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Showing content with the highest reputation on 07/08/2016 in Posts

  1. ow 20-Year-Old Student Changed U.S. Law for Adventist Free Clinic My phone rang. Sean Worix said he was about to speak to West Virginian leaders in the State Capitol Building. POSTED JULY 7, 2016 By Naomi Tricomi It was Thursday, June 9 — only four short weeks before the free mega clinic organized by Your Best Pathway to Health was scheduled to open in my hometown of Beckley, West Virginia. West Virginia’s law was not favorable to our plan to bring hundreds of out-of-state medical professionals to Beckley to provide $3 million worth of health-care services to 1,500 people from July 13 to 15. In fact, it appeared that we might have to cancel the free clinic because we were unable to secure state licenses for physicians and dentists to participate in the event. As the person responsible for organizing the event on the ground, I was deeply worried. Sean Worix, a 20-year-old pre-med student at West Virginia University. (Courtesy of Sean Worix) Driving to the Mountain View Camp Meeting in Parkersburg, West Virginia, that Thursday, I had several hours to plead with God to show us the way forward. Suddenly my cell phone rang. The voice on the other end was Sean Worix, a 20-year-old student from Beckley who was on summer break. “I am at the State Capitol Building as a representative of a student leadership summit called HOBY,” Sean said. Sean was calling from West Virginia’s capital, Charleston. HOBY is the acronym for Hugh O'Brian Youth Leadership, an organization whose motto is “to train and nurture the young leaders of tomorrow.” Sean continued: “I have been invited to address the governor’s Cabinet in just a few minutes. I want to tell them about Your Best Pathway to Health, but what should I tell them?” I suggested that Sean give a brief synopsis of Your Best Pathway to Health’s mission to collaborate with the Seventh-day Adventist Church and health-care companies in providing medical, dental, and other services to uninsured people across the United States. I said he could also mention our need for temporary licenses for out-of-state physicians and dentists. Sean asked for prayer and hurriedly hung up. I immediately telephoned Larry Boggess, president of the Adventist Church’s Mountain View Conference, who happened to be leading a meeting with his pastors. After listening to me quickly tell the story about Sean, he asked for immediate prayer. I listened on speaker phone as the group of pastors fervently prayed. Read also: Sabbath School Class Paves Way for Beckley Free Clinic “I’m Your Guy” Moments later my phone rang again. An excited Sean spoke on the other end. He said that after he concluded his presentation, he was approached by Joey Garcia, director of legislative affairs for West Virginia’s governor, together with the governor’s secretary and chief of staff. Garcia asked for more information about how the state could help, and Sean explained how current state law prohibited Adventist medical professionals from coming to West Virginia to volunteer at the clinic. “I’m your guy,” Garcia said. “I will see what I can do to help you and your organization.” He gave Sean his contact information and asked that we send all requests to him. But that’s not all that Sean has done in recent weeks. State dental regulations meant that we could not provide dental services unless we were sponsored by either the West Virginia University School of Dentistry or the local dental association. Sean, who is a student at West Virginia University in Morgantown, contacted Richard Meckstroth, head of the School of Dentistry. When Meckstroth asked for additional information, I spoke with him by phone. He was most cordial and said he was a graduate of the Adventist Church-owned Loma Linda University in southern California. He also said we were giving him very short notice but he would do all he could to help us. True to his word, Mecktroth arranged for our dentists to work under the auspices of the School of Dentistry, making it possible for us to have a dental department at the free clinic in Beckley. Read also: Here's Your Chance to Organize a Free Adventist Clinic A Free Forklift Nine days before the clinic’s opening day, we needed a forklift. Sean went all over Beckley, population 17,600, before stopping at an equipment rental company close to the convention center where we’ll hold the clinic. He spoke to the managers, and they donated the use of a forklift. Sean also made successful contacts with various department heads at the local hospital to be sure that they would partner with us. Eight days to go, we needed an additional laboratory to process patients’ samples at the clinic. In just a few hours Sean made a successful contact with a major, Wall Street-listed company. I asked Sean how he was able to meet the right people to cover our needs. “I don’t know,” he said. “I just pray before I go in and tell them what we need.” That’s exactly what happened in the State Capitol Building. After Sean’s presentation and meeting with the governor’s top deputies, state lawmakers changed the law to allow out-of-state medical professionals to receive temporary licenses in West Virginia. Interestingly, when Sean spoke in the State Capitol Building, the lawmakers were not scheduled to gather in legislative session again until the fall because of the summer break. But the lawmakers found themselves in a special session because they had failed to finalize the state budget earlier. This made it possible to change the law to accommodate the Adventist free clinic. God is in control! Naomi Tricomi is a Bible worker in Beckley, West Virginia and the person on the ground responsible for organizing Your Best Pathway to Health in Beckley.
    4 points
  2. 8thdaypriest

    Voting this year?

