Guest Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: Shane said: Quote: then the point of starting this thread was what? Name of this section is [:"red"] "Things we don't talk about..." [/] yes.... I see... my bad.... it is the typical adventist response to anything uncomfortable.... "let's not talk about it, let's just pray for them...." carry on..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: "let's not talk about it, let's just pray for them...." Am not saying that... AM saying to take solid action and not be a gossipmonger or a rumormonger… Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kountzer Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 the 'truth, and you, or someone else sees it. Quote I prayed for twenty years but received no answer until I prayed with my legs. Frederick Douglass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 An example is this, one on of our sister forums someone started a rumor that a certain trust department had been shut down, well I had confirmation this AM that it is not true by any means. It appears as it was asked as an honest question, however it was viewed soon as a fact. Those rumors go wild and it was reported on another thread here as a fact. This is an example of the damage gossipmongers do to online forums. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: Stan Jensen said: Is it a rumor or is it a fact???? If it is a fact it needs to be dealt with, if it is a rumour that people area spreading all over the internet, because they heard someone say that their cousin is sure that he heard from a friend of his,... then it should be stopped and action taken... Why don't people take action when it is in their power to do so?? Quote: I know I have mentioned my cute little small country church before. Well... The treasurer told my good lady friend how much tithe a rich member pays. The Treasurer hadnt seen my lady friend in awhile so she wanted to 'keep their closeness' by divulging certain friendly gossip. The lady friend used to be a border on her property so they were very close in years past. My lady friend went to my home right after leaving the Treasurer and was upset. She told me She isnt glad she dont tithe at that church. It kind of spooked her. I could of asked the amount. I have known him or known of him since I was a teen cause that rich guy was married to the family that introduced me to Adventism as a kid. Its a small town and a small church where everybody knows each other business. I know too much and I dont repeat it more often than not. It does nobody good. It just proves 'I'm in the know', and so what. This kind of gossip makes its rounds weekly at my cute little small town church. Classic example of the above.......... Quote: because they heard someone say that their cousin is sure that he heard from a friend of his,... then it should be stopped and action Is not asking how much the solution? Or taking action to correct this wrong the solution? Third hand information has just been repeated and acknowlegded here . No way of knowing of course but with C/A being a very visible adventist forum it is possible both the treasurer in question and "the good lady friend" nay be reading and recognize themselves. Stan suggested a very simple solution to problems like this, an overly simplistic solution many times. Why not take what you have been told to the church board??? This is definately a wrong that needs to stop or should. Why are you listening to your "very good lady friend" long enough to get the details of the gossip??? A short and simple solution would be to say, "I don't care to hear this, but sounds serious enough you need to take it to the church board" Or by posting this here you have done exactly the following..... Quote: If it is a fact it needs to be dealt with, if it is a rumour that people area spreading all over the internet, because they heard someone say that their cousin is sure that he heard from a friend of his,... then it should be stopped and action taken Bonnie Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: D_Bishop said: the 'truth, and you, or someone else sees it. I'm not talking about it DB..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> Stan Jensen said: Am not saying that... AM saying to take solid action and not be a gossipmonger or a rumormonger… <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> To take solid action in most cases concerning the denomination or members requires the hide of an rhino, the determination of a pit bull,and to develope the ability to not care what others think. Most take some time to get there. It does not matter what the action is that needs to be corrected. It can be anything from theft to gossip to sexual abuse. Typically the first reaction is to go thru the laundry list of sins of the one filing the complaint. We know all have sinned so sins will surely be found. This has the effect of discouraging or intimidating most. It also serves the purpose of those making this statement complicit in the current wrong act. While at the same time gives a biblical excuse for not taking action, unless the action is required towards those that persist in their complaint Far easier said then done, even those that do persist and take action,still have to run the gauntlet. By the time they are done, many times their lives will never be the same. Nor will they themselves be the same person they were when it began. Look at Mary Kay Sliver and what she had to be willing to do, go thru,and fight to get the leadership of the denomination to listen to her and do what was right. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: Stan Jensen said: An example is this, one on of our sister forums someone started a rumor that a certain trust department had been shut down, well I had confirmation this AM that it is not true by any means. It appears as it was asked as an honest question, however it was viewed soon as a fact. Those rumors go wild and it was reported on another thread here as a fact. This is an example of the damage gossipmongers do to online forums. however as the discussion continues eventually it will be uncovered that the information was not correct... so your example is not one of someone deliberately starting falsehoods and it mushrooming from there.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted August 10, 2006 Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> so your example is not one of someone deliberately starting falsehoods and it mushrooming from there.... <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Too often it isn't. More often it starts as one fact but gets embellished from ear to ear. That is what is scary and damaging Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: It appears as it was asked as an honest question, however it was viewed soon as a fact. As I said.... Too many people are eager to read anything similar just to destroy the ministry. They remember it as fact during situations that are so emotionally charged. HOWEVER this is not near as nasty as the Quote: ... leans back in a large couch. His eyes drift over to where a new step-daughter is playing and his lips curl in a slight smile. He reaches over and pats his new wife on the thigh, as he watches the little girl play. Memory takes him back over the years to another step-daughter. That is a clear example of abuse of a personality, with its sheer intent of places pictures in the minds of the readers that will be recalled as fact. That is one of the best examples as why forums will not be supported by the Church as an institution. AND exactly why this thread was started.. Facts are never needed when stories can be fabriacated. