We don't talk about the way we treat Widows....

[Stan]

True Religion is reveled on how we treat Widows and Orphans.. and reality is, we are not that good at that..

Yet, we can sound very 'popeish' and feel like we are doing God's work..

How weird is that??

[cricket]

The Seventh-day Adventist Church, perhaps, isn't "very good" at it; but I know of several individuals who are great at caring for widows and orphans!

[Dr. Shane]

I also think we need to considered divorced women and children of divorce as widows and orphans. On that note I will add I was raised in a divorced family and looking back on it I think our local Adventist church did all that one could ever expect of it. They even told my mother she could send us kids to church school for free if she would only buy our books, which she did. When my mother went into drug rehab, the pastor and school teachers took us kids into their own homes until she got out.

[cricket]

As well as divorced men and their children??

Divorced women do have a more difficult time of establishing themselves financially, but many of them are quite successful at creating a loving, stable, financially secure home for their families.

[Jerry Rogers]

Divorced men.... now THAT's a situation/need that is hardly addressed in church. I'm currently re-married but I can tell you, there are "always" classes for women going through problems, like divorce, but men are given the impression in church that, "Hey, you're a guy, you're tough, you don't need any help."

And then they wonder why the ratio of divorced men to divorced women in the SDA Singles is about 35/65. The church doesn't "take care" of divorced men that have been hurt.

Been there...

[darlene]

There have been times that I have noted that the church doesn't care for the divorced or widowed members. Recent stats that have come out of the NAD show that 70% of those divorced members leave the church in the first year of their divorce. What shocking stats! What does that say about us?

1) I believe it says that we do not like those whose marriages fail because it indicates failure in the institution we hold most dear; marriage.

2) I believe that it says we take sides in divorce (something is rarely, if ever, appropriate!)

3) I believe it says that we judge people and then condemn them as sinners. We are certainly not Christ-like in this area of our church family.

4) I believe it says that think we are better Christians then those who are divorced.

This is certainly something our church needs to study and find out how to change. We need to be a place that is loving and accepting of ALL people.

[K]

Seeming to be an expert on the divorce thing. . . . after a 21 year marriage went out the window. . . . many of my close friends enclosed and circled my girls and me with much love and support.

The majority of the church members. . . . they were uncomfortable with me. . . . smiled. . . one liner chit chat at church. Never a call, never in 4 years was I asked to do any church job. . . . and never asked to participate in the service. (In case you are wondering . . . I was very active until that point)

Now remarried. . . .got my first call in 4 years from the nominating committee. . . . people who hadn't spoken to me much in years talk to me. . . . ask about my new husband. . . . it is all of a sudden like a light went on in my church family's head that said. . . she's good enough now. . . . she is married.

I may be way off. . . . but my perceptions can't be put out of my mind.

I attend church sporadically now. . . .and most of the time I force myself to go and am sorry once I am there.

Widow, divorce men and women. . . . yep we fail miserably as a denomination.

[Stan]

CONGRATULATION on the marriage K!!

Am so sorry about the treatment, I have heard that a lot in various places..

Sometimes we get so 'Graced Centered" we can forget there is a Judgement Day... I would rather have a friend who treated people well, then a friend who "had all Knowledge and Wisdom' yet without Charity.. (Love0

[K]

Thanks Stan.

[Morning Glory]

I would like to add my congrats, too. It IS wonderful to have someone with whom to share one's life. Interesting how "the church" is so two faced in the way it treats folks in regards to divorce and remarriage. As a single, then later as a divorced person I felt really out of place at church so I can relate, there. Perhaps it was my own perceptions, but that is how I felt. At any rate, I am happy for you that you have found someone!! I wish you many years of happiness and fulfillment.

Morning Glory

[Nan]

I am glad that you are now happy, K, and sorry for the way you were treated. Not every SDA church is like that, however.

12 years ago, after 25 years of marriage, my husband was senior elder at our church and decided that further fields were greener and left - obviously causing a lot of shock in the church. His new partner was/is not SDA.

