Members phkrause Posted November 21, 2013 Members Share Posted November 21, 2013 by Rob Kerby, Senior Editor Bullies and bullying are growing problems in the U.S. and the rest of the world. Some children have committed suicide as a result of such bullying. How should Christian parents respond? Should you teach your kids to fight back? http://www.beliefnet.com/iLoveJesus/Feat..._term=yahoo.com Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 If the Adventist people were actually following the lifestyle blue print outlined in great detail in the spirit of prophecy, bullying wouldn't even be on the radar of problems to deal with. Fixing the fence to keep the deer out of the garden would be the issue. Getting more wood in for winter would be how the kids get strong. Home schooling with a eye toward serving God would be the goal, not some college degree. A trade, a skill to support themselves, while working for the Lord. We, as a people, have gotten so far off track of the blue print for so long we can't even conceive of what the spirit of prophecy has to say regarding lifestyle. It's SO different, we can't take it seriously, can't comprehend it. But some do, I am, it CAN be done, but it will take a serious effort. I know this, heaven is cheap enough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 If the Adventist people were actually following the lifestyle blue print outlined in great detail in the spirit of prophecy, bullying wouldn't even be on the radar of problems to deal with. Ok, I'm gonna bite...what is the "lifestyle blue print"? ...and don't tell me that it is that "fixing the fence and cutting wood for winter"...because that is what secular people also do when they want to move out of the city... Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 What was the lifestyle blueprint for the Children of Israel? It's not a question that can be answered in a single post or even single long thread. Consider the detailed information the Children of the covenant had concerning how the government should be run. The poor taken care of. How loans should be made, property owned, slaves treated, what you should and shouldn't eat, how to work, where to work. A close examination reveals a remarkably detailed lifestyle blueprint. MUCH of that blueprint STILL applies to us today. We have been given the most detailed information of how to live our lives. What to eat, to drink, how to work, care for the sick, the widows among us, what to wear. And for the most part Adventists are not only ignorant of these details, they argue over which ones apply and which ones don't! With one eye on the world and one eye on the heavenly crown. How to live the blueprint while keeping one foot firmly planted on what the world has to offer. We, as a people, are in so deep, so far off track, reformation is impossible. Our institutions will have to collapse, great persecution will have to come to change things. As the children of Israel had to be taken captive into Babylon to learn, to reform, so it will be with this Church. It's the only way, were in to deep to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Bakker Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Tough question. Most people that shrink at physically defending themselves have no problem with calling the police to do it for them. In that case, aren't you just using the police as hired mercenaries? Do we, in the last days, take up arms to defend ourselves and our families? If someone speeds through a playground zone, do you turn the other cheek? If someone if raping a woman in an alley, do you walk on by? I think sometimes we express our belief in law, order, and social responsibility by defending those beliefs - physically if necessary. "He said to them, 'But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.' ” or in todays language... "and if you don’t have a gun, sell stuff and buy one.” RB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil D Posted November 24, 2013 Share Posted November 24, 2013 Do you see Jesus as defending Himself with a sword? I don't either.... Any reference that He made to owning a sword was in the context of fulfilling scriptures- "He was numbered among the transgressors".... So, if you use Jesus as your example, then the honest answer is that His followers would not buy a gun to defend themselves....Early Christianity for the first 300 years shows that the followers of Jesus did not defend themselves against those that gathered to put them to death..... It also allowed the greatest growth in Christianity..... so, is your religion worthy of dying for it? Quote Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted November 24, 2013 Members Share Posted November 24, 2013 Certainly glad my ancestors took up arms in the Revolutionary War... even my Quaker ancestors helped by providing ammunition and other assistance... Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted November 24, 2013 Share Posted November 24, 2013 Quote: so, is your religion worthy of dying for it? Perhaps my religion isn't, but my friendship and trust in Jesus is. "No longer do I call you servants, for a servant does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I heard from My Father I have made known to you."John 15:15 NKJV God cares!/Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 24, 2013 Share Posted November 24, 2013 Ron, there is nothing wrong with calling on the authorities or the armies of the world to do their duty, protect the citizens. These groups are used by our Lord as He sees fit to constrain evil. I note He used the armies of Babylon as His "servants" to take captive Israel. I note that many of the battles Israel engaged in they never had to use nor were they ever meant to use a sword. Jericho, Gideons band and many other examples. It was NEVER Gods intention that Israel fight for themselves, with an army, the battle was supposed to be of the Lord and Him only. His people are NEVER called to bear arms in a military campaign, UNLESS compelled to do so on pain of death by the ruling Government. A review of the Civil War in Testimonies Vol 1 puts this into perspective. Some Adventists refused to join the military on pain of death for treason. James White called that madness, he called such illogical positions suicide. Daniel did the same when the Babylonians came, he told the people not to resist, lest they be killed. They were not to fight. I note this article talks about the Jews being taken by the Nazi's, that is irrelevant to Christians. The Jews had forsaken any protection from God, they are on their own. Under the curse they pronounced upon themselves. As God will not fight for them, what they do, if they choose to bear arms is between them and their opposing force. God is not in it, if they want to live, they must fight for themselves. Not so with Christians, if need be, God will directly intervene, as he did with His representatives in the fiery furnace. But even those men said if God did not deliver them, they would still believe. To resist would have been "madness". They would accept whatever God deemed appropriate, if they die, they die. If they live, they live. Then we see Abraham saving Lot and his family. Abraham WAS the "civil authority" of that time, and God was with him. THAT was a righteous battle. Not for conquest, but to directly rescue his family. Christians should have little concern over the "politics" of war. There is nothing noble about enlisting to save the world from Islam, that to is madness to enlist when we are not forced to do so or called to do so. God will use those whom He will to restrain evil, He doesn't need to and doesn't want to use HIS people. There are plenty of others He will use as "cannon fodder" to do His will. I do not support in any way the religious fanaticism we heap on our veterans today. No one has compelled them to do anything against their will. They are aware of the dangers of war, they have made a personal choice. Some pay the ultimate price and Satan delights in their demise. As they go down to the grave with a curse on their lips and blood on their hands awaiting the second death. Satan delights in seeing the soldiers of any side being mowed down like grass. I support the missionaries, those men and women of God who volunteer to risk life and limb in answering a call to service. I support the Desmond Doss' of war, men who refused to bear arms but chose to cooperate with those whom God would use to overcome evil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted November 26, 2013 Moderators Share Posted November 26, 2013 Quote: I support the missionaries, those men and women of God who volunteer to risk life and limb in answering a call to service. I support the Desmond Doss' of war, men who refused to bear arms but chose to cooperate with those whom God would use to overcome evil. I personally know of SDAs, to include leaders (and missionaries), who beleive that it was God who sent the U.S. military in to deliver them. I participated in one such invasion in which denominational leadership told me the invasion was an answer to their prayers to God to deliver them. Quote Gregory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubV12 Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Thats a nice testimony Gregory, the Lords hand is not shortened in how He can and will protect and provide for His flock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted November 28, 2013 Moderators Share Posted November 28, 2013 Quote: I personally know of SDAs, to include leaders (and missionaries), who beleive that it was God who sent the U.S. military in to deliver them. I participated in one such invasion in which denominational leadership told me the invasion was an answer to their prayers to God to deliver them. Aren't some of those same soldiers who came to deliver them Christians too? "Christian" nations would not be where they are today if they didn't believe in bearing arms. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted November 28, 2013 Moderators Share Posted November 28, 2013 I work in a Federal hospital limited to serving the needs of military veterans. Some are very religious. Some are not. Quote Gregory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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