With new executive order, Trump takes aim at church-state wall

[phkrause]

The timing of the event was clearly awkward. On Wednesday night, one of Donald Trump’s lawyers unexpectedly told a national television audience that the president repaid a different lawyer for the hush-money payoff he made to a porn star before the election. On Thursday morning, Trump hosted a National Day of Prayer event at the White House with a group of allied religious leaders.

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/new-executive-order-trump-takes-aim-church-state-wall

[hch]

phkrause,

 

Thanks for sharing this.

 

I continue to watch prophecy unfold and wonder how this or that current event will impact us in the last days?

 

Some who claim to see: see not.
Those who have ears; hear not and are different from those who hear.

 

The promise is that the wise will understand.

(But many have told me that the wise is not speaking about me.)

 

It is not my place to inspire a heart. The Holy Spirit does that.

 

By faith, I tell what I understand at the time I know it!
By faith, I grow in knowledge as the LORD leads.

 

By faith, I followed prophecy to Albert Arnold  Gore II (666) and declared that he was the last American President.
GW was 664 by my count before the election  when I believed that 666 was prophesied to appear.

 

By faith, I could not see past GW when he usurped the office (if all of Florida had been recounted Gore would have won).
By faith, I could not see Barack Obama as President.

 

Then knowledge increased and I learned that GW and Obama (the two were as though they were one)

 

By faith, I saw Obama as America's last President. Then came Trump.

 

The study is sound, the  Bible is true, so how did I have so many inconsistencies with reality vs prophecy.

 

By faith, I asked the LORD how I could be so close and miss calling the prophecies correctly.

Then He allowed me to call that Benedict XVI would not be pope after the spring of 2013 (called that from September 2011-September 2012)

 

And now 'the LORD has allowed me to understand where President Trump is in Bible prophecy and that President Pence will follow him.

 

Because President Michael Pence stands for his people,
Christ will stand for His people.

 

This is my understanding by faith. 

So the question that follows, is it important to have a ball park understanding of prophecy before it is fulfilled?

Or should we wait until it happens to be sure?

 

Should we say nothing because we might not have the complete picture?

And wait until we are certain?

 

It is dangerous to go  forward in faith.

 

But Those who fail to go forward by faith will have a very difficult time when the endtime prophecies are fulfilled.

 

The old adage is not to throw out the baby with the wash water.

 

I published this book predicting that President Pence is the man of prophecy 2 February 2018.
It IS May. The saga around the Trump Presidency makes it look so shaky that I wonder how much longer can he reign????

 

The war between the US and Iran (Iran attacks US fleet in Persian Gulf) is soon to take place and endtime events will be rapid ones!

 

And now you show us that President is taking aim at the wall that separates church and state.

 

If ever there was a time to go forward by faith, it is now.

But expressing our faith will have  consequences!

 

It was true in Noah's Day. By faith he entered the ark.

And By faith (or presumption?) multitudes di not enter the ark.

https://www.amazon.com/Highest-Loyalty-Truth-Larceny-Dawning-ebook/dp/B07C7DRPVS/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1524479061&sr=8-3&keywords=the+highest+loyalty

 

[Gregory Matthews]

HCH:  the central issues in your string of false predictions is not the Bible.  It is not God.  It is you and your approach to the Bible in which you read into the Biblical message what you want it to say instead of allowing the Bible to tell you what it is saying. God does not stop people form doing that.

[B/W Photodude]

23 hours ago, hch said:

By faith, I followed prophecy to Albert Arnold  Gore II (666) and declared that he was the last American President.

 

By faith, I could not see Barack Obama as President.

 

By faith, I saw Obama as America's last President.

How is that faith thing working out for you?

[hch]

10 hours ago, Gregory Matthews said:

HCH:  the central issues in your string of false predictions is not the Bible.  It is not God.  It is you and your approach to the Bible in which you read into the Biblical message what you want it to say instead of allowing the Bible to tell you what it is saying. God does not stop people form doing that.

Gregory,

I understand how you came up with that assessment (though many people who know me personally would say it is erroneous).

