Are the three Angels' Messages Dead or Alive?

[hch]

18 hours ago, Robert said:

Also keep in mind that the delusions through this 1st beast almost deceive the very elect.  Many question how the 2nd beast (USA, at some future point) could renounce its constitution, especially the first amendment, in favor of Romanism. Well, its really not a difficult scenario at all.  

Some future point? Surely it will not always be in the future. How will we know when we have arrived at that future point? Hasn't America repudiated every principle in the Constitution? We have a president issuing presidential orders that are the law of the land as long as he says so with the inept congress dumbfounded as to how to stop him.

If what you are describing (papal delusions) is the ecumenical movement, has that not happened? The world wondered after Pope John-Paul II and now it is wondering after Francis.

"I will show unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters"  (Revelation 17:1)

Doesn't that happen during the Judgment Hour? after 22 October 1844? Angel 1 Judgment hour repeats - judgment of the living. Angel 2 Babylon falls repeats-because of her fornication.

"With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication" (17:2)

Didn't the fornication of RC priests bring down Pope Benedict? Angel 2 repeated the fall of Babylon in the press that publicized the RC priests fornication with boys. Then weren't "the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication" when the Supreme Court ruled that the fornication of the RC's priests is now the law in America: marriage is now the union of a man with a man?

The first 2 angels have repeated their messages. But the Remnant Church has been silent. The news media has been doing our job.

The third angel is about to sound "Don't take the Mark of the Beast" and those who refuse to take it will be martyred.

"And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration" (17:6).

No it is not really a difficult scenario to follow.

But those deceived who would be the very elect who are afraid- to fearful of what folks will think to say anything about the 3rd angel's message before it is upon us because they don't want to be embarrassed if they don't have everything right will pay the consequences.

 "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" (21:8).

[hch]

9 hours ago, Nic Samojluk said:

When James Gilley retired, the 3ABN board elected Danny Shelton back to the presidency.

My suggestion to improve the message of 3ABN is to include the protection of the right to life of the unborn. The Catholic Church is wrong on many fundamental doctrines, but Rome is right on the sanctity of human life. Their hospitals refuse to offer abortion services to their patients.

This will grant Rome the high moral ground when they attempt to impose Sunday as the obligatory day of rest. They will argue: "Look at these Adventists! They believe that worshiping God on Sunday is wrong, but they see nothing wrong with killing innocent unborn children for profit."

Nic,

It is interesting how many members of the RC (Remnant Church) and the RC (Roman Church) are so distinctly different on the Sabbath issue and so indistinguishable on this issue. Is it possible that emotional issues will have more to do with salvation than Bible based theology?

The 3 angels' messages were emotional issues when they were first preached. Now they have become old news - history. Since the emotional impact of the timing of the messages has faded (the Judgment Hour of the Dead has past and most likely the time allotted for the Judgment Hour of the living has past as well and the time of dispensing the Judgment upon the ungodly is about to overtake us),is Satan stirring up our emotions to get us off message?

[Kevin H]

9 hours ago, hch said:

Gerry,

So those who are muzzling our evangelists are killing the 3 Angels' messages?

The problem is that the evangelists have a partial understanding and they have built traditions on top of them, then pile tradition upon tradition and these traditions about the 3 angle's messages are what have replaced the 3 angel's messages.

[hch]

38 minutes ago, Kevin H said:

The problem is that the evangelists have a partial understanding and they have built traditions on top of them, then pile tradition upon tradition and these traditions about the 3 angle's messages are what have replaced the 3 angel's messages.

Kevin,

Knock me off my chair while you're at it.  It looks like you've seen that huge pink elephant in the center of the room. But who else is willing to see it? And what are we to doe with it? about it? or to it? Laodiceans are notorious about being in need of nothing and they ignore anything that does not fit into their perception. It sure is not like it used to be when we would open a Bible and study the Bible. Now we have canned Bible studies that use those notorious proof texts. Yes the ones that have nothing to do with the subject, but if they did they would really sound good.

Someone preaching from the pulpit at our church wanted to make a point about taking the blood of the sacrifice into the sanctuary so he  added a text to his presentation that was totally out of context. When I mentioned that this was only done under special circumstances and was not the normal, he replied "I know that but I wanted to make my point." The problem with that line of thinking is that it is wrong to teach error to make no matter how good the motives might have been.

Thanks for your comment, Now how do we fix the problem? Or do we just let the 3 angels' messages die off when the third is about to meet its fulfillment?

[Robert]

11 hours ago, hch said:

Hasn't America repudiated every principle in the Constitution?

No, it hasn't. Neither has fire come down from heaven in the sight of men by the 1st beast.  Babylon has not yet fallen....

