Another Black hole found in space?

[hch]

They discovered a black hole in space and got a photo:

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/black-hole-picture-could-unlock-new-era-astronomy-ncna993531

But now they have found another dark structure that is as big as a million suns, but it is not a black hole:

https://www.newsweek.com/huge-hole-ripped-milky-way-1426920

 

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@NASAHubble I was wondering where the dark structure recently found via Gaia observations is in relation to the position of Orion as seen from earth. In 1848, it was written that we would one day be looking through the "open space in Orion."

 

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Dec. 16, 1848, the Lord gave me a view of the shaking of the powers of the heavens. I saw that when the Lord said "heaven" (in giving the signs recorded by Matthew, Mark and Luke,) he meant heaven, and when he said "earth" he meant earth. The powers of heaven, are the Sun, Moon and Stars: they rule in the heavens. The powers of earth are those who bear rule on the earth. The powers of heaven will be shaken at the voice of God. Then the Sun, Moon, and Stars will be moved out of their places. They will not pass away, but be shaken by the voice of God. {RH, August 1, 1849 par. 19}

 

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Dark, heavy clouds came up, and clashed against each other. The atmosphere parted and rolled back, then we could look up through the open space in Orion, from whence came the voice of God. The Holy City will come down through that open space. I saw that the powers of earth are now being shaken, and that events come in order. War, and rumors of war,--sword, famine and pestilence, are first to shake the powers of earth, then the voice of God will shake the Sun, Moon and Stars, and this earth also. I saw that the shaking of the powers in Europe is not (as some teach) the shaking of the powers of heaven, but it is the shaking of the angry nations.

 

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On September 14, 2015, LIGO became the first instrument to detect gravitational waves on Earth. When two black holes—each about 30 times more massive than our sun—merged, they generated gravitational waves—ripples in space and time.

With the discovery of the black hole and the huge dark space we must not overlook the LIGO discovery that not only proves Einstein's theory, but confirms Christ final sign in the heavens 

https://www.ligo.caltech.edu/news/ligo20160211

Read about that LIGO detection that proves Einstein's theory and Christ's words that the powers of heaven and earth will be shaken. it was not with a earthquake but a we small voice that the prophet heard the voice of God.

[hch]

One black hole that draws everything into itself.

And another black hole that is like a shadow? "The shadow knows."

[JoeMo]

On 5/21/2019 at 7:05 AM, hch said:

Read about that LIGO detection that proves Einstein's theory and Christ's words that the powers of heaven and earth will be shaken. it was not with a earthquake but a we small voice that the prophet heard the voice of God.

And just how does this prove Christ's power?  It simply verifies Einstein's theory of general relativity, as well as certain aspects of quantum theory (which Einstein had initially rejected).  Quantum gravitational waves are so weak over long distances that they are just barely detectable.  The LIGO is so sensitive it can detect a gravitational disturbance that moves an object no more than the diameter of the nucleus of an atom from 20 miles away.

I'm currently reading Steven Hawking's "A Brief History of Time" that describes quantum gravitational waves and the LIGO Project.  Whereas gravitational waves are extremely weak over a distance of 1.3 billion light-years, near the collision site, there was probably a temporary rift in space-time.

[hch]

19 hours ago, JoeMo said:

And just how does this prove Christ's power?  It simply verifies Einstein's theory of general relativity, as well as certain aspects of quantum theory (which Einstein had initially rejected).  Quantum gravitational waves are so weak over long distances that they are just barely detectable.  The LIGO is so sensitive it can detect a gravitational disturbance that moves an object no more than the diameter of the nucleus of an atom from 20 miles away.

Not being a "scientist" I have to refer back to the article about LIGO. The postulation was that the space time disturbance was caused by two super sized black holes colliding and merging. The energy released by their union rippled through the universe. 

JoeMo, Is it not the purpose of LIGO to confirm disturbances in the space time continuum that would be caused by such a collision?

[Gregory Matthews]

No.   The purpose of LIGO was to detect cosmic gravitational waves.

[JoeMo]

3 hours ago, hch said:

JoeMo, Is it not the purpose of LIGO to confirm disturbances in the space time continuum that would be caused by such a collision?

Yes; but it only proves part of Einstein's theory of general relativity; it doesn't prove anything about the existence of God; anymore than Einstein attributed his theory to the existence of God.

IMHO, the entire universe - it's order, symmetry, and beauty - as well as the power and energy involved in the aggregate power of the trillions of starts, pulsars, quasars, etc. right down to the forces inside the tiniest of particles (quarks) - demonstrate the existence of an infinitely powerful and intelligent God.