But when an individual diligently studies the Scriptures to show himself approved of God, his scope of experiences will be unique. Others will not have the same perspectives when they do not share the same journey on their pursuit for truth.

This thread interests me because of President Trump's actions that appear to align with Bible prophecy depiction of endtime events.

I have read the prophecy of Daniel 7 to say that as the three kings were plucked up (Visigoths 508, Vandals, and Ostrogoths 538) from the area that composed the Western Roman Empire.

Thus I have been watching to see the same actions by America in the area that composed the Eastern Roman Empire in the endtime.  Afghanistan and Iraq have been invaded by America. So I anticipate a third Islamic nation to be at war with America. [As there was a fourth power (the Heruli) in ancient times, there is Syria today. I do not see that Syria fits the prophecy.]

Iran links to Chittim identified in Daniel 11. Chittim historically linked to a Greek Island in the Mediterranean sea. The Alexander the  Great (Greeks) conquered Iran. So I am watching Iran.

And it is very helpful when folks like  phkrause find a piece of the puzzle.

[hch]

9 hours ago, The Wanderer said:

Hch. We cannot compare Pence or anyone else with Christ. Pence could never match the "standing up" that Christ will do

PS  its against forum rules to ask members for money

Men cannot be compared to Christ. 

But when Bible prophecy declares that "Michael shall stand for his people" and there is a Michael that links to the "last power that will wage war against God's people" who is in a position that he is about to be given the opportunity to show his colors, I would be like an ostrich if I did not share what I know at this time in history. 

God's people are called to be watchmen.

A watchman that does not sound the alarm puts his very life in danger.

Those that hear the warning are responsible for how they respond or fail to respond.

[hch]

9 hours ago, The Wanderer said:

well one has to wonder what is meant by "allied religious leaders."

Didn't Jesus say that all roads do not lead to heaven? 

It does appear that there is now a movement of "allied religious leaders" that do teach that there are many roads that lead to God.

Is the One Way just as good as another?

Should we take notice that different denominations are trampling down the barriers that once divided them? 

Should that concern us?

[hch]

52 minutes ago, B/W Photodude said:

How is that faith thing working out for you?

B/W Photodude, 

It is working out quite well. Thanks

Though I have been through the school of hard knocks, I know more about God's love, leading, and Bible prophecy than ever before. (Knowledge IS increasing)

God's word is TRUE and His promises are SURE!

I have been watching Iran for more than 5 years and tweeting that it is going to attack America's fleet in the Persian Gulf.

I even tweeted that I expected it long before this. (Right event bad timing)

Then President Obama made a deal with Iran and folks laughed that I was in left field.

But President Obama could not get his deal with Iran through the Senate so he made a Presidential agreement.

Now President Trump is ready to decertify that agreement and make it collapse.

Daniel 11 says that the Ships of Chittim will attack.

Chittim relates to Javen (Greeks) and they went as far as India (they got to Iran)

There is an excellent explanation of Iran being Chittim and why they will attack the US fleet in the Persian Gulf

[and the  evidence that they have told us as much] in the book "The Highest Loyalty" if you are interested.

here's the link https://www.amazon.com/Highest-Loyalty-Truth-Larceny-Dawning-ebook/dp/B07C7DRPVS/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1524479061&sr=8-3&keywords=the+highest+loyalty

 

[Gregory Matthews]

Phkrause began this thread with a focus in mind.

It now appears to have been hijacked.

It is very close to being closed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[B/W Photodude]

1 hour ago, hch said:

B/W Photodude, 

It is working out quite well. Thanks

Problem is, you may be right at times, but self admittedly are wrong sometimes. Even Jeanne Dixon gets it right sometimes.

Perhaps you should not study Bible prophecy so much by yourself, but find a group to study it together. Groups have a way of being more accurate.

Given that Jesus is the author of our faith, when you are getting it wrong, where does your faith come from?

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

9 hours ago, The Wanderer said:

hch, you have failed to give even one verse with Pences name in it

otoh, the Bible doesn't provide the the year 1844 as the beginning year of judgment, nor does it mention Justinian (538 AD) or Pope Pius IV (1798 AD) — and Adventists have had no problem in hooking up those years and names and events with prophecies from the Bible...  In addition, there have been multiple enormous meteor showers (the stars falling), as well as multiple "blood" moons (the moon turning to blood).  

