Disposable

[8thdaypriest]

We were created.   God created us.   He could just let us all die (or get rid of us).    He could then create another creation.   Right?

That thought must have gone through the minds of all "created" beings.  If HE created us, then HE can just get rid of us.  We are disposable.  

The flood of Noah didn't help.   It certainly appeared that God was disposing of humans who were a disappointment to HIM.  

How was God to let HIS creation know they are NOT DISPOSABLE.  HE gave HIS Son - to suffer with them and then to die by torture.   

This was HIS "I love you" message.  "I love you so much, I would die rather than loose you." 

You are NOT disposable.    

[dgrimm60]

8THDAYPRIEST

this is a very  good thought

dgrimm60

[8thdaypriest]

I was trying to put myself into the mind of Noah and family, or those who "returned" from the Babylonian captivity.  FEAR - came to mind.  

[Aliensanctuary]

There is a war going on in the USA. It's the War on Babies.

Democrats, Leftists, Radicals, Progressives, and Trump-haters all tend to consider the unborn or new born as disposable.

Killing babies is just the beginning of the disposal of unwanted humans. Servants of YHVH will ultimately be considered criminals and enemies of the State, thus qualifying them for burial in landfills or incineration in government-run crematoriums.

The Kingdom of YHVH, on the other hand, values all life until the time for the destruction of everything evil. Those who choose Satan as their master must all be disposed of in order to make the universe safe from crime and criminals.

[JoeMo]

On 4/7/2019 at 5:57 AM, Aliensanctuary said:

Killing babies is just the beginning of the disposal of unwanted humans.

Yes.  Next will be old people and poor people.  When and if the government takes over all healthcare, the bureaucracy will "prioritize" health care. If an 80 year-old and a 40 year-old both need a new heart, the 40 year-old will get it (unless the 80 year-old has enough wealth and influence to "buy" it).  If a street junkie and a millionaire are both hit by a bus and suffer a broken leg, the millionaire will receive preferential treatment.

[B/W Photodude]

8 hours ago, JoeMo said:

Yes.  Next will be old people and poor people.

That has been a theme of some Hollywood movies. I refer to two movies from the 70s - "Soylent Green" and "Logans Run". I won't spoil them in case you haven't seen them!

Unfortunately, it is already being put into practice in some countries. I read once where anyone older than 73 cannot receive treatment for certain kinds of leukemia. Euthanasia and assisted suicide in Europe has moved past the terminally ill to those who are pressured by family even to go thru with physician assisted suicide. It is said the doctor arrives expecting goodbyes to be done and he is gone within 15 minutes.

8 hours ago, JoeMo said:

When and if the government takes over all healthcare, the bureaucracy will "prioritize" health care. If an 80 year-old and a 40 year-old both need a new heart, the 40 year-old will get it (unless the 80 year-old has enough wealth and influence to "buy" it). 

I will have to disagree with you on this one. First of all, an 80 year is  unlikely to get a heart and it will have nothing to do with wealth. Wealth and influence will not help in the US. However, a poor person may not be able to afford the procedure. 

Several decades ago, it became quite the scandal when Saudi royalty came to US hospitals, sometimes taking over entire floors and they seemed to be moved up the list quickly undoubtedly due to ability to pay well. The results is that today, organ donations are handled by UNOS with very strict guidelines on how available organs are distributed.

I am aware of all of this because at one time I was certified in requesting organ donations from families with a deceased family member. I often took care of the deceased until the process of donation was worked out and the recipient had made it to the hospital. This is referring to the brain dead donors. Brain death leads to a severe instability in the body and needs careful management in the ICU to preserve the organs. I worked very closely with the the donor network teams.

Although I ethically approved of organ donation, sort of, I am not an organ donor myself. I seriously disapproved of some of the attitudes of some healthcare workers when the wait was on for an organ. I remember someone coming thru my unit once and was asked about a child that needed an heart. The person said, "we're just waiting for a heart." I was quite upset about it as what they were saying was "We are waiting for someone else's child to die." (it was their attitude more than the reality of what needed to happen.)

In a weird sense of it all, organ donation is almost like high tech canabalism! Primitives eat their victims to survive. Moderns take their organs to survive.

This also gets into allocation of resources. While it does not translate directly, the cost of one organ transplant could save far more lives thru just having more food to eat. It is a huge per capita resource consumption to transplant organs. Early in the days of total abdominal organ transplant, one little girl finally survived after ten others failed and died. So, up to her alone, the total costs was over five million dollars. That was just the procedure. Then comes a lifetime of healthcare to manage organ rejection and immune suppression related infections.

Nuff said, I could go on!

[JoeMo]

13 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

That has been a theme of some Hollywood movies. I refer to two movies from the 70s - "Soylent Green" and "Logans Run". I won't spoil them in case you haven't seen them!

I've seen them both.  Excellent but disturbing films.

13 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

Although I ethically approved of organ donation, sort of, I am not an organ donor myself. I seriously disapproved of some of the attitudes of some healthcare workers when the wait was on for an organ.

It's all about the money.  The same thing with Planned Parenthood selling fetal tissue and criminal organ theft (kidnapping people to take their organs or taking organs in payment for delinquent debt).

 

13 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

will have to disagree with you on this one. First of all, an 80 year is  unlikely to get a heart

I will defer to you on this given your medical background.  I'm just a lowly conspiracy theorist.

I really appeciated your insight.

[B/W Photodude]

9 minutes ago, JoeMo said:

The same thing with Planned Parenthood selling fetal tissue and criminal organ theft (kidnapping people to take their organs or taking organs in payment for delinquent debt).