[Gerr]

15 hours ago, hch said:

Gerry,

So those who are muzzling our evangelists are killing the 3 Angels' messages?

Fortunately, the evangelists that I see on TV are not the least bit influenced by these revisionists.

[Aliensanctuary]

As I see it, the book of Rev is all set in the future, including the 3 Angel's Messages, perhaps presented to the world by the 2 Witnesses who may be machines. This won't be some watered-down religious presentation by man-made denominations, but a stark warning to all of those in rebellion against YHVH and his Kingdom. I believe that this presentation takes place after the 2nd Resurrection where all of humanity will be given the opportunity to understand what the Kingdom of YHVH is all about. All man-made religions will be discarded on the garbage pile of human history at this time, along with Darwinism and Evolution. Those who receive YHVH's mark of ownership on thier foreheads will be safe, even if they die, but those who receive the Mark of the Beast do not fare so well.

[hch]

11 hours ago, Robert said:

No, it hasn't. Neither has fire come down from heaven in the sight of men by the 1st beast.  Babylon has not yet fallen....

Robert,

How can you be sure?

The victims in the once Christian enclaves of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were eye witnesses of the 2 beast calling fire down from heaven.  And in the sight of many, because of the pedophile priest scandals, Babylon has fallen from her role as the world's moral leader.

And we could ask about the drone fire that Obama's military is using today.

Quote

 

"Satan's power would increase, and some of his devoted followers would have power to work miracles, and even to bring down fire from heaven in the sight of men. I was shown that these modern magicians would yet account for all the miracles...on the earth, were accomplished by this same power. I was pointed back to the time of Moses, and saw the signs and wonders which God wrought through him before Pharaoh, most of which were imitated by the magicians of Egypt; and that just before the final deliverance of the saints God would work powerfully for his people, and these modern magicians would be permitted to imitate the work of God."  {ExV 47.3}

 

If the modern magicians (scientists, munitions experts, etc.) are counterfeiting the miracles that have been foretold, are we as up to date on our understanding of endtime events as we need to be on the eve of Christ's Advent?

Didn't the Jews expect the Messiah to fulfill prophecy according to their way of thinking? And when Jesus came, He did not fit into their scenario? So if our endtime scenario is not completely in harmony with Scriptures, are we not in danger of doing the same thing? 

[hch]

9 hours ago, Gerry Cabalo said:

Fortunately, the evangelists that I see on TV are not the least bit influenced by these revisionists.

Gerry,

I wish I could be that confident about the tele-evangelists that I see. But I generally only watch SDA evangelists.

[hch]

6 hours ago, The Wanderer said:

Hello hch, May I ask if you have made a decision that the 3 angels are relevant or not? Just trying to see more where you are coming from.

Wanderer,

The Bible depicts the 3 angels as flying through heaven (urgency), crying aloud (imperative warning to the inhabitants of the earth), etc. Do you see those who have been given the responsibility of being God's agents on earth demonstrate urgency in giving the 3 angels' warning to our fellow men? 

[hch]

2 hours ago, Aliensanctuary said:

As I see it, the book of Rev is all set in the future, including the 3 Angel's Messages, perhaps presented to the world by the 2 Witnesses who may be machines. This won't be some watered-down religious presentation by man-made denominations, but a stark warning to all of those in rebellion against YHVH and his Kingdom. I believe that this presentation takes place after the 2nd Resurrection where all of humanity will be given the opportunity to understand what the Kingdom of YHVH is all about. All man-made religions will be discarded on the garbage pile of human history at this time, along with Darwinism and Evolution. Those who receive YHVH's mark of ownership on thier foreheads will be safe, even if they die, but those who receive the Mark of the Beast do not fare so well.

Aliens...

When I first read your note, I intended to write something entirely different. But now that I have reread it a few times:

it is as though you are saying-- Prophecies are not for the church now, but that at some time in the future it would be necessary for the church to receive it. 

Beware: "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children" (Hosea 4:6).

[hch]

 

Quote

The doctrine of the world's conversion and the spiritual reign of Christ was not held by the apostolic church. It was not generally accepted by Christians until about the beginning of the eighteenth century. Like every other error, its results were evil. It taught men to look far in the future for the coming of the Lord, and prevented them from giving heed to the signs heralding his approach. It induced a feeling of confidence and security that was not well founded, and led many to neglect the preparation necessary in order to meet their Lord.  {GC88 321.1}

[Gerr]

6 hours ago, hch said:

Gerry,

I wish I could be that confident about the tele-evangelists that I see. But I generally only watch SDA evangelists.

I am referring to Adventist evangelists. I don't know of any televangelists who are preaching the 3 Angels' messages.