It's a lot easier to pick events that have already happened, and say thus-and-so was what was meant by prophetic verses in the Bible, than it is to give an actual prophecy (which may or may not be connected to biblical verses) that pans out in the near future.  

Just sayin' .....

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

 

what an odd response to my post (which wasn't referring to anyone in particular) ...  Sometimes, when such vehement responses are made, it reminds me of the sizing of shoes.  

 

[hch]

21 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

Problem is, you may be right at times, but self admittedly are wrong sometimes. Even Jeanne Dixon gets it right sometimes.

Perhaps you should not study Bible prophecy so much by yourself, but find a group to study it together. Groups have a way of being more accurate.

Given that Jesus is the author of our faith, when you are getting it wrong, where does your faith come from?

That is the main reason, I post on this forum.

Group study. Share what I find, get feedback in real time.

And receive a blessing from the insights of others.

[hch]

 

8 hours ago, rudywoofs (Pam) said:

what an odd response to my post (which wasn't referring to anyone in particular) ...  Sometimes, when such vehement responses are made, it reminds me of the sizing of shoes.  

 

The sizing of shoes reminds me of a funny incident that happened to me lately.

My daughter bought me 2 pair of shoes for Christmas in 2015

the casual pair fit perfect and was a welcome replacement that I wore immediately.

The dress shoes were nice. I tried the left one on...perfect fit.

Put it back in the box and set that pair aside until a later date.

Special occasion came in April of this 2018. Got out my new shoes...unwrapped the tissue paper

TO DISCOVER ---in that box were 2 DIFFERENT STYLES AND BOTH SHOES were for LEFT FEET.

The 30 day customer satisfaction period had ended...No Refund No exchange.

I protested. If they were the wrong size, style, or color...my bad.

But this is a packaging issue that falls on the seller. No body has 2 left feet.

My protest letter got notice. Somewhere along the way my normal type one page protest

got transformed into 85 point type. Too big to read some words on the screen.

I learned that there is some merit it taking care of things in a timely fashion.

If the Antediluvians had paid more attention to Noah, believed his message, or examined it more carefully

there would have been more people on the ark... Who can say

Maybe God would have showed mercy on them as He did on Nineveh at the preaching of Jonah?  

I'm particularly watching to see what President Trump will do this Sabbath

when he is required to certify that Iran is complying to the terms of the treaty.

My view is on record, but now it is time to  wait and see if prophecy is meeting history?

 

[APL]

On 5/6/2018 at 7:21 AM, hch said:

I have read the prophecy of Daniel 7 to say that as the three kings were plucked up (Visigoths 508, Vandals, and Ostrogoths 538) from the area that composed the Western Roman Empire.

Hm- HCH's re-interpretation of the 3 kings plucked up? 

[hch]

36 minutes ago, APL said:

Hm- HCH's re-interpretation of the 3 kings plucked up? 

The Adventist pioneers split into two groups way back in the 1800's on this topic...

One group went with the Heruli and the other went with the Visigoths.

It took a lot of searching to nail that down, but the Visigoths fit the prophecy better.

That is all I am allowed to say on that here and now.

[JoeMo]

On 5/6/2018 at 10:04 AM, B/W Photodude said:

Even Jeanne Dixon gets it right sometimes.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

[JoeMo]

hch,

I usually disagree with your posts; but I am going to agree with you (at least as a plausible scenario) about needing to watch Iran carefully.

Back to the topic, Trump is in an awkward position.  He has many skeletons in his closet of the past.  Most of us do.  Much of the stuff Trump is being grilled for happened in an era where his masogenistic behavior was more or less the norm among young "studs".  I don't imagine it was ever acceptable to women; and "acceptable" doesn't mean "right".  Nonetheless, Clinton and Kennedy were allegedly doing this kind of stuff in the White House while they were president; so why is what Trump did any worse?  In addition, most aAmericans don't seem to gibe a rat's patoot about Trumps shenanigans.