    While I would agree that this election is a "dumpster fire", I will NOT vote for Hillary. I saw the video of her saying, "Deeply held religious beliefs will have to be changed". What beliefs would those be? Beliefs based on the Biblical prohibition against homosexual practice? A vote for Hillary will stack the Supreme Court for the next 40 years. Persecution of Christian's who do not want to participate in SCOTUS "marriage" ceremonies will increase. Also persecution of Christian parents (and Christian schools) who do not want their daughters to shower with males who think they are females. I will also NOT vote for an "independent", because that would be a vote for Hillary.
    2 points
  3. Green Cochoa

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    You need to define headship theology. As I see it, the Bible teaches headship. It would appear that the "headship deniers" would like to erase this aspect from their theology for one reason only: women's ordination. However, God is the head of Christ, and man is the head of woman, according to Scripture. Like Martin Luther, I must stand on the principles of the Word of God alone, though all men forsake me.
    1 point
  4. Tom Wetmore

    History on "headship" in the church

    @Green Cochoa Here is another headship topic...
    1 point
  5. Tom Wetmore

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    @Green Cochoa Here is a prior discussion of the headship issue...
    1 point
  6. JoeMo

    Are the three Angels' Messages Dead or Alive?

    Martin, There are several instances in the NT where people worshipped Jesus. There are at least 4 occurrences in Matthew, 1 in Luke, and 1 in John. In Revelation, it is easy to infer that the 24 elders are worshipping Jesus. There are no instances in the OT nor NT where people pray to or worship the Spirit. We are warned in scripture to only worship God. So, either Jesus is God (He accepted the worship) or He is a charlatan. I believe the former.
    1 point
  7. rudywoofs (Pam)

    Motorcyclists, Past and Present

    a steampunk motorcycle, built from the ground, up...
    1 point
  8. Tom Wetmore

    Pacific Union Info on WO...

    Now you are speaking out of both sides of your mouth... You and Ross have been insisting on a "Thus saith the Lord" and ignoring or rejecting anything you deem to be extra-Biblical, even clear and undisputed contextual information. Now when the absence of that explicit directive from God on the key disputed issue of ordination, it no longer matters. Nice try...
    1 point
  9. pierrepaul

    ChristianMingle Opens Doors to Gay Singles Under Settlement

    There are many "activist" attorneys. However, they tend not to be greedy; the greedy attorneys tend to gravitate towards the far more lucrative and remunerative fields of work - securities compliance, tax, mergers and acquisitions, banking/secured asset lending, insurance - all of which pay generally far more than devoting one's career to "activist" causes.
    1 point
  10. Stan

    If we err..

    If we err, let it be on the side of mercy rather than on the side of condemnation and harsh dealing. Letter 16, 1887 EGW
    1 point
  11. JoeMo

    Are the three Angels' Messages Dead or Alive?

    Martin, Twinity - I like that! I must be a twinitarian! BTW - twinitarianism doesn't seem to be that popular among SDA's these days. Maybe 1 in 10 is a twinitarian. I see no problem with accepting Jesus as God. Jesus says or implies several times that he and the Father are One. He also says "‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength." (Mark 12: 28-30) If God can do anything, why can't He be in 2 places at once (i.e., in heaven and on earth)? Didn't Jesus also say that if you have seen Him you have seen the Father?
    1 point
  12. Kevin H