[hch]

2 hours ago, The Wanderer said:

I don't understand the idea of "flying through heaven" as depicting "urgency." Would be interested to hear why/how you come to that conclusion. I think it's pretty easy to see that many who are commissioned to give the three angels message do not have ideas of "urgency" in their minds when they do it. But it would depend on who we are talking about.

Wanderer,

My studies have led me to understand that the 3 angels' messages first appeared in Daniel.

Chapter 4: Angel 1 the hour of King Nebuchadnezzar's judgment came "The same hour was the thing fulfilled upon Nebuchadnezzar" (Daniel 4:33).

Chapter 5: Angel 2 Babylon fell. "In that night was Belshazzar the king of the Chaldeans slain" (5:30) and Babylon fell to the Medes and the Persians.

Chapter 6: Angel 3 Worship God not the beast. "whosoever shall ask a petition of any God or man for thirty days, save of thee, O king, he shall be cast into the den of lions. Now, O king, establish the decree, and sign the writing, that it be not changed, according to the law of the Medes and Persians, which altereth not. Wherefore king Darius signed the writing and the decree" (Daniel 6:7-9).

The significance of flying angels is also disclosed in Daniel. "Yea, whiles I [was] speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation" (9:21).

When Gabriel was commissioned to take a message of comfort to a stressed prophet, he did not dilly dally. The more important (a life or death message) the more urgent its deliverance is. If the flying 3 angels' messages are not all that important (as some who have become complacent may think) what's the rush? Probation will close unexpectedly, sinners will be doomed, and the Laodiceans who become the 10 Virgins (5 wise and 5 foolish) will meet the Bridegroom. Are the Wise Virgins those who hastened to prepare and those who did not see the need to rush? I'll let you ponder that question.

[hch]

18 hours ago, Gerry Cabalo said:

Fortunately, the evangelists that I see on TV are not the least bit influenced by these revisionists. ...

3 hours ago, Gerry Cabalo said:

I am referring to Adventist evangelists. I don't know of any televangelists who are preaching the 3 Angels' messages.

 

Gerry,

I was afraid that was what you were saying. The 1st angel's message was of the Judgment Hour of the dead commenced. The 2nd angel's message was of the fall of Babylon. And the 3rd angel's message is of the Mark of the Beast: obey man rather than God.

I hear SDA evangelists talking about the judgment of the dead, but not the living. I hear SDA evangelists talking about the papal Babylon, but not the fall of apostate Protestant Babylon. I hear SDA evangelists talking about there will be a mark of the beast someday, but not the specifics that are readily available in Daniel and Revelation as they relate to our day.

It is pitiful! Too little to late.

[JoeMo]

9 hours ago, hch said:

But I generally only watch SDA evangelists.

You need to expand your horizons.  You might learn something new.  Check out Joseph Prince, Sid Roth, Perry Stone, Bill Johnson, Chuck Missler  or Rabbi Kirt Schneider - to name a few.

[hch]

5 minutes ago, JoeMo said:

You need to expand your horizons.  You might learn something new.  Check out Joseph Prince, Sid Roth, Perry Stone, Bill Johnson, Chuck Missler  or Rabbi Kirt Schneider - to name a few.

Hey JoeMo,

Though I generally "watch" SDA evangelists (B, B, & N put me to sleep) I listen to lots of non-SDA evangelists when I'm driving: They keep me awake.

But I must admit that I have not heard of any of the ones that you mentioned above.

[hch]

7 minutes ago, The Wanderer said:

Thank you for the reply, and the food for thought. I have more to comment on later when time permits but for now, was wondering about the angels "flying swiftly."  I have wondered if, rather than how fast, we do the work of the three angels message, it was, instead, more urgent, as in the sense of how important is it to us personally? Do we "fly swiftly" in order to cover more ground, faster, or because it is so important? I don't know if I am making sense yet, but I have to run for now. Look forward to more discussion here.

Wanderer,

Both angels appear to be included. How far did Jesus say the gospel would get before He returns? He said take it to all the world, but He also said how far it would actually get.

[Buzzards]

On 4/26/2016 at 2:47 PM, hch said:

Wanderer,

 

The significance of flying angels is also disclosed in Daniel. "Yea, whiles I [was] speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation" (9:21).

 

Quote

 

Dan.9:19

O Lord, hear; O Lord, forgive; O Lord, hearken and do; defer not, for thine own sake,

O my God: for thy city and thy people are called by thy name.

