We don't talk about Spiritual Abuse in the Church.

[JeriAnne]

Spiritual Abuse

Physical Abuse

Emotional Abuse

Sexual Abuse

[size:11pt]All of these are avenues of manipulation and control! The Powers of Darkness know them well and since they hate the light will take advantage of EVERY way to control!

And the Powers of Darkness often dwell in churches!

Gatherings of people

Play acting righteousness

Competetive Religiousity

Praying loudly to be heard and noticed for the long flowery words

Jesus knows how it works...in churches! And Jesus wasn't happy about it! He created whips for controllers and words like "white-washed seplucters" for those with controlling hearts and sanctimonious demeanors!

We are left with Promises of The spirit of Light and Love that would dwell in hearts!! and That Spirit would love us in our unloveliness and gently inform our ignorance and bring healing conviction and comforting salve for our pain.

I am reminded of a poem I wrote a few years ago. My own confrontation of abuses and the event that gave me reason for hope in the darkness!

Chorus:

You feel shame?

Well shame on you!

Jesus died on the cross for you!

Just claim His blood for all your sin

And He will make you white again!

Verse 1:

I messed up really bad today

I did my thing to medicate

I have no right to feel so low

“Jesus loves me this I know.”

Chorus: (Softly but accusing)

You feel shame?

Well shame on you!

Jesus died on the cross for you!

Just claim His blood for all your sin

And He will make you white again!

Verse 2:

My faith was weak, my focus wrong.

If I try harder, I’ll be strong.

I’ll smile and put away my fear.

“God will forgive, He loves you dear.”

Chorus: (Ominously)

You feel shame?

Well shame on you!

Jesus died on the cross for you!

Just claim His blood for all your sin

And He will make you white again!

Verse 3:

And so the downward spiral spins

Into the darkness into the sin

Where Jesus blood no longer heals

Or covers blackened heart of steel.

Chorus: (tauntingly)

You feel shame?

Well shame on you!

Jesus died on the cross for you!

Just claim His blood for all your sin

And He will make you white again!

Verse 4:

The heart it doesn’t have a choice

Of right or wrong, there is no voice

A heart of sin will always be

A heart of sin for all to see.

Chorus: (Jeeringly)

You feel shame

Well shame on you.

Jesus died on the cross for you!

Just claim His blood for all your sin

And He will make you white again!

When from the pit of deep despair

I know that God must NOT be there

A tiny little voice I hear

(gasp!) There is no condemnations fear!

“You feel shame? I can create

A heart that’s pure and free from hate.

It will be tiny, it will be small

Sometimes you’ll wonder if it’s there at all.

But this small heart will have no choice-will beat to freedom, love and joy!

Will always do what’s pure and right

Will NOT be shamed!

Will LOVE the light!

Will NOT be shamed!

Will LOVE the light!”

When Jesus blood fell to the ground,

His heart broke up without a sound.

So each of us can have inside

Our own small piece

Of peace of mind!

Our own small piece

Of peace of mind!

And when all is said and done it is in the Holy place of our Heart that Jesus dwells through The Spirit! What goes on in church may or may not be relevant to that wonderful Sanctuary of our Hearts! The Church is NOT GOD!!!!Only in our hearts can we truly experience the honest integrity from which will flow a life that will exhibit interactions free from abusive influence!

[LifeHiscost]

The Church is NOT GOD!!!!Only in our hearts can we truly experience the honest integrity from which will flow a life that will exhibit interactions free from abusive influence!

"...not forsaking our own assembling together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another; and all the more as you see the day drawing near."

Hebrews 10:24 NASB

In the world we will always find those that abuse. This world is satan's domain. Where we are is not what determines who we are. Who we set our mind on does influence who we are.

Good reasons to ask Jesus for His cleansing every day___

"To the pure, all things are pure; but to those who are defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure, but both their mind and their conscience are defiled." Titus 1:15

NASB

"And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Matthew 19:17

KJV

"If we [freely] admit that we have sinned and confess our sins, He is faithful and just (true to His own nature and promises) and will forgive our sins [dismiss our lawlessness] and [continuously] cleanse us from all unrighteousness " 1 John 1:9 AMP

Blessings!

[LifeHiscost]

Originally Posted By: David Koot

[quote name='aldona.

I work in the health care profession' date=' and am a member of an SDA church, and I have heard every single one of these phrases, and continue to do so regularly.

In 20 years of various types of ministry, including full-time exposure to church situations, regular hospital visitation as well as chaplaincy training, I have NEVER heard any of those things said to someone who is sick, nor can I imagine anyone who is stable and has a healthy Christian experience saying such things.

Dave [/quote']

Thank you Dave. I was beginning to believe that I live in a "different" world.