[stinsonmarri]

12 hours ago, JoeMo said:

Yes; but it only proves part of Einstein's theory of general relativity; it doesn't prove anything about the existence of God; anymore than Einstein attributed his theory to the existence of God.

IMHO, the entire universe - it's order, symmetry, and beauty - as well as the power and energy involved in the aggregate power of the trillions of starts, pulsars, quasars, etc. right down to the forces inside the tiniest of particles (quarks) - demonstrate the existence of an infinitely powerful and intelligent God.

Time and time again, we try to question the mystery of the Universe. The Bible makes it clear:

Thus, the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. Gen 2:1 

Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge? Knowest thou the ordinances of heaven? canst thou set the dominion thereof in the earth? Job 38:2, 33 

The secret things belong unto YAHWEH our ELOHEINU: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children forever, that we may do all the Words of this Law. Deut 29:29 

Sometimes I think many do not really believe that THE THREE ALMIGHTY ONES truly exist. We rather accept man's concept over THEIR'S! Einstein’s general theory of relativity is only a theory; it has not been proven if it had they would not continue to call it a theory! Again, we continue to speculate about the heavens/universe instead of accepting that it is finished and that our ancient ancestors know more then we do. YAHWEH stopped them, but they provided maps and sacred places about the stars. We today think they were jungle bunnies with long sharp sticks. These people after the flood were exploring and were using 100-90% of their brains. All the drawings were done after YAHWEH stopped them and confounded their language. Even after that, they were able to start writing down their new languages and they had huge libraries of tablets that were found. There are still languages today that we have not even decipher. Some had huge observatories and India temples look like landing pads. Drawings have been done that can only be seen from the sky and we cannot fathom things here on earth and think we know what's in the universe. If so explain to me how planets can orbit and what keep them hanging out in space! Why are some gaseous and some are not in our solar system? Explain Saturn's rings or how Uranus tilts on its side? Why have all the planets in our solar system have not collided? We do not know anything about what looks like a black hole! All are theories and speculations. We can't even figure out how we are made let alone the universe.

My plan is to pray, obey and watch for the signs that will soon come. The Bible said if YAHSHUA would not hurry up and come, Satan will eventually deceive even the elect. That is something to think about! I will say this again if Trump a man can deceive so many people today like never before, then we are no match for the beast and Satan that is to come! I know some of you will get upset with me, but I just ask you to sincerely think about it, please! I'm not here to fight about parties or what you think he's supposed to have done, just pray and ask THE HOLY SPIRIT to show you his character, nothing else! I am not better than anybody and I just want to stand and call sin by its right name that's all! Accept that we need to know YAHWEH and HIS Wisdom!

Happy Sabbath and be bless!

[hch]

20 hours ago, Gregory Matthews said:

No.   The purpose of LIGO was to detect cosmic gravitational waves.

Was that ever in doubt ? But what do the gravitational waves do?

When the two black holes collided in the scenario postulated by the article cited about LIGO, power was released that rippled through the universe as gravitational waves. Objects near the  epicenter of the impact would likely experience more of the force of those gravitational waves than distant objects. The fact that the gravitational  waves traveled through time and space to reach the earth on 14 September 1015 verifies Christs words that the powers of heaven and earth would be shaken as a sign of His coming. Not only did it happen,  but LIGO was in place in time to confirm the occurrence. And the shaking of the earth was not a violent earthquake, but a chirp.

It is like the prophet Elijah hearing the voice of God in the whisper rather than the earthquake.

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Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth? Luke 18 :8

 

[Gregory Matthews]

For a 33 page discussion of gravitational waves, written before LIGO was fuolly operational, see:

http://www.tat.physik.uni-tuebingen.de/~kokkotas/Teaching/NS.BH.GW_files/GW_Physics.pdf

For a more up to date article written in March of 2019, which takes into consideration what we have learned from LIGO see:

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/space/reference/gravitational-waves/

 

 

[JoeMo]

10 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

Einstein’s general theory of relativity is only a theory; it has not been proven if it had they would not continue to call it a theory!

Almost all physical laws are theories.  All it takes is a single instance of an observation that the theory does NOT predict to nullify the theory.  Usually it results in the theory being refined.  All "theories" are mathematical models of reality; but they are not actual reality.  I find the verification of quantum gravitational waves just another amazing example of God's creative power and majesty.

