can't die so that we (the woman) can be joined (married) to Christ (the 2nd man). Then what's the solution?

again, verse 4

So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ

In other words the solution is not doing away with the law (the 1st man). Why? The law is holy and good!

So what's the solution?

The solution was for God to put us (the woman) into Christ (the 2nd man) and then we (the woman) legally died so that the marriage to the law (which was for life) was no longer binding.

[Robert]

The solution was for God to put us (the woman) into Christ (the 2nd man) and then we (the woman) legally died so that the first marriage to the law (which was for life) was no longer binding.

"So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead...."

Last part of verse 4:

"in order that we might bear fruit to God"

You see the law demands righteousness and since we have none the law demands our death.

So we want to get with the 2nd man because He doesn't condemn us every time we sin. Does that mean that in the 2nd marriage to Christ that we live for the flesh as a lifestyle? No, as we abide in Christ we "bear fruit to God". In other words we grow spiritually.

[Robert]

verse 5

For when we were controlled by the sinful nature, the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, so that we bore fruit for death.

Now what did Paul mean by the words “when we were controlled by the sinful nature”? It means “before we died,” in our pre-converted state, while we were still under the law, married to the law, depending on ourselves because the law will not help us. The only kind of fruit you bear under the law is sin, which ends up in death.

[Robert]

verse 6

But now, by dying (in Christ - verse 4) to what once bound us (the law - the 1st man), we have been released from the law (i.e., the 1st man) so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit (married to Christ - the 2nd man), and not in the old way of the written code (the demands of the 1st husband).

[Robert]

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: Robert

Romans 7:1 (RSV) Do you not know, brethren--for I am speaking to those who know the law--that the law is binding on a person only during his life?

Other versions say that the law is binding "over a man only as long as he lives". In other words if you're dead the law can't demand anything of you.

Who is Paul writing to? The believers in Roman. Many of them were Jews who, through Judaism, were very acquainted with the law.

So the minute you are born the law comes to you and says, "obey & live, disobey & die". There's no escaping the law. After all the law was not abolished.

verse 2

For example, by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage.

Now Paul presents an illustration in verses 2 and 3. It’s a difficult illustration, but it is one that we need to understand in the context of the Bible.

By the law of marriage, a woman is bound to her husband as long as he is living, but if he dies, she is released from that law.

So, what does it mean to be dead in Christ to the law?

[Gerr]

Last part of verse 4:

"in order that we might bear fruit to God"

You see the law demands righteousness and since we have none the law demands our death.

So we want to get with the 2nd man because He doesn't condemn us every time we sin. Does that mean that in the 2nd marriage to Christ that we live for the flesh as a lifestyle? No, as we abide in Christ we "bear fruit to God". In other words we grow spiritually.

But if you are still willfully obeying what sin tells you to do, you are really not dead! Therefore still married or bound by the law. A dead person can no longer be told what to do!!!

Here is what Paul says that grace does:

ESV Titus 2:11-14 "For the grace has appeared, (1) bringing salvation for all people, (2) training us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passion [it teaches us to say 'No' to ungodliness & worldly passion - NIV, passion = lust - KJV] (3) to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age, waiting for the blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our gread God and Savior Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us (4) to redeem us from all lawlessness (5) and to PURIFY for himself a people for his own possession who (6) zealous for good works."

"But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law," Gal 5:18. And one who is led by the Spirit "will NOT gratify the desires [lust - KJV] of the flesh," Gal 5:16.

How could the man of Rom 7 be led by the Spirit if, as Paul says, "For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I KEEP ON DOING [present tense, practised sin]," Rom 7:19.

[Gerr]

So what's the solution?

The solution was for God to put us (the woman) into Christ (the 2nd man) and then we (the woman) legally died so that the marriage to the law (which was for life) was no longer binding.

You cannot be dead if you "keep on doing" what your husband tells you to do. And if you are not dead, you are not free to marry another man!

[Robert]

So, what does it mean to be dead in Christ to the law?

Your question is worded wrong if you look at the context of Romans 7:4.

The question should be what does it mean that I "died to the law through the body of Christ"?

You see your corporate life from Adam "died" (past tense - refers to the cross) "in Chirst" because the law demanded your death. If you didn't die then the law is still binding on you. If the law is still binding on you then you'll never make it to heaven. Why? You are a sinner because of your past transgressions and you are a sinner because you are coming up short when it comes to living Christ's selfless life.

So no matter how spiritually mature you think you are, in the eyes of God's law you are still a sinner. Only "in Christ" are you perfect in obedience & justice.

Some will reject this notion. That's why Paul goes on to expound on Romans 7:7-24.