Not suggesting that each of your experiences aren't true to form, for some. There is a principle of the dark kingdom that provides just the right influence that is most apt to cause us to retaliate in the same manner as we find it most difficult to maintain our godly decorum. I've found it true that when all negative events cause one to flee to Jesus side, the spiritual strength gained acquires power beyond anything retaliation will accomplish.

"Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you." James 4:7 KJV

Blessings!

[carolaa]

Originally Posted By: Naomi

With the exception about not placing anything on the Bible. It was during my first year at Church Camp and I was unpacking and laid something on my Bible and another girl went into a state of shock.

Just recently (well, in the last year, since my son joined Pathfinders)my son got a little panicked when I placed some papers on his Bible at the table. He told me that we aren't supposed to put anything on top of the Bible. I asked him where he had heard that, but he couldn't remember. I am suspecting that he must have heard it at church or at a Pathfinder meeting. I grew up in another denomination, but have never heard that before! I told him that I thought that was superstitious thinking and not to worry about it. Of course, he should treat the book well (as I try to teach all my kids to take care of their books), but putting papers on top? I think that's proabbly okay. :-)

My husband has a great term for that (let's see if I can spell it) -- Bibliolatry

[Morepork]

I was suffering from severe back pain a few years back, and my girlfriend approached the minister (with my permission) to have an annointing. All the Elders were called in, about a dozen, and after the Pastor spoke, I was asked why I thought I should be healed.The questions that came from some of the Elders, and the heated argument that followed when my friend objected - we were there for an annointing, not a 3rd degree!, caused my friend to walk out and I desparetly wanted to follow.

Years later one of those Elders came to my current church and took on SS Superintendant. He rang me the first friday night and told me that he had shut down my Women's Class in the library, as it was not Biblical for women to teach women.

No amount of objection from several could reverse the decision, and no amount of asking could produce a text to support his decision.

We tried to meet in other areas of the church, but finally gave up when the class realized the absolute anger we were generating.

Spiritual abuse if rife in our churches.

Yes, I have heard myself the above quotes from well meaning christians.

We are in a war zone, we can either be defeated, or strengthened.

Use them as stepping stones to the Kingdom.

[nuff sed]

Why is it that we wait until someone is dying before we anoint them. The Scriptures say,"If there are any "Sick" among you......"

[Woody]

I've been annointed and I'm still kickin.Fact is ... I was annointed by your pastor Gladussee. I get my exercise by comin' here to do my kickin' ... thanks to his annointing of me. Some may be lookin for me to 'kick the bucket' but I ain't done yet.

[Woody]

I was suffering from severe back pain a few years back, and my girlfriend approached the minister (with my permission) to have an annointing. All the Elders were called in, about a dozen, and after the Pastor spoke, I was asked why I thought I should be healed.The questions that came from some of the Elders, and the heated argument that followed when my friend objected - we were there for an annointing, not a 3rd degree!, caused my friend to walk out and I desparetly wanted to follow.

Years later one of those Elders came to my current church and took on SS Superintendant. He rang me the first friday night and told me that he had shut down my Women's Class in the library, as it was not Biblical for women to teach women.

No amount of objection from several could reverse the decision, and no amount of asking could produce a text to support his decision.

We tried to meet in other areas of the church, but finally gave up when the class realized the absolute anger we were generating.

Spiritual abuse if rife in our churches.

Yes, I have heard myself the above quotes from well meaning christians.

We are in a war zone, we can either be defeated, or strengthened.

Use them as stepping stones to the Kingdom.

Thank you for sharing this experience. I am so sorry for the abuse that you experienced. Yes, spiritual abuse is alive and well. But instead of us being defeated ... we need to join together and defeat it.

This is a new one about women not being able to teach women. In my home ... we experience the old guard that don't want women to teach men. And those folks can be quite militant. We have the scars to prove it.

Anyways ... back to your experience: Did you get annointed or did you leave? If you got annointed ... how was the experience for you? I hope the Third Degree that you received didn't get in the way. You have to be strong in the strife of the church.

Perhaps the topic of annointing would be a good thread. But either way ... I would love to hear more from you.

[teresaq]

I was very young and immessionable when I first came to church as a adolescent with my next door neigbhor.

I was wide eyed and bushy tale!

I was taught so much and took it all to heart.

God doesnt listen if my eyes arent closed in prayer.

God doesnt like me when I sin.

Never place anything on the Bible.

Dont marry mixed races.

If I obey GOD I will be rich and handsome/pretty.

If I sin others will know it when bad things happent to me.

If I dont read and pray fervantly enough every moring I will be lost that day Cause I have not re astablished my relationship with God.

