Chrislam in the Church of England

[Sojourner]

No real surprise to see that the Liberal leaning C of E has moved to the embrace of islam. I would suggest to you that the same thing will likely become a cornerstone of the Presbyterian and other liberal churches also as the Evangelicals enter into persecution for refusing to modify our beliefs in the same way. 

 

http://www.charismanews.com/world/48756-church-of-england-pastor-welcomes-muslim-prayer-service

[Tom Wetmore]

I would not be so quick to judge and condemn this. The One we follow, said "Love your enemies... Do good to those who wrong you... GO the second mile..." He also was greatly upset at the temple when the one temple courtyard reserved for gentiles to worship and pray was filled up with temple merchants. His proclamation was that His Father's House was to be a place of prayer for ALL people. Not just those who believed in Him, not just for the Jews, but ALL people.

[JoeMo]

I agree with everything Tom said; but I disagree with one premise of the article, which stated that "He [Rev Goddard] claimed: "It is the same God, we share a tradition."

 

Allah is NOT the same god is YHVH.  He is an ancient moon and war deity that was chosen by Muhammed as the "one God".  He is the polar opposite of YHVH. I would go so far as to state that IMHO, Allah will be the power behind the Antichrist.

[Tom Wetmore]

Then perhaps you might explain to the entire Arabic speaking Chritians and Indonesian/Malaysian Chrisitans why in their Bible the name of God is Allah. I listened to prayers being offered to Allah in Adventist churches while living in Indonesia. It is simple the Arabic and Indonesian word for God.

One explanation - http://christiananswers.net/q-eden/allah.html

[JoeMo]

I agree that Allah is an Arab word for god, and have no problem with Arab and Indonesian Christians referring to God as Allah.  To clarify my point.  the Being of reference when Christians use the name Allah is a different Being than the one being addressed in the Koran

 

The article on the website you posted even states that "It is a question of whether you can say you are worshipping the same God when you have such different understandings of the nature of God. Those who are troubled by this concern say that although Christians and Muslims use the same name for God and many of the same words to describe Him, they are not talking about the same God".  Part of that is the "One God vs. a Triune God" thing.  But when you compare the character of the God of the Bible vs. the god of the Koran, you will find they are polar opposites.

 

Just because an entity is called god doesn't mean he/she is "the God".  satan wants to be god.  The Caesars wanted to be gods.  Some SDA's believe that the Pope wants to be god.  In that sense, Allah sounds more like a title than a name.

 

I will retract my assertion that the Islamic Allah was the name of a moon-god.  Upon further research, the moon-god was Hubal; whose statue is in the Kabaal (the most sacred place in Islam).  That being said, both Muhammad and his enemies clearly identified Hubal and Allah as different gods.

[Tom Wetmore]

Thanks for withdrawing the moon god thing... I didn't have time to correct that common misperception. But sooner or later...

[whbae]

God the Muslims worship is the same God, the creator of universe.

[LifeHiscost]

God the Muslims worship is the same God, the creator of universe.

Since it is seen as the same god, supposedly the same One worshiped, why do those of the Islamic faith use the Qur'an as their holy book when it gives the direct opposite instruction for their followers than Jesus gives His followers?

 

…29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. 30"I and the Father are one."...John 10

 

…15Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God. 16We have come to know and have believed the love which God has for us. God is love, and the one who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him....1 John 4

 

27"But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.…Luke 6

 

 

 

Sahih International

You will find others who wish to obtain security from you and [to] obtain security from their people. Every time they are returned to [the influence of] disbelief, they fall back into it. So if they do not withdraw from you or offer you peace or restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you overtake them. And those - We have made for you against them a clear authorization.

 

Sahih International 4:101

And when you travel throughout the land, there is no blame upon you for shortening the prayer, [especially] if you fear that those who disbelieve may disrupt [or attack] you. Indeed, the disbelievers are ever to you a clear enemy.

 

 

God is Love!  Jesus saves! 

[whbae]

I made a mistake in my previous post.  I wrote the God muslims worship is the same God, the creator.  I meant to say  it is not the same God, the creator.

 

We all know about story of Joseph who was tempted and to be seduced by his employer's wife, but he went to jail my dishonest trial.

In Koran, it states that later Joseph married this woman!

[Gregory Matthews]

Please cite the chapter and verse where the Quran says that Joseph married her.

 

Le! us talk a bit about the story of Joseph, which in the Quran is found in Surat (Chapter) 12:

 

1) Surat 12 is divided into 12 sections with a total of 111 verses. 

 

2) Depending on the English translation of the Quran, Joseph is sometimes written as Joseph and other times as Yusuf.

 

3) Potiphar is written as Aziz, which may be title as Joseph was called by that name after he was restored.

 

4) Joseph is restored after Potiphar's wife confesses that she falsely accused Joseph of sin, see verses 51 -53.

 

5) it is probable that Potiphar had died by that time, although the Quran does not say so.

 

I do not find that Surat 12 tells us that Joseph married Potiphar's wife.  So, where did the idea come from that he did.

 

It probably came from a group of legends that surround the life and times of Joseph.  One of these does say that Joseph did marry Potiphar's  wife.  But, there is another that says that Joseph married Potiphar's daughter. 

 

In any case, Anna Patricio Byrd wrote a novel titled ASENATH (as I recall in 2012)  which is a fictionalized account of the life of Joseph which is based largely on the legends that she collected about Joseph. 

 

Your source for that idea probably came from her novel.

 

But, If you can find a source in the Quran, please cite chapter and verse as I would like to read it.

 

Actually the story of Joseph and Aseneth has a substantial basis in  Jewish literature.  For more on this see:

 

http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/1905-asenath

[whbae]

I had conversations with this muslim patient of mine who is from Morocco. During the conversation she offered me a book of Koran, but it took her a long time to get it for me.  She told me that for me to understand Koran she thought it would best for me to read "children's version" and it took her a long time to find one.  I read the book through here and there. I found the book is written in very  childish way.  I read about the story of Joseph.  Since the book was childish and I did not believe the story of Joseph I threw the book away so I cannot tell you the information you ask.  If you are really interested in finding out I can ask her to get me another copy.