Who's fooling who?

[hch]

On 12/31/2019 at 5:24 PM, Gregory Matthews said:

And the vital truth is your mistaken (false) predictions as to what will come to pass?  Astounding!

And again, yes, you will have come to pass some of what you have predicted.  You tell us that President Trump will be broken.  That may happen after he completes his 2nd term and 8 years in office..  In any case,, it is true that sometime in the future he will no longer be the President of the U.S.

 

There are those who relish in my errors and refuse to see the correct positions that I have taught. So be it.. 

Many who have believed and preached the First and Second angels' messages will "refuse the Third Angel's Message."

Perhaps it is because they can see the first two messages historically and do not have faith that the third angel's message will involve people who are now living and who will play a part in the worlds final events? Or that they cannot see clearly the times in which we live? But the truth is that 5 of the 10 virgins will be lost. Is that saying that 11 million SDA's will not make it to the kingdom? In the extreme, not 1 in 100 SDA's are living for Jesus as they aught. Does that mean that of 21 million SDA's in the world (1:100 ==210,000) we will not have enough SDA's to make up the 144K? Either possibility 50% lost or less than 1 in a 100 getting it right in the endtime is horrible.

And knowing how hard I make it for myself to be faithful in spite of discouraging words, I have no doubt that others are struggling to be faithful as well.

The fulfillment of the Third Angel's Message is upon us! Believe it or not! like it or not. want it or not. ready or not!

 

May we have the Joy in Jesus in 2020 and 20/20 vision to see us thru!

[hch]

On 12/31/2019 at 11:50 AM, thx4mercy said:

Where in the Bible is it referring to a "counterfeit Michael" standing?

That is what I have gleaned from Bible study.

Daniel 7 begins with 4 sea beasts. Heaven interprets them as earth kings (American presidents 7:17).

A study of Daniel 7 reveals 9/11/01 and the identity of the 4 earth-kings (American Presidents) interacting with Pope John-Paul II

He is allotted 42 months (9/11/01 thru 4/2/05) One of the keys is in understanding the word duo that is 2 and 2 in Luke 10:1

when Jesus sent them out two and two

John-Paul II lived 42 & 2 months to the day from 9/11/01 to 4/2/05 by Hebrew reckoning

which aligns with the Spirit of Prophecy insight that the entire chapter of Revelation 13 would be repeated in the endtime

Then the first beast in Rev 13 (papal beast) transitions to the earth beast with the duo lamblike horns during the reigns of Benedict XVI and Bush II

Counting the duo lamblike horns as 2 & 2, they are Bush II, Obama, Trump, and Pence

Daniel 11 says that Trump is to be broken and the ships of chittim come against Pence (#IranUSwar that morphs into Armageddon )

If you study Daniel 12:1 with Strong's in hand you will discover that the translators added quite a few words to give us our English rendition

"And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation [even] to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. "

So who is Michael? Is He Christ? He could be. Is he Michael Pence (Bible study shows that he will stand for his people as well.

Remember "Isa 44:28  That saith of Cyrus, [He is] my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure: even saying to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be built; and to the temple, Thy foundation shall be laid."

How do we know based on Daniel 12:1 whether God is talking About Michael (Christ) or Michael Pence as Isaiah spoke about Cyrus?

From my Bible study, I am certain that Daniel 12:1 is about both. America's "great prince" President Michael Pence stands for his people to implement the National Sunday Law and Michael (Christ) stands to deliver His people from the persecution of Christendom gone dictatorial as it was when the Roman Church ruled absolutely.

 

 

[B/W Photodude]

9 hours ago, hch said:

There are those who relish in my errors and refuse to see the correct positions that  I  have taught. So be it.. 

Quite the strange post. Acknowledgement of errors past and then we refuse to "see" the correct positions. Wonder why?!

And then the "I  have taught". Exactly who made you the teacher of correct positions and determined that everyone else should follow you? If you had a few followers in real life, you could almost be a cult leader!

So, thank-you, but I do not think I need to seriously study your positions on Bible prophecy. I have quite a bit of other things to study like the Bible, EGW, and other theologians in the church.

Seriously, in the words of one pastor, "Repent immediately!" (One of my most favorite preachers ever in the current days.)

[hch]

18 minutes ago, B/W Photodude said:

Quite the strange post. Acknowledgement of errors past and then we refuse to "see" the correct positions. Wonder why?!

Strange? It is like thinking a train is coming at !0:00 and it does not. People laugh at me because I waited for a train that did not come. Then at 11:00, board the last train for the day and revise my schedule accordingly. Then the earthquake that I warned folks about comes and the train tracks are demolished and those who should have taken the last train are left to ponder the situation of their own making.

25 minutes ago, B/W Photodude said:

And then the "I  have taught". Exactly who made you the teacher of correct positions and determined that everyone else should follow you? If you had a few followers in real life, you could almost be a cult leader!

When I discovered what I deemed to be life altering truths from the word of God, I felt obligated (because of human decency) to warn others of their peril. So if I am wrong, I may be embarrassed. When the skeptics see the things that I have warned about come to pass, maybe they will be able to save themselves. The choice is a no brainer. Check out what I say or take your chances and assume that I am wrong. The preponderance of the evidence will show anyone who cares enough to look that I am right. It is not a matter of blind faith in something I said, it is matter of looking at the facts and acting on them.

31 minutes ago, B/W Photodude said:

So, thank-you, but I do not think I need to seriously study your positions on Bible prophecy. I have quite a bit of other things to study like the Bible, EGW, and other theologians in the church.

That my friend is your choice. My Bible states that a watchman is only obligated to give the warning. The response of the hearer (to take appropriate actions or to ignore the warning) will result in consequences to the hearer...and not the one giving the warning. (By the way: everything that I post is from my study of the Bible, the Spirit of Prophecy and comparing the signs that are fast fulfilling with the news reports that confirm my studies. I'm on the 11:00 train.