 

10 hours ago, stinsonmarri said:

If so explain to me how planets can orbit and what keep them hanging out in space! Why are some gaseous and some are not in our solar system? Explain Saturn's rings or how Uranus tilts on its side? Why have all the planets in our solar system have not collided? We do not know anything about what looks like a black hole! All are theories and speculations. We can't even figure out how we are made let alone the universe.

Some of these questions have their answers in science; and some do not.  Just because a theory has not been proven beyond the shadow of a doubt does not make it wrong. For example, science has no idea if the "initial conditions" immediately prior or after the "big bang".  Science is not even sure that the currently observed laws of physics apply to the initial conditions of the universe. If the "big bang is feasible (I think it is), God would have had to design "the Beginning" very carefully to ensure that the universe would be a smooth, stable operation for a VERY long time that would not "run away" with itself into nothing but cold, empty space or to collapse upon itself into a singularity.

[stinsonmarri]

 

 

 

 

 

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12 hours ago, JoeMo said:

Almost all physical laws are theories.  All it takes is a single instance of an observation that the theory does NOT predict to nullify the theory.  Usually it results in the theory being refined.  All "theories" are mathematical models of reality; but they are not actual reality.  I find the verification of quantum gravitational waves just another amazing example of God's creative power and majesty.

 

Some of these questions have their answers in science; and some do not.  Just because a theory has not been proven beyond the shadow of a doubt does not make it wrong. For example, science has no idea if the "initial conditions" immediately prior or after the "big bang".  Science is not even sure that the currently observed laws of physics apply to the initial conditions of the universe. If the "big bang is feasible (I think it is), God would have had to design "the Beginning" very carefully to ensure that the universe would be a smooth, stable operation for a VERY long time that would not "run away" with itself into nothing but cold, empty space or to collapse upon itself into a singularity.

Joe: This is another thing we disagree on. YAHWEH create not bangs, that is to me so unholy and unreverence to THE ALMIGHTIES! When we make something we may have to bang, but the Bible says HE Speak and things are done by THE HOLY SPIRIT! I have never read that they bang at all! I know what theories are and once one is proven it is no longer called a theory! If it cannot be proven it is an assumption and that's simple. We do not have the WISDOM of THE ALMIGHTY ONES! No ones know how the body is made, the brain runs on electricity call synapses that take messages can you explain it, I can't! We came from dirt shaped into a body and YAHWEH THE SON BREATHE HIS BREATH and we became a living soul! There a Tree that also has this LIFE and if we had continued to eat its fruit we would have lived forever! I would like someone to explain that! How do angels fly from a place that has no time to a place that is marked with time? Explain Black Matter, or even the Milky Way or other galaxies that are hanging out in Black Matter? What is gravity and how does it work. How does the blazing sun blow out all these enormous fire waves that cause radiation? Nothings collides, how is that possible? The moon controls the earth especially the tidal waves and more how? What makes the moon be at the right place to be between the sun and the earth to reflect the sunlight so that we can see it? How does a seed produce a plant, or where does lighting come from and why? How do the clouds stay afloat even when they are dark and heavy with water? How does sperm come into eqq and produce chromosomes that turn into a baby, how? I can go on and on and on and on of so many hows and human beings cannot explain these things with theories, they just don't know!

Blessings!

[Gregory Matthews]

The  statement quoted below is not true.  In science, a theory may be considered to be established, and yet it is called a theory.  Regardless of the fact that it is established, some of the boundaries may not be known.     Further information as to the established theory may be discovered.  

I know what theories are and once one is proven it is no longer called a theory!

[hch]

As I understand it, a hypothesis is a working model until it is proven to be a theory.

An example might be the evolution hypothesis that is mistakenly called a theory by its believers, though it has never been proven.  And since it is opposed to the revelation from the word of God, it will never be proven. 

[Gregory Matthews]

1)  I agree that the "word of God" will not be proven wrong.  However, the alleged "word of God" may not be the actual word of God.  it may be proven wrong.  As an example, we often have had one of our members of this forum post an alleged word of God, only to be proven wrong.  Just demonstrated that  what that member posted was a word from some source other than God.

2)  So you are telling us that evolution is not a theory? 

3)  The word "evolution" has  wide range of meanings.  Some aspects of the meaning of that word have been demonstrated to be factual and not opposed to the word of God.  There are other aspects of the meaning of that word that continue to remain under study.

 

By the way,  there are Bible believing scientists who have published aspects evolution that have been documented and are not opposed to t he word of God.

[Gregory Matthews]

On an aspect of "Black Holes:"  Black holes only draw into itself that which has crossed the Event Horizon.  That which has not crossed the Event Horizon is not drawn into a Black Hole.