I received incredible support from the church, very rarely for many months was I left to have Sabbath lunch alone. A few years later, still single, I was asked to be an elder in that same church. (I had served as an elder in another church some years before.)

4 years ago I remarried and now I feel I know what marriage is meant to be all about, but that is another story.

Some congregations seem to have the ability to be more accepting than others.

[bevin]

Now that is a very positive story, Nan.

I wonder if Australia is better at this particular area than many other areas of the world.

My wife and I were married in Adelaide Australia during the Ford Upheaval of the early 80's. We watched as almost every adult between 25 and 40 abandoned the 7 SDA churches in Adelaide, and wondered how the future would play out. We were still young and naive and with parents going to the church so we didn't.

We moved to the USA in 1982, and so watched from a distance and got 2-yearly snapshots on our 3 week visits. It was pretty obvious that the Australian young-adult SDA church that formed out of our generation didn't care much for theology, but was deep into forming relationships.

One of my wife's siblings is still very active SDA in Australia and, when we were back there for the last few weeks, it was obvious that both their church and the Nelson NZ SDA church were deep into appropriately treating people.

Especially obvious in Nelson was that they had broken down the barriers between SDA's and other Christian groups in the area.

It was VERY nice to see, and so completely different to the nonsense that goes on in the New England congregations I am familiar with.

I would actually consider being an SDA in NZ/Australia... here in New England, no way.

/Bevin

[Dr. Shane]

It underscores the need for family ministries within the local church. That is a position a lot of nominating committees leave left unfilled. A good family ministries program will see that all families are ministered to. Our denomination is making progress in ministering to the divorced.

1995:

Quote:

In a morning business meeting of the congress, the 2,600 delegates representing the 8.5-million worldwide membership voted to change the official Church Manual so that church members who divorce would not be disfellowshiped.

"The Church sees offense to its standards not through divorce as such much as it abhors such dissolution but only if remarriage to another partner after divorce occurs," explained Kenneth Mittleider, Silver Spring, Maryland, U.S.A., a general vice president of the Church. "In some cases there is actual danger to one of the partners if they continue in the marriage. Certainly it would not be right to disfellowship the endangered partner. The Bible does not counsel such."

MARRIAGE, DIVORCE, AND REMARRIAGE

2000 Church Manual:

Quote:

3. Grace Available for All—God seeks to restore to wholeness and reconcile to Himself all who have failed to attain the divine standard (2 Cor. 5:19). This includes those who have experienced broken marriage relationships.

4. The Role of the Church—Moses in the Old Testament and Paul in the New Testament dealt with the problems caused by broken marriages (Deut. 24:1-5; 1 Cor. 7:11). Both, while upholding and affirming the ideal, worked constructively and redemptively with those who had fallen short of the divine standard. Similarly, the church today is called to uphold and affirm God's ideal for marriage and, at the same time, to be a reconciling, forgiving, healing community, showing understanding and compassion when brokenness occurs...

Basically the position now is that divorce is permitted for sexual perversion (adultery, incest, child sexual abuse, and homosexual practices) or abandonment. The "innocent" party is free to marry. The "guilty" party is to be disciplined which can be simply censorship - not disfellowship. If the guilty party remarries, he or she is to be disfellowshipped and must be rebaptised to gain membership again.

If a divorce occurs without "biblical" grounds, there is no problem as long as the parties do not remarry. If after the divorce, one of the parties becomes sexually active with someone other than the ex-spouse, the ex-spouse than has the right to remarry. The one now sexually active with someone new is to be disfellowshipped and must be rebaptised in order to be a member again.

Not quite the position I hold personally but certainly a move in the right direction from where the church was before. Personally, I believe an Adventist married to a nonbelievers should have the right to divorce as well.

Regardless if a person divorced with or without "Biblical" grounds should not impact whether or not the church continues to minister to them. We minister to complete strangers - unbelievers - that we know are living in sin. I don't see that we need to judge a single parent first before we minister to him or her.

In today's society, I think we need to consider single parents as widows and minister to them. If their children do not have an active father in their lives, we need to mentor them.