Back to hch - several Bible prophecies talk about Jesus' coming at the last trump.  Could Donald be the last "trump"?

[APL]

10 hours ago, hch said:

The Adventist pioneers split into two groups way back in the 1800's on this topic...

One group went with the Heruli and the other went with the Visigoths.

It took a lot of searching to nail that down, but the Visigoths fit the prophecy better.

That is all I am allowed to say on that here and now.

Yes, it is off topic and also unlikely to be true.

[Gregory Matthews]

I recognize the spirit of humor intended in the quote below.  However, thanks for a great example of eisegesis.

 

Quote

Back to hch-several Bible prophecies talk about Jesus' coming at the last trump.  Could Donald be the last "trump"?

[hch]

16 hours ago, Gregory Matthews said:

I recognize the spirit of humor intended in the quote below.  However, thanks for a great example of eisegesis.

 

Not withstanding. Perhaps God has a sense of humor too.

[Gregory Matthews]

Perhaps?

God created a monkey and one suggests that God perhaps has a sense of humor?

 

 

 

[hch]

God puts kings in office for the time in which they reign. And God removes them at His pleasure.

Is that true of everyone in authority (would that include presidents or anyone else) or just kings?

With President Trump having so many awkward moments

(it makes one wonder if he is going to finish his term or if he will have a colossal blunder ?).

He recently stated that he 'is a man of his word.'

But historically,  he also said that he would be true to three different women (supposedly until death do us part)

The historical evidence indicates that in spite of his word, he has been monkeying around.

So if we take him at his word, is it the man of his word that he speaks to us today or the man that monkeys around

(who said something yesterday and did not keep his word)?

Should God's people be concerned by the actions of those in authority?

Is President Trump going to hasten Christ's Second Coming (or perhaps delay it)?

It is noteworthy that the day after he announced that the USA would reimpose sanctions on Iran:

Iran bombarded Israeli positions in the Golan Heights

And Israel bombed Iranian positions in Syria.

What consequences will befall God's people as a result of men in authority  monkeying around? 

 

[JoeMo]

6 hours ago, hch said:

Is President Trump going to hasten Christ's Second Coming (or perhaps delay it)?

I have often wondered the same thing.  But it has nothing to do with his sometimes errant moral judgement; it has to do with Donald vs. the world.  So far, he has a pretty good record on delivering on his campaign promises.  It appears that North Korea is ready to sit down with him now rather than engage in a [censored] - measuring contest.  I doubt that Iran will succumb to the Donald without a war; and I'm confident that neither Russia nor China will give in. Is this hastening the end-time crisis?

OTOH, if Hillary would have become president, we would likely be neck-deep in globalism right now; joining the rest of the UN against Israel and the free practice of Christianity.  So did Donald's election delay end-time events?

I guess time will tell.

Another alternative is that God has His own timeline for end events; and there is nothing we as humans can do to hasten or delay it.  Maybe God's timeline is not based on humanity's limited view of time (since He is transcendent of time), but on the sequence of certain events that preclude His divine intervention.  Just a thought ...

[hch]

Why did God reveal endtime events in Bible prophecy if He did not want us to understand them?

Is there any merit in knowing the folks who will precipitate the final conflict?

Those in Noah's day were not blessed when they did not believe that a flood was eminent. 

Does God want us to be prepared or to be ignorant when it comes to the final events predicted in Bible prophecy being fulfilled?

If President Trump is about to plunge us into the Time of Trouble,

is it wise to think that things are going to go on pretty much like they have for some time to come?

And if Mr. Trump is not involved in final events, is anything that he says or does important?

At Christ's first Advent there was a class of people studying the prophecies and watching for the Messiah.

Are we studying and watching as we should, or depending too much on vague signs instead of specific instructions?

I'm making every effort to dig a little deeper:

If you have Amazon Prime, you can read all about it at

https://www.amazon.com/Highest-Loyalty-Truth-Larceny-Dawning-ebook/dp/B07C7DRPVS/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1524479061&sr=8-3&keywords=the+highest+loyalty

If you don't have prime you can still read a large portion of the material for FREE!