    Washington Conference Grants Females ______

    It is easier to answer her silence than the not opposing when the church wanted to ordain women. She was concerned about people coming to a belief through study and allowing the Holy Spirit to lead them. We know that her friend and who she trained, A. G. Daniels was pro-women's ordination, but he was the one who stopped it in the first decade of the 20th century. He did not want to stop it but wanted us to move this gently and slowly so as to not confuse the people who do not realize that women's ordination is Biblical. The problem is that the anti-women's ordination movement wants to force their view on us in a manner that Daniels did not want to force women's ordination. He felt that other topics were more important and that this topic can wait (topics in like how we are supposed to use the Bible and Mrs. White, which finally got him thrown out of office). If women's ordination was accepted I would oppose for now a woman to be put in charge of a church out in the middle of nowhere, I'd want it to start out where churches where people have a choice, those who oppose women's ordination to have a church pastored by a male in the area. Remember Mrs. White put her reputation on the line by giving her food for worms vision when the church planned an evangelistic outreach, they gave the outreach to committee to implement and it got lost as well. Did Mrs. White change her mind and decide that evangelism was not important for her pen to be silent then even though it meant that all who heard that vision ended up food for worms? Mrs. White talks about the long slow process that God is willing to use to deal with the Great Controversy. A person convinced against their will is of the same opinion still. This is not an urgent point where God had to come out and state something strongly. He prefers taking his time for people to grow. He has us choose of the weight of evidence. He did just enough in the Bible and is teaching us more about the Bible that can make us question. He leads us into this situation of the church wanting to simply start ordaining women, but there are church members who think it's unbiblical, and instead of coming out and saying "It's Biblical so you better do it or else!" God troubles our minds with the questions "Why didn't Mrs. White nip the issue in the bud instead of allowing the seed to be planted?" "Why did she write articles that lean more in the direction of where the church wanted to go, even though we can act like a band of lawyers digging through those articles to find loopholes instead of uprooting the idea" and as more and more people kick against the thorns, and have to wrestle with the evidence, it will be a deciding to accept it by their own journey. The anti-ordination people are trying to use the methods of using the Bible and Mrs. White that Elder Daniels was trying to prevent and they are trying to make the ignorance that Elder Daniels wanted to dispel by education become official church dogma. They want to shred Mrs. White's articles that were written when the church actively wanted to ordain women to make them of no effect because of all the loopholes they can find in it and explain it some other way than face and historical value.
    1 point
  13. Robert

    Pacific Union Info on WO...

    I believe EGW is dealing with marriage; not ordination. Again, I do not have a dog in the race....What's important to me is the presentation of the gospel. My two cents
    1 point
  14. doug, You probably are over reacting just a bit. If you remember the assurances that have been given ,here and publically. The LGBTQIAL agenda is only a question of fairness. It isn't catchy and certainly doesn't impact herertesexual marriages Society is changing and we will have to change with society.Not even sure if the biblical scholars will agree that a homosexual lifestyle is unbiblical. We need to lighten up on the subject,lest we be seen as homophobic bigots. The LGBTQIAL community will not rest until all their lifestyle is accepted as on par with herertesexual lifestyles. Puzzles me as to why now the SDA church seems concerned about this bill passing. Can they honestly say they didn't see this coming?
    1 point
  15. Robert

    Pacific Union Info on WO...

    Ordination is a side issue. Gay issues within the church - a side issue. SDA are called to preach the third angel's message. Have you folks forgot about presenting "the everlasting gospel"?
    1 point
  16. rudywoofs (Pam)

    Voting this year?

    I vote. If you don't vote, you've no right as a citizen to complain about the government or politicians, imho.
    1 point
  17. CoAspen

    Voting this year?

    Yep, I will vote as usual....regardless of the above. None of the 12 apostles would be 'correct' to vote for, if alive today. Certainly not David!
    1 point
  18. Johann

    Pacific Union Info on WO...

    But irt might go the other way too. Will a majority be saved? The headship idea is so ingraded in this sinful world. Only a true minister is a servant.
    1 point
  19. B/W Photodude

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    Part of Eve's mistake was stopping at the tree and engaging in conversation with the serpent! I have read enough on the pro-side and have not been convinced. I do think there is too much altering of scripture in the pro-women's ordination movement and it opens the door for many other heresies to come in. You may not accept that, and it is your choice. The concerns I have are much the same as Larry Kirkpatrick outlined in the immediately proceeding link. You may choose not to watch it if you feel I am not watching your stuff. I do have my own paper coming out with my review of headship as soon as I am done editing and proofing it. I think I have some issues from the Bible and EGW that have not come up yet!
    1 point
  20. B/W Photodude

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    An Appeal to the Delegates of the 2015 General Conference Session Larry Kirkpatrick discusses what is behind the WO movement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNChPlSxRQA
    1 point
  21. B/W Photodude

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    It is really not good to suggest someone will remain ignorant for not buying into your arguments. I did answer several of your points in my last post in this thread. However, you answered none of mine, but only tried to get me to read your type of material. What others find compelling may be interesting but I find the anti-women's ordination even more compelling. Especially when the more I read, I find the headship for some and submission of others to be in place before sin entered into this world and is even the natural order of things throughout the universe. And I suspect that constantly looking for "equality" is just one more way to make people spend more time watching others to make sure they don't get one more bit of anything than you. Which suggests a real problem with selfishness.
    1 point
  22. B/W Photodude