If I pay Tithe I will never be without want or comfort.

God hates fags until they are straight.

If I eat meat I will die under God's wrath.

If I do everything right at all times I will be rewarded someday by going to heaven.

All of this- I took to heart. I was and am surrounded by people who takes these and much more to heart.

wow! i can identify up to a point. i was born into this church but escaped at age 12 permanently. temporarily a couple of times before.

im not sure what would have happened to me if i hadnt. i think tho, that it is a combination of the church and parents.

i think healthy, stable parents can thwart the churchs dysfunction. that is the only conclusion i can come to for the very few born into this church who turn out stable, loving Christians, or close to it.

i have fairly recently worked through my issues with the church, or mostly so. i so encourage those still in pain or harboring whatever to please, please deal with it for your own sake, no one elses. there are just going to be "bad" people, or ignorant, or operating in their dysfunction, however one wishes to state it.

but that doesnt touch on the issues you raised paradeorange. healing for that can take a lot longer but as we come to the true Christ as opposed to the religious christ i believe we start changing.

sorry stan, didnt realize this thread was going before spouting my mouth elsewhere.

great topic!! now lets jump on the bandwagon for healing cause it feels so good! and free!!

[Overaged]

When I became a coleporter I didnt have a car and didnt know how to drive. My parents didnt teach me-anyway I digress.

So after an Elder in the church taught me how to drive I aquired an old mustard toyata.

The dear old saint who sold me the car for coleportering told me 'as long as I dont sin my car wont break down.

Being a new gulliable naive christian I believed her and made the agreement with God that as long as I dont sin my car would always be running!

I was faithful as much as I could be but I knew God was showing the church that I was a sinner and it killed me. I tried to be good.

I dont think like that now(?) but as a young Christian rejoicing in the Lord and sitting at the feet of the older saints- I took all their garbage in.

that was spiritual abuse. Of course I am partly to blame. I hung on their every word.

As I read your accounts here of that first car; (I apologize) but I had to chuckle. It sounds like one of many old beaters I have had. I would have had a lot of fun with that old car.

Wow. You must have sinned quite a few times for the water pump to go!

I am just kidding of course; but I did have a similar experience when I did the Literature Evangelism. I had a little Chevette, and while on my way to an appointment; I rear-ended someone and totalled the car. Thankfully, no one was injured; but the spiritual abuses heaped upon me following this incident were outrageous. It's too much to recount much of it here; but one of the first things I was told is that "you don't have ENOUGH faith."

I eventually left that line of work, and it took years to get over the impact of this. I have come to accept that some people don't have a clue what they are talking about; and that inspite of it all; God has given me some wonderful experiences that I still use to encourage others with when the occassion presents.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

I was in a job where the owner/administrator was an SDA pastor. It was the worst job I ever had. He told me that *that* was where God wanted me to be, and he would hang Bible texts all over around my work station. He would call me into his office and harangue me for more than two hours at a time (after work) for not doing what God wanted me to do. I stayed there for 5 years because I try to be loyal to wherever I work, but that job cost me a lot, in more ways than one.

[Overaged]

I was in a job where the owner/administrator was an SDA pastor. It was the worst job I ever had. He told me that *that* was where God wanted me to be, and he would hang Bible texts all over around my work station. He would call me into his office and harangue me for more than two hours at a time (after work) for not doing what God wanted me to do. I stayed there for 5 years because I try to be loyal to wherever I work, but that job cost me a lot, in more ways than one.

I can think of a similar experience I had; it seems so much harder when someone we are supposed to trust or look up to treats us like this. I hope you were able to take some of the skills from that job and apply them elsewhere? Crises can = opportunity.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Actually, I had to stop working because of that, and how it had indirectly affected my health.

[Overaged]

Actually, I had to stop working because of that, and how it had indirectly affected my health.

Sorry to hear that. My health was very adversely affected for a while too because of a very abusive Pastor. It kind of bothers me that they are not held accountable the same way we are; its amazing what some of them get away with. And when I see that same guy standing up front somewhere and giving "testimonies" it really makes me want to stand up and yell out exactly what he did. (LOL I am a trucker and I can really yell). But it all got to the point where I had to let it go before it literally killed me. I'm glad God has been able to penetrate my sometimes very thick skull and help me through this. I now feel very blessed to be a Church member and to be a Christian.

[pindoc]

I was suffering from severe back pain a few years back, and my girlfriend approached the minister (with my permission) to have an anointing. All the Elders were called in, about a dozen, and after the Pastor spoke, I was asked why I thought I should be healed.The questions that came from some of the Elders, and the heated argument that followed when my friend objected - we were there for an anointing, not a 3rd degree!, caused my friend to walk out and I desperately wanted to follow.