Regarding theologians in the church. Jesus had them in His day too. I think of Jeremiah and Hananiah. Two totally different people with opposing messages and the hearers had to choose which message they would believe to be God sent. Hananiah had the biggest following and led most of the people astray. Some things never change.

[phkrause]

49 minutes ago, B/W Photodude said:

So, thank-you, but I do not think I need to seriously study your positions on Bible prophecy. I have quite a bit of other things to study like the Bible, EGW, and other theologians in the church.

Amen!!

[BlessedMan]

1 hour ago, hch said:

Regarding theologians in the church. Jesus had them in His day too. I think of Jeremiah and Hananiah. Two totally different people with opposing messages and the hearers had to choose which message they would believe to be God sent

They were not "theologians," by any stretch.

1 hour ago, hch said:

And then the "I  have taught".

Someone has "I" trouble.

[B/W Photodude]

2 hours ago, hch said:

Then the earthquake that I warned folks about ...

There is too much "I" in everything you write!

Quote

When I discovered what I deemed to be life altering truths from the word of God, I felt obligated (because of human decency) to warn others of their peril. So if I am wrong, I may be embarrassed.

When God gives a message, it happens. You would not be in the position of trying to explain why you were wrong.

The Bible was designed to be a guide to all who wish to become acquainted with the will of their Maker. ...

Those important matters that concern our salvation were not left involved in mystery. They were not revealed in such a way as to perplex and mislead the honest seeker after truth. Said the Lord by the prophet Habakkuk: “Write the vision, and make it plain, ... that he may run that readeth it.” Habakkuk 2:2. The word of God is plain to all who study it with a prayerful heart. 

By the cry, Liberality, men are blinded to the devices of their adversary, while he is all the time working steadily for the accomplishment of his object. As he succeeds in supplanting the Bible by human speculations, the law of God is set aside, and the churches are under the bondage of sin while they claim to be free. Great Controversy p.521 **

When you are wrong, is it because you are engaging in human speculations? 

BTW, how come you were unable to predict the taking out of Soliemani by drone strike the other day? That seems like it is something that really should have been on your radar, or will you be back searching Scripture to see how you missed it?!

Quote

Regarding theologians in the church. Jesus had them in His day too. I think of Jeremiah and Hananiah. Two totally different people with opposing messages ...

Oh, I pick my theologians to follow very carefully!

**This quote was in this weeks Sabbath school lesson beginning the new quarter on the book of Daniel.

[BlessedMan]

10 minutes ago, B/W Photodude said:

By the cry, Liberality, men are blinded to the devices of their adversary, while he is all the time working steadily for the accomplishment of his object.

So true, there is no such thing as a fake $3.00 bill because there is no such thing as a real $3.00 bill! Everyone is looking for a devil with tail & pitchfork, and meanwhile he is dressed in a suit and has your sons or daughters for his pleasure just down the street, or, heaven forbid, in your own house.  People (me included) are blind to this kind of "stealth" because they dont want to see it. The whole time we have a Bible in our hands, so does the devil! (see Mat 4, etc.)

What we are seeing in certain things being coined as "prophecy" here is a complete lack of His Presence; a total and wilful exclusion of "The Hand That Intervenes!"  WA Spicer wrote a wonderful book about that, and even on the inside cover, before he gets down to the subject at hand, he is talking about THAT hand, which most of the "prophecy" in this topic seems to ignore:

Quote

"He is the living God, and steadfast forever...He delivers and rescues; and He works signs and wonders in heaven and earth." (Dan 6: 26, 27).

Why THAT hand is not the center and the foundation of ALL prophecy, Ill never know. It really is a shame.

[B/W Photodude]

1 minute ago, BlessedMan said:

The whole time we have a Bible in our hands, so does the devil! (see Mat 4, etc.)

I tend to believe that no one on earth understands prophecy as well as the devil, and it won't save him.

I also think that we focus too much on prophecy, especially prophecy that doesn't have Jesus at the center of it.

[JoeMo]

2 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

I tend to believe that no one on earth understands prophecy as well as the devil, and it won't save him.

I also think that we focus too much on prophecy, especially prophecy that doesn't have Jesus at the center of it.

I agree; and I also tend to believe that the Second Coming of Jesus is the next (and everlasting) direct interaction with God that humanity will have; so it's good to have at least a general sense of prophesied last-time events so we can recognize them as they unfold rather than being taken by surprise.

[stinsonmarri]

On 1/1/2020 at 12:49 PM, hch said:

Dear sister, you say of me "you do all of this predicting without any Bible references" and you missed the 7 Scriptural references that I cited. That is not without any. Seven is the number of completeness. Too quick to accuse the brethren and too slow to ask for more references if you need them. Certainly, a Bible student would see the subject matter clearly and know where the material came from even if no references hqd been given.

God be merciful to us!

Dear Brother: First, your correlation of Eze 4:6 with Adam makes no sense at all. This prophecy was to symbolize prophetic time versus literal time. I have never hear anyone speak of Adam and the judgment was even a question about literal time. The day both Adams ate of that fruit, they both literally start dying. And if you truly understood the Hebrew meaning of the word, "ye shall surely die;" you would know that their DNA immediately changed and their body started to aged! Aging is a form of dying, the DNA structure begin to decay. The you try to put it together with the Scripture in Peter which states that a thousand years to YAHWEH is like a day! This total ridiculous because Adam did not even live a thousand years. So you up with this weird math equation using John 11:9, that has nothing to do with your equation 1000 year day divided by 12 hours = 83 years 4 months. You have really gone way off the map! Because Adam lived nine hundred and thirty years, not a thousand, so it makes no sense at all!

Then you again, make no sense using the assembly of Sardis with dead Roman popes and your false calculations. The seven assemblies had to do with YAHWEH'S people during periods of time and not the papacy. You gave references that you pick at random to try to fit unfounded illogical belief. I am truly sorry Henry, because I don't know who you are anymore. You have gone far far far away from the truth to you appear to be something wrong with you.  Only one thing I will agree and that is the papacy was the beast 7th head that was wounded to death. However, the head died but the wound or the head did not kill the beast himself.  