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 Why slanderous post like that remain reflects nothing short of the clear support of the evil one. Quote If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 The words of a talebearer are as wounds, and they go down into the innermost parts of the belly. (Prob. 18:8) Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: Stan Jensen said: Why slanderous post like that remain reflects nothing short of the clear support of the evil one. slanderous only because you are not aware of the total truth.... as for church support, why should the church support internet forums? Don't they have enough to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Quote: Stan Jensen said: Quote: It appears as it was asked as an honest question, however it was viewed soon as a fact. As I said.... Too many people are eager to read anything similar just to destroy the ministry. They remember it as fact during situations that are so emotionally charged. HOWEVER this is not near as nasty as the Quote: ... leans back in a large couch. His eyes drift over to where a new step-daughter is playing and his lips curl in a slight smile. He reaches over and pats his new wife on the thigh, as he watches the little girl play. Memory takes him back over the years to another step-daughter. That is a clear example of abuse of a personality, with its sheer intent of places pictures in the minds of the readers that will be recalled as fact. That is one of the best examples as why forums will not be supported by the Church as an institution. AND exactly why this thread was started.. Facts are never needed when stories can be fabriacated. well at bsda we have asked and received the needed documentation and verification of certain things before they are posted.... they are not always made available to the forum but we have them "just in case." Consequently while we have drawn the line at some speculation, the stuff than has proof gets discussed...is that the goal? that forums are supported by the church? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted August 10, 2006 Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2006 When I first became separated, a few of my church friends knew about it but not many. When one elderly woman heard, she did not go any farther until she called me up to verify whether it was true. Even then I don't think that she is the type to pass along something anyway I was thankful that she took the action she did. She was very encouraging to me and she treated me with dignity Even if news is true but not uplifting, why on earth would we WANT to pass it along if we can not be part of the solution? I am with Stan here, it just tears down. Not only does it tear down the subject of the tale, it tears down faith in those who hear it. That's not even considering what it does when the information is false If the news is true but bad, we don't need details. If it involves us and we can be part of the restorative process I can see a reason to wanting to know and I think that would be justified. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Gail Posted August 10, 2006 Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2006 If it seems so right to spread rumours, why then does the Bible condemn it? It doesn't condone wrong behaviour or prevent standing up for victims, but it does condemn talebearing Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Shane Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> Not only does it tear down the subject of the tale, it tears down faith in those who hear it. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Amen </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> If it involves us and we can be part of the restorative process I can see a reason to wanting to know and I think that would be justified. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Amen again. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kountzer Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Hey, tell Huggins to hit me with an e mail. I want to ask him some stuff about the Atl. Quote I prayed for twenty years but received no answer until I prayed with my legs. Frederick Douglass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> D_Bishop said: Hey, tell Huggins to hit me with an e mail. I want to ask him some stuff about the Atl. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">will do..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodema Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 There is a fellow online who runs another forum who has routinely, over the past several years, indulged himself in tale-bearing, gossip, malicious speculations, and rumors where I am concerned. What his obsession with me is, I will never understand, but he has routinely "reported" half-truths, his own intrusively unflattering speculations, and total falsehoods on his forum about me as if they were gospel truth and as if it were his "duty" somehow to "warn" people about this person he assumes or has concluded I am, which bears no resemblance whatsoever to the person I actually am. Obviously, since I cannot control what this person does, I have only the choice of controlling how I feel about it. I have decided he is a worthless putz and I don't give a rat's patoot what garbage he wants to spread. Anyone stupid enough to listen to him, associate with him, or give his garbage credence deserves whatever misery befalls them as a result. And it's been my observation that most who do choose to associate themselves with him and his ilk are, in fact, pretty miserable creatures to begin with. However, if I live for all eternity I will never understand the source or purpose of this type of petty, pointless, obsessive malice. Never. Can't say I want to, either. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> But it reminds me of a George Carlin quip: "It's time to start smacking people." <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/catfight.gif" alt="" /> Quote "After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> claborn1960 said: rumors are one thing, sharing the truth unpleasant though it may be is another issue correct? <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> "Sharing" is not by ANY stretch, the right word to use here. <img src="/adventist/images/graemlins/sad25.gif" alt="" /> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> Gail said: If it seems so right to spread rumours, why then does the Bible condemn it? It doesn't condone wrong behaviour or prevent standing up for victims, but it does condemn talebearing <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Gail It is only "right" because people want it to be, not because it's in the Bible... And, it is only when there is a market for the "product" that "sales" will prosper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kountzer Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 that's not sharing truth. That's malicious muck raking, or worse. Quote I prayed for twenty years but received no answer until I prayed with my legs. Frederick Douglass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> This is one of the reasons why RMS wants charges laid against those who need to be charged. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Who/What is RMS? Is that Risk Management Service? Quote The greatest want of the world is the want of men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true & honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty..., men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.{Ed 57.3} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonnie Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> Fran said: </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> This is one of the reasons why RMS wants charges laid against those who need to be charged. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> Who/What is RMS? Is that Risk Management Service? <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> It is. If RMS was so eager to have charges laid against those that need to be charged, victims that report crimes, sexual advances, even children victims, would not be forced to run the gauntlet when they do. It is necessary to be very through when a complaint is filed because of that rare instance when an alleged victim lies,but that is not what happens. First the wagons circle to protect the "church". Generally speaking when it has gone to this extent, you find a pattern of behavior, or at least other incicences that have been reported. Makes for a sticky mess when someone has to explain why it was not dealt with effectively the first time. As for RMS being eager, not so very long ago, a young woman reported, received absolutely no satisfaction in removing this man from his teaching position, filed a lawsuit. RMS was so eager for this to take place they sent a army of twelve lawyers to take depositions. The victim had acess to only one lawyer and a paralegal, as that is the only one that would take her case. She won a substantial out of court settlement. Guess what Risk Management learned??? Simply place this same academy teacher in another academy. This was only a couple of years ago. Rumors began to surface again, and this time the denomination finally decided to remove him permanently. Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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