See:

https://www.space.com/black-holes-event-horizon-explained.html

 

[hch]

13 minutes ago, Gregory Matthews said:

1)  I agree that the "word of God" will not be proven wrong.  However, the alleged "word of God" may not be the actual word of God.  it may be proven wrong.  As an example, we often have had one of our members of this forum post an alleged word of God, only to be proven wrong.  Just demonstrated that  what that member posted was a word from some source other than God.

2)  So you are telling us that evolution is not a theory? 

3)  The word "evolution" has  wide range of meanings.  Some aspects of the meaning of that word have been demonstrated to be factual and not opposed to the word of God.  There are other aspects of the meaning of that word that continue to remain under study.

 

By the way,  there are Bible believing scientists who have published aspects evolution that have been documented and are not opposed to t he word of God.

1) it is good for brethren to agree on things that do not require compromising of standards. The "word of God" as it was alleged by the church in the Dark Ages had the sun going around the earth instead of the earth orbiting the sun: When knowledge increased the alleged truth of that day was set right: It was neve an error with the Bible, but misunderstanding it -- that was the problem. We often encounter a moderator among us who has demonstrated skepticism that appears to look at the messenger more the message. The messenger is a human vessel, frail and imperfect. When seeking truth, there can be false starts and misunderstandings like the earth's motion in relation to the sun: but when the truth is known as it is in the Bible, the Bible always wins. And the message in the right context is a blessing in spite of the messenger.

2) "What's the difference between Hypothesis and Theory? A hypothesis is either a suggested explanation for an observable phenomenon, or a reasoned prediction of a possible causal correlation among multiple phenomena. In science, a theory is a tested, well-substantiated, unifying explanation for a set of verified, proven hypotheses A hypothesis is either a suggested explanation for an observable phenomenon, or a reasoned prediction of a possible causal correlation among multiple phenomena." www.diffen.com/difference/Hypothesis_vs_Theory 

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3) "Men take it upon themselves to rein up the word of God before a finite tribunal, and sentence is pronounced upon the inspiration of God according to finite measurement, and the truth of God is made to appear as a thing uncertain before the records of science. These false educators exalt nature above nature's God, and above the Author of all true science. At the very time when teachers should have been firm and unwavering in their testimony, at the very time when it should have been made manifest that their souls were riveted to the eternal Rock, when they should have been able to inspire faith in those who were doubting, they made admission of their own uncertainty as to whether the word of God or the discoveries of science, falsely so called, were true. Those who were truly conscientious have been made to waver in their faith because of the hesitation of those who were professed expositors of the Bible when they dealt with the living oracles. Satan has taken advantage of the uncertainty of the mind, and through unseen agencies, he has crowded in his sophistries, and has caused men to become befogged in the mists of skepticism.  {FE 328.2}  

Gregory, Thank you for your input.

[hch]

35 minutes ago, Gregory Matthews said:

On an aspect of "Black Holes:"  Black holes only draw into itself that which has crossed the Event Horizon.  That which has not crossed the Event Horizon is not drawn into a Black Hole.

See:

https://www.space.com/black-holes-event-horizon-explained.html

 

That is a fascinating point. On the one hand, scientists have recently produced pictures of a "black hole" and not too soon after that -- they have discovered a void in the Milky Way that is (an area of darkness the size of a million of our suns) absent of light, but it is not a black hole.

And the timing of the discovery of the latter aligns with an EGW comment that we have yet to understand:

 

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December 16, 1848, the Lord gave me a view of the shaking of the powers of the heavens. I saw that when the Lord said "heaven," in giving the signs recorded by Matthew, Mark, and Luke, He meant heaven, and when He said "earth" He meant earth. The powers of heaven are the sun, moon, and stars. They rule in the heavens. The powers of earth are those that rule on the earth. The powers of heaven will be shaken at the voice of God. Then the sun, moon, and stars will be moved out of their places. They will not pass away, but be shaken by the voice of God.  {EW 41.1} 
     Dark, heavy clouds came up and clashed against each other. The atmosphere parted and rolled back; then we could look up through the open space in Orion, whence came the voice of God. The Holy City will come down through that open space. I saw that the powers of earth are now being shaken and that events come in order. War, and rumors of war, sword, famine, and pestilence are first to shake the powers of earth, then the voice of God will shake the sun, moon, and stars, and this earth also. I saw that the shaking of the powers in Europe is not, as some teach, the shaking of the powers of heaven, but it is the shaking of the angry nations.  {EW 41.2}