And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. Rev 17:11

The papacy rulership died she lost her kingdom, but not her religion of church; the eighth beast has not been revealed at this time yet. Noones knows who he is, he will be recognized until the 3 1/2 years are complete and the 144,000 will have brought in the great multitude Rev Chapter 7; 9:4; 11:7. Know there is no equations or math. Also, where is the national sunday law mention in the Bible? SDA keep talking about this Sunday law thingy that Bible nor the world is dealing with at all!

Happy Sabbath!

[hch]

7 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

When you are wrong, is it because you are engaging in human speculations? 

Was that the case in 1843 & 1844? Or was it a matter of not clearly understanding the word of God because tradition had crept into their understanding?

7 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

BTW, how come you were unable to predict the taking out of Soliemani by drone strike the other day? That seems like it is something that really should have been on your radar, or will you be back searching Scripture to see how you missed it?!

Being a Bible student, I study and learn? Was Soliemani revealed in Bible prophecy? Did you see him there? But maybe he was and if that is true, we should be able to find him.

7 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

As he succeeds in supplanting the Bible by human speculations, the law of God is set aside, and the churches are under the bondage of sin while they claim to be free. Great Controversy p.521

Great quote. (Wish I could say that for the Sabbath School lesson.) It's only redeeming quality so far IMHO is that it uplifted Jesus. Too much technical stuff and tradition without much increase of knowledge since 1844. But as I keep studying it hopefully some useful information that will help us to prepare for the Time of Trouble will come to light. 

8 hours ago, BlessedMan said:

They were not "theologians," by any stretch.

The scribes, Pharisees, and priests in Christ's day did more to conceal truth than to rightly instruct the people. Has that changed?

7 hours ago, B/W Photodude said:

I also think that we focus too much on prophecy, especially prophecy that doesn't have Jesus at the center of it.

All Bible prophecy has Jesus as the center of it. Does it not warn us about what is to come so that we can be ready for Jesus to come and to be able to stand in His presence?

5 hours ago, JoeMo said:

it's good to have at least a general sense of prophesied last-time events so we can recognize them as they unfold rather than being taken by surprise.

With God being so specific in His word, do you really think that a casual understanding of prophecy will do anyone any good?

[hch]

7 hours ago, BlessedMan said:

What we are seeing in certain things being coined as "prophecy" here is a complete lack of His Presence; a total and wilful exclusion of "The Hand That Intervenes!"

That statement looks rather judgmental. Did you come to that conclusion after reading all the posts on this thread or just the last few pages?

4 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

your correlation of Eze 4:6 with Adam makes no sense at all.

Then let us look at the context of my statement that is causing you difficulty. (I gave the references for the info that follows.)

1) God told Adam that in the day he ate of the tree , he would die.

2) Genesis is where literal time is first mentioned 

3) Adam did not die in literal time … the literal day that he ate the fruit.

4) Adam did not die in long time (that is where a day is prophetic of a year Ezekiel 4:6 explains that a day can be a year in prophecy)

5) Adam did not die in the day that he ate the fruit if God had meant that a day is a year in His prophesy of Adam's death.

6) Adam died at 930 years old, which was within the 1000 year day in which he ate the fruit based on millennial time.

Saying that it does not make sense "at all" is really saying that it does not make sense to you. Did you misread what I said? reading too fast? Or saying that it does not fit what you believe? Did anyone else have trouble following the thought?

4 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

I have never hear anyone speak of Adam and the judgment was even a question about literal time.

The judgment that God pronounced on Adam came within the 1000 year day that David and Peter ascribe to God's timing. To understand what God meant when He told Adam "In the day that you eat it you will die" we had to look at what a day means (24 hours, a year, a 1000 years?). God meant within the 1000 year day Adam would die is evident because Adam did not live to be 1001 years old. Thus, God's pronouncement of Adam's judgment within the 1000 year/day explains that God meant  "In the1000 year/day that you eat it you will die" 

The principle of first mention shows that the first mention of Judgment in the Bible was Adam's judgment and it linked to a 1000 year/day. Thus when God speaks of a Judgment hour,  it is an hour of time based on a 1000 year/day. And hour can be a moment in time like we do not know the hour Jesus will come. And hour is also a measurement of time like someone makes us wait for an hour.

5 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

DNA immediately changed

When you introduce this stuff, you are totally changing the subject. My point had to do with HOW LONG IS A JUDGMENT HOUR? Of course, you cannot understand me if you try to change what I am saying and what I mean into something that I am not saying. My point was that based on the length of ADAM's 1000 year/day Judgment Day, an hour has the duration of 83 years 4 months. That length of time was based on Christ's statement about 12 hours in a day.

Then I showed that the Roman church that traced its roots back to the apostles was the dead church identified in Revelation 3. Judgment must begin at the House of God. The RCC died in 1798. Adventists should be able to understand 1798 without my explaining it. Thus, the RCC was the dead church on 22 October 1844 when the judgment hour of the DEAD began. The RCC was dead on 22 October 1844 and it remained dead for the entire Judgment Hour of 83 years 4 months until 22 February 1928. A short tarrying time followed.

Mussolini revived the papacy in 1929. His revival began in February and the pope was a king of Vatican kingdom by June of 1929 according to the Lateran Treaty. Thus, the RCC was alive again by June 1929. As the Judgment of the dead church began on the 22 October 1844 Day of Atonement, The judgment hour of the living church must start on the Day of Atonement. In 1929, the Day of atonement was on 14 October 1929. The Judgment Hour of the living aligns with the living RCC and it began on the 14 October 1929 Day of Atonement. It continued for 83 years 4 months and ended on 14 February 2013. 

In February 2013, Pope Benedict XVI resigned ending the one pope at a time papacy. Thus there were 7 popes that align with the 7 heads of the papal beast in Rev 13:1-10 from 14 October 1929 to 14 February 2013. And the second beast in Rev 13 with the lamblike horns came to power at that time 14 February 2013. Pope Francis I is not included in Revelation 13 because the prophecy was only talking about the 7 heads (not the 8 heads). Thus, Rev 13 aligns the focus of the prophecy moving from the papacy to the earth beast with the lamblike horns 14 February 2013.