20 And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel,

and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;

 

for thine own sake,

Maybe its because the SDA's want the message to come to vindicate them; and not God;

hopefully I don't get in trouble for that statement;

but I read somewhere she said,  if the SDA's don't take the message and run with it;

he will give it to someone else

[Robert]

http://www.jacksequeira.org/3angels1.htm

[Kevin H]

I like Buzzards "Maybe its because the SDA's want the message to come to vindicate them; and not God" 

I'm sorry that I have not written more on this thread than I have. Been busy. But actually the 3 angels have been a major theme of most of my posts here.  Some of the basics are as we look at the chiasm of Revelation, the center is the 3 beasts on one side and the 3 angels on the other with the point being between of "Who shall be able to stand" and it is the 144,000 in the center. So this is the capstone of Revelation. It is a miracle that being unaware of Chiastic structures we hit right on the important parts.

It is a theme in scripture where especially the numbers 2 and 3 keep appearing. The 2 aspects of God, infinite/impersonal yet finite and personal. The infinite/impersonal aspects which are outside of time and space and which can only be described as "Holy, Holy, Holy" and the finite personal being the 3 manifestations of the trinity: God as power, God as friend and personality, and these two being objective manifestations of God, with God as Holy Spirit being a subjective revelation.

The law of God of self sacrificing love: the 2 great principles of Love God supremely and love your neighbor as yourself and the 3 aspects of the Exodus 20 version of the 10 commandments. (there are other versions, such as Deuteronomy 5 and a  number of those with the text "Do not boil a kid in it's mother's milk" are in a list of 10 commandments) but the Exodus 20 version breaks into 3 parts that correspond to the 3 angel's messages.

Then there are the 3 deceptions of Satan. A whole bunch of 3s in the Bible and finally the 3 deceptions of Satan personified in the 3 beasts and fully answered by the 3 angel's messages.

 

[hch]

21 hours ago, Buzzards said:

for thine own sake,

Maybe its because the SDA's want the message to come to vindicate them; and not God;

hopefully I don't get in trouble for that statement;

but I read somewhere she said,  if the SDA's don't take the message and run with it;

he will give it to someone else

Buzzards,

As I read the Spirit of Prophecy, it repeats the message in revelation to the churches: If the churches let their light go out God will put another candlestick in their place.  It also says that there will always be 7 (the number of completeness continues to the end).

[hch]

Could we conclude that there is nothing wrong with the 3 angels' messages?

Is this an instance where the Lord needs to kill the messengers?

[Gerr]

On ‎4‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 6:54 AM, hch said:

Gerry,

So those who are muzzling our evangelists are killing the 3 Angels' messages?

Human power did not establish the work of God, neither can human power destroy it. To those who carry forward His work in face of difficulty and opposition, God will give the constant guidance and guardianship of His holy angels. His work on earth will never cease. The building of His spiritual temple will be carried forward until it shall stand complete,

 

White, E. G. (1973). God’s Amazing Grace (p. 128). Review and Herald Publishing Association.

[hch]

On ‎4‎/‎30‎/‎2016 at 9:23 AM, Gerry Cabalo said:

Human power did not establish the work of God, neither can human power destroy it. To those who carry forward His work in face of difficulty and opposition, God will give the constant guidance and guardianship of His holy angels. His work on earth will never cease. The building of His spiritual temple will be carried forward until it shall stand complete,

 

White, E. G. (1973). God’s Amazing Grace (p. 128). Review and Herald Publishing Association.

Quote

 In great distress I awoke. I went to sleep again, and I seemed to be in a large gathering. One of authority was addressing the company, before whom was spread out a map of the world. He said that the map pictured God's vineyard, which must be cultivated. As light from heaven shone upon anyone, that one was to reflect the light to others. Lights were to be kindled in many places, and from these lights still other lights were to be kindled.  {9T 28.2} 
     The words were repeated: "Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savor, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden underfoot of men. Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." Matthew 5:13-16.  {9T 28.3} 
     I saw jets of light shining from cities and villages, and from the high places and the low places of the earth. God's word was obeyed, and as a result there were memorials for Him in every city and village. His truth was proclaimed throughout the world.  {9T 28.4} 
     Then this map was removed and another put in its place. On it light was shining from a few places only. The rest of the world was in darkness, with only a glimmer of light here and there. Our Instructor said: "This darkness is the result of men's following their own course. They have cherished hereditary and cultivated tendencies to evil. They have made questioning and faultfinding and accusing the chief business of their  lives. Their hearts are not right with God. They have hidden their light under a bushel."  {9T 29.1} 
     If every soldier of Christ had done his duty, if every watchman on the walls of Zion had given the trumpet a certain sound, the world might ere this have heard the message of warning. But the work is years behind. While men have slept, Satan has stolen a march upon us."   {9T 29.2}