Was EGW Ever Wrong?"

[Gregory Matthews]

The name Richard Coffin, should be familiar to you due to his former positon in the Review.  His following article on Ellen Whit should be of value to your understanding of her ministry.

https://atoday.org/was-ellen-white-an-infallible-theologian/

[phkrause]

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Years ago, in a private conversation with retired NAD president Charles E. Bradford, the topic of White’s authority came up. What Brad said surprised me. On the one hand, he acknowledged that she did much to encourage the education of African-American slaves. But on the other hand, what she wrote about the origin of Blacks has kept contemporary African-American Seventh-day Adventists from being entirely comfortable with her.

I would personally like to see that statement, where she actually says something to the "origin of Blacks?" I personally can't believe that CEB would've believed she meant that!!!!!

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In Spiritual Gifts, Vol. 3, pages 64 and 75, Ellen White talks about the dire effects of the “amalgamation of man and beast.” This sounds, taken at face value, as though some of Noah’s descendants had mated with primates—and many at that time understood it that way.

I just went and read these 2 pages and I don't see that at all!!!!! Again I don't see where anyone gets that, unless it's a white that came up with that and why would anyone believe that?????

Quote

Smith claimed to clearly understand what she had meant. Smith insisted that White had not intended to teach that Blacks were subhuman. She did mean, however, argued Smith, that she accepted what many scientists of her day believed: that some dark-skinned peoples originated after the Noachian Flood when certain unnamed postdiluvians had engaged in coitus with apes. The results were “the wild Bushmen of Africa, some tribes of the Hottentots, and perhaps the Digger Indians of our own country.” Smith continued: “Naturalists affirm that the line of demarkation [sic] between the human and animal races is lost in confusion.”

I can understand some scientists believed that and probably all white guys?? Sorry but I don't see that!!

But I do agree that she was, as are all of us, a fallible human being!!

Again is this just another person wanting to cast doubt on her?? I don't know!!

[GHansen]

Chapter 6 and 7 of volume 1 of the "Spirit of Prophecy" volumes may throw light on this subject. "Amalgamation" is also mentioned there. Amalgamation there likely refers to the intermarriage of the daughters of Seth and the daughters of Cain.  

 

[Kevin H]

There is one, probably two important points that should be taken in consideration of the "amalgamation" topic. First, Mrs. White was of mixed race. Her dad met her mom when he had to go to the south for business, and she was of mixed race. Second, I'm not sure about the dates of the quotes, but they seem to be early. If they came from the early days of the Review, when it was in Rochester NY; we do not have more than compelling evidence but no official record for this. There was an unnamed printer/publisher in Rochester who took James and Ellen and the early review staff under his wing and guided them 

While, as I said, we do not have the name of this publisher who helped our early printing work; Rochester NY had a number of publishers of which it could have been any one of. However, one of these were very kind and supportive of the Millerites. He allowed the Millerites in and around Rochester to wait on the roof of his building on October 22, 1844. When Jesus did not come, he was very sympathetic and encouraging to these souls. So he seems like the one who the Millerites of the Whites may have gotten the help from. We also find years later that the Whites were personal friends with this publisher. We don't have records as to how and when they met, but the evidence points to the early days of our publishing work in Rochester. That he was most likely the publisher who took the White's under his wing and helped them set up our publishing work. 

Now, if the publisher was the one who helped the Whites and our early publishing work; and if the amalgamation statements came from the time in Rochester; this publisher most likely would have had a say in the matter. His name was Fredrick Douglas. 

So we know that what ever Mrs. White thought about the amalgamation topic, it did not upset her as a mixed race woman, and it may not have bothered one of the greatest activists for civil rights. As we study these statements, we need to remind our selves of at least Mrs. White's mixed race, and maybe how it might have been in the awareness of without objection to the great Fredrick Douglas. 

[Kevin H]

Mrs. White tried to teach us how she wanted to be used. Due to Fundamentalism too often we try to squeeze her into the Fundamentalist framework. I find it ironic on how Stephen Haskell took pretty much every word of hers to be directly from God. Yet, he kept wanting to teach her how her visions work, and refused her disagreement on the topic. Haskell's view has basically won out in the church, which probably can be summarized as "Mrs. White was not infallible, it's just that she never made a mistake." 

[Kevin H]

As for living before God without a mediator; Scholars from different aspects of Adventism, from Graham Maxwell to Raoul Detteren, have pointed out that we view intercession from two different directions. First there was the Catholic view where you go to a priest and pray to the saints to appeal to Mary to appeal to Jesus to get God to look kindly instead of wrathfully at us.

Reformation theology was built on this frame work, only removing all the middle people and we pray to Jesus to plead our case before the Father. 

However, in places such as Exodus 19:5-6 and Revelation 1 and other places in the Bible, instead of intercession/mediation being us trying to reach out to God, it is God through Christ, to the angels and his people to reach out to a lost world. From seeing intercession/mediation from this direction we find the time where God has either won our hearts over to him, or there is nothing else he can do. Thus no longer a need for God to try to reach out to us in love hoping that we will accept him.  

[Kevin H]

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phkrause

By the decree enforcing the institution of the papacy in violation of the law of God, our nation will disconnect herself fully from righteousness. When Protestantism shall stretch her hand across the gulf to grasp the hand of the Roman power, when she shall reach over the abyss to clasp hands with spiritualism, when, under the influence of this threefold union, our country shall repudiate every principle of its Constitution as a Protestant and republican government, and shall make provision for the propagation of papal falsehoods and delusions, then we may know that the time has come for the marvelous working of Satan and that the end is near. {5T 451.1}

It's amazing how we are seeing this in our world today. When Kennedy was running for President, he gave a short but powerful speech where he pointed out the difference between being a Catholic candidate for the Presidency, and being the Democrat (and we could change Democrat with any other party) candidate for the Presidency who happens to worship in the Catholic Church. 

Today Kennedy's words have been forgotten, as we have many politicians who are their religion's candidate for office. They want to do for their church what Kennedy was wise enough to avoid. In Kennedy's day people knew the danger. Kennedy knew the danger and made it clear that he was not going to bring that danger. Today, we have too many who have embraced the danger. Today we have a generation who are clueless of the general knowledge in 1960. We have one party who has people who are trying to make us catholic Europe (small c catholic). Then the extreme of the other party wants to make us French Revolution Europe, where the religion of secular humanism is the national religion. 

I do not mind politicians who are Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Muslim, or any other religion, including secular humanism, who understands what Kennedy understood. As I understand Thomas Jefferson, he wanted the United States to be an open market for ideas, including religious ideas, and the individuals choose what makes the most sense to them. This was the world where Mrs. White wrote. This was the world that President Kennedy understood, supported and defended. This is the world that has been discarded for the fight as to which religion will be forced on this nation. Jefferson, White, and Kennedy would be rolling over in their graves. 

[GHansen]

"My conclusion after studying Dr. Dudley’s book was that, while he was not attempting to argue something he knew to be untrue, he is simply not familiar with genealogical evidence and the sources needed to properly analyze and construct genealogical links. Nothing in his book even suggests that the Gould ancestry of Ellen Gould (Harmon) White was in any way connected with the Gould family of Gouldtown, New Jersey, or that any part of Ellen’s Gould ancestral line traced to persons of color, at least not in this country."

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