5 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

Then you again, make no sense using the assembly of Sardis with dead Roman popes and your false calculations.

Adam's judgment day was within God's 1000 year/day time frame.  Sardis was the dead church. Judgment begins at the house of God. The RCC received its deadly wound in 1798. Thus for the Judgment of the Dead to begin at the House of God, it had to begin at the dead church. So maybe your understanding of the identity of the churches in Revaluation needs to be reviewed? The Bible does not lie. The times cited align too well with prophecy to be wrong. So for you to deny that which does not align with your private interpretations should cause you concern. 

5 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

You gave references that you pick at random to try to fit unfounded illogical belief.

You are trying to justify your private interpretation that is not aligning with the facts. Denying the facts will not change truth into a lie. The references that you refuse to believe are rock solid. They are not cherry picked!

5 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. Rev 17:11

Since you bring this point up. it will be addressed. In context "And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, [and] the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space" (17:10) They are KINGS. Those kings were Popes:Pius XI & XII, John XXIII, Paul VI, John-Paul I & II, and Benedict XVI that aligned with the healing of the post 1929 papal wound. They are the popes identified as heads on the papal beast in Rev 13. The 8th is not Francis I, because he is not "the eighth, and is of the seven" The 8th is Satan personating John-Paul II (I got that from studying the Spirit of Prophecy and you can look it up in an earlier post on this forum).

Benedict XVI is the Pope that that reigned a short space. (I have written about that in the past as well you can search this forum of it too.) The hour is the 83 years 4 months from 14 October 1929 to 14 February 2013. "And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast" (17:12). Those kings were 10 American Presidents that align with the 7 popes just mentioned. Revelation 13:11-18 explains the identifying features of the earth-beast with the lamblike horns. "It calls fire down from heaven"  Truman literally did that in WWII. Thus, he is the first American President of the 10: Truman, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush I, & Clinton that bonded with the papacy during this prophetic hour. 

6 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

where is the national sunday law mention in the Bible?

Quote

When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) (Mt 24:15)

 

Quote

Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known;  Then shalt thou enquire, and make search, and ask diligently; and, behold, [if it be] truth, [and] the thing certain, [that] such abomination is wrought among you; Deuteronomy 13:13-14

The Sabbath is the Sabbath of he Lord our God. It identifies Him as God and it is an abomination to serve other gods or to honor the day that honors other gods. Desolation is destruction in perdition. That is the quick answer on this long post.

Sister Marri, I am not so sure that you do not understand. I think it is a matter of not believing the information that you understand.

[BlessedMan]

5 hours ago, hch said:

15 hours ago, BlessedMan said:

What we are seeing in certain things being coined as "prophecy" here is a complete lack of His Presence; a total and wilful exclusion of "The Hand That Intervenes!"

That statement looks rather judgmental. Did you come to that conclusion after reading all the posts on this thread or just the last few pages?

Its really sad to see that all you want to do here is to quip back at anyone who dares to question your prophecy prowess. Setting yourself against us all as THE expert, who is never wrong, even when he is wrong, is hypocrisy, not prophecy. Trying to tell people they are "judgmental" because they made an observation of what they are seeing says more about you than the person you direct it at. The Bible commands believers to exercise "righteous judgment" in deciding right from wrong.

"It is not good to accept the person of the wicked, to overthrow the righteous in judgment." (Prov 18:5), and  " Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment." (John 17:24). Why are you on a Christian forum telling people to not do something that the Bible clearly tells them to do?

Your "prophecy" is no different. Its just incantations of prediction. The Bible talks about "the sin of witchcraft." Maybe it's time for us to review that here? It is nothing but a rejection of the word of God to pump it out as "prophecy" when it has nothing to do with Christ, and dwells on the prediction mindset and its maker.

[stinsonmarri]

On 1/3/2020 at 8:31 AM, hch said:

As I read Bible prophecy Michael Pence stands and the National Sunday Law bring the time of trouble on God's people.

  Quote

You do not read Pence in that Scripture at all! What you are doing is adding a false message, when the Bible clearly says don't. There will never be any Sunday law, the SDA myth!

On 1/3/2020 at 8:31 AM, hch said:

When the third angel's message closes, mercy no longer pleads for the guilty inhabitants of the earth. The people of God have accomplished their work. They have received “the latter rain,” “the refreshing from the presence of the Lord,” and they are prepared for the trying hour before them. Angels are hastening to and fro in Heaven. An angel returning from the earth announces that his work is done; the final test has been brought upon the world, and all who have proved themselves loyal to the divine precepts have received “the seal of the living God.” [SEE APPENDIX, NOTE 13.] Then Jesus ceases his intercession in the sanctuary above. He lifts his hands, and with a loud voice says, “It is done;” and all the angelic host lay off their crowns as he makes the solemn announcement: “He that is unjust, let him be unjust still; and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still; and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still; and he that is holy, let him be holy still.” [Revelation 22:11.] Every case has been decided for life or death. Christ has made the atonement for his people, and blotted out their sins. The number of his subjects is made up; “the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven,” is about to be given to the heirs of salvation, and Jesus is to reign as King of kings, and Lord of lords.  {GC88 613.2} 

First, where is the words; :I saw or I was shown or the angel showed me," none. This was the view of the church and not of YAHWEH. Then notice that is says see appendix note 13, that they put in without EGW had in her original writing of this book. It is done is not in Daniel 12:1 show me! The Sabbath is not the seal, the sealing process will be done by THE HOLY SPIRIT! The angels flying from the east had the seal to show it would not be complete until the 144,000 called IsraEL are seal and the great multitude.

You need to stop reading and ask THE HOLY SPIRIT to lead and guide you when you study the Bible!

Happy Sabbath!