Planned Parenthood, the name is even deceiving. But some will try to justify abortion as a source of stem cells. It is my understanding that stems cells can be gotten from cord blood. Also, at one time I donated, OK, sold ($50 was a lot in the 70s!) bone marrow for stem cells. But I was on summer break from nursing school and the doc harvesting turned it into a learning experience. He told me that frequently those taking bone marrow give a very hard pull on the aspirating syringe to get a sample quickly. He says, "I don't, but since you will likely see patients in the future, I will give you a taste of what many experience in giving bone marrow." He pulled back slight harder on the syringe. He was taking it from my iliac crest, but I felt pain all the way to my toes. So, I go on my way and the next year I am in my peds rotation in school and I am sitting with the pediatric hematologist and a child's mother discussing his condition with the child (4 or 5 yr)  playing on the floor. You sometimes don't think kids are listening, but they always do to every word. The doctor said to the mother that he thought a repeat bone marrow should be done. Instantly that child screamed like few I have seen before or since. They will usually hurt a lot.

But justifying abortions as a source fetal tissue for stem cells. I tend to think Dr Mengele would be proud. The other chilling thing about this is that the experience of the fetus as it is being aborted is never considered. Researchers are now finding that babies are far more sensitive to pain than thought, if not more sensitive than adults. Then when you consider how an abortion is done. Even Dr Mengele would be appalled. I read a statement from one feminist supporter of abortion once who wanted to get pregnant so she could have an abortion just so she could be one of the group who had done so.

[Gregory Matthews]

I was once trained and certified to inform and request from family members organ donations.  Eventually it came to the place where I decided in good conscience that I would not continue due to some aspects of the conversations that I became required to have with family members.

 

[B/W Photodude]

1 hour ago, Gregory Matthews said:

Eventually it came to the place where I decided in good conscience that I would not continue due to some aspects of the conversations that I became required to have with family members.

I would be curious to know what was uncomfortable in those conversations ( non-specifally!). 

It used to be a short training to become certified, but eventually,  as I recall, it got to be where only UNOS people did the asking. This was due to some unfortunate discussions that resulted in a donation being denied.

A medical center now can be fined substantially for non-certified people doing the asking.

[Gregory Matthews]

I did not want to ask a wife whose husband had just died if he ever had visited a prostitute.

[B/W Photodude]

6 hours ago, Gregory Matthews said:

I did not want to ask a wife whose husband had just died if he ever had visited a prostitute.

Don't think I would have asked that one either. And not just because it was an invasive question, wife may not have known what her husband did when off by himself, and was medically useless information! But just because it would have been so insulting and hurtful at a tragic time.

[Gregory Matthews]

That question alerted clinical authorities to the fact that the deceased had engaged in risky behavior that could have exposed him to AIDS.

I just was not going to ask the wife that question.

In the beginning, when I was first trained and certified,  my role was not to ask such questions.  Once I had obtained consent from the person, other clinicians carefully examined the clinical records and took whatever steps were needed to determine if the deceases was eligible to donate.

So, I declined to participate in  update training.  When asked, I simply  informed that I had not taken the required update training and therefore was not certified.  Soon, thereafter, the hospital changed the policy and only allowed physicians and nursing personal to obtain consent.  

 

[R. G. White]

On 4/7/2019 at 5:57 AM, Aliensanctuary said:

Democrats, Leftists, Radicals, Progressives, and Trump-haters all tend to consider the unborn or new born as disposable.

You are mistaken. Here is one Trump-hater (if that's what you call someone who has no regard for the man) who does NOT consider unborn children disposable.

[phkrause]

19 hours ago, R. G. White said:

You are mistaken. Here is one Trump-hater (if that's what you call someone who has no regard for the man) who does NOT consider unborn children disposable.

I agree, I'm not a Trump hater though, I just dislike him!! I'm not for abortions at all! God gave us the ability to choose right from wrong? If someone comes to me for advice about it, I'd tell them they have other choices!! I obviously have issues with this issue! Why are we not up in arms about people that choose to smoke? Secondhand smoke?? How we treat others? etc., etc.!!! There are many more issues, and all we say than is, well its a choice?? Yes everything we do is a choice and we will have to deal with those choices with God, not the state or the government!! And if people actually think that making abortions illegal is going to stop this murdering there wrong. We will get back to before abortion was made legal, and that wasn't very pretty! As long as we have free choice, which we do, per God, people are going to make the wrong choice!! That's how we got here, isn't it??

[R. G. White]

28 minutes ago, phkrause said:

I agree, I'm not a Trump hater though, I just dislike him!! I'm not for abortions at all! God gave us the ability to choose right from wrong? If someone comes to me for advice about it, I'd tell them they have other choices!! I obviously have issues with this issue! Why are we not up in arms about people that choose to smoke? Secondhand smoke?? How we treat others? etc., etc.!!! There are many more issues, and all we say than is, well its a choice?? Yes everything we do is a choice and we will have to deal with those choices with God, not the state or the government!! And if people actually think that making abortions illegal is going to stop this murdering there wrong. We will get back to before abortion was made legal, and that wasn't very pretty! As long as we have free choice, which we do, per God, people are going to make the wrong choice!! That's how we got here, isn't it??

You dislike Trump. I despise him. I take my license for this from Psalm 15. Has there ever been a more vile public figure? I'm not sure if Nero was a worse character, although he certainly had the power to accomplish more evil. Same goes for Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, and many others.

You are right, of course, about the limitations of what legislation can accomplish. Only the grace of Christ can save this world, one person at a time.