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    1. Probably not. It is one thing to commit to a video, but another to ask people to buy a book on line to read. And this when you have no idea how many books I might already have on the subject or how much pro-women's ordination stuff I have read. I have and find it weak and non-Biblical. 2. You make much of the blue tassels. You may note in Numbers that all of the sons of Israel were commanded to wear blue tassels. However, we know that not all the sons of Israel were priests. That was limited to the tribe of Levi. Then keep reading and you will note from the Bible the blue tassels were to remember all the commandments of the LORD. Did women ever wear blue tassels? Maybe. But not because they were priests. Numbers 15:37The LORD also spoke to Moses, saying, 38"Speak to the sons of Israel, and tell them that they shall make for themselves tassels on the corners of their garments throughout their generations, and that they shall put on the tassel of each corner a cord of blue.39"It shall be a tassel for you to look at and remember all the commandments of the LORD, so as to do them and not follow after your own heart and your own eyes, after which you played the harlot,… I will say that in the Orthodox Jewish tradition today, only men wear tallit in the temple and the last time I was in a conservative temple it was the same. 3. The fact that Jesus had Mary at his feet was in no way a secret sign to the supporters of women's ordination that Jesus was trying to ordain Mary. He was known for upsetting tradition in many ways. And Mary at his feet was just another way. There is no reference anywhere that the disciples sat at his feet either. And his appointed apostle who followed him quite explicitly forbade women to be in positions of authority over men. So, either all scriptures are not inspired or Paul was not following what Jesus wanted. I am sure that if ordination was approved by Jesus, one of the other apostles would have clued Paul in on these new changes. But they did not should writings of support either. 4. It is hard to say whether there were women rabbis, but there is nothing in the Bible authorizing it. And the amount of time that Israel spent following the traditions of surrounding nations with the priestesses acting as temple harlots could have influenced the practice of Judaism. So, the burden falls on you to provide a Bible text and not what the people may have been doing establish this as an acceptable practice.
    1 point
  23. B/W Photodude

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    I have watched both of these videos in full. And yes, it does take a time commitment. However, I think it is valuable information especially as we come into another GC session and the times we live in. I know we sometimes want to surf right thru sound bites and give one line answers, but ... Ingo Sorke talk: This was an interesting talk where he took on and discussed many of the rationals given by the pro-ordination supporters and those who are just tired of the whole argument. I found it interesting how much the pro-women's ordination movement depends on feelings and emotions. This is also something we are well warned about. Feelings are not doctrines. Another issue that he discussed is the claim that male headship is a relatively new Roman Catholic doctrine. He listed a couple of reasons why this wasn't so. Sorke also discussed following the Bible and not other sources of wishfull thinking such as misunderstood archeology and other things. The Bible will speak for itself. I do tend to believe that everything needed for church doctrine and policy is in the Bible on any subject. You don't need to go elsewhere for understanding. Dr John Peters talk: Dr Peters listed 26 reasons why male headship existed even BEFORE the fall! We tend to think Eve was to be in submission to Adam because of the fall, Dr Peters show that Eve being subject to Adam was just a re-statement of how things were before the fall. Dr. Peters was able to compare Eve's "restlessness" to the modern feminist movement. Dr Peters discussed the rise of the women's ordination in the SDA church as a contemporary movement accompanying the modern feminist movement. Overall, these are two very well worth watching videos.
    1 point
  24. Daryl

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    I feel that those who are for it are the ones who do not treat very nicely those who are against it.
    1 point
  25. Daryl

    Dangers I see in Headship theology

    I would like you to show me from the Bible where this was done by Jesus in reference to Mary. From my study of this and watching the various symposiums and forum and group email discussions on the subject of women's ordination, as well as the personal testimony of two locally ordained women as elders, who both believed it wasn't biblical, one of the two who renounced her ordination as being unbiblical, I am presently believing that the Bible doesn't teach that the ordination of women is biblical. I must say that I do find it interesting that there is such a division over the issue of women's ordination from the General Conference President, who I believe is against women's ordination, to the other leaders of our church, some of who are somewhat divided over this issue to an extent, even to the level of a few being rebellious to the previous GC session decisions of the General Conference, which I believe is clearly wrong, to the lay people, some of who are also somewhat divided over this issue in a few of our Divisions. Did you watch the video of a response of the lay people of a NAD congregation over the Q&A Mailing that was sent to all the NAD churches? In case you didn't, you can watch it here:
    1 point
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