[hch]

On 1/4/2020 at 1:33 PM, stinsonmarri said:

You do not read Pence in that Scripture at all! What you are doing is adding a false message, when the Bible clearly says don't. There will never be any Sunday law, the SDA myth!

When Michael stands for his people: Michael is a man just like king Cyrus was a man when Isaiah told of him in Bible prophecy.

First Michael stands for his people and the time of trouble begins. The Ships of Chittim attack Americas armada. This morphs into Armageddon.

And finally Jesus has had enough and He declares "It is finished!" Then He stands for His people and we get to go home to be with Jesus.

[stinsonmarri]

4 hours ago, hch said:

When Michael stands for his people: Michael is a man just like king Cyrus was a man when Isaiah told of him in Bible prophecy.

First Michael stands for his people and the time of trouble begins. The Ships of Chittim attack Americas armada. This morphs into Armageddon.

And finally Jesus has had enough and He declares "It is finished!" Then He stands for His people and we get to go home to be with Jesus.

Here you go telling things that are not true! You stated Michael is a man just like king Cyrus was a man!

But I will shew thee that which is noted in the Scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but MICHAEL your PRINCE. Dan10:21

And at that time shall MICHAEL stand up, THE GREAT PRINCE which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a Time of Trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. Dan12:1

 Yet MICHAEL the ARCHANGEL, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The ALMIGHTY rebuke thee. Jude 1:9 

  And there was war in heaven: MICHAEL and HIS angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Rev 12:7

MICHAEL, THE SON of THE MOST HIGH was never a man! YAHWEH, HIMSELF prepare a flesh body for HIS SON! Heb 10:5; 2:4; Col 1:22; Phi 2:7 and in the Syriac Version of the Bible states: "THOU hast clothed ME with a body" MICHAEL was and is a SPIRITUAL BEING that was clothed in a fleshly body that HIS FATHER made for HIM. It is a DIVINE MYSTERY and the DIVINE BODY cannot die, the fleshly body did.  I am not going to tell you anything else. YAHSHUA was and is THE ONLY ARCHANGEL as HE is THE ONLY SON of MAN! HE as ALL of THEM have POWERS we cannot fathom! I have faith to believe without doubt! So, I stand on THE WORD where is you evidence not from your mouth but from the WORD of ELOHYIM?

Peace!

[hch]

I have been told: Between the two dates for which you have claimed a prophetic link (9/11/01 and 4/2/05) , there are not 1260 days.  There are not 83 years and 4 months.  There are not 1290 days.  By any calendar.  There ARE 1299 days.

Others here may be confused about this as well.

The date identified in Daniel 7 from a study of a season and time is 9/11/01
a season is 1/4 of a year. For Bible prophetic calculations a year has 360 days. 
1/4 of 360 days is 90 days. In Bible prophecy a day can be a year=90 years
and a time, which is already a biblical year. 90 years and a time = 91 years.
President Reagan turned 90 years old on 2/6/01
In Reagan's 91st year: He, Bush I, and Clinton met the criterial of the text...1) alive  2) out of office

From the context of Daniel 7, the little horn pope that spoke great words did so after the Judgment was set (after 1844)
The 10 horns on the earth beast were identified by a feature in Revelation 13 "the beast called fire down from heaven"
The American President that called fire down on Japan in the sight of eyewitnesses was President Truman.
The 10 Presidents were: Truman, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton.
The pope that spoke great words and plucked up three Presidents (Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton) was John-Paul II
Reagan healed the papal wound on America's behalf by declaring John-Paul II head of state (sent US ambassador to Rome)
Bush I Recognized Pope John-Paul II as head of all the churches: "the world's Moral leader"
Clinton wondered after Pope John-Paul II "This guy is on my side!"

Valid point: There ARE 1299 days.

That is correct. But within that 1299 days 42 full months are clearly identified from Bible prophecy:
Oct, Nov, Dec 2001; 12 months each in 2002, 2003, 2004; and Jan, Feb, and Mar 2005= 42 full months.
There is some time left over between 9/11/01 thru 4/205
The Bible writers did not use the Gregorian Calendar, they used the Hebrew lunar calendar.
Revelation 13 says 42 months.
The word duo translated as 2 in Revelation 13 is translated as 2 and 2 in Luke 10:1

Note that when 40 duo is translated as 42 and 2 it aligns 9/11/01 thru 4/2/05 to the very day
There is no unexplained time in that application

Within the 1299 days that you counted note this third application
from 9/11/01 the 1260 day period ended February 22, 2005.
On February 24, 2005 Pope John Paul entered the hospital in the dying process
he never recovered or came back from the hospital in which he died.

By the Gregorian Calendar, the 42 full months fulfill the prophecy
By the Hebrew calendar, the 42 and 2 months fulfill prophecy to the very day.
And his entering the hospital in the dying process aligns with the 1260 days 
between the start date 9/11/01 and the end date 2/23/05

The Bible prophecy is not off. 

You are reading it to say what you think it means rather than studying it to determine what it means.
Since the Bible does not agree with you reading, you assume it is wrong.
Rather than to let the Bible explain itself, you refuse to believe that which does not agree with you.

Regarding the 83 year 4 month hour
1000 years divided by 12 is 83 years 4 months (an hour based on 1000 years)
The judgment of the dead began 22 October 1844
The RCC received its deadly wound 42 years before the Judgment Hour arrived. 
So how does that impact the prophecy that states that judgment starts at the House of God?
The RCC House of God was dead when the 22 October 1844 Judgment Hour began
Like the dead RCC, Adam, Abraham, and millions of saints were dead before the 22 October 1844 Judgment Hour began
But when the 22 October 1844 Judgment Hour is compared to the dead church
The 22 October 1844 Judgment hour ended 22 February 1928 while the dead RCC was dead
Then came the brief tarrying time Hab 2:1-3 in which the RCC recovered from its deadly wound
On the Day of Atonement 14 October 1929, the RCC was ALIVE!
The living RCC remained a one pope at a time kingship until the 83 year 4 month Judgment Hour of the living ended.
Shortly after the Judgment Hour of the living ended (14 February 2013) pope Benedict resigned effective 2/28/2013
The RCC was dead during the entire Judgment Hour of the Dead
The RCC was alive during the entire Judgment Hour of the Living

The facts are the facts
But it is not evidence that some people need.
They have the evidence
It is the Holy Spirit that leads us to all truth
Pray for the Holy Spirit to rightly divide the word of truth.