[pindoc]

That reminds me. I have an aunt with whom I hardly speak. I had too many times of 20-30 minutes of "You can't possibly go to heaven because you think that way? Doesn't that bother you a lot?" The more I said no, the more it ticked her off. One day, she ended up storming out of the room in disgust.

I was at her house.

[SivartM]

Reading this thread made me mad.

I'm so glad that nobody has said anything to me like the things mentioned in this thread or I don't know where I'd be.

I guess the worst spiritual abuse I must have had is being told in Sabbath School when I was little never to put anything on top of my Bible. It took me a long time before I could convince myself that I would not be sinning if I happened to put a paper down on my Bible.

Another spiritual abuse, I think, though probably unintentional, is keeping people in ignorance of other points of view. I like my SS teacher, but if I believed everything he said... I would have some strange ideas (of course, I did believe things like that for most of my life). Things like, "Most other Christians just ignore the book of Revelation because they just can't understand it," and, "Everyone but us just leaves out the parts of the Bible they don't like!" Uh... riiiight...

[Overaged]

Well; the worst thing to have on your Bible is dust!

[Overaged]

LOL; you should have locked the door after she left!

[Ellen]

Quote:

Well; the worst thing to have on your Bible is dust! announce

What a perfect conclusion to this discussion.

[skyblue888]

(Just tagging on some thoughts, not in response to anyone in particular.)

Spiritual abuse, to me, is when someone tries to use moralistic or theological "heavy handed" language as a means to manipulate someone else's feelings, perspective, or decision.

If something really is true, it can stand on its own merits as such. We don't need to "scare" or "browbeat" or manipulate someone into seeing it as truth. In fact, the lighter the touch, the more compelling the truth. Sometimes a phrase such as, "in my experience" or "the way I see it" -- which might at first seem like a "compromise" upon the "absolute" nature of truth -- is its most effective vehicle of conveyance to another's mind, precisely because it is so non-intrusive.

Remember, Jesus says He stands at the door and knocks. He doesn't barge in, take over, and insist on His way.

Exacltly! And the "loud cry" will not be about raising the voice or yelling at people but more along the lines of your above post. The still-small voice of the Holy Spirit speaks louder than any other voice when the truth is presented in love.

sky

[skyblue888]

Originally Posted By: Naomi

With the exception about not placing anything on the Bible. It was during my first year at Church Camp and I was unpacking and laid something on my Bible and another girl went into a state of shock.

Just recently (well, in the last year, since my son joined Pathfinders)my son got a little panicked when I placed some papers on his Bible at the table. He told me that we aren't supposed to put anything on top of the Bible. I asked him where he had heard that, but he couldn't remember. I am suspecting that he must have heard it at church or at a Pathfinder meeting. I grew up in another denomination, but have never heard that before! I told him that I thought that was superstitious thinking and not to worry about it. Of course, he should treat the book well (as I try to teach all my kids to take care of their books), but putting papers on top? I think that's proabbly okay. :-)

Well put Toni!

sky

[skyblue888]

After reading the whole thread I couldn't help but think of the fact that the Lord has already warned us, many years ago, of what would happen to us as a people, if we, like the Jews, chose to have a man instead of Christ as the world church leader.

"The high-handed power that has been developed, as though position has made men gods, make me afraid, and ought to cause fear. It is a curse wherever and by whomsoever it is exercised. This lording it over God's heritage will create such a disgust of men's jurisdiction that a state of insubordination will result." T.M.361.

This is the spiritual abuse the Lord warned us about if we were to look to men for help instead of to Him alone.

"For years the church has been looking to man and expecting much from man, but not looking to Jesus, in whom our hopes of eternal life are centered." T.M.93.

sky

[Restin]

It distresses me how everyone is expected to evangelize like Billy Graham: memorize all the texts to say to strangers, be able to grab someone in the parking lot of the grocery store and give them a Bible study, and have the charisma of the Avon Lady. If you dare to say in church that you just don't have the nerve to do that, you're made to feel very guilty, like a copout, and in soul jeopardy!

Must we all be carbon copies in God's work? Someone has to make the literature we pass out, design and print the Bible studies, fold flyers. Can someone with social anxiety, or maybe even a touch autistic, be approved by God by work behind the scenes. Or must we all become exactly the same?

[Stan]

It is so good to see a post from you, one of my favourite artists.

It has been my experience that those who go to witness to people don't, and those who just be themselves do.

Am reminded of a person who always likes to go to another town to witness, and yet she cannot do it in her own town. The truth is this, she is doing it in her own town as she interacts with people, and she try to be a fake person in the other town.

Hope that came through as I had meant it to.

Witness is not something we do, it is something we are.