hch Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 ... Hamas used many millions of dollars to build extensive underground tunnels to be used to attack Israel, and buy up extensive armaments be used to attack Israel... Israel is fighting for its existence against enemies who are committed to not only destroying the state of Israel, but to wiping out the Jewish people... It brings a tear to my eye to think that to date 1000 women and children are dead in Gaza and hundreds are wounded for life if they survive because they live in a conflict zone and have nowhere to go. Even those who found refuge at a UN compound got slaughtered. And for Israel to slaughter the innocent with the guilty in the name of self preservation is a means to an end that cannot be justified. Is Hamas or Israel good in this fight? But won't it be worse when Hamas and Israel make peace? When the agencies of evil unite, won't they turn upon God's people? Not far away from this conflict zone the agencies of evil are uniting. ISIL has declared itself a caliphate and is uniting mercenaries under its leadership. ISIL claims all the territory from Saudi Arabia to the borders of Russia which includes Israel. And the US, Russia, and Iran have all united to send "advisers" to Baghdad to stop ISIL. Moral clarity does not exist while everyone is doing what is right in his own eyes. But the final events will be rapid ones. So stay tuned and be prepared to be surprised. Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Those who have all the answers to this trauma are not aware of what the questions are. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted July 31, 2014 Moderators Share Posted July 31, 2014 Quote: But won't it be worse when Hamas and Israel make peace? When the agencies of evil unite, won't they turn upon God's people? You are kidding right? Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted August 1, 2014 Moderators Share Posted August 1, 2014 Have a look at the map of Palestine from 1948 to today. It has shrunk dramatically and continues to do so. More people in less land with less resources. There is something about justice that is a central part of any peace plan. If it remains possible for Israel to annex people's land and homes and settle it, resistance should be utterly unsurprising. Demanding a peace based on the present borders combined with the right to continue expanding Israel and compressing what is left of Palestine is unjust. A solution must involve two states and fixed borders. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoarrge Posted August 1, 2014 Share Posted August 1, 2014 The "Palestinians" were already given a state. It's called Jordan. Quote To be an agent of creation is to serve the Creator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoAspen Posted August 1, 2014 Share Posted August 1, 2014 Really? Was that supposed to be a Joke, or are you serious? If you are serious, what do you base that on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted August 2, 2014 Share Posted August 2, 2014 Have a look at the map of Palestine from 1948 to today. It has shrunk dramatically and continues to do so. More people in less land with less resources. There is something about justice that is a central part of any peace plan. If it remains possible for Israel to annex people's land and homes and settle it, resistance should be utterly unsurprising. Demanding a peace based on the present borders combined with the right to continue expanding Israel and compressing what is left of Palestine is unjust. A solution must involve two states and fixed borders. Yet there never was any actual "map" of Palestine. No such country has ever existed. The worlds Palestine and Palestinian are never used in the Koran, only the term Israel. The word "Palestine" was invented after WW1, it included all the areas of Israel, Jordan and Lebanon and was a generic term for arabs that included Jewish people, that were indigenous to those areas. There very much was a presence of Jews and Jewish communities in Jerusalem and areas in modern Israel. History tells us that those Jews that survived the death camps in Poland were true refugees in every sense of the word. The Nazis had taken everything they owned, they had nothing to go back to. They were still hated after the war by people in their own countries. Hence many were repatriated to the existing Jewish Community in Israel and modern Israel grew from there. Tell me what you would have done if you were a German Jew in 1945? - Would you not have accepted resettlement in Israel, the one place in the world where you could be free to be Jewish without persecution? When Israel was declared a state, Iran, Saudi and other muslim nations actually expelled their Jewish people, they took their homes and possessions from them and forced them out of their nations and into Israel. Those Jews had no choice but to live in Israel. What concerns me it the likes of Abbas who states openly that "No Jew will ever live in Palestine". That is openly Racist and Apartheid right there and the Political Left could not care less and openly condone what he says. Where should those Jewish refugees and the generations that followed them born in Israel should go? Why do they not have the right to live in peace in Israel? Why is it that simply being identified as a Jewish business owner in France gets your business attacked in riots begun after Boycott Israel rallies? Could it be that the reason today that so many Jews continue to move to Israel to live is because its the last place in the world where you can be openly Jewish and not be persecuted? Try being openly Jewish in the Western Suburbs of Sydney and see what happens - bashing's, threats, places of worship vandalized seem to be all to common place in a western nation like Australia today. Seems that not a lot has changed since 1936 and the rise of Hitler... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hch Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Quote: But won't it be worse when Hamas and Israel make peace? When the agencies of evil unite, won't they turn upon God's people? You are kidding right? Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliensanctuary Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Perhaps radical Islam has been given a mandate by the Creator to destroy Western Civilization, including the democracies that have permitted so much evil to go unchecked, and in fact, have promoted grossly evil practices as "freedom". Once the USA is neutralized, then, goodbye Israel. Not that those practicing radical Islam are saints, it's just their job to destroy nations flouting the laws of YHVH. Quote The Parable of the Lamb and the Pigpen https://www.createspace.com/3401451 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted August 4, 2014 Moderators Share Posted August 4, 2014 What do you think? Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoAspen Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Or any other war in which Christianity initiated!! I reckon it depends on which side you are on!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoarrge Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Really? Was that supposed to be a Joke, or are you serious? If you are serious, what do you base that on? History. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Mandate_for_Palestine_(legal_instrument)#Transjordan] Quote To be an agent of creation is to serve the Creator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeHiscost Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Originally Posted By: EGW "He bids them behold the vast confederacy of evil arrayed against God, against Christ, against all who unite with these holy powers. Christ tells them they were to fight in fellowship with all the children of light; that satanic agencies would combine their forces to extinguish the light of the life of Christ out of their ranks.{16MR 204.4} Did you also apply this quote to the war in the former Yugoslavia, the Congo, Soviet Union v Afghan Mujaheddin? i guess not. I didn't know the intent nor even the context of who that particular quote was about nor who it was addressed to, but I would suggest if you consider the bigger picture of the warfare between good and evil, especially knowing that true goodness always is derived from Jesus(God) and evil committed is always derived from satanic agencies, it isn't too difficult to draw conclusions different than what appears to be immediately obvious. "And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed."Genesis 12:3 KJV God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted August 5, 2014 Moderators Share Posted August 5, 2014 I didn't know the intent nor even the context of who that particular quote was about nor who it was addressed to, but I would suggest if you consider the bigger picture of the warfare between good and evil, especially knowing that true goodness always is derived from Jesus(God) and evil committed is always derived from satanic agencies, it isn't too difficult to draw conclusions different than what appears to be immediately obvious. I'm not disputing the quote itself, I'm questioning its application to Gaza or any other war so far in earth's history. BTW, whose side was God on in the American civil war? Were they both good, both evil, or one good and one evil? Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hch Posted August 6, 2014 Share Posted August 6, 2014 I'm not disputing the quote itself, I'm questioning its application to Gaza or any other war so far in earth's history. Everything comes to an end in the world as we know it. Bible prophecy has an end as well. "we know in part, and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away." (1 Cor 13:9-10) We have arrived at the time when that which is in part is to be done away. [This morning, I published my most comprehensive study of Daniel and Revelation to date (America, the Obama Nation). And I am very confident that the third angel's message is about to go viral and God is going to wrap it up. It is like the frog has been in the water for 6000-years and the heat has been turned up ever so slightly until now when everything is culminating. If Jesus does not come soon, there will not be anyone left to redeem. It's in the book you can check it out at http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/DanielsRevelation if interested put in the promo code LJSD14 any you will save a few bucks on postage.] After you have looked at the bigger picture, I don't think you will question the application of the SOP quote. But maybe you will see something that I missed? Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliensanctuary Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Noteworthy is the underwhelming support of the Arab nations for Hamas and its bedfellows, according to news reports. They don't want Hamas in their countries, either. Quote The Parable of the Lamb and the Pigpen https://www.createspace.com/3401451 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 That is because Hamas dig tunnels into egypt and kill egyptian soldiers also and their government has also had enough of it and surprise surprise wants to protect their own people from Hamas who are a violent terrorist organization, not just a political party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators lazarus Posted August 7, 2014 Moderators Share Posted August 7, 2014 Noteworthy is the underwhelming support of the Arab nations for Hamas and its bedfellows, according to news reports. They don't want Hamas in their countries, either. Why would Arab dictatorships support a radical populist movement? They want American money just as much as the Israelis do. Egypt is just as willing as Israel to support the slaughter of innocent people. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted August 8, 2014 Author Members Share Posted August 8, 2014 With Rifle and Baby in Hand Hamas’ perversely brilliant strategy in using human shields should serve as a wakeup call to all of humanity. http://www.aish.com/ci/s/With-Rifle-and-Baby-in-Hand.html Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 It brings a tear to my eye to think that to date 1000 women and children are dead in Gaza and hundreds are wounded for life if they survive because they live in a conflict zone and have nowhere to go. Even those who found refuge at a UN compound got slaughtered. And for Israel to slaughter the innocent with the guilty in the name of self preservation is a means to an end that cannot be justified. Is Hamas or Israel good in this fight? But won't it be worse when Hamas and Israel make peace? When the agencies of evil unite, won't they turn upon God's people? Not far away from this conflict zone the agencies of evil are uniting. ISIL has declared itself a caliphate and is uniting mercenaries under its leadership. ISIL claims all the territory from Saudi Arabia to the borders of Russia which includes Israel. And the US, Russia, and Iran have all united to send "advisers" to Baghdad to stop ISIL. Moral clarity does not exist while everyone is doing what is right in his own eyes. But the final events will be rapid ones. So stay tuned and be prepared to be surprised. Israel goes a long way to limit civilian casualties. They were condemned for bombing a hospital, but nobody says what happened before they bombed the hospital where Hamas was storing and from which it was firing rockets into Israel. 30 minutes before Israel bombed the hospital they called and asked if there were any patients or medical personnel in the hospital. They were told no there weren't when the question was asked multiple times. So, they bomb a hospital from which they were being attacked and which they were repeatedly told had no civilians in it. What happened? They were lied to by Hamas. What would you do if where you lived was under attack by people who hid behind children, wounded, etc... when they attacked your home and town. Would you demand that your government allow your home and town to be attacked because the attackers were using human shields? What if this had been going on for a decade? Would you still think that your family and neighbors should die because the human shields might be killed if your government attacked the people killing your family, friends, and neighbors? Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 That is because Hamas dig tunnels into egypt and kill egyptian soldiers also and their government has also had enough of it and surprise surprise wants to protect their own people from Hamas who are a violent terrorist organization, not just a political party. Now you know why the Egyptian army overthrew the Muslim Brotherhood government. Hamas is an arm of the Muslim Brotherhood. They are one and the same in all things other than name. And our dear Obama was ticked off when the Egyptians threw the Muslim Brotherhood out of office. He was also giving the Brotherhood major armaments to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars a year while they had control of Egypt. Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted August 9, 2014 Author Members Share Posted August 9, 2014 On that note, here's an interesting tidbit: The Mysterious Missing Rocket Photos Journalists in Gaza are intimidated and threatened by Hamas. www.aish.com/jw/mo/The-Mysterious-Missing-Rocket-Photos.html Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whbae Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 I was surprise and disappointed when I learned that Pres. Jimmy Carter was against Israel and wants Hamas to be recognized as a legitimate government organization. How naiive can Pres. Carter be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phkrause Posted August 11, 2014 Author Members Share Posted August 11, 2014 I'm with you whbae, I disagree with Pres Carter on this issue. I really like him as an individual, and for the many things he has done for so many people. Quote phkrause By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Bravus Posted August 11, 2014 Moderators Share Posted August 11, 2014 Any claim that all the evil is on one side and all the good on the other in this conflict cannot be called 'moral clarity'. I don't care which way around people have it, it's moral confusion to absolve *either* side of its crimes. Quote Truth is important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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