When I teach the 3rd angel's message'
I teach that President Michael Pence implements the Mark of the Beast
when America forms an image to the beast.
You teach that I am in error and that my teaching is not of God.
Thus, you teach that President Michael Pence will not implement the MOB
Thus, you have judged me to be a false prophet
And your teaching is not in harmony with mine.

This is not the unity of the faith that God would have us to have

Ellen White states: Christ is waiting with longing desire for the manifestation of Himself in His church. When the character of Christ shall be perfectly reproduced in His people, then He will come to claim them as His own.  {COL 69.1} 

How will that unity come about when one SDA stands for truth and other SDA's fight tooth and nail to keep that truth from the world and from the church?

 

[stinsonmarri]

13 hours ago, hch said:

I have been told: Between the two dates for which you have claimed a prophetic link (9/11/01 and 4/2/05) , there are not 1260 days.  There are not 83 years and 4 months.  There are not 1290 days.  By any calendar.  There ARE 1299 days.

Others here may be confused about this as well.

The date identified in Daniel 7 from a study of a season and time is 9/11/01
a season is 1/4 of a year. For Bible prophetic calculations a year has 360 days. 
1/4 of 360 days is 90 days. In Bible prophecy a day can be a year=90 years

Henry, once again you do not make sense. Eze 4:6 is very clear that a day is a year in prophetic time. Here is the proof when Gabriel stated very clear about the 70 weeks in Dan 9:24 Cyrus issued on 537 B.C the original Persian Law to restore the Temple. If you know why the Persians were selected let me remind you from the Bible. 

 I now give you permission to make a law that will save the lives of your people. You may use my ring to seal the law, so that it can never be changed. Esther 8:8 CEV

YAHWEH chose the Persian specifically because their cannot be changed their laws once seal by the king. So, when there seem that the prophetic appointed time was not going to go through Darius Hystaspes in 519 B.C. confirmed the original law of Cyrus. On 457 B.C., in the seventh year Artaxerxes, again obeyed the command who sent Ezra to Judea to start the rebuilt of the temple. Ezra 6: 14, 15 It took 7 weeks (a day in prophetic time a years), so that would be 49 years, which is 408 B. C.! The 62 weeks time was silence, no other time was given by the minor prophets! This time was 483 years that ended in A. D. 27 the exact time of THE TRUE MESSIAH'S BIRTH! Seven years and in the midst of those seven years, YAHSHUA die on the tree around A. D. 34 and the stoning of Stephen ended the calling on the Hebrews to continue as YAHWEH chosen IsraEL. Like the Canaanites were given 430 years, the Hebrews were given 490 years!

The reason is simple why YAHWEH uses prophetic time instead of man's calendar years because they are off! It all has to do with the lunar/solar Calendar that was given in Creation. Also, most do not understand what the flood actually did, there was so much water that earth was moved from it original place during Creation. The word season should not being used for the Hebrew words "ulov'adimem," which means appointed time, place, or YAHWEH Special meeting or appointed days! Gen 1:14 Before the flood, the earth temperature was neither cold or hot nor was there any rain. The people were tall, the animal were of great sizes and the vegetation was large as well. There were no mountains only hills and plains and the cursing of the ground was only thistle and thorns. Man had to till it but it reaped abudance of crop all the time. The crop would grow because of the abundant of dew, the temperature and the clean air and chemical regneration of the soil and the air.

However, after the flood thing changes, the people height shorten due to eaten animal flesh and the change of the weather and bacteria that were formed. Animals shorten their size for killing and eating animals and the green verbage was not the same. It was during the flood that bacteria and other pest were created to eat up the decayed bodies of both people and animals. Mountain were causes by the tossing of large waves, the movement of the land being broken up there was a lot more going on then we relize. All to cover up the dead bodies more than the people of the earth today! The eight people who came out of the ark was still tall but because of man's sin everything shrink and the earth was sick. Noah was also told:

While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease. Gen 8:22  

You do not realize that the earth is off and the moon only travels 29 to 30 days around the earth to make up a month. The Catholic calendar, that even SDA keep including Easter, Holloween, Christmas, January 1 are what Gabriel told Daniel; that the pope will think, attempt to change YAHWEH Time and HIS Law but it won't be for long. So, YAHWEH still uses HIS Set Time of the lunar/solar calendar that cannot be decipher by you or any creature here on earth. Why? HE can multiply by dividing and add by subtracting; our ways are not HIS WAYS, nor are our thoughts HIS THOUGHTS. Isaiah 55:8-9 You nor anyone can fathom HIS TIME or HIS Laws.

Scientist think suns HE Created dies, or stars are being created in Orion Belt. They think they know what a Quazar is or a Nova. Never been out there to see but only through a telescop that is manmade!They still do not understand what black matter is, or why the Universe has no bottom. Zillons on Zillion x Zillions of constelations are in the vast Universe hanging on what? Do you know! The secret things does belong to HIM and what HE share with us is HIS WISDOM and MYSTERY that even Satan cannot fathom and you think you can. Get a life, you can't. Each prophet had visions of time, and it was an angel of YAHWEH that send them the understanding and you have the nerve to think you can figure out YAHWEH'S MATH! You cannot and will not only the wise that he chooses will understand! You have turn you back on THE CREATOR thinking that you have all the knowledge that HE choose to give to the one HE wants. People that have pride and shows no humilty is not who YAHWEH CHOOSES. They are humble people, fill with reverence and adoration for THE MOST HIGH! Again, I reach out to you before it is too late Henry to pray, confess you sins with humbless and ask HIM to lead you His way through THE HOLY SPIRIT! Used your mind for good, I know you can!

With love Marrian!

[hch]

Sister Marrian,

 Too many are waiting in unbelief denying that Michael Pence is about to stand for his people
Will They wait until it is too late?

The Lord has given us Daniel 7 and Revelation 13 to prepare us for what is to happen.
From Bible study, we know that the judgment began in 1844.
Then while it was in progress, the little horn (John-Paul II) plucked up Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton

That Pope Benedict was the 7th head on the first beast in Rev 13
And during Benedict's reign the time allotted to judge the living ended
And Rev 13 transitioned from the papal beast with the 7th head to the earth beast
The earth beast depicts the USA with the duo horns that are 4 American Presidents
Three of them have reigned: Bush II, Obama, and Trump
Daniel 11 states that in a "few years" Trump will be broken
At that time Michael will stand for his people and the Time of Trouble will start
Daniel 11 further explains that ships from Chittim, i.e., king of the South (Iran) 
will attack (Pence) king of the north's fleet in Persian Gulf
That leads to Armageddon when the US calls fire down from heaven

Quote

Ellen White states "Are we to wait until the fulfillment of the prophecies of the end before we say anything concerning them? Of what value will our words be then? Shall we wait until God's judgments fall upon the transgressor before we tell him how to avoid them? Where is our faith in the word of God? Must we see things foretold come to pass before we will believe what He has said? In clear, distinct rays light has come to us, showing us that the great day of the Lord is near at hand, "even at the doors." Let us read and understand before it is too late.  {9T 20.1}  

The third angel's message is about to be fulfilled.
The Laodiceans that do not need it, cannot see it, believe it or preach it!
The opportunity has been extended to Laodicea:
to study the message to see if it is rightly understood
To believe it by faith
To join in the proclamation

But too many in Laodicea who believe the first and second Angels' Messages
refuse the Third angel's message.
Thus, we have the parable of the 10 virgins that is upon us.
And the wheat and the tares will grow together until the harvest.
 

[Gregory Matthews]

Question:  Who's fooling who?  [The title of this thread.]

Answer:  HCH.

[hch]

1 hour ago, Gregory Matthews said:

Question:  Who's fooling who?  [The title of this thread.]

Answer:  HCH.

When a lack of understanding and spiritual discernment prevails, the results is that "some honest souls have been driven to take positions against the visions and against the body, which they never would have taken had their cases been managed with discretion and mercy."--Testimonies, vol. 1, pp. 382, 383. (1863)

I can only teach what I understand upon the subject presented and encourage everyone to check the facts. 

If GM's assessment of what I have presented is right, I will be embarrassed. When the spiritual discernment that the Lord has blessed me with is proven to be the heart of the third angel's message that we need to have to see us thru to the kingdom, my testimony will be that I made countless efforts to present the warning in every possible way that I could find to make it clear and to encourage further study.

 

[hch]

I came across this for whatever it is worth:

We know that Brother Jones has been giving the message for this time--meat in due season for the starving flock of God. Those who do not allow prejudice to bar the heart against the heaven-sent message, cannot but feel the spirit and force of the truth. Brother Jones has borne the message from church to church and from State to State; and light and freedom and the outpouring of the Spirit of God have attended the word, as events of a most startling nature in the fulfilment of prophecy show that the great crisis is rapidly approaching.  {15MR 298.3}  
     Brother Jones seeks to arouse the professed people of God from their death-like slumber, to see the importance of giving the warning to the world. But he advances some ideas with which not all agree, and instantly Brother Gage is aroused; he harnesses for the battle, and before the congregation in the tabernacle he takes his position in opposition to Brother Jones. Was this in the order of God? Did the Spirit of the Lord go from Brother Jones and inspire Brother Gage to do this work? Suppose that Brother Jones's statement concerning the formation of the image was premature; did the case demand such demonstrations? I answer No, no; not if God has ever spoken by me.  {15MR 298.4}  

     The Bible rules must be strictly followed. The matter concerning which a difference of opinion prevails should be calmly considered, with much prayer, with hearts yearning for unity, and with perfect love for one another's souls. Examine every point as if you could see the whole heavenly universe looking upon you. If there is a positive evidence that one of the brethren is in error, try to convince him from the Word of God. If success should not crown your efforts, even then the world has no business with this matter, for it would only dishonor the God of truth and Jesus Christ whom He hath sent.  {15MR 299.1}  
     I have received letters from different points telling the sad, discouraging results of these things. We have opposition enough from our foes, and we shall have conflicts fierce and strong; let us not now cause Satan to glory because of the pitched battles within our own ranks. The unity for which our Saviour prayed should be brought into our practical life. Peace, the peace of Christ, inspired by truth and sustained by righteousness, we must each cultivate.  {15MR 299.2}  

[stinsonmarri]

On 1/23/2020 at 1:54 AM, hch said:

Sister Marrian,

 Too many are waiting in unbelief denying that Michael Pence is about to stand for his people
Will They wait until it is too late?

The Lord has given us Daniel 7 and Revelation 13 to prepare us for what is to happen.
From Bible study, we know that the judgment began in 1844.
Then while it was in progress, the little horn (John-Paul II) plucked up Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton

That Pope Benedict was the 7th head on the first beast in Rev 13
And during Benedict's reign the time allotted to judge the living ended
And Rev 13 transitioned from the papal beast with the 7th head to the earth beast
The earth beast depicts the USA with the duo horns that are 4 American Presidents
Three of them have reigned: Bush II, Obama, and Trump
Daniel 11 states that in a "few years" Trump will be broken
At that time Michael will stand for his people and the Time of Trouble will start
Daniel 11 further explains that ships from Chittim, i.e., king of the South (Iran) 
will attack (Pence) king of the north's fleet in Persian Gulf
That leads to Armageddon when the US calls fire down from heaven

The third angel's message is about to be fulfilled.
The Laodiceans that do not need it, cannot see it, believe it or preach it!
The opportunity has been extended to Laodicea:
to study the message to see if it is rightly understood
To believe it by faith
To join in the proclamation

But too many in Laodicea who believe the first and second Angels' Messages
refuse the Third angel's message.
Thus, we have the parable of the 10 virgins that is upon us.
And the wheat and the tares will grow together until the harvest.
 

You now have going over the line and I feel you are about to see the door of mercy shut before you. You have become unholy using a mortal man in place of MICHAEL THE SON OF THE MOST HIGH! The messenger's that flying in the midst of the sky are the 144,000. Where have you seen THE SON messengers flying in mid air?

And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the Everlasting Gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Rev 14:6  

SDA and you need to read what the Scripture is actually saying: John see another messenger. Let's stop here first. Let look as the meaning of some Greek words, shall we. The Greek word "mesouranēma,"  and the Greek word "allos," Strong Greek Dictionary states:

1. Mid-sky

2. It is a primary word; “else”, that is, different (in many applications): - more, one (another), (an-, some an-) other (-s, -wise).

The Bible never said there was three, it begin with another that is different also wise! Next, let look at the English word flying! There are 11 verses found in the KJV,  and also 11 matches. The Books that this word is found are:

 

Leviticus: 2 verses found; 2 matches-creeping things

Psalms: 1 verse found; 1 match-fowl

Proverbs: 1 verse found; 1 match-the swallow

Isaiah: 3 verses found; 3 matches-serpent, birds

Zechariah: 2 verses found; 2 matches-roll

Revelation: 1 verse found; 1 match - eagle

Revelation: 1 verse found; 1 match -messengers

When any messenger from Heaven came you never see them flying. When two angels came with YAHSHUA to speak to Abraham, he saw them walking. With Baalim, the angel was standing with a sword, in Ezekiel he saw them going with THE SPIRIT and they went whenever THE SPIRIT go!  Daniel, Gabriel came and talked to him! Gabriel came and talked to Zechariah and also to Mary, the shepherds saw an angel appear and then a host of them appeared and praised THE MOST HIGH! Finally, the Bible said this:

And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. Mat 24:14

And YAHSHUA came and spake unto them, saying, All authority is given unto ME in Heaven and in earth.  Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in THE NAME of THE FATHER, and of THE SON, and of THE HOLY SPIRIT: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen. Mat 28:18-20  

Angels will not preach the Gospel, the 144,000 that was standing around the Throne of YAHWEH with the LAMB will complete it! They are the ones who this whole Chapter is about. You see them receiving their reward for the work they accomplish. Then, very clearly the Chapter tells what they did going swiftly around the world giving the Everlasting Gospels to every nation, tongue and kindred! 

Now, the other lies about Reagan, Bush and Clinton does not come from the Bible. It is deception that you have allowed Satan to twist up your mind. You prophecy is false and it will fail and your false doctrine that have given in Daniel 12:1 will be your downfall!

Happy Sabbath, Henry with much prayer!

 

[hch]

Who is fooling who?

It was said of me mentioning "Obama returning to office for which there is only one person's reading of the tea leaves as such: 'his child' he's an authority on the matter"

And that may be true:

When I understood that the papal beast in Revelation 13 had duo "two horns" 
I could see no other option for prophecy to be fulfilled.

The 7 heads on the papal beast were: Pius XI and XII, John XXIII, Paul VI, John-Paul I and II, and Benedict.
In the reigns of President Bush II and Pope Benedict XVI, the prophecy moved from the papal beast to the earth beast.
Since a horn is a king (Dan 7:23; 8:21-22) and the beast only had duo horns Bush II (horn one) Obama (horn 2)
I assumed that Trump had to be in office for less than a year and Obama had to come back into office.
in order for the traditional reading of duo horns (2 horns) to be correct

The traditional duo reading was incorrect.
The reading of duo as it in in Luke 10:1 (two by two or two and two) is the correct reading.

When the first beast transitioned to the earth-beast the horns were: Bush II, Obama, and Trump with one to yet come come

further study of Daniel  8 and 11 indicates that Trump will be broken
and from the four powers remaining in America (Senate, House of Reps,, Supreme Court, and presidency)
a little horn will arise that will become great toward the promised land (Israel)
He is the power identified in Daniel 11:30...

Quote

In the thirtieth verse a power is spoken of that "shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant." [Verses 31-36, quoted.] 

Knowing that GW was anointed the Protestant Prince of America's Covenant on the very day identified in Daniel 9 
and that the Protestant Prince of America's Covenant title went from GW to Obama and on to Trump
and that duo horns indicates a fourth and final horn of the earth-beast

Daniel 12:1 explains who Michael, the Protestant Prince of America's Covenant is that comes from 
America's (Senate, House of Reps,, Supreme Court, and presidency) when the Trump horn is broken.

So you can attribute my prophetic understanding as "reading tea leaves" if you so desire

But the promise is that in the endtime knowledge will increase regarding Daniel's prophecies
And if we expect to successfully make it through the Time of Trouble,

we are obligated to study the prophecies and to follow them
and if the devil can get you to believe that Bible prophecy is no more accurate than tea leaves
he is going to rejoice with great joy as he runs your clock down.

After America's Prince Michael of the Constitution stands for his people the Time of trouble morphs in Armageddon
Then Michael (Christ) will stand for us.

Quote

Satan can present a counterfeit so closely resembling the truth that it deceives those who are willing to be deceived, who desire to shun the self-denial and sacrifice demanded by the truth; but it is impossible for him to hold under his power one soul who honestly desires, at whatever cost, to know the truth. Christ is the truth and the "Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." John 1:9. The Spirit of truth has been sent to guide men into all truth. And upon the authority of the Son of God it is declared: "Seek, and ye shall find." "If any man will do His will, he shall know of the doctrine." Matthew 7:7; John 7:17. {DD 12.1} 

We have arrived at the time when there will be no delaying Bible prophecy. As the fruit follows the bud on the fig tree, Michael Pence will follow Trump and the Mark of the beast will be implemented and God's people will be sealed and judgment